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[Morokh]

Whatever the situation is regarding what they have ready/planned or not, there is one thing I feel they failed at since the original announcement, and that is setting the scope of this expansion.

Usually, when someone first introduces an expansion you get a general overview of what to expect even if you don't necessarily get the details. ( X new maps with X zones, X new Dungeons, X new raids, classes, battlegrounds, whatever etc .... )
It doesn't spill the beans on everything but tries at least to give a rough idea of the overall quantity of content you can expect.

For HoT, we didn't even get that.

People got excited in the first place, because 'YAY ! new stuff' but let's face it the original announcement (and the following interviews) didn't say much and basically established an overall concept that's pretty much it.

We know about a few things by now (Stronghold, the new Borderland, Specializations, or should I say, Masteries) for the rest, which usually consists of the meatiest bit of an expansion, like new zones, challenging group content, and content in general it's as vague as it can be ( and the few tidbits we have, have most people completely confused)
It's kind of weird, cause it's quite a hot topic really considering that on top of that the base game kind of missed the mark on some of those things.

But even for what they've shown us, there is always something off as well.
We still don't know how Stronghold will fit in the map selection for PvP which will play a big part in the way people will be able to enjoy it (or not).
The new Borderland looks cool, and so do the new systems implemented into it, but the main map (Eternal Battleground) remaining the same is a bit odd, so is their mention or rotating Borderlands with the old ones from time to time (on what type of schedule ? How will the new mechanics work in those maps if they even are implemented there ?)
The reworked trait system into masteries, and the additional masteries are nice, and it definitely looks like the system will be more future-proof for adding new ones, and yet with only one Specialization to begin with, it won't feel any different than the usual 'let's add a bunch of new skill to this class and call it a day'

Then, Anet's presentation so far has focused on systems, creating, and showing us some that will be easier to expand upon (which, don't get me wrong is a very good thing).
The thing is the community craves for content, not only in-game because we're in an off season with nothing to look forward to but the expansion (wich seems to slip further and further away), but also because many could use some new stuff to do that is different from the Vanilla game they've been playing for the last 3 years.
I mean, a simple look at Reddit after the last beta and there was almost as much threads asking questions on things like Dungeons, Challenging group content, to new armor skins than threads talking about the Beta experience.
Systems are nice, and they enable content, but that's the thing, they're nothing without significant content to back them up which is more and more what people want to see.

One could also say that they are very good a refining/coming up with new and improved systems, yet not that good at actually supporting and expanding them, which isn't entirely false either ...

They clearly only have shown us a fraction of what they intend to deliver with the final product, for obvious reasons (not finished enough, things changing as they go along ...), and in there are some aspects of the game they have still to show us that will be very important for this expansion, but yeah, right now .... it is still kind of hard to shake the feeling that they are cooking something else than a big feature-patch labelled as an expansion.

 

[Thorgal]

Welp it has happened.

Wildstar is now F2P

 

[XT Vengeance]

Welp it has happened.

Wildstar is now F2P

Eh. That game was not very fun, at least not when I played it that week it was in beta. Guild Wars is way better in pretty much every way.

 

[Moondrop]

We know we will have guild halls still and my low expectations for those is that it'll just be an instance for us to chat room in.

I totally forgot about guild halls and I'm now feeling even more positive about the expansion. Behold the magic of low expectations.

And 50% of what I'm actually excited for will be added to the base game. I'm more excited for the system changes than most everything else, which is kind of sad...

It isn't sad at all. The solid fundamental systems are the heart of what makes GW2 fun to play.

We know about a few things by now (Stronghold, the new Borderland, Specializations, or should I say, Masteries) for the rest, which usually consists of the meatiest bit of an expansion, like new zones, challenging group content, and content in general it's as vague as it can be

Systems are the meat; content is the bread.

Systems are nice, and they enable content, but that's the thing, they're nothing without significant content to back them up which is more and more what people want to see.

The only content necessary to support these systems is a game mode in which one can target enemy players. I couldn't care less if people want more "significant content" like Living Story Season 2; it added nothing to my enjoyment of the game. But I wouldn't turn my nose up at new fractals and the like.

They clearly only have shown us a fraction of what they intend to deliver with the final product, for obvious reasons (not finished enough, things changing as they go along ...)

Statements like these read to me as supposition and speculation that will most likely lead to disappointment.

 

[Retro]

We should decide on a time everyone is available, and we can look around for other events in the area while we are at it.

Evenings work best for me, 7-8pm Eastern. I don't imagine the event is too terribly long.

