UltimateIke
Member
Tomorrow needs to be a GAFGuild in the Desert special event. LFG to tag mobs and get me a pass for the beta.
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Guild Wars 2 |OT5| We've got fun and games
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appletoasty
Member
inc staff guard invasion of dry top
Nemesis121
Member
fixed
Edit: nevermind
I get on, I check the news and all but then I see they're adding those portal for beta events in game... when I'm away! The nerve, I think i'm gonna rage.
Flip laptop
Flip table
Flip chair
Why oh why you're doing this to me AGAIN sending beta related stuff on those few moment when I can't play.
I need more info, I can't access the beta FAQ where I am, is it only farmable on the 28? is it for a week? 2 week? etc. If anyone can copy paste the info it would be greatly appreciate.
Now I think I'm gonna go cry in a corner.
Also, oh hey specialization...FU.
Flip laptop
Flip table
Flip chair
Why oh why you're doing this to me AGAIN sending beta related stuff on those few moment when I can't play.
I need more info, I can't access the beta FAQ where I am, is it only farmable on the 28? is it for a week? 2 week? etc. If anyone can copy paste the info it would be greatly appreciate.
Now I think I'm gonna go cry in a corner.
Also, oh hey specialization...FU.
They said farmable starting on the 28th for a limited time. I'm not seeing any end date given.
Starting tomorrow, April 28, heroes adventuring in the Maguuma Wastes have a chance to find a mysterious portal to the heart of the Maguuma Jungle. Looting one of these special trophy items grants you access to the next Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns PvE closed beta event!
For a limited time only, rare portals will drop from enemies in Dry Top and the Silverwastes. Portals cant be traded between players, so bring your friends along to hunt for their very own! Dont worry if your portal gets misplaced in a sandstorm or devoured by a passing ravager; beta access will be flagged upon looting the item, and its not required to claim participation.
Please visit our Heart of Thorns Beta FAQ for more details, and happy hunting!
Crafting and gambling also.
UltimateIke
Member
Force and Accuracy are really good for Guardian.
Ok, thanks. I had a sigil of strength in as a placeholder
I feel like... for the guardian, yeah they combined a ton of talents into one, but they still aren't imaginative enough. Like 20% more damage while standing in symbols is AWESOME, but is just so bland in design. How about 20% more damage, Slows things in them, and when enemies leave symbols, they're afflicted with Burn. Something that changes the way people regard symbols. You could even tweak the damage to be lower if all of that is a little much.
Technically that's what you're getting. When a guardian puts down the symbol, you need to gtfo or face a bonus damage whirling wrath or mighty blow. What you're looking for is just more pizah, which honestly isn't always needed. Plus, what they're giving you has basic counter play, which then gets countered by setups and combos.
Like, the fact that we can have 3 grandmasters minimum instead of the usual 1-2 means they can't just make every grandmaster a fundamental change. Too many and it becomes harder to balance them, and there's the lingering possiblity of power creep. If you want to make a fundamental change to symbols with pizah, you do it through an elite specialization.
appletoasty
Member
Only offhand focus CoF1 and 50 minute 3-man SE1
Is this the true dungeon experience
Is this the true dungeon experience
It's pretty mean to exclude Avatar from that SE1 run.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
All that portal hunting... surely this means populated DT again right?
I'm still talking about imaginative and interesting effects. You're talking about numbers.
The hate on "numbers" in this thread gets a little silly sometimes. 20% percent damage does way more to affect how opposing players react to symbols than your suggestion of applying conditions.
Let's take the current elementalist adept traits for example. I can take One with Air (1.5s of super speed) or Bolt to the Heart (+20% damage against foes < 33% health). One of those traits is imaginative and interesting and of almost no consequence in actual gameplay, and the other significantly changes how eles fight and how opponents fight against them in PvP and WvW.
Though I do want to hear more of Proven's delicious pizah theories of game design.
I understand what it does from a psychological perspective. I'm talking about something that feels "unique" and lets people know "I am a symbol guardian". There's no way to tell that unless you notice "hey this dude is dropping symbols everywhere". But that was already the case before the changes, now everything is just easier to get for that type of gameplay.
Granted, symbols now have a chance to burn from the minor traits (awesome)!
