I'm essentially brand new to the series and I'm having a blast. I do have a fighting game background tho. (Street fighter for a decade +)
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Guilty Gear Xrd -SIGN- |OT| - Cross Play on a Heavy Day
- Thread starter Volcynika
- Start date
Hm, well then I think it'll be pretty overwhelming at first. Taking things slowly and paying close attention to the game's tutorial section should get you used to the basics of the game's mechanics, though.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
GG is the easiest of the anime fighters to get into imo it also scales for a long time with skill growth
I agree that the more absurd, technically difficult things that plague many fighters ought to have their barrier lowered, for the good of the games.
But reversals are another thing entirely.
Take SF4, for example.
There is a game that completely destroyed reversals.
It is not merely the fact that they are piss easy in it.
It is that the entire Meta around them is destroyed.
Meaties are rendered moot.
And thus, so too, are reversals.
But reversals are another thing entirely.
Take SF4, for example.
There is a game that completely destroyed reversals.
It is not merely the fact that they are piss easy in it.
It is that the entire Meta around them is destroyed.
Meaties are rendered moot.
And thus, so too, are reversals.
Karsticles
Member
Did you just call reversals moot in Street Fighter IV? I don't even know how someone could form that opinion.
Karsticles
Member
I hear you man, and I'm still not seeing what you're talking about. This is a game where wake up ultras still get wins in high level play.
No way in hell are wakeup reversals moot in SF4. That shit is everywhere.
It really, really shouldn't.
And when it does, it isn't for the same reason.
Of course that shit is everywhere.
It is everywhere because it is piss easy.
R.I.P. the days when meaties >>>>>>>>>>>>>> reversals 90% of the time, and the players who appreciated that fact, I guess.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Lostconfused
Member
Because for some reason people are saying she is hard to play when she's not
Look the just frame Dauro into PPP or whatever is hard, at least for me. I'll just go back to my own corner and dodge games some more.
Might be easier on stick, but it's not a real just frame at least. So no one frame timing.
Also, I'm all up for showing people how great this series is and why I love it so new people can enter.
But calling people out on being casual or lazy isn't going to help. I'd rather show why things are the way they are in this game, and the reasons behind it.
Some of you guys are, but in a slightly hostile way lol
The Yo Tornado
Member
I'm totally cool with the strict reversal windows. I'm having a harder time adjusting to tapping to recover and 1f untechable OS-able grabs than anything else.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
If I can't press 1 button multiple times to do a combo the game is too hard!
While you are learning still just get used to tapping a button while getting hit in the air. Later on though you wont want to recover right away as there are characters with tech traps
Lostconfused
Member
I am willing to go as far as to let you wiggle the stick a bit between one or two button presses for optimal combos, but that's my limit.
So... Smash?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Dragon Ball Z/Naruto games confirmed best fighting games?
While 1 frame untechable grabs sound amazing, you'll get used to dealing with them.
it's not something you need to be extremely cautious about to be honest.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
I personally found BB to be easier to get into. I still need to hook up my PS3 again and try things out in AC+R. In training mode I noticed I was getting random 3's when doing a half circle back in-between 2,1,4.
If I can do supers every time there then I'll know for sure there's some kind of issue with the PS4 controller.
If I can do supers every time there then I'll know for sure there's some kind of issue with the PS4 controller.
Okay, Sony was able to fix the PS3 and PS4 system voices for I-No and Faust on the SEN Store
So if you buy the I-No system voice you'll get I-No, and if you buy Faust, you'll get Faust~
(the master art images are still pending a change though haha)
For those of you that have already bought the DLC, Sony should be reaching out to you, so stay tuned!
So if you buy the I-No system voice you'll get I-No, and if you buy Faust, you'll get Faust~
(the master art images are still pending a change though haha)
For those of you that have already bought the DLC, Sony should be reaching out to you, so stay tuned!
Lostconfused
Member
For inputs, BB is definitely easier to get into. Especially considering the advanced buffer input and that the games have shortcuts on supers.
Comon, Gundam Battle Assault 2 is some legit shit. MFer has like 42+ characters or something when fully unlocked.
Curry-Hakase
Member
Haha, that reminds me that Faust, Chipp and Ino essentially have a Fuwa.
Essentially this.
In the modern era the sense of entitlement in gaming culture is absurd. People just can't accept the fact that not every damned consumer product on the planet has to appeal to them. Even if it exists in a category/genre that generally appeals to them.
Look at General Discussion and the console wars.