Nah it's okay, most people don't seem to share my sentiments on such, so it's all good.

Sentiment has nothing to do with it; I'd love to have a blog post every day, a live stream every week and betas every weekend. But that's not realistic and your list of complaints really aren't either (see Proven's comment on comparing HoT to FFXIV, 73.6% of all statistics are made up, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, etc.).

Here is one I found
http://www.zam.com/story.html?story=35650&storypage=2

I actually came across that article while looking for Ash's source of info but dismissed it because I didn't think that was close enough to what he was describing (I guess I assumed the "playground" bit was an actual quote). The paragraph after the one you quote is actually closer to what he was describing (the "They are not one-and-done maps; you play there a lot and have different experiences" line especially, though that's not a quote from a dev.).

The first paragraph of that page is actually kind of relevant to the overall discussion though;

We were able to confirm that the Heart of Maguuma is a region that will consist of multiple maps. Colin said that with this region they are focusing on the depth of the experience, not on creating a whole bunch of maps that you tear through quickly and leave a wasteland of unused content with no long term value.

This kind of gets back to my earlier comment about this being a lot of people's first expansion. The scenario he's describing in that quote isn't an exaggeration; I've played a bunch of MMO expansions where players jump in, chew up the content in a few weeks and then demand more. The high-level zones added to Cataclysm, for example, took about a day each (and there were only 5 of them). Considering the amount of time spent waiting, does anyone really want it to come loaded with maps like Queensdale where you finish it once and never go back?

In that sense, I think most zones in HoT will have reoccurring zone-wide meta events with their own reward structure (though probably not as zone-specific as DT/SW) to keep players coming back to it; like the article describes, that's basically an evolution of Dynamic Events. We've gone from isolated events (most launch zones) to big event chains and webs (Harathi, Orr) to zone-wide events (Scarlet Invasions) to big, meta events. Dry Top and the Silverwastes are both pretty great maps, but there's not a lot of variety in them and after months of them doing the heavy lifting (a situation that should ahve never happened) they're understandably pretty dry (pun intended). Even giving ArenaNet as little credit as possible, "what color is the fortress I am defending" is unlikely to be the most variation these new maps have to offer.

I think DT / SW are going to end up looking more like experiments (in the same way that we look back on things like the Scarlet Invasions or the Nightmare Tower) that unfortunately had to serve as "end game" for much longer than they should have.

I know it's insane to state this on NeoGAF, of all places, but we should try to break free from the mindset that wanting is more pleasing than having.

This is exactly the right mindset to have. People are almost addicted to hype, eagerly anticipating the next big thing instead of enjoying the things they have. In fact, that pretty accurately describes a huge chunk of MMO players (the "content locusts") who constantly go from game to game, feeding on hype and looking to recapture the magic of their first MMO.

It's cool to be excited (and I certainly am), but some people take it way too far and expect the moon (or worse, they start extrapolating from the small amount of info they have and start making up bullshit that could happen). When that doesn't happen, that's when you get the ugly "but they promised!"-type comments.

So 4-8 zones for Heart of Maguuma sounds reasonable.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's at the low end of your range or even lower. We don't know how the whole 'layers' thing is going to work, but from the sound of things the new maps are going to be pretty dense.

Usually, when someone first introduces an expansion you get a general overview of what to expect even if you don't necessarily get the details. ( X new maps with X zones, X new Dungeons, X new raids, classes, battlegrounds, whatever etc .... )
It doesn't spill the beans on everything but tries at least to give a rough idea of the overall quantity of content you can expect.

For HoT, we didn't even get that.

I don't agree with this at all. For most of the expansions I've been through, there's generally a teaser trailer that rattles off a bunch of new features, a press release that roughly outlines them, then a lot of slow leaks until you get closer to release (at which point they sort of dump everything all at once). Watching the WotLK trailer after all these years, it's actually kind of funny how similar it is in tone and pacing to the HoT trailer; voiceover about the fate of heroes, preview of new zones, list of features... it's actually kind of disappointing to compare them and see how by-the-numbers the HoT one is.

But what isn't there are details like you're suggesting. And in the press-release that accompanied WotLK (copy here, Blizzard's own site doesn't host anything that old). No details at all; no x zones, x new dungeons, x new raids, etc. It was only over the span of a year (and three months; WotLK was announced 8/3/2007 and released 11/13/08) that details started to come out (believe me, I was there, people hung on every. single. word).

