Guild Wars 2 |OT| Buy Once, Sub Never, Fun Forever

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arimanius said:
Damn, I've played most mmorpgs since OU and raided since EQ but apparently I don't have a good background in pve cooperative play. :(
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Do you actually have some objective reasons why GW2 has good team based cooperative pve gameplay?

What encounters had strict team play requirements in order to successfully complete? Where are the mechanics that actually test controlled, deliberate team based strategy and decision making?
 
Songbird said:
I agree with Tekno. PvE can be a cakewalk but bullshit bosses like the Metrica reactor's Fire Elemental feed on your tears and repair money.

It spawns fire aoe fields under downed players. Really, now?
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That's not the elemental spawning the aoe, that's the embers flying around. Until people figure that out and get off the damn bridge, stop trying to res people and KILL THE EMBERS FIRST, it's going to be pretty sorrowful.
 
A lot of people say to do dungeons in this game, you have to let go of your previous MMO-mindset... and that's perfectly fine. But the game doesn't even teach you how to properly progress through dungeons and how to deal with the absurd damage and aggro-table of mobs. I mean, in almost all of the dynamic events I experienced on the road to 80, all I had to do was trait pure damage, sit in front of a mob, and 100 blades it to death. Maybe roll once or twice. Then you try out the first dungeon and an Ascalonian Ranger (which are piss weak out in the normal world) ends up wiping your whole team clean. Learning how to use combos and how to buff/debuff your team is really, really tough for a lot of people when there are zero tutorials before that.

I'm level 80, have 200 Ascalonian Tears stocked up, and I still haven't figured out how to do the last trash mobs in the AC Explore cannon room without wiping a million times. I just don't understand the threat management. I dodge away, use heal, blow utility spells and stuns when the ghosts focus me. They end up hugging my ass and I die instantly with no way to retaliate. There's no way for other players to "pull" the mobs off of me -- the mobs get stunned and then come right on sailing towards me anyway. What's the sense in that?
 
erragal said:
Do you actually have some objective reasons why GW2 has good team based cooperative pve gameplay?

What encounters had strict team play requirements in order to successfully complete? Where are the mechanics that actually test controlled, deliberate team based strategy and decision making?
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Nope. That was more tongue in cheek than anything else. I didn't expect pve encounters to use the old standard mechanics in gw2. They really can't do that if they want to keep their word of not having a holy trinity.
 
erragal said:
But why have it be a dedicated group activity at all? They could have made all the dungeons world available dynamic events and scale the numbers and they'd have the same personal difficulty. The whole purpose of team based pve gameplay is to create team reliances that require meaningful timing/coordination.
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I think the dungeons were their attempt at creating a more intimate environment where friends or randoms could exist outside of a giant mob of people. A large reason as to why PvE is a clusterfuck is due to the sheer number of people involved who blast their attacks and cloud the screen in magic and swords.

In a closed space, they could tailor enemies to give a better hint of when to dodge, etc. It's more likely that Anet added it in order to cater to everyone. It doesn't really hurt the game and the dungeons are definitely more difficult than a giant dragon attacking 40+ people where not a single one of those people died, making the dragon seem like a wuss because it kind of just sits there.

Also, certain classes can still bring certain elements to the table that promote cooperative gameplay. Condition removal, healing, granting aegis, etc. For example, I know that when facing a Golem and it begins to slightly crouch I should run, stand right in front of it, and drop a projectile reflecting wall so it a) doesn't decimate my team and b) causes the mob to inflict heavy damage to itself.

Boogdud said:
That's not the elemental spawning the aoe, that's the embers flying around. Until people figure that out and get off the damn bridge, stop trying to res people and KILL THE EMBERS FIRST, it's going to be pretty sorrowful.
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Fun tidbit - that same boss appears later in a level 50-60 zone. But the objective instead is "kill the embers to weaken the boss!"
 
I wouldn't judge PVE encounters one week in to a game with a new pve system that requires new ways of thinking. I'd wait a few months before declaring the PVE mindless. As in, I'd wait until there's enough time to really figure them out.

I also don't find raiding to be all that with regards to challenge. You learn the dance steps to the raid boss, do the dance steps and beat the boss. They've been recycling dance steps for awhile now, so raids have gotten a bit stale. You then have elements that are just gear checks and gear checks are not a genuine challenge.
 