I'm probably rolling symbol guardian when the changes drop.
Granted, symbols now have a chance to burn from the minor traits (awesome)!
I'm probably rolling symbol guardian when the changes drop.
I was thinking that it would be logical that the next Black Lion set would be the same as the new Balthazar set introduced in GW1 for the anniversary, and this confirms it
Some of them look really good in GW1.
Yeah, most likely.
Edit:
How about...
Plumber's Retribution. Your jump height on symbols is increased by 500%. If you take falling damage, any enemy nearby is Knocked Down.
Combine this with the half damage falling trait.
I feel for you Ashodin, but what you really want is something that they plan to provide through Elite Specializations, although those seem more focused on affecting your base mechanics instead of parts of your class aspects.
I'm excited about Elite Specializations because using one completely changes you and your virtues. It's not about the new weapon, heal, utilities, or elite, all of which you can mix and choose if and when to use. It's not about the traits, six of which you won't even be using while specced. It's the fact that you get to do something "unique" that couldn't be done before with damage numbers, speed modifiers, or conditions. They will likely, as a base (although possibly through minor traits), give your virtues entirely new effects at the minimum. And they will probably take a playstyle of the class, strong or weak, and put it in overdrive. So let's assume that they consider symbol play interesting enough to be the focus of the Elite.
DEFENDER - Super Symbol Guardian
Random Major or Grandmaster trait: My Temple. Enemies that attack you while you stand on symbols you generated give you a stack of Stability (1 sec).
Random Major trait: Hallowed Symbol. Symbols you create remove one condition from allies per pulse.
Random Adept trait: Virtue of Smite. Virtue of Justice becomes Virtue of Smite. Activating Virtue of Smite damages and knocks down all enemies standing on symbols you created.
And of course, Random Grandmaster trait: Plumber's Retribution.
One other option of elite specializations is that they focus on promoting two trait lines at once. Like, if the five trait lines were put on a pentagon, one for each side, then an elite specialization is what happens at the corner between two of those sides. In this case I'd imagine Defender to be someone with Honor and Zeal.
One last edit: I'm still surprised that the class mechanic trait lines aren't turned into elite specilizations themselves, honestly. I feel like only reason that's not the case is because some amount of functionality they feel is core to building the class (like cooldown reduction on Steal or Shatters) are too important to remove the option for, but too powerful to make completely baseline.
Edit:
You do realize that all you suggested was a condition if you stay in symbols, and a condition if you walk out of symbols? But fine.
The hate on "numbers" in this thread gets a little silly sometimes. 20% percent damage does way more to affect how opposing players react to symbols than your suggestion of applying conditions.
Let's take the current elementalist adept traits for example. I can take One with Air (1.5s of super speed) or Bolt to the Heart (+20% damage against foes < 33% health). One of those traits is imaginative and interesting and of almost no consequence in actual gameplay, and the other significantly changes how eles fight and how opponents fight against them in PvP and WvW.
Though I do want to hear more of Proven's delicious pizah theories of game design.
How about...
Plumber's Retribution. Your jump height on symbols is increased by 500%. If you take falling damage, any enemy nearby is Knocked Down.
Combine this with the half damage falling trait.
I feel for you Ashodin, but what you really want is something that they plan to provide through Elite Specializations, although those seem more focused on affecting your base mechanics instead of parts of your class aspects.
I'm excited about Elite Specializations because using one completely changes you and your virtues. It's not about the new weapon, heal, utilities, or elite, all of which you can mix and choose if and when to use. It's not about the traits, six of which you won't even be using while specced. It's the fact that you get to do something "unique" that couldn't be done before with damage numbers, speed modifiers, or conditions. They will likely, as a base (although possibly through minor traits), give your virtues entirely new effects at the minimum. And they will probably take a playstyle of the class, strong or weak, and put it in overdrive. So let's assume that they consider symbol play interesting enough to be the focus of the Elite.
DEFENDER - Super Symbol Guardian
Random Major or Grandmaster trait: My Temple. Enemies that attack you while you stand on symbols you generated give you a stack of Stability (1 sec).
Random Major trait: Hallowed Symbol. Symbols you create remove one condition from allies per pulse.
