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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen
- Thread starter ResetEraVetVIP
- Start date
Wishmaster92
Member
https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2015-metal-gear-solid-5-phantom-pain-face-off
MGSV by far for me. Can’t believe it ran on those consoles.
amigastar
Member
Yep, that looks really good. GTA IV is not the answer i assume.
GooseMan69
Member
Some candidates:
Uncharted 2/3
Killzone 2/3
Halo 4
Gears of War 3
God of War 3
The Last of Us
Both MS and Sony went so hard that gen holy fuck. MS fell off toward the end but still.
What a time of visual and technical innovation that was. Honestly, those games STILL punch well above their weight, especially with remasters. Just a few months ago we were comparing the desert in FF16 to the desert in Uncharted 3 and Uncharted kinda wiped the floor with it tbh…astounding.
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rhodesianshepard
Banned
There's a reason why FF7 Rebirth took less than 4 years to develop, even during a world wide pandemic. It's ridiculous to expect "next-generation" leaps with graphics on UE4 in such a small time frame. I find it pretty impressive everything they were able to do, honestly. It's just the reality of gaming. Is it worth it for studios to delay an extra year or two for cutting edge graphics? Probably not.End of chapter 4 is impressive I suppose. Pretty big scale, lots of NPCs and some fairly decent modeling. Still, not up to par compared to say similar areas in star wars but i can at least see where the budget went.
Interiors are still crap though and look fairly last gen. Both in terms of lighting and model quality. Star wars did nail the modeling of these 3d objects in the environments so they never felt like painted on textures.
Just lol if you think it is up to the Individual studios whether a game is cross-gen or not. Only now is it starting to become financially viable to release games only on current gen systems, especially if it exclusive to one system, with Sony's 1st party games.
A game like SM2 was not very ambitious. Everybody looks at the crazy 315mil price tag, when that budget includes Disney Royalties and marketing. SM2 probably cost Sony less than 150mil to actually develop. It was an obvious rushed production schedule to get it out in time. A lot of shortcuts were seemingly made because of that, including choosing to target 4k.
I would be very surprised if the vast majority of Sony's upcoming AAA games aren't targeting 30fps and cutting edge graphics just like the PS4 days. Death Stranding and Wolverine are very clearly doing so. It's also why Sony probably won't have a major 1st party release until 2026(probably ghost 2). Shit takes so long. This generation doesn't truly begin until next year with GTA 6 and DS2
meech
Member
Native 4k is not needed with decent upscaling like Nvidia offers.
Fbh
Member
I think it's tricky because it depends on what you are looking for.
If you just care about pure visuals and ignoring all context then I think Beyond had some impressive graphics for the time:
But the gameplay is very limited, movement when playing is stiff and the environments are small
Games like Uncharted 3, TLOU, Gears 3 and God of War 3 don't have the same quality models but they have way more impressive gameplay with cool setpiece moments that still hold up with games today. But they are still linear games with relatively small environments.
Then you have the open world stuff like GTAIV, RDR, AC 3/Black Flag, etc which don't look as good up close but have a way more impressive scale with big open environments a lot of NPCs
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
ChiefDada
Gold Member
So many gems in that generation, but MGS4 is up there. When the opening cutscene transitioned to gameplay, I didn't do anything for 10 seconds because I thought I was still watching a cutscene.
I would throw battlefield 3 into the mix, not sure about anything else that hasn't been mentioned already.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
So was star wars. Star wars was done in less than 3.5 years.
Remedy and Massive made AW2 and Avatar in 4 years while working on other projects. Besides, other smaller devs like Immortals devs, Remnant 2 devs, Lords of the Fallen devs, and Robocop devs all managed to make UE5 games in the same covid wfh conditions in around the same amount of time. I think FF7 devs just didnt want to.
Lastly, graphics dont take that much time. If anything, UE5 is supposed to reduce dev time. Immortal devs had a pretty cool dev diary about how much time they saved once they actually did migrate to UE5 which was indeed a challenge at first. but once that happened it was fairly easy. You can find dozens of UE5 tutorials on youtube where these dudes are creating entire open world areas in like an hour and a half. If an artist is drawing a table from scratch in FF7, the time it would take him to model a shitty looking ps3 quality one instead of a ps5 quality one would be roughly identical. The only thing different would be the materials hes using. If anything, creating different LODs for each object takes more time than having nanite take care of it in UE5.
I think Sony studios do enjoy a certain autonomy not afforded to other studios. I find it weird that Sony allowed Ratchet, Demon Souls, Returnal, FF7 Rebirth, Forspoken, FF16, TLOU Part 1, and Spiderman 2 to be next gen only but drew the line at HFW, GOW, and GT7. Besides, we have quotes from GG and SSM devs saying they chose last gen.
