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Guild Wars 2 |OT3| Two Week Updates, One Box, Zero Subscriptions

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Lunar15

Member
There needs to be a reward you can only get from completing the invasion. Farming is part of all economy games, that's not surprising to anyone. I can't say "hey guys, stop farming". That's silly. It's part of the game, no matter what anyone says.

Instead, there are really only two ways to mitgate that kind of behavior: Tailoring rewards to fall at the end of the overall goal, rather than during. The other is to make the result a permanent inconvenience, something Anet's been shy of. The best example of these are CoE and CoF. If we don't do the event, we don't get access to the dungeon. This is often an annoyance though, so I'm not sure how to make this work.

There are certain core elements of GW2 that make it difficult to ever really answer a lot of its own problems. The focus on DPS is one of them. GW2 is a massively schizophrenic game in design. It wants to be many different, conflicting things. In many ways, I agree with many of the people that say GW2 is not the next "evolution" of MMO's, whatever that actually means. If anything, it's a refinement of many MMO aspects. But it's certainly not that "next generation".

MMO's are a vague, weird genre where fans actually don't often know what they want. They want this world that appears to be living, but they absolutely don't want to be inconvenienced. They want permanent change, but complain when they miss something. Everyone has this grand idea of what an MMO should be without considering the fact that many of the things they want aren't actually fun in practice.

/end weird rambling rant/ponderings
 

Levyne

Banned
MMO's are a vague, weird genre where fans actually don't often know what they want. They want this world that appears to be living, but they absolutely don't want to be inconvenienced. They want permanent change, but complain when they miss something. Everyone has this grand idea of what an MMO should be without considering the fact that many of the things they want aren't actually fun in practice.

I...I think I like this paragraph.
 
Colin replied to a comment I made in the latest Woodenpotatoes thread on reddit.
[–]kosluftar 7 points 1 hour ago
Yeah, your videos got me really excited and Colin saying that stuff will be tied together. I guess he just mean that we will know who is behind Aetherblades and Molten alliance.
I guess they want to use her for awhile as the main villain. I guess this is the main villain they talked about way back which a lot of people thought it was Canach.
I have a feeling we will never defeat her and she will just be the Gary to our Ash and will probably interfere with us whenever we try to accomplish anything.
[–]ArenaColin 7 points 40 minutes ago
That is indeed all I meant, but fear not...the rest of the story questions you may have will be answered all in due time. The Scarlet story has more chapters to come.

Scarlet story is just beginning I guess so don't get too upset because there is a lot more about her that they will explain in due time.
 

Retro

Member
Something along these lines happened in an overflow I was in last night. People just saying farm it, people getting mad at the farmers, and portals taking forever to close. 100 people following the 4 commander tags who never split up. We beat Scarlet with less than minute to go.

Just finished one in Iron Marches with seconds left; got hung up on the Aetherblades phase, as usual.

I wasn't referring to the general "Just farm it, guys!" comment, just this new tactic of trying to trick people into thinking they're going to fail. When I saw it this morning, it was literally 39 minutes in and they were already calling it a loss (the events are only 45 minutes long). By playing up this supposed rigid time schedule, they're getting people to stop the events at the Aetherblade stage so they "all can get something out of it." It's just flat out deception wearing the disguise of expertise.

/end weird rambling rant/ponderings

I feel like I owe this post a little time to consider and then reply. I'll come back to it later, after lunch.

Scarlet story is just beginning I guess so don't get too upset because there is a lot more about her that they will explain in due time.

Yeah, they said way back in February that we'd meet our "Sassy Nemesis" soon; I'm just shocked it took half a year to get here, but I guess it was a slow burn. I have a feeling she'll be around for a while, hopefully they explain a bit more so she's not just another Mary Sue.
 
It's just flat out deception wearing the disguise of expertise.

This is why I only listen to GAF in my chat boxes!

So has anyone noticed a lot of new players running around? I like the idea of returning to some starter zones and lending a hand. With the invasions going on, I would hate for new players to get the wrong idea that the game is "dead."

I think I'll return to Caledon, maybe run around there some instead of just hitting up wurm, maybe a jumping puzzle then splitting.
 

Levyne

Banned
Hmm. I'm sure I need a starter zone or two map completed on my warrior. I'll swing by if the lag/chat/atmosphere isn't bad.
 

Lunar15

Member
For tonal context: that ramble post was more of a ramble than criticism. I've loved the invasion every time. I was just responding to comments about farm v. not farm players.

It was more just a collection of random thoughts that have accumulated over time.
 

Katoki

Member
If you bringer lv to the invasion, say a lv 38, do you still get the two rares? what about the other rewards, like the satchels and stuff?

Yes to the exotic reward bags and satchels and what not. I can't remember for the life of me what level the rares were in the UI chest though.