Hell, they didn't even allow people to opt-in for the beta until July the next year, almost a full year later. The point is, the rate at which info has been released for HoT has been much faster than similar expansions were in the past, and they've been more willing to show off unfinished content like Elite Specializations in detail and discuss their philosophy behind their design. If anything, we're kind of spoiled by how much information comes out about games before they release these days (and in turn, it kind of spoils the experience, but that's another long post).

One could also say that they are very good a refining/coming up with new and improved systems, yet not that good at actually supporting and expanding them, which isn't entirely false either...

I strongly agree with that, actually, and it's one of my biggest non-specific complaints with the game. Nothing demonstrates that more clearly than Fractals, which seemed like they were going to become something that was regularly expanded on (small bites of content in a random rotation is the perfect platform for that) but has only seen some retro-fitted content over the last two years.

---

To end on a positive note: conversations like these only take place because people are passionate about something, so even if folks disagree it's safe to assume we're all in the same boat.

Edit:

Welp it has happened.

Wildstar is now F2P

I will openly admit that I was wrong;

Wildstar will go completely F2P within the first year, as the target audience (Vanilla/TBC raiders) are now 10 years older and can't indulge in that play style anymore (despite how much they claim they want it back). Lukewarm reception from most other MMO fans due to archaic questing structure, odd progression scheme and lack of customization. Fades into the background of MMOs that are still around but not very active quicker than anyone expects.

By the time it goes F2P this autumn, it will have actually lasted more than a year... though I suppose I could argue that they announced the change to F2P within the first year. Going F2P had great results for LotRO, SWTOR, TERA, RIFT, etc., so I would imagine WS will see a huge increase in activity. TERA, for example, had a ten-fold increase in peak concurrent users after the change.

Better the stigma of F2P than going the way of Warhammer Online or Tabula Rasa, right?

 

[Shanlei91]

I know it's insane to state this on NeoGAF, of all places, but we should try to break free from the mindset that wanting is more pleasing than having.

 

[Proven]

You've always been a systems kind of guy.

True...

The original announcement covered a lot of things. New PvP mode, new WvW map, Guild Halls, new specializations/subclasses. These were all things that didn't need much in the way of explanation to entice us, assuming Guild Halls don't have a mode or some large content or social system attached.

What was missing and explained later was the Masteries system, of which we so far have a decent grasp on. Especially after playing Verdant Brink myself, Masteries are more about optimizing your play or getting powerups rather than content gating. To compare to a Metroid game, it's like they're being used to offer missile packs, energy tanks, and some shortcuts between areas, rather than being the gatekeeper to areas. There will be some exceptions, like for Legendaries, but those aren't a huge amount of content.

The only things we have left to see are PvE zones and PvE difficulty. The meat of content that most people who get excited about an MMO expansion want to see. The thing I'm wondering is, did any of us know how large GW2 base game was going to be until the beta weekends, or even until launch? I remember back then not knowing how large the area of Tyria was and them being extremely tightlipped about it, but I also didn't check reddit for information much three years ago.

To be drip fed in the meantime: Masteries, Guild Halls, the rest of the Elite Specializations, and possibly whatever specific amount of difficult PvE content they want to showcase. Much else of the PvE content info dump will come around beta weekends or nearer to launch, if it matches GW2's original launch style (from my memory of it).

 

[Ashodin]

There are also presumably any number of things that are smaller but weren't bulletpoint worthy, such as cooking 500, that I'm extremely excited to hear about if it's true. The smaller QoL and interesting little bits are what I'm after.

 

[nataku]

Build saving.

Please, ANet.

 

[SourBear]

cooking 500

I'm looking forward to Bloodstone Brick Soup.

 

[Proven]

Seriously, that Priory Chef cracked me up.

 

[Moondrop]

To compare to a Metroid game, it's like they're being used to offer missile packs, energy tanks, and some shortcuts between areas, rather than being the gatekeeper to areas.

I actually find this disappointing. The Grappling Beam in Super Metroid is perhaps the best form of area gatekeeping I can recall in a video game. I will be shocked if there isn't a zone only accessible by glider.

Hookshot please, Anet.

 

[Hawkian]

X new maps with X zones, X new Dungeons, X new raids, classes, battlegrounds, whatever etc

For perspective, this was helpful to read because I don't even feel neutral about the numbers that would fill in those Xs... I actively don't want to know them before experiencing the expansion, personally.

I don't want to have "Oh I know this is the first of 4 new zones I'm in right now" in mind the moment I log in. It will deeply- and with no particular benefit- color my expectations about what is to come during a play experience that, for me, should be filled with constant surprises and the intangible reward that accompanies a sense of true exploration. Through identical reasoning I have no desire to take part in the beta (the novelty of "is it actually a good game or not?" being my impetus for participating in the original beta weekends before launch- a question that has long been answered).