Wtf is this?

gw0095vu6i.jpg
 
Milly79 said:
People in guild do it quite often. I never understood it.
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do what? how does he have that much gold or did he change the number somehow when he linked it? he said in chat:

"just got lucky playing the auction house"

and then later mentioned how he "bought 60 of the lvl 60 training books to mess with my guildies"
 
arimanius said:
Nope. That was more tongue in cheek than anything else. I didn't expect pve encounters to use the old standard mechanics in gw2. They really can't do that if they want to keep their word of not having a holy trinity.
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I'm fine with non standard mechanics... but you better make those mechanics clear, concise and consistent.

I'm not particularly attached to the holy trinity myself ; I usually play hybrid characters. because I enjoy personal versatility. That can still be slotted into a game where there are at least clear indicators of primary boss targets, clean particle effects that emphasize enemy indicators as a priority, and an emphasis on mechanics such as mini burn down phases with strict timers, ally rescue mechanics, team positioning checks, actual boss room lockouts, and even requiring specific conditions or boons as a counter to a mechanic. So many ways to improve teamwork without having a whack a mole healer.
 
"Given sufficient time, shouldn't most every character have level 400 in all crafting disciplines?"


Yep, but high end crafting recipes for the other disciplines require quite a bit of rare materials, cooking not so much. You can reliably farm most of those materials quickly without relying on luck like you would for "fine" crafting materials and ectoplasms. The price on a lot of stuff on the AH will probably creep down over time, a lot of people are just overeager because they finally had an auction house for 48 hours. :/
 
etiolate said:
I wouldn't judge PVE encounters one week in to a game with a new pve system that requires new ways of thinking. I'd wait a few months before declaring the PVE mindless. As in, I'd wait until there's enough time to really figure them out.

I also don't find raiding to be all that with regards to challenge. You learn the dance steps to the raid boss, do the dance steps and beat the boss. They've been recycling dance steps for awhile now, so raids have gotten a bit stale. You then have elements that are just gear checks and gear checks are not a genuine challenge.
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The combat is no more complex or demanding than any other MMO. Just like you claim you learn the dance steps, so will players learn the dance steps of the encounters in GW2 fights.
 
Teknopathetic said:
"Given sufficient time, shouldn't most every character have level 400 in all crafting disciplines?"


Yep, but high end crafting recipes for the other disciplines require quite a bit of rare materials, cooking not so much. You can reliably farm most of those materials quickly without relying on luck like you would for "fine" crafting materials and ectoplasms. The price on a lot of stuff on the AH will probably creep down over time, a lot of people are just overeager because they finally had an auction house for 48 hours. :/
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Ah. Well then once I max cooking I guess I'll spend time in another crafting discipline.
 
MOTHERF&&&&&***AW*Ew*

gw002a.jpg


Turns out the PVP ones were easy with infinite world selection...I checked every zone is 100%, the only thing I can see I may have missed is the island southwest of Lions Arch - how do I get to it?
 
Oh wow, just learned this today:

Yo, your problem is that the game doesn't scale you based on your gear level compared to the dungeon level: It scales you based on your gear compared to your character level.

So you had complete shit gear for a level 80, that means that when you went into a level 50 dungeon you were scaled down so that you have stats that are complete shit for a level 50.
I completely disagree with this method of scaling, but that's how the game is coded right now.
What you need to do is either find easy level 80 rares/masterwork or wait for the trading post to get up and buy a decent level 80 starter set. It looks like we might have the TP going from today on, so most of your problems aren't actually going to be an issue going forward.
All of your difficulty issues are because of your gear level.
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What the fuck man. I'm weaker than a level 35 in AC explore because not all of my gear is 80 yet.
 
Artanisix said:
Oh wow, just learned this today:



What the fuck man. I'm weaker than a level 35 in AC explore because not all of my gear is 80 yet.
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It makes perfect sense really. I like the way they implemented it, means you can't just ignore your gear just because you're leveled. They truly scaled it.
 
LumpOfCole said:
I want to wear the GAF Backpack but there's a problem with them on asura right now.
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Anyone else notice (at least on my asura engi, don't have any of the other races) that the backpacks are switched for kits? The bomb pack has grenades hanging off of it, and the grenade kit has what look to be bombs hanging off of it?
 
erragal said:
I'm fine with non standard mechanics... but you better make those mechanics clear, concise and consistent.