Thanks. Hopefully we get that Karka event going Monday or w/e. I'm now itching to try this.

Edit: Going to need a third 18 slot safe box for gear now, lol.

I'm gunning for settlers on the warrior as well so hopefully we get it rolling on Saturday like Hawkian said.
 

Luigi87

Member
It's everyone's favourite bounty during an invasion

J88yZQu.jpg
 

Lunar15

Member
Incoming vague dev talk:

ColinJohanson:

I just want to remind folks again, the features and content you’d traditionally find in an expansion will absolutely be added to Gw2. The thing we haven’t decided is what form the release of that content would be presented in, be it a traditional expansion, living world, or some other form.
https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/gw2/Possibility-GW2-Never-Gets-Full-Expansion/first#post2688030

So... uh, that's a weird way of putting it.
 

Levyne

Banned
I'm gunning for settlers on the warrior as well so hopefully we get it rolling on Saturday like Hawkian said.

See:

I was thinking we'd do our Southsun Cove event on Sunday, but [paraphrased: no].

We can visit the Karka Queen on Monday night if that works for people.

But Maybe I'll get a set for the warrior too whenever it happens. Only one of mine without at least one armor swap.

Incoming vague dev talk:

Colin said:
I just want to remind folks again, the features and content you’d traditionally find in an expansion will absolutely be added to Gw2. The thing we haven’t decided is what form the release of that content would be presented in, be it a traditional expansion, living world, or some other form.


https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/game/gw2/Possibility-GW2-Never-Gets-Full-Expansion/first#post2688030

So... uh, that's a weird way of putting it.

I believe someone said something similar before (about the determination of a delivery method) but only in a stream and not written anywhere. In some ways the possibility of traditional boxed expansion is a bit comforting..
 

Proven

Member
Fair enough, but the point is spvp is the place to learn new playstyles for free. Shaman/spirit rangers have become effective bunkers.

I've become a much stronger offensive player with my recent spvp experience and build honing. It will be interesting to see if I can still tolerate my cleric gear when I return to wvw.
It's one thing I enjoy about PvP; it feels like it rewards the most builds/playstyles.

If you bringer lv to the invasion, say a lv 38, do you still get the two rares? what about the other rewards, like the satchels and stuff?

No and Yes. If you're too low a level to equip rares, you generally are going to not get rares. However, level 30 is the point you're able to start getting rares, so you're good to go.
 

Retro

Member
Will Update this post as he streams, until somebody else replies then I'll do a new post. Refresh it to see new details!

Hmm... "Improved Swiftness" in WvW via Supply Mastery, grants 50% speed increase (regular Swiftness is only 30%)... and he hinted that it may appear elsewhere.

He just called it "Courier Speed."

Treb Mastery allows you to inflict the "Supply Spoilage" debuff via the Cow Launch, which removes enemy supply if people stand in the cloud.
It also has a new skill, "Healing Oasis" that can heal people. This isn't exactly good news, but it's cool to see in action. Acts as a water field too.
The last step in the Treb Mastery actually can drain supply from supply points it hits. Looks like it removes 10 supply per hit.
 

Retro

Member
That last one is brutal toward our affinity for holding towers in range of hills. T.T

I was just thinking, you could drop a treb somewhere and just completely choke off an enemy's supply. Not just caravans, but the actual camps could be drained to zero. No supply = no siege, that's kind of insane... especially if you can treb those positions with impunity from relatively safe places.

More Updates:
Burning Oil mastery can remove supply and get a defensive bubble now.
Mortar Mastery now gives you a ground-targeted multi-missile attack.

Q: New Seige in the Future?
A: Right now we're not looking into it, but are always thinking about it.
 

Rafterman

Banned
As the on-going epic struggle between people doing the Invasion Events and the people who want to just farm, the latest maneuver seems to be the farmers feigning expertise by being time nazis in map chat. After about 5-10 minutes they will begin shouting "Oh darn, we are 30 seconds off schedule, we have zero chance of doing this guys. Just make the most of it and farm!"

Of course, this leads to a lot of people believing it, and so it actually starts to happen; people start farming and the ones trying to fight back the Invasion see their numbers drop and things really do fall apart.

Every single event this morning has played out like this.

They just nerfed the loot again, btw. When you fail you get less items than before and the items that are coming out of those boxes seem decidedly worse. I also have this strange issue on my Warrior, since the first nerf patch, where every single item i get has healing stats on it.

If I could figure out which zone I need to finish this last Achievement I'd stop doing them completely, but since I have no way of knowing I think I'm just going to join them and afk/play WoW until I get lucky. I have no desire to run these things any more, they aren't fun IMO. At least in Rift the invasions actually invaded and attacked towns, took over zones, etc. Here they just sit there waiting for you to run up and kill them. We aren't even fighting back an invasion, we are waiting for the medal so we can't leave what's up and run to the next portal as quick a possible. Bleh.
 