Random Adept trait: Virtue of Smite. Virtue of Justice becomes Virtue of Smite. Activating Virtue of Smite damages and knocks down all enemies standing on symbols you created.
And of course, Random Grandmaster trait: Plumber's Retribution.
One other option of elite specializations is that they focus on promoting two trait lines at once. Like, if the five trait lines were put on a pentagon, one for each side, then an elite specialization is what happens at the corner between two of those sides. In this case I'd imagine Defender to be someone with Honor and Zeal.
One last edit: I'm still surprised that the class mechanic trait lines aren't turned into elite specilizations themselves, honestly. I feel like only reason that's not the case is because some amount of functionality they feel is core to building the class (like cooldown reduction on Steal or Shatters) are too important to remove the option for, but too powerful to make completely baseline.
Ash is kind of misrepresenting that whole side of the discussion; the numbers themselves aren't the problem, they're simply the clearest indication of the passive nature of most traits.
A passive 20% damage boost against foes with less than 33% health is the obvious choice in that situation, because passive traits like that are dependable, require no input, change in behavior or or special action, and are just as effective when used by a poor player as they are by a very skilled one.
My go-to example of what I consider to be a 'good' trait is the warrior's Missile Deflection (soon to be Shield Mastery, as it's paired with Mighty Defenses and half of Shield Master). This is a trait that requires skill and situational awareness to utilize properly but, in the right hands can turn Rangers and Sniper Warriors into mush. Nobody takes it, however (and no one likely will) because the same slot can be occupied by passive traits like Armored Attack ("Gain 7% power based on your toughness.") or Dogged March ("Incoming movement-impeding conditions have their durations reduced. Gain regeneration when you are affected by one of these conditions"). In contrast to Missile Deflection, both of those traits require zero skill or situational awareness, are always on, are more easily calculated when theorycrafting optimal DPS, and work just as effectively whether you're the Best Player on Earth or the guy shoveling Cheetos into his mouth while watching Youtube videos on his second monitor.
That's essentially my problem with passive traits, that they're "no-brainers" in every sense of the term. They're always the best choice because they're the ones with stats that can be tracked and formulated, and you don't need to think or do anything to take advantage of them. Traits are, in my opinion, supposed to represent a choice in how you play a given profession, but with passive traits there really isn't a choice at all (except between two passive traits, of course). Nobody would take Missile Deflection over Dogged March, just as nobody would take One with Air over Bolt to the Heart in your example.
My ideal trait system would be one composed entirely of "Missile Deflection"-style traits with all of the passives stripped out. It won't happen, of course, for various reasons (not least of which is that the use of passive traits is already established). The biggest is that passive traits are easy to design, track and balance; you can't tweak the effectiveness of a trait like Missile Deflection much, whereas you can adjust the internal CD, condition duration reduction percentage, duration of regen, etc.
But, I mean, this is a gripe I've had with the game (and MMOs in general) forever, so at this point even I'm starting to get tired of talking about it. I just wanted to comment on it at this point because it's not just a "hate on numbers" thing (though I do believe the game would be better without character stats as well, but that's a different discussion).
UltimateIke
Member
Passive traits are fine as they are. The whole point is that they work all the time and you don't have to worry about losing effectiveness and being pigeonholed into a specific role that might come up once every ten encounters. And it's a very good point.
Always works doesn't mean always the best, of course. The beauty of being able to change traits between fights in PvE and WvW is that you never really have any options unavailable to you. You can be ready for that one in ten encounter. You're only limited by your willingness to adapt.
I'm pretty sure PvP already sees a lot more play with the "skillful" traits than any other game mode, so I won't go out of my way to defend it there.
Insert self-promotion here:
Solo a dungeon if you feel like your traits need a reason to branch out.
I don't know about everyone else, but for Fractals in particular, I have at least six different trait setups and nine different weapon setups I use depending on what we are doing. It's rarely ever an optimal damage build, but it's what works and makes us most likely to succeed. And in all that there are a lot of times passive bonuses are what I use. I can't think of many skillful effects I would want while I'm bashing in Bloomhunger's face.