Look at the SFV threads. People aren't upset because they can't support Capcom, or the Street Fighter franchise and its community: they're upset because they don't own PS4s and merely don't have the option to buy. The definition of petty.
NEWS FLASH: You're not entitled to experience everything there is under the sun!
Scrubby players that want to be publicly pretentious regarding their desires to be competitive will always exist to complain about execution-barriers, no matter which direction those barriers shift. People like fader can't accept the proven history that these types of people would not stick with the game even if these barriers weren't there.
Look at people complaining about SmashWiiU not teaching them enough about high-level play for fucks sakes. A game with practically no execution-barriers at this point.
PEOPLE ARE ENTITLED AND LAZY. THEY DON'T LIKE LOSING BUT DON'T WANT TO PUT IN WORK TO WIN. To these people these are "just games" and their egos won't allow them get better no matter how low the execution-barrier is. These people are the reason games like SF4 have made some of the gameplay concessions they have, despite being ultimately worthless.
King Awesome unwittingly provided a great example that proves my point with the Shoto FADC Option Selects: people complained on forums incessantly about the "unnecessary" and "obtuse" execution barrier involved in maximizing damage via "esoterica" like FADC. A skill necessary to not only compete, but to play a Shoto competently. Where are those people now? They either learned to execute the technique or they quit playing the game. But if you really think someone would quit playing solely because they couldn't execute FADC you're a sucker. They likely just got tired of the game and moved onto something else, like the average person. No one complains about FADC now. The core community stepped up to the challenge, at large.
Could you really imagine yourself, or anyone saying "I'd like to take X seriously, but I won't, because Y is too hard."?
Seriously consider it...
No! That person never wanted to take 'X' seriously in the first place!
Ultimately, the barriers to a game's high-level/competitive techniques is not what determines whether or not someone decides to take a game seriously. Playing a game with that mindset is an emotional sell due to the commitment, and there's a number of social factors that could provide the adequate charge necessary for someone to say: "I want to accept this particular challenge for at least 'x' amount of time." and actually follow through with that.
No execution barrier in the world is going to subdue that.
Someone serious about getting their body into shape doesn't get discouraged because they see someone benching 315lbs. when they're starting out. They set goals, humble themselves and make the necessary progressions over a period time. One day, they'll get there. They don't let injuries, or debilitations stop them either. They'll work around them. And yes, these are analogous, because fighting games aren't "just games" when you're approaching them with the mindset of improving. It's a self-improvement project like any other.
Lostconfused
Member
Its still not a pass/fail selection mechanism. It's a balance between social pressures/desires versus the challenge presented. Everyone will hit a limit eventually, the execution barrier simply determines how soon the individual will reach that limit if at all.
Karsticles
Member
I want to take Xrd seriously, but I won't, because finding a PS4 fightstick is too hard.
Hellshingu
Member
This is where I am at lol. I haven't played as much because I know I am going to develop bad habits and have bad play trying to get used to using the DS4.
Until I get a TE2 that is. I am honestly surprised Madcatz didn't realize these things would be sold out the moment they were released.
The beauty about self-improvement is that it's an ongoing process. Perfection is just an ideal you chase into the grave but you enjoy every moment of it. No one ever truly hits their "limit".
I'm not gonna lie, this is cute as hell.
*edit*
But I do see you trying to make moves so you can at least play the game, though
Why do the patches seem to make online play WORSE?
When I first got the game, I could play against a friend with 3-4 frames of lag, now it's like 7-8 all the time. We're playing at the same locations, at the same times of of day, but getting poorer and poorer results. Arcsys has really gotta sort this stuff out.
When I first got the game, I could play against a friend with 3-4 frames of lag, now it's like 7-8 all the time. We're playing at the same locations, at the same times of of day, but getting poorer and poorer results. Arcsys has really gotta sort this stuff out.
Lostconfused
Member
I agree, that's why I think games should be fun to play or have some other draw besides "pure competition" and "drive for self improvement". Helps the less dedicated players stick around and get better. Like me, hah!
Karsticles
Member
Is it possible that the NK hack is messing with Sony's servers?
I would have happily gotten a Hori if it had Sanwa buttons.
I would have happily gotten a SFIV TE2 if it didn't have that hideous blue siding.
I would have happily gotten a GG Xrd TE2 if it existed.
I would happily use my HRAP V3 SA on my PS4 if ASW patched in compatibility.
There are so many goddamn possibilities, and none of them are options.
Yeah, I've been going into training mode to learn basic stuff, but I can't do Zato's missions past the 20s because they start to require negative edging, and I can't do that on a pad for the life of me.