Retro

Member
Q: Will you add new Masteries?
A: Will will continue to push WvW lines out as needed, for all Masteries. They've gotta be cool, we don't just want to push them out to all be 10.

New Feature appears to be 5 control points in the (now-drained) lake that, if all 5 are captured, you get a "Borderlands Bloodlust" buff. So they've basically removed the Krait and Quaggan entirely and the middle of the map is now going to be open with a new objective within. VERY nice.

When you fail you get less items than before and the items that are coming out of those boxes seem decidedly worse. I also have this strange issue on my Warrior, since the first nerf patch, where every single item i get has healing stats on it.

Anecdotal, but I picked up a Deathwish and Bonetti's Rapier this morning, so I think you're just unlucky. My warrior has also been getting a variety of gear; Rampager's, Berserker's, some cleric stuff but not really one specific stat weighting. I think I would have noticed.
 

Hawkian

The Cryptarch's Bane
They just nerfed the loot again, btw. When you fail you get less items than before and the items that are coming out of those boxes seem decidedly worse.
Hmm. Are you able to be any more specific?
If I could figure out which zone I need to finish this last Achievement I'd stop doing them completely
Is it just that you want the points for that individual achievement? It's not necessary for the meta, or to get access to the pavilion.
 

Proven

Member
Q: Will you add new Masteries?
A: Will will continue to push WvW lines out as needed, for all Masteries. They've gotta be cool, we don't just want to push them out to all be 10.

New Feature appears to be 5 control points in the (now-drained) lake that, if all 5 are captured, you get a "Borderlands Bloodlust" buff. So they've basically removed the Krait and Quaggan entirely and the middle of the map is now going to be open with a new objective within. VERY nice.

It was such a tease. It looks like there will be siege equipment you can use, based on the one point they showed.

People are going to laugh since some cynical minded people predicted fighting over capture points in the center of the map. More objectives were needed though. My only issue is that the maps are still a little tight for this.
 

Hawkian

The Cryptarch's Bane
Will wait to see how it plays I suppose. Something to do besides sieging or havoc on the BLs isn't bad.

I think I may actually do a little newbie tour for our WvW thing tonight (I should be there at 9PM to lead), if there are people in on the free trial that want to see a little of what wuvwuv is like.
 

Retro

Member
It was such a tease. It looks like there will be siege equipment you can use, based on the one point they showed.

People are going to laugh since some cynical minded people predicted fighting over capture points in the center of the map. More objectives were needed though. My only issue is that the maps are still a little tight for this.

What might be really cool is if there's a little bit of a meta game where each control point has some kind of benefit; do you try to grab the SW point, which has siege, to help grab the others nearby, or do you go to the northern one which us easily defensible? Maybe one of the points actually has a 'mini supply camp' that helps you set up siege or something?

Obviously we have no idea what it entails and that's just speculation, but it's a hell of a lot better than the big, empty lake in the middle, and I could see this drawing Havok squads or even pulling from the Zerg... lots of desirable objectives around the map will make large Zergs inefficient, just like the PVE-side Invasion is doing.
 

Lunar15

Member
If I could figure out which zone I need to finish this last Achievement I'd stop doing them completely, but since I have no way of knowing I think I'm just going to join them and afk/play WoW until I get lucky. I have no desire to run these things any more, they aren't fun IMO.

But then why do you continue to do them? For the achievement? Don't mistake my tone here, I'm inquisitive: is the reward of the achievement so compelling that you'd continue to do something you don't enjoy in order to get it? Why would you play a game in AFK when really you'd much rather be playing another game much more? I just don't get the self-punishment.
 

Jira

Member
See:



But Maybe I'll get a set for the warrior too whenever it happens. Only one of mine without at least one armor swap.



I believe someone said something similar before (about the determination of a delivery method) but only in a stream and not written anywhere. In some ways the possibility of traditional boxed expansion is a bit comforting..

You know the big issue with boxed expansions is it'll take them 1.5-2 years to release it. Last we heard they haven't started working on it yet. So we would see the first expansion in roughly 2015. Personally, it's a hell of a lot more preferable to get that stuff added in every two weeks as its finished versus waiting 1.5-2 years. Even if some feature takes 6 months to develop, you get it in 6 months instead of having to wait 3-4x longer while they package it all and then charge you for it. I think they could even do big quarterly "mini-expansion" releases if they don't want to do it with the two week schedule. As much as people love the idea of all this new stuff in one go, you have to wait 1-2 years before you get it and as I said I prefer to just get it as soon as each part is finished. Keeps you interested and playing versus oh well I'll stop playing till the expansion as some people have said they'd do.
 