Always works doesn't mean always the best, of course. The beauty of being able to change traits between fights in PvE and WvW is that you never really have any options unavailable to you. You can be ready for that one in ten encounter. You're only limited by your willingness to adapt.
I'm pretty sure PvP already sees a lot more play with the "skillful" traits than any other game mode, so I won't go out of my way to defend it there.
Insert self-promotion here:
Solo a dungeon if you feel like your traits need a reason to branch out.
I don't know about everyone else, but for Fractals in particular, I have at least six different trait setups and nine different weapon setups I use depending on what we are doing. It's rarely ever an optimal damage build, but it's what works and makes us most likely to succeed. And in all that there are a lot of times passive bonuses are what I use. I can't think of many skillful effects I would want while I'm bashing in Bloomhunger's face.
Love it. This would make me play Guardian.
I think we disagree in a subtle way here that I would like to illuminate. For me, Armored Attack and Dogged March are completely different examples of numbers-based traits. The first is a class of inherently passive statistics that, although they have some value due to the straight-jacket stat combos in PvP, I would be fine if they were removed from the game entirely. When I imagine you or anyone complaining about passive stat-based traits, I think of take 7% of X and add it to Y.
But I disagree that Dogged March is inherently passive because it modifies how enemy skills affect you. It may not require me pressing 5 to activate, but the concepts "that warrior may reflect my projectiles" and "that warrior's going to rush right through my soft cc" both affect an enemy's state of mind in real time.
What about ele's diamond skin? Would you claim it as similar to Missile Deflection? Because I would argue it's more akin to Dogged March, and that these numbers-based traits are not actually no-brainers like the class I described above, but do promote skillful play.
P.S. I know that I sometimes "talk past" people by framing my responses in PvP/WvW context when others are referring to PvE; it amuses me.
UltimateIke
Member
Passive trait bonuses are very good for giving you an option that is guaranteed to benefit you when there is not an immediately more useful option. They fill in the gaps. I would much rather be able to default to some +5% damage choice than have several options of which none are applicable to the current situation. The thing in my mind worse than a passive bonus is the idea of using a trait that had zero outcome on the fight.
I do not believe it is possible to fill every slot with enough active trait effects that at least one choice will always be useful. Hence, passive traits.
I do not believe it is possible to fill every slot with enough active trait effects that at least one choice will always be useful. Hence, passive traits.
I'll join if I'm online.
I was thinking that it would be logical that the next Black Lion set would be the same as the new Balthazar set introduced in GW1 for the anniversary, and this confirms it
Some of them look really good in GW1.
Chances are of at least updating one of my war's weapons with these (warhorn at least) is pretty high.
The set in the first game looks great.
Kos Luftar
Member
Shopped.
human onion
Banned
What professions among Warrior, Thief, and Necro do you guys find the most fun? I have 400 gems from AP and I'm thinking of getting more with gold for a new character slot.
Necros aren't the highest damaging classes in the game, and they get flak for it, but I found the class to be the most fun of the three. Mostly because the class comes with a lot of bells and whistles where as Warrior and Thief is very meat and potatoes.
Looks like it. Let the farming begin! Looks like the portals will be around for a week at least.
"To celebrate the tenth anniversary of the original Guild Wars, we’ve updated the Black Lion Weapon Specialist’s inventory.
The new Balthazar’s weapon set is available for one Black Lion Claim Ticket.
- The Chaos weapon skins inspired by the original Guild Wars have been reduced to one Black Lion Claim Ticket each for a limited time.
- The Tormented weapon skins inspired by the original Guild Wars have been reduced to one Black Lion Claim Ticket each for a limited time."
Well that pretty cool heh.
UltimateIke
Member
BALANCE, BUG-FIXING, POLISH
Profession Skills
Engineer
The engineer’s turrets are now affected by conditions and critical hits.
Burn them all to the ground!
Profession Skills
Engineer
The engineer’s turrets are now affected by conditions and critical hits.
Burn them all to the ground!
It depends on what we consider a passive trait. Anything that triggers because of some action shouldn't be considered passive (for example, Powerful Banners requires you to summon a banner for it to trigger). And some passive effects are useful because they directly affect mechanics (Berserker's Might giving you adrenaline while in combat is passive, but it's modifying the core mechanic).