I like learning about the new mechanical improvements and specializations as much as possible (I read up on every skill I possibly could for every class before launch), but I really don't want to know much more of anything content/area/encouter-wise than I already do, especially in terms of simply giving raw numbers that don't really speak to quality or density.

What matters most to any individual player flails wildly across populations. Personally, the mere addition of new weapon skills... I can't even overstate how radically this will reinvigorate the gameplay for me. Those that are "meh" on that aspect of the expansion may well be surprised at how much it does change things. I consider it gravy that they actually took it a step further with specializations and are mixing up class mechanics as well, and of course a full-fledged new class can't go without mention, since it carries its own suite of new weapon skills too. I'm lucky, in that what I am most looking forward to is actually something that affects every single moment of gameplay, even in old areas and fights. It does make me less concerned with psuedo-objective metrics like the "amount of new content," I suppose; but on the other hand, I know that some will be satisfied with it and others will be disappointed, unavoidably.

The only concrete numbers I care to hear from ArenaNet are a release date and price. Everything else is colored bubbles. At the moment I just have no sense of how far off we're talking with this expansion and that's a pretty unusual feeling in the MMO marketplace.

 

[Trey]

Build saving.

Please, ANet.

And templates. All would be forgiven.

 

[Levyne]

Templates would make me a lot more willing to try out random things instead of just sitting in general trait sets most of the time out of laziness.

 

[Morokh]

Statements like these read to me as supposition and speculation that will most likely lead to disappointment.

It's hardly speculation when they litterally haven't talked about any detail of half of the things they talked about in the inital announcement.

I don't agree with this at all. For most of the expansions I've been through, there's generally a teaser trailer that rattles off a bunch of new features, a press release that roughly outlines them, then a lot of slow leaks until you get closer to release (at which point they sort of dump everything all at once). Watching the WotLK trailer after all these years, it's actually kind of funny how similar it is in tone and pacing to the HoT trailer; voiceover about the fate of heroes, preview of new zones, list of features... it's actually kind of disappointing to compare them and see how by-the-numbers the HoT one is.

But what isn't there are details like you're suggesting. And in the press-release that accompanied WotLK (copy here, Blizzard's own site doesn't host anything that old). No details at all; no x zones, x new dungeons, x new raids, etc. It was only over the span of a year (and three months; WotLK was announced 8/3/2007 and released 11/13/08) that details started to come out (believe me, I was there, people hung on every. single. word).

Hell, they didn't even allow people to opt-in for the beta until July the next year, almost a full year later. The point is, the rate at which info has been released for HoT has been much faster than similar expansions were in the past, and they've been more willing to show off unfinished content like Elite Specializations in detail and discuss their philosophy behind their design. If anything, we're kind of spoiled by how much information comes out about games before they release these days (and in turn, it kind of spoils the experience, but that's another long post).

You know what, looking back and checking dates a bit closer my perception of things might indeed be skewed, because I must have taken breaks from WoW pretty much everytime they started talking about the next expansion, meaning I came back to it either for the expansion, or a few months before, so basically when the bulk of the information was already out.

For perspective, this was helpful to read because I don't even feel neutral about the numbers that would fill in those Xs... I actively don't want to know them before experiencing the expansion, personally.

I don't necessarily want to fill those X's with actual numbers either but getting an overal picture, or an order of magnitude of what I can expect from what will be the 'base' content I will be playing in the months/years to come should I continue to play GW2, that's something i'm interested in.
Yes I know, the old areas are still there, they are still somewhat relevant, and will even be a bit more with the few changes they already talked about and the Precursor collections for instance, but in the end, the focus will be on those new areas.

I'm not one to want to be entirely spoiled either, even though I don't mind a bit of it to give me a glimpse of what's new.

But say, with WoW there was always a well defined structure to it, even if you didn't know the details or the new flavor they decided to introduce that structure was still mostly there.
With GW2 it's a jump into the unknown, which has it's exiting aspects I'll give you that, but the fact that they will touch on things where they missed the mark in the vanilla game also brings some concerns.

 

[Emitan]

It's been less than 24h, you're hardly late, but thank you!

I think you got culled for inactivity recently but if/when you come back to us I'll invite you myself <3 <3

OMG congrats!!

 

[Proven]

Emitan again making me jealous that I don't change my avatar more often.

 

[Retro]

I actually find this disappointing. The Grappling Beam in Super Metroid is perhaps the best form of area gatekeeping I can recall in a video game. I will be shocked if there isn't a zone only accessible by glider.