MMO's are a vague, weird genre where fans actually don't often know what they want. They want this world that appears to be living, but they absolutely don't want to be inconvenienced. They want permanent change, but complain when they miss something. Everyone has this grand idea of what an MMO should be without considering the fact that many of the things they want aren't actually fun in practice.

/end weird rambling rant/ponderings

I can agree with this.

I remember during launch when people complained about how hard the dungeons were; now we have people who complain about the lack of challenge.

Then there were people who complained about not having enough mini-games in the game. A half a dozen seasonal and another have a dozen permanent mini-games later, people are complaining about too much fluff.

Also remember the time when people complained they couldn't farm or how Anet "hated" farmers? Now there are people who complain about Farmwars 2.

Heck, I have a couple of friends who say there isn't any endgame in GW2. I just roll my eyes and think back to the day when we went to PAX12 together and they complained about how bored they were and there was nothing to do in Seattle, WA. Which leads me to my theory about the people who complain about the lack of endgame in GW2 are also the type of people who would sit at the fountain in a middle of a Theme Park and complain how bored they are or that there isn't anything to do.

Now take everything I just said in the last paragraph and compare it to the people who complain that the game is too overwhelming with stuff and can't keep up with the updates.
 

Lunar15

Member
I will say that there are genuine benefits to a boxed expansion that an incremental system can't possibly imitate.

One of the weird things about the current invasions is that they seem like a neat mechanic mapped to a world where they don't exactly fit. A boxed expansion would, theoretically speaking, allow them to build a world that this kind of mechanic made sense in.

That's just one thing though. I'm pointlessly speculating. I like the living world too, but I certainly don't discount the desire for a full fledged expansion. Sometimes it does feel like we're getting bites of cake than a full slice.
 

Levyne

Banned
I can agree with that. When aetherblades are attacking and overlapping the event where you have to collect samples to heal poisoned ebon vanguard...just not cohesive.
 

Jira

Member
I will say that there are genuine benefits to a boxed expansion that an incremental system can't possibly imitate.

One of the weird things about the current invasions is that they seem like a neat mechanic mapped to a world where they don't exactly fit. A boxed expansion would, theoretically speaking, allow them to build a world that this kind of mechanic made sense in.

That's just one thing though. I'm pointlessly speculating. I like the living world too, but I certainly don't discount the desire for a full fledged expansion. Sometimes it does feel like we're getting bites of cake than a full slice.

Right. They've run the numbers and found that when they were doing monthly updates, people would play for two weeks, stop, and then come back with the next release, play for two weeks and so on. So they then switched to the two week model and people don't stop playing. A lack of things to do is a big issue for MMOs in general, especially for ones that don't get updated very often. With a constant stream of new content and features rolling in every two weeks, it's pretty much impossible to think about stopping. More content/features means people keep playing, when people keep playing it means more potential income which then translates back into more content/features. It's a win/win for everyone.
 

Ashodin

Member
Unfortunately Lunar is exactly right on the story and stuff lololol

Barely any story in-game? Let's write up a whole thing that you have to read online to understand it all!
 
Unfortunately Lunar is exactly right on the story and stuff lololol

Barely any story in-game? Let's write up a whole thing that you have to read online to understand it all!

In-game stuff already explained about her education and her claims to know the grand design. All this story did was illuminate specifics of her past. It doesn't even give any real context about her true desire. Just a vague goal.
 

Lunar15

Member
Ceara. Hm.

Hm, indeed.

So here you go, here's her backstory, everyone. No big mysteries there. No dragons or great forces, just a mary sue and a plan. Hell, at the very least, it would have been kind of neat to see her conversation with the Pale tree in a cutscene, but nope, here's a blog post.

Not like this, Anet.

afro-shaking-head-no.gif
 

Shanlei91

Sonic handles my blue balls
I would love to hear about a player's experience who doesn't read GW2 e-mails, doesn't read any news sites, doesn't read dulfy.

Just lives their life and turns on GW2 every once in a while. What kind of an experience would that be.
 
That story just made her sounds like an even bigger bitch.

She saw a tree...she didn't like what she saw, so now she is going to burn the world down.

So far I think she is the equivalent to Traherne except that she is suppose to be evil.
 

Hawkian

The Cryptarch's Bane
Things ended suddenly and badly, however, when Ceara and her krewmate Teyo broke into the city’s archives and tampered with several of the designs they found there. It was presented to her as a means to give the Inquest a competitive edge in the upcoming Snaff Prize competitions, but Ceara also left her stamp on a few unrelated projects she found.
Vague memories of the very early personal story. Teyo's in there. Wonder if this specifically refers to any other projects.
 

markot

Banned
Pretty bad story and character....

They need to lose their hard on for the sylvari...

The whole plotline is so stupid....
 
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