I'm honestly at the point where I hope someone will gameshare their digital version with me for some $ so I can play on the PS3 version until a stick comes out. I am mega frustrated because playing GG Xrd and getting Zato down was basically my plan for all of Christmas vacation.
It's beyond MC's control. There's a strike going on that's messing with transportation.
I would have happily gotten a Hori if it had Sanwa buttons.
I would have happily gotten a SFIV TE2 if it didn't have that hideous blue siding.
I would have happily gotten a GG Xrd TE2 if it existed.
I would happily use my HRAP V3 SA on my PS4 if ASW patched in compatibility.
There are so many goddamn possibilities, and none of them are options.
Kimo-san called me cute. Uguuuu~.I'm not gonna lie, this is cute as hell.
*edit*
But I do see you trying to make moves so you can at least play the game, though
Yeah, I've been going into training mode to learn basic stuff, but I can't do Zato's missions past the 20s because they start to require negative edging, and I can't do that on a pad for the life of me.
I'm honestly at the point where I hope someone will gameshare their digital version with me for some $ so I can play on the PS3 version until a stick comes out. I am mega frustrated because playing GG Xrd and getting Zato down was basically my plan for all of Christmas vacation.
"I cant think of a way to actually respond to any of the moderate points being raised like DiscoSharks, so I'll just mis-represent the argument and accuse people of being entitled"
Leaving aside what exactly being "publicly pretentious regarding their desires to be competitive " would actually look like, I'd love to see the data you have i.e. the "proven history" that when a game lowered arbitrary (the bit you seem to keep missing) barriers to entry it had no effect on the size of the userbase.
Oh look wild emotive generalisations to support your point of view, shocker
What a terrible argument, this happens all the time in the "real world", from Karsticles facetious example to other more realistic ones. To turn the question around, what is the advantage of, again, arbitrary barriers to entry? No-one seems to be suggesting that mechancis be removed or simplified purely for the sake of it, nor that practice or the need for manual dexterity be removed or meaningfully lessened.
To use your analogy, plenty of people do get discouraged during self improvement projects, for a variety of reasons, if it doesnt negatively affect the game wheres the harm in removing some of those reasons? And as an aside fighting games arent magically different from any other competitive game, all of which require certain skillsets, be they mental or physical, and all of which require practice. However I suppose this is getting rather off topic, I dont actually mind the mechanics of XRD and the more general argument is best suited to a more general thread on the subject I suspect.
Tyrant Rave
Banned
I know your pain Karst. That's the whole reason why I went for the PS3 version in the end. Well, that and the fact that I didn't want to shell out the money on a third stick right now.
Karsticles
Member
Maybe there are enough disgruntled PS4 players that folks might want to go in on a gameshare this late...
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
If I went digital I would of hooked you up but yeah needed to show support with that tasty LE
You didn't really argue against my main point but I'd like to clarify regardless: the reversal into FADC into Ultra is bad that it's brain dead (although somewhat technically difficult) and gives a lot of reward for little risk as if your reversal is blocked you can escape punishment with the FADC. That's mostly fixed in Ultra now.
But I agree with those complainers that FADC is obtuse and inelegant. Maybe Capcom thought straight up stealing Roman Cancels would give the player too much freedom but that would have been preferable to what we got.
Anyway, to address your statement about people taking the game seriously might be true to the extent but it's irrevelant. If people don't play the game there's no scene. Barriers to entry can take many forms and execution is one of them.
DOTA and LoL are super popular for many reasons and one of those is that it's free and available on PC which most people have. This is a big reason why cell phone games are successful. Fighting games aren't free and they already come with the barrier of an expensive piece of hardware that most people need if they want to be good and do these execution heavy techniques (yes, you can win EVO with a PS1 pad but it is even more unlikely for the regular fg player).
So if the game doesn't suffer and barriers to entry that grow the scene are removed, who cares? And things like 1f links being removed will never hurt the overall gameplay. No one is suggesting that P4A's mash A combo into super becomes de rigueur.
Why not make all inputs chicken wings and tiger knees? SPDs 720s and super SPDs 1440s? Answer: overly difficult for no reason other than some high level players could consistently pull it off.
SixMachine
Member
Any of you players from Texas? Got pretty bad internet at the moment (need to wait till the next billing cycle to upgrade and other stupid isp crap) so I would like too play someone as close to me as possible. PSN is GiygasXLR. Throw me a friend request if you want to play some matches, still figuring out who to main.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
and he's still S tier
I guess I'm gonna have to learn that teleport-->YRC command throw
What are you referring to here?