Regardless, it doesnt matter. Its not like any of their next gen games look even remotely close to the Matrix and other UE5 demos. If you want to blame Sony the publisher instead of Sony's developers, thats fine. Doesnt change the fact that the best studios have failed to deliver this gen.
Bert Big Balls
Member
I think you might be right about diminishing returns. Even my partner, who has no clue about technology or even cares about the quality of what she's watching, said to me the other day that she can't see things like pictures getting much better quality than they are. If even she thinks that, then there must be something to it lmao.
That demo runs on 30fps with drops. It's not even a full game yet.
So indeed the Matrix Demo is something for maybe the next 2 generations.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Show her this and ask her if she thinks we cant get any better than this.
I bet it took them longer to create these shitty ps3 era assets than creating photorealistic ones or borrowing them from quixel megascans.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
We have to discuss the turds in order to appreciate the games where devs did put in the effort. I am seeing a lot of people talk about FF16 in light of Rebirth's underwhelming graphics. it's great to see games like FF16 and Star Wars finally get their due after being shat on last year for their shortcomings. Even Rebirth despite its shortcomings is doing some pretty cool things in other areas. So in that sense it wouldnt have been possible last gen, but I think shitting on shitty graphics is a large part of this thread.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Why was this not posted here? it has thousands of NPCs on screen at once and the concept is absolutely hilarious.
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
rhodesianshepard
Banned
Ratchet, Demon Souls, and Returnal were games made to sell the PS5 during its launch period. None of those games cost more than 60mil to make. There was no way GOWR or HFW would logically come to PS5 exclusively, it would have made no business sense. It's one of the reasons why Sony is going to have 7-8 single player games dropping in 2026-2027, when the userbase on PS5 is closer to 80-90mil. The games will actually be able to recoup their costs
But if DS2 visuals don't impress you than i just think you are living your own bubble. Matrix demo is highly curated to achieve those visuals
Balducci30
Member
It bothers me that this gif of this person from a 360 era game is largely comparable to some of the games released this year. It actually looks better than many player characters I’ve seen this generation.I think it's tricky because it depends on what you are looking for.
If you just care about pure visuals and ignoring all context then I think Beyond had some impressive graphics for the time:
But the gameplay is very limited, movement when playing is stiff and the environments are small
Games like Uncharted 3, TLOU, Gears 3 and God of War 3 don't have the same quality models but they have way more impressive gameplay with cool setpiece moments that still hold up with games today. But they are still linear games with relatively small environments.
Then you have the open world stuff like GTAIV, RDR, AC 3/Black Flag, etc which don't look as good up close but have a way more impressive scale with big open environments a lot of NPCs
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Balducci30
Member
Holy shit how has no one thought of this concept before this is amazing
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
i think they are very impressive. We are talking about Matrix quality visuals and they don’t come close that’s all.
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ResetEraVetVIP
Member
I’m talking pure fidelity. Graphics.
ResetEraVetVIP
Member
You're expectation was for this level of quality to be what to expect ingame on PS5.,
So yeah, vastly over estimating whats actually possible.
I was looking at the kingsglaive demo, I'll admit I meant to say PS6
Those expectations ARE possible, but I’ll say it again, devs aren’t using the PS5s power. Here are some realtime demos on PS5.
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Bojji
Member
We have to discuss the turds in order to appreciate the games where devs did put in the effort. I am seeing a lot of people talk about FF16 in light of Rebirth's underwhelming graphics. it's great to see games like FF16 and Star Wars finally get their due after being shat on last year for their shortcomings. Even Rebirth despite its shortcomings is doing some pretty cool things in other areas. So in that sense it wouldnt have been possible last gen, but I think shitting on shitty graphics is a large part of this thread.
I was too harsh on 16 for sure, Rebirth made me appreciate how next gen it was compared to to it.
Lethal01
Member
See this is all you needed to say to show you have no idea what you are talking about, nothing is coming close to pre-rendered CGI.
Reminds me of when Chiefda tried to claim Spiderman 2 was gonna easily get close to its prerendered trailer, something no PS5 game has done, or will do.
ChiefDada
Gold Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
They look fairly close to cg to me. Especially the cutscenes in the matrix and the lion demos.
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Lethal01
Member
People have said this since ps3 generation, it means nothing.
Yeah well just a couple days ago you couldn't even see the difference in quality in rebirths models from the low poly rebirth ones so that means about as much as that other guys partner saying things can't better.
A game like Horizon and probably avatar are fine examples, but the scale of everything else you mentioned just it silly to compare compare to the other. Not only the scale of the world but the scope of the project and its gameplay and graphical features in general make FF7 a much more ambitious project than something like Alan wake, that games enemy variety is just abysmal.
FF7R has ugly, glaring issues but there were many good reasons for large scale AAA games to not just immediately switch over to UE5 mid development, the freedom to attempt to do so is definitely a perk of those smaller games from smaller devs. Those "build an open world in 2 hours" videos are good for making portfolios and learning the tools but making an actual open world for an actual game with gameplay and graphical constraints is a completey different scenario.