I'm mostly talking about things like "A percentage of <stat x> is given as a bonus to <stat y>," "+z% chance to ...", etc. Things that are just happening under the hood that you don't have to think about. I feel like that sort of passive stuff, if it's in the game at all, could be on Runes or Sigils. Traits should be all about shining a light on a particular aspect of a profession and making it stand out more.
Let me put it this way; one of my biggest gripes with MMOs is that they essentially give you a series of bigger hammers with which to solve all of your problems, whereas I feel you should be given a variety of different tools. GW2 does this fairly well, actually (weapons and skills have different uses in different situations), but when it comes to passive traits it's just more... tool inflation (lol), whereas my ideal would be "Hey, this hammer can also be used to pry now." Does that sort of make sense?
Both are passive, in so far as they require no special input or activation, but I agree that there is a difference; Armored Attack is offensively boring (again, it's one of those "under the hood"-type effects) while Dogged March is just sort of "there", being a subtle improvement. Subtle enough that I don't think an enemy player is going to process "that warrior is going to rush through my soft cc," and certainly not "Hey, my cripple only lasted for 2 seconds instead of 3, I better change up my tactics." Something like Mobile Strikes, on the other hand, is going to get noticed and has more dramatic effect on gameplay. I feel like the condition duration aspect of Dogged March would make a better rune than a trait.
Neither Dogged March or Armored Attack requires any thought or consideration from the player in terms of minute-to-minute actions, which is something I think traits should do (at least the major ones, though I think Minor Traits should go away anyways)
Well, Diamond Skin is kind of awful in my opinion for other reasons (it's only useful against Necros and pure Condi builds, and even then something like warrior or engineer has enough tools to get an ele below 90%).
Diamond Skin isn't entirely passive, in that it requires you to pay attention to your health and make a decision on whether to heal and potentially push yourself back above the 90% threshold to block further condition attacks (since it doesn't remove conditions when you go back over 90, it only blocks incoming ones... unless they've changed it recently) or not. So in that regard, it's a lot more interesting than Dogged March in that there's something you have to keep in mind while playing that will affect your playstyle whereas "movement effects are slightly shorter" really doesn't.
Written in Stone is honestly the only 'sexy' GM trait in the Earth line, and even though that's all about preserving passive effects it's still a solid "gameplay mechanic" effect that changes how signets function (and signets are one place where I like passives, since you have to make a decision on whether to use the active effects or not). It breaks a fundamental rule of the game ("Signet passives stop when activated") and breaking the rules is cool. That's not to say Stone Heart and Diamond Skin aren't effective, but they're not exactly thrilling (though maybe knowing you're immune to crits is a thrill, I dunno). Stone Heart at least requires you to change to earth attunement.
I dunno what a more interesting version of Diamond Skin would look like beyond having it damage enemies for each condition they attempt to apply which isn't especially interesting either.
Even if seems impossible, that's no reason not to strive for it and reduce as many passive traits as possible (which is something they seem to be doing anyways). As long as the options are strong and have a variety of uses (In this regard, Missile Deflection isn't a good example, though the new version of it for HoT is better), even if there's a few instances where a given trait effect doesn't work, the choices are more interesting.
Another part of the problem as I see it is, with passive traits the safe, reliable, always-on effect generally looks like the better option because there's no way to screw it up. "+10% damage" is always a better choice than "a chance at +20% damage if you're paying attention". Theorycrafters reinforce that because a static damage boost is guaranteed vs.something like Missile Deflection that isn't. The trait system is meant to give you choices on how to play your character, but because passives are always a sure thing, they're almost always considered the ideal choice.. which means less choice overall.
hockeypuck
Member
That has got to be the biggest nerf a profession has ever seen in this game, or at least in spvp mode, right?
I guess the engineer can still fix the health with the wrench.
Daily Engineer Win just got a bit harder.
Those are my three favorite classes in the game, but I play them all counter-meta like... (Except Power Necro, which eventually became slightly meta).
For PvE I'd probably recommend Warrior.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
The Balthazar weapons are good... yet disappointing that not all of them have hound heads and the ones I wanted to use don't have them
Beastmaster rangers thank you for the lulz.
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