Hookshot please, Anet.

In the data-mined version of Verdant Brink,

Spoiler

there are big walls you can't get past without gliding over them. It will definitely be required to get into some places, though we have no idea how significant those places are or if progress through the zone will be tied to them.

Through identical reasoning I have no desire to take part in the beta (the novelty of "is it actually a good game or not?" being my impetus for participating in the original beta weekends before launch- a question that has long been answered).

This whole post was well done, but this part specifically is something I'm with you on 100%. The first Beta we got to play was "Is Revenant cool?" and "Is gliding fun?", and I'd say the vote is still out on those since they were limited by the scope of the demo (the weapons Revenant could use were limited, for example).

The only concrete numbers I care to hear from ArenaNet are a release date and price. Everything else is colored bubbles. At the moment I just have no sense of how far off we're talking with this expansion and that's a pretty unusual feeling in the MMO marketplace.

It's impossible to judge how close it is to done, and even when things seem solid they aren't. I once took three weeks of vacation for The Burning Crusade launch... in December. Then they pushed it back to January.

I wouldn't be shocked if the build folks were playing this week was several weeks old compared to their internal build.

You know what, looking back and checking dates a bit closer my perception of things might indeed be skewed, because I must have taken breaks from WoW pretty much everytime they started talking about the next expansion, meaning I came back to it either for the expansion, or a few months before, so basically when the bulk of the information was already out.

Absolutely, even when I was looking up the dates and such I was shocked by just how much time there was between the last update of one expansion and the announcement of the next, and then the waiting waiting waiting for it to finally release. I was stupid about it too, I didn't cancel my sub or anything.

When we get a release date, they'll have committed themselves and I am sure things will accelerate quickly from there. And in a couple years I'm sure we'll look back and think nothing of the wait all over again.

 

[Ashodin]

Ouch on the vacation time. Damn!

 

[Retro]

This may have gotten lost in the shuffle, but...

During Living World Season 2, Crystin took charge of a new team that was organized to improve in-game rewards in Guild Wars 2. Previously, no single dedicated team handled in-game rewards, and individual content teams were responsible for deciding how players would be rewarded. Crystin felt there should be a greater balance between Gem Store item offerings and in-game rewards, and she and the rewards and commerce teams have worked on creating a clear division so that items will fit their method of distribution. For example, armor sets are now exclusively designed as in-game rewards while outfits are primarily Gem Store offerings. (source)

Dunno if that's been stated clearly before, but it's good to know.

Ouch on the vacation time. Damn!

Yep, the job was four days on / three off so it sounds like a lot more time than it was, but it still hurt (though some of the days were going to expire so I had to get rid of them). Was nice to have a ton of time off though from that job though since it was a pain in the ass, got to spend some time with my family around the holidays too.

But yeah, lesson learned. Don't take a ton of time off for game releases. A day or two tops.

 

[Ashodin]

This may have gotten lost in the shuffle, but...



Dunno if that's been stated clearly before, but it's good to know.



Yep, the job was four days on / three off so it sounds like a lot more time than it was, but it still hurt (though some of the days were going to expire so I had to get rid of them). Was nice to have a ton of time off though from that job though since it was a pain in the ass, got to spend some time with my family around the holidays too.

But yeah, lesson learned. Don't take a ton of time off for game releases. A day or two tops.

Colin actually told me that was their goal, about the armor rewards. I almost thought your post was about the reward system structure of Dry Top/SW added to HoT's zones, as I thought there was an article about someone who was in charge of that as well. It must be the endgame lady, I'll see if I can find it.

Aha, it's the same lady, Crystin Cox, but it's just about masteries.

As many of you now know, we&#8217;re introducing an entirely new progression system with Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns&#8482;. The Mastery system is a key component of one of our primary goals with this first expansion to Guild Wars 2. We want to introduce a new framework for endgame progression and a meaningful way for players to grow their characters and their experience once they&#8217;ve reached the maximum level in the game.

A post written written by Ordon and Hughes gives insight into the fact that every map will have Outposts and a second phase to it.

Outposts are content structures that broadly explain and contextualize the consequences of localized groups of dynamic events. If you&#8217;ve been to the Silverwastes, you&#8217;ve seen a forerunner of this concept at each tower. In the Silverwastes, each tower helps the Pact prepare for its assault, and your successes and failures at each tower affect the sort of events you&#8217;ll see around you. In the Heart of Maguuma, you&#8217;ll have a similar experience with outposts, which are always vital to preparing for the secondary phase of each map.