The FF7 devs fucked up in a lot of ways, But sticking to UE4 was likely a good call. Unless you look at it from the perspective that maybe the issues it caused could force them to delay the game for a year or 2. But a consistent release schedule is not a negative.
Get back to eating crow.
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I'd say Uncharted 2. Uncharted 3 was more spectacular, but for me it felt like it was just pushing the hardware that bit too far. I think Uncharted 2 sort of hangs together better because of that.
I think the Insomniac leaks stated that Wolverine is targeting 60fps, although whether they stick to that who knows.
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
Shame about 60fps.
It only took me one evening to get used to 30fps in rebirth and it’s perfect. I have no problems with that mode at all.
Each to their own, but I'm fairly set on not going back to 30fps now. I'm jealous of people who can't see/can ignore how shit it looks. For me it's a fallacy to say you get used to it, because the trade-off is still equivalent: before you get used to it, it's a matter of 60fps looking nice vs 30 looking atrocious; after you get used to it it's more like 30 looking tolerable vs 60 looking spectacular.
The gulf to the alternative is there regardless of how "used to it" you are.
rhodesianshepard
Banned
I don't think it said that anywhere. The test material was in 60 fps, which doesn't mean much. The reason I believe it will be 30fps is because there were slides in a presentation(leak) that wanted graphic fidelity to be on par with Hellblade 2. If that is the case, no chance it will be 60fps
I also think any AAA single player game Sony releases after 2025 will target 30 FPS. By the time the PS6 comes out in 2027 or 2028, it will entice players to double dip for the 60fps experience
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rofif
Can’t Git Gud
4k30 is so much more worth it to me because I can always see bad image quality but I get used to 30 quickly. Granted if it’s good 30 and not this laggy crap we get often. Ff16 also had good 30.
Alternative is 60 and while it’s great, I also get used to it quickly to the point poor iq bothers me more than I get from playing at 60.
I mean it’s not ignorance or some inability to see it. I will see it always from 1000km away when I want to.
I just choose to let my brain adapt and I bet many people would be surprised by their brains flexibility. Don’t look at anything 60 for 2 days, he’ll do some 20 fps limits in there and then 30 will seem smooth as butter lol
Balducci30
Member
The 60fps thing is so overblown. I played it the first year I had the new consoles and then chose graphics mode from then on. It’s nice but you get used to 30fps very quickly - and I’m on OLED. I can’t believe people are willingly trying to limit technological advances for that mode
Lethal01
Member
Worth noting that the PS5 seems to have an issue when its set to enable VRR in unsupported game causing them to be much worse and leaving people with a bad impression.
amigastar
Member
I couldn't imagine playing Doom or Quake 3 with 30fps only. 60fps is not overblown it should be the standard.
rhodesianshepard
Banned
1st person shooters need to be 60fps. 3rd person, not so much
PUNKem733
Member
God of war 3/Ascension EASILY.
Senua
Gold Member
Or use your 3080 equipped PC to get quality modes at 60fps
JCreasy
Member
Y’all . . . will it run like this on consoles? If we see this on PS5, could be a watershed moment this gen.
It look like Nanite and Lumen are in full use here. Has anyone heard different?
Insanely dense geometry. Particle effects are simply stunning.
Also, this is the fidelity I wanted from Rebirth. Hope we get there by the third installment.
That tiger fur is amazing. The best in-game fur I’ve ever seen. An industry best. Fight me.
It look like Nanite and Lumen are in full use here. Has anyone heard different?
Insanely dense geometry. Particle effects are simply stunning.
Also, this is the fidelity I wanted from Rebirth. Hope we get there by the third installment.
That tiger fur is amazing. The best in-game fur I’ve ever seen. An industry best. Fight me.
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ChiefDada
Gold Member
Yeah I'm not sure what you're seeing exactly. it looks ok but nothing spectacular. Anyways, I'm pretty sure the game is being developed on UE4, i.e. no Lumen or Nanite.
Senua
Gold Member
Yea dude it's no Spiderman 2
It's unreal engine 5, where have you been mate? Game looks awesome.
As for running well on consoles. Hopefully but I'm sure it's going to be heavy, maybe one for the Pro..
ChiefDada
Gold Member
Giallo Corsa
Gold Member
The supported games being only those that support a 40Hz option (like Horizon forbidden wear and Hogwart's) ?
Edit : The better question would be, how to know if a game supports VRR ? I don't think it's necessarily tied to the 40Hz option, correct ?
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Pharaoh 117
Member
Games with 40fps option work in the 120Hz mode. The VRR range is from 48 to 120Hz.
Lethal01
Member
I have no idea really, I only found out cause people noticed it while playing FF7 Rebirth.
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