I'm not particularly attached to the holy trinity myself ; I usually play hybrid characters. because I enjoy personal versatility. That can still be slotted into a game where there are at least clear indicators of primary boss targets, clean particle effects that emphasize enemy indicators as a priority, and an emphasis on mechanics such as mini burn down phases with strict timers, ally rescue mechanics, team positioning checks, actual boss room lockouts, and even requiring specific conditions or boons as a counter to a mechanic. So many ways to improve teamwork without having a whack a mole healer.
Click to expand...

I agree with everything you just said. I've been apart of so many mmorpg launches that I'm use to pve end game being ok at the beginning. I'll give anet a couple of months to tweak and add more technical encounters before I start getting to concern about it. In the meantime I'll do some spvp and wvw which I really enjoy.

One thing they have to do is explain the mechanics and just the overall game better. IMO that's their biggest failure post launch. Their "tutorial" was horrible and they just haven't explained the game mechanics very well at all.
 
Artanisix said:
I don't like it. I don't like feeling weaker than I was 50 levels ago. That makes no sense to me.
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It makes sense because you get gear in dungeons equal to your current level. So going into a dungeon wearing lvl 35 items and expecting lvl 80 gear is ridiculous. In theory you wouldn't have to worry about incremental gear upgrades at all. You'd just hit this dungeon for a huge upgrade at the end.
 
So my team just got trounced in TA, going to take a break for an hour and then try and get more people together.

We had several problems, 1. One of our guys rushed and never listened (he was a guildie, doubt I'll be asking him to go again -_-), 2. The knights near the start, they hit HARD, 3. the hounds that killed us several time not long after the first champion (and after some archers/cultists/etc). They mobbed us easily.

Two people ended up leaving after that :/
 
Ferrio said:
It makes sense because you get gear in dungeons equal to your current level. So going into a dungeon wearing lvl 35 items and expecting lvl 80 gear is ridiculous. In theory you wouldn't have to worry about incremental gear upgrades at all. You'd just hit this dungeon for a huge upgrade at the end.
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He's not talking about loot scaling to your gear and level, he's talking about your character scaling down compared to your gear and level.

So say at level 50, you've got this badass sword that's really good for your level and you feel really powerful. At level 80, you could be use a level 72 sword for a while. When you go to that level 50 zone, you'll be underperforming the average level 50 player, and be doing worse than you, yourself did 30 levels ago.
 
Stuart444 said:
So my team just got trounced in TA, going to take a break for an hour and then try and get more people together.

We had several problems, 1. One of our guys rushed and never listened (he was a guildie, doubt I'll be asking him to go again -_-), 2. The knights near the start, they hit HARD, 3. the hounds that killed us several time not long after the first champion (and after some archers/cultists/etc). They mobbed us easily.

Two people ended up leaving after that :/
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That's a real shame. TA is really not that hard with a good group. I wish I was in the mood for a dungeon today, as I would join you.
 
Littlegator said:
He's not talking about loot scaling to your gear and level, he's talking about your character scaling down compared to your gear and level.

So say at level 50, you've got this badass sword that's really good for your level and you feel really powerful. At level 80, you could be use a level 72 sword for a while. When you go to that level 50 zone, you'll be underperforming the average level 50 player, and be doing worse than you, yourself did 30 levels ago.
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Right, and I gave you my explanation why that makes sense. The dungeon rewards you with your current level type gear. So if you're going to receive rewards based on that, then you should be held accountable for your current gear in relation to your level. Not to mention the dungeon experience isn't suppose to change much as you level up. If you're wearing underleveled gear in relation to your level it should hurt your progress no matter what level you truely are.
 
None of these stat combos on the Exotic heavy armor is very appealing for Guardian. XD

Power/Healing Power/Condition Damage? @_@

What would you level 80 Guardians say I should work towards stacking in terms of armor stats? Really can't decide if I want to stay burn/critical signets sword build for fear of too many damage dealers LFGing at dungeons, or if I should go support Guardian with a staff and Sword plus Shield or Mace with a lot of shouts.
 
LumpOfCole said:
I want to wear the GAF Backpack but there's a problem with them on asura right now.
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Before this thread blows up...

How do I get a GAF backpack? I only have around 25 silver and am level 19, but those look awesome!

Are they just for appearance or do they serve a purpose? Also how do you get the GAF logo on your gear?
 
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