Further down the page was what I was getting at: it doesn't explicitly state "It'll be like SW/DT!" but it's close.

In the Heart of Maguuma, there are even bigger threats and more epic battles waiting for you. You&#8217;ll find maps with a greater replay value and depth of content than anything we&#8217;ve put into Guild Wars 2 before, maps that provide a unique experience and multiple layers of gameplay. Rather than a more traditional strategy of rapidly expanding land mass with limited content to fill it, Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns will focus less on total land mass in the expansion and will instead focus on depth of content within that gameplay space. Each map will be rich in content, rich in 3-D play space, and very deep in replay value to ultimately provide more gameplay value to our players and not leave an empty wasteland of rarely played content behind.

Replay value is what SW/DT have, but it's kind of stale - there's only one huge meta event, and everything funnels into it then into another reward structure after that (Pac-Man). With HoT, I expect layers upon layers of meta events, which will be pretty awesome to see.

This is the shit that gets me really excited:

It&#8217;s a challenge for you to overcome. Your performance in adventures will be scored, and you&#8217;ll be able to see&#8212;and test yourself against&#8212;the scores of your friends and guildmates. Because adventures take place in the open world, you&#8217;ll see other players working to overcome the same challenges as you, and in many cases you&#8217;ll be able to work and excel together. Adventures are a reimagining of the concept of permanent content that you can challenge yourself with and enjoy as you move through the world that&#8217;s been around since launch. As a result, you may see some activities you heard about before the launch of Guild Wars 2 make an appearance as adventures.

yaaaaaasssssssssss

 

[Retro]

Colin actually told me that was their goal, about the armor rewards.

Yep, I remember it being mentioned somewhere in an interview or something, maybe even one of your posts, but this is the first time I can recall seeing it spelled out clearly (and if it's not the first time, it's still nice to know).

Replay value is what SW/DT have, but it's kind of stale - there's only one huge meta event, and everything funnels into it then into another reward structure after that (Pac-Man). With HoT, I expect layers upon layers of meta events, which will be pretty awesome to see.

The blogpost you linked makes it sounds like the new zones won't be anything like the Silverwastes, beyond the zones having multiple phases (which has always been kind of a no-brainer). There's no way in hell they were ever going to make more maps like the game launched with; renown hearts are unlikely to come back, there will be more focus on telling a story across a whole zone through meta events, replayability, etc. But I think describing them as "giant mindless grind-fests" (to borrow Kanik's term) would be a bit unfair; there's obviously going to be a lot more going on, whether it's through 'layers upon layers' as you've just suggested (which seems likely) or something else entirely.

We've already seen in the footage from earlier this week that each Outpost (the Itzel in the north and Pact in the south) is going to have a different event chains that contribute to the overall meta, so I think assuming the zone will be "another Silverwastes" has kind of already been disproven. The blog post even describes the Silverwastes and Drytop as forerunners to Outposts, so more of the same seems unlikely. I still think DT/SW are going to look like experiments that just ran too long in retrospect.

This is the shit that gets me really excited.

Part of me kind of hopes they make some of the old content Adventures. I've wanted the Pac-man phase of SW to keep score since the day it came out.

 

[appletoasty]

Was there anyone who still needed Arah story (last step of personal story)? I was going to do it this weekend at some point, would be happy to take some new players along.

 

[Shanlei91]

Can you just take me through Arah P4? Thx

 

[Tech-Wolf]

Was there anyone who still needed Arah story (last step of personal story)? I was going to do it this weekend at some point, would be happy to take some new players along.

My ele need it and I have been lazy about completing it. Ill come if you don't mind.

In the data-mined version of Verdant Brink,

Spoiler

there are big walls you can't get past without gliding over them. It will definitely be required to get into some places, though we have no idea how significant those places are or if progress through the zone will be tied to them.

About that spoiler,

Spoiler

I managed to sneak around it in the beta thanks to some glider abuse jumping, but it will probably be fixed before release.

 

[leng jai]

First thing Officer Toasty does is runs people through ARAH story so they all quit the game after the Zaitan sequence.

 

[Moondrop]

Y'know what's even cooler than systems? Meta-systems! So let's talk animation-cancelling.

Most PvPers know that mesmer's greatsword auto-attack can be cancelled using the "stow weapon" keybind. Stowing weapon is the mechanism behind the form of animation-cancelling I will be discussing, but this represents only one possible use. In this case, it's to break the 1.75 second channel, sacrificing 1-2 hits of the chain but not a dodge. All channeled skills can be cancelled in this manner, but it's generally unproductive when the effects are biased toward completing the channel, e.g. guardian's Empower.

But if the effects are biased toward the beginning of the channel, then animation-cancelling may be in one's best interest. The most notable example that I'm aware of is warrior's Flurry, which applies the immobilize immediately and the rest is just slashing bleeds. In wvw and pvp, it's very much advised to cancel quickly to maintain mobility. Now that I know Flurry shares an animation with Blurred Frenzy, I wonder if it can be animation-cancelled immediately to preserve the Blur effect (not at my PC to test). One relatively trivial example I've found is that thief can cancel Dagger Storm to gain 3 seconds of stability. Not necessarily the best use of an elite skill, I acknowledge, but thief doesn't have much access to stability otherwise. I imagine the same applies to elementalist Tornado, necromancer Plague, etc.

And lastly animation-cancelling can be used during a skill's cast time to preserve its cooldown. Any non-movement, non-instant skill can be cancelled with stow weapon and put on a mere three second cooldown. Clearly for skills with 1/4 second cast times, you need to be already inputting the stow to cancel. But for long windup, long cooldown skills like warrior's Backbreaker, it's legitimately within one's reflex time to learn to cancel it when you see your opponent has a block prepared or has evaded.

If anyone knows of other skills that benefit from animation-cancelling, lay 'em on me.

 

[Shanlei91]

It takes a lot of blood sweat and tears to cancel out of the Ranger main-hand-axe auto-attack.

 

[Levyne]

Y'know what's even cooler than systems? Meta-systems! So let's talk animation-cancelling.

Most PvPers know that mesmer's greatsword auto-attack can be cancelled using the "stow weapon" keybind. Stowing weapon is the mechanism behind the form of animation-cancelling I will be discussing, but this represents only one possible use. In this case, it's to break the 1.75 second channel, sacrificing 1-2 hits of the chain but not a dodge. All channeled skills can be cancelled in this manner, but it's generally unproductive when the effects are biased toward completing the channel, e.g. guardian's Empower.

But if the effects are biased toward the beginning of the channel, then animation-cancelling may be in one's best interest. The most notable example that I'm aware of is warrior's Flurry, which applies the immobilize immediately and the rest is just slashing bleeds. In wvw and pvp, it's very much advised to cancel quickly to maintain mobility. Now that I know Flurry shares an animation with Blurred Frenzy, I wonder if it can be animation-cancelled immediately to preserve the Blur effect (not at my PC to test). One relatively trivial example I've found is that thief can cancel Dagger Storm to gain 3 seconds of stability. Not necessarily the best use of an elite skill, I acknowledge, but thief doesn't have much access to stability otherwise. I imagine the same applies to elementalist Tornado, necromancer Plague, etc.

And lastly animation-cancelling can be used during a skill's cast time to preserve its cooldown. Any non-movement, non-instant skill can be cancelled with stow weapon and put on a mere three second cooldown. Clearly for skills with 1/4 second cast times, you need to be already inputting the stow to cancel. But for long windup, long cooldown skills like warrior's Backbreaker, it's legitimately within one's reflex time to learn to cancel it when you see your opponent has a block prepared or has evaded.

If anyone knows of other skills that benefit from animation-cancelling, lay 'em on me.

Maybe not quite the same thing, but if you dodge in the middle of power stab, you get the evade frames from it twice (before and after), plus from the dodge (inbetween).

Weapon swap canceling Acid Bomb is pretty essential too.

These are probably pretty obvious ones but it was what came to mind.

 

[Moondrop]

There's a new PvP Stronghold beta coming June 2, and this one will feature a Stronghold tournament.

If GAF is signing up a team for a crack at some Mini Llamas, I'm available.

Weapon swap canceling Acid Bomb is pretty essential too.

So the point of this is to cancel the leap to stay in melee range? I never really use the Elixir Gun. I wonder if it works with stow weapon as well.

 

[LumpOfCole]

Mini Llamas aren't going to dish out themselves! Team GAF simply showed up last time and five of us came away with Llamas because the other team flaked out.

http://battlefy.com/academy-gaming-...tournament-1-na/556555d4d1cf794700e5b5a9/info

IF you are going to be around on Tuesday June 2nd at 5:00pm Pacific/8:00pm Eastern, then sign up for Team GAF One in this thread. The first four who reply to this post with their GW2 Username (e.g., LumpOfCole.4701) AND a commitment to be play the Stronghold 5v5 Tournament on Tuesday will get a spot on Team GAF One.

I want to lock this Team in by the end of the day before all 16 teams fill up (2 are already signed up), so please be quick about deciding if you wish to join.

If the team fills up and you want in, then feel free to make Team GAF Two!

FYI, I'm likely going to be playing Hambow Warrior in the tournament.

 

[Moondrop]

IF you are going to be around on Tuesday June 2nd at 5:00pm Pacific/8:00pm Eastern, then sign up for Team GAF One in this thread. The first four who reply to this post with their GW2 Username (e.g., LumpOfCole.4701) AND a commitment to be play the Stronghold 5v5 Tournament on Tuesday will get a spot on Team GAF One.

Spoiler

Moondrop.5703

, at your service.

I found staff elementalist most effective in the last beta, but I'm flexible.

 

[Shanlei91]

Kanik.5470

I need more Llamas.

I can go dagger Ele or Bearbow.

Edit: Just realized it's for Stronghold. I'm flexible, but staff Ele is the superior Ele for Stronghold.

 

[Wanderer5]

Oooh Stronghold. Tuesday around 5 shouldn't be a issue.

Lordphantomhive.1256

I probably bring my Celestial Rifle Engi, but can be a bit flexible.

 

[LumpOfCole]

Room for one more!

 

[Wanderer5]

Sorry I might actually need to step down, and check something quick in regards to tuesday. Should be fine, but just in case.

 

[Zeroth]

Would love to join but I cant make a commitment. Will cheer for GAF in the sidelines like last time.

 

[Ashodin]

Ashodin.7604

Damn you lump you took my idea!

Tuesday is definitely totally open for me.

 

[Wanderer5]

Okay I should definitely be fine, so you got a whole team now.

 

[Ashodin]

That timing is 3:30 EDT BTW.

 

[Quenk]

That timing is 3:30 EDT BTW.

What timing? Doesn't that site say that check-in is at 8:15pm Eastern?

 

[Ashodin]

What timing? Doesn't that site say that check-in is at 8:15pm Eastern?

Oh oops, I was looking at the ESL website.

 

[Wanderer5]

Should we get a sub too?

 

[LumpOfCole]

Subs got left out of llama goodness last time. I recommend anyone else wanting in makes a second team.

Also, our team is made! Team GAF Gold has a 50% chance at Llama!

 

[Ashodin]

Subs got left out of llama goodness last time. I recommend anyone else wanting in makes a second team.

Also, our team is made! Team GAF Gold has a 50% chance at Llama!

Huzzah! Finally I can get Llama soon hopefully!

I'm studying up on Stronghold, and you can too!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ohVzXihZOI

Watch some good narration and explanation of Stronghold and study up! We'll win this thing!

 

[Proven]

Mini Llamas aren't going to dish out themselves! Team GAF simply showed up last time and five of us came away with Llamas because the other team flaked out.

http://battlefy.com/academy-gaming-...tournament-1-na/556555d4d1cf794700e5b5a9/info

IF you are going to be around on Tuesday June 2nd at 5:00pm Pacific/8:00pm Eastern, then sign up for Team GAF One in this thread. The first four who reply to this post with their GW2 Username (e.g., LumpOfCole.4701) AND a commitment to be play the Stronghold 5v5 Tournament on Tuesday will get a spot on Team GAF One.

I want to lock this Team in by the end of the day before all 16 teams fill up (2 are already signed up), so please be quick about deciding if you wish to join.

If the team fills up and you want in, then feel free to make Team GAF Two!

FYI, I'm likely going to be playing Hambow Warrior in the tournament.

I want to play I want to play I want to play!

But I have work during the time of the tournament. Dammit.

I'll be on playing Stronghold non-stop in the evening at least. It's perfect timing, since Heroes of the Storm finally launches that day and I plan to drop it like a bad habit.

 

[Ashodin]

Simply put: we haven&#8217;t announced it yet &#8211; when we&#8217;re ready to show everything about our plans for challenging content for HoT, we&#8217;ll announce it.
Though it isn&#8217;t the &#8220;challenging content&#8221; feature discussed in our announcement &#8211; I will add we want our open world content experience to be more challenging as well just in general. Though the AI was better in our CBT experience &#8211; we think we still have a lot of work to do to get our creatures and encounters even at the start of Verdant Brink up to where we want them to be. Our game has great combat, our creatures and encounters should challenge and require you to use that combat system.
More info &#8220;when it&#8217;s ready&#8221;.

Challenging content likely to be instanced, from that inference.

Also don't forget to

 

[hythloday]

Random thought: I bet the entire continent of Orr just smells awful.

 

[Levyne]

Good luck to GAF pvp team (s)