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[Wag]

So I've been thinking about something for a few years now. I've been playing guitar since I was about 9 or 10, so about 15-16 years off and on. I never had lessons, and never progressed past reading Tabs and learning riffs. I only ever learned one full song which was Master of Puppets when I was like 13, and yet somehow still remember the whole damn thing. How does someone like me, with terrible posture, finger technique, bad picking, and just all around bad habits from not having an instructor go about unlearning everything and starting over? Is it just as easy as starting up lessons from justinguitar, and sticking with them until I've unlearned all the evil ways?

I'm sort of in the same place. I don't really know if it's worth investing money into a site like Jamplay or just trying Justinguitar for free.

 

[Clockwork5]

I keep trying when I have time. lighter strings might help, actually. And yeah I'm on acoustic.

Barre chords are tough on acoustic. Lighter strings will help. Also, there are things you can do to lower the action on the guitar and make learning a bit less painful.

Has a seasoned guitarist ever given it a play and given you feedback on the feel of the instrument?

Either way, barre chords are going to be hard for a while. One thing that can help is figuring out exactly where to put your index finger in order to get a clear note from all the strings you are barred across. Then every time you want to play that chord, take your time to put your finger in that spot and eventually you won't need to think about it. Everyone's fingers have nooks and crannies in different spots, just play around with it.

It's 75% finger positioning and flexibility and 25% strength.

 

[zbarron]

I'm working on barre chords right now. Those multi colored strings are 11s instead of the 12s I was using before so that makes it slightly easier, but I'm just not sure how much pressure I should be using. Some sites say it takes hand strength and others say I shouldn't be using more pressure than I do with open chords and if I am I'm doing it wrong.

Any thoughts?

I'm just practicing by playing creep which is an E shaped barre chord on the 3rd, 7th, and 8th fret, followed by the Em shape barre chord on the 8th fret.

 

[Wag]

I'm using very light gauge on my acoustic right now and it was adjusted. Only thing is it doesn't stay in tune very well after the music store adjusted it.

 

[zbarron]

I'm using very light gauge on my acoustic right now and it was adjusted. Only thing is it doesn't stay in tune very well after the music store adjusted it.

That's weird. How long have you been playing it since the adjustment. I assume they put fresh strings on. Strings need a little while to settle in and for the first little bit get out of tune really easily.

 

[Timeaisis]

This is probably a good place as any to ask a bass question.

Anyone experienced with Fender Jazz know if there is enough of a difference between MIM and American Standard to warrant the ~$600 difference? Looking to upgrade from my Ibanez, and they sound pretty similar in store. But it's hard to say because those use stock strings and such.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Wag, re tuning problems, did they put the strings on wrong? Have they not lost their initial stretchiness? More likely the latter.

Some sites say it takes hand strength and others say I shouldn't be using more pressure than I do with open chords and if I am I'm doing it wrong.

Any thoughts?

It takes more strength to play a barre chord than an open chord. You don't end up pushing the strings any further into the neck (you only need to push the strings so they stop against the frets, not actually touch any wood-- this nuance is something to practice once it stops hurting and you can get every chord to sound).

 

[30yearsofhurt]

This is probably a good place as any to ask a bass question.

Anyone experienced with Fender Jazz know if there is enough of a difference between MIM and American Standard to warrant the ~$600 difference? Looking to upgrade from my Ibanez, and they sound pretty similar in store. But it's hard to say because those use stock strings and such.

You'll have to do some research. What woods are being used? What pickups are being used? What neck profiles are being used?
Generally the only american made guitar where MIA means something tangible is PRS.
Fender and Gibson aren't worth the premium they charge for MIA gear.

 

[anarchy_panty]

This is probably a good place as any to ask a bass question.

Anyone experienced with Fender Jazz know if there is enough of a difference between MIM and American Standard to warrant the ~$600 difference? Looking to upgrade from my Ibanez, and they sound pretty similar in store. But it's hard to say because those use stock strings and such.

They charge you a hell of a premium for that little American flag sticker on the guitar. Just get the MIM and slap some aftermarket pickups in it and you'll be golden

 

[teruterubozu]

This is probably a good place as any to ask a bass question.

Anyone experienced with Fender Jazz know if there is enough of a difference between MIM and American Standard to warrant the ~$600 difference? Looking to upgrade from my Ibanez, and they sound pretty similar in store. But it's hard to say because those use stock strings and such.

Basically your MIM will lose its value immediately when you walk out the store. The Made in America will likely increase over the years.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Basically your MIM will lose its value immediately when you walk out the store. The Made in America will likely increase over the years.

Why would the MIA one increase in value over the years? they aren't exactly rare. 1958-60 Les Pauls were worth a lot more in 1980 than 1994-1996 Les Pauls are now.

 

[Teknopathetic]

Yeah, MIA guitars haven't really risen in price past circa-70s models. The only reason those still maintain their high value is because of the attachment to bygone eras in company history, finishes that aren't available on recent models, etc. The only recent examples where that isn't the case off the top of my head are MIA Hamer and Reverend going up in price compared to 10-15 years ago and that's because Hamer ceased operations and Reverend stopped making MIA guitars. Obviously, that would increase the price.

The general increase in quality (or increase in recognition of quality) of Mexican, Japanese, Korean, Chinese, and Indonesian guitars is also a factor. Why would a 1990s MIA Tele go up in price when you can just get a Classic Vibe Tele that's as well made as a 90s MIA (as far as craftsmanship goes), with the only notable quality difference between the two being parts that are replaceable? Outside of Custom Shop/hand-lathed and shaped by master luthier boutique guitars, these guitars are pooped out of (the exact same) CNC machines en masse. Quality Control is equaling out across the board. There's nothing particularly special about them any more. That said, depending on the brand, some MIA guitars will certainly *hold* their value pretty well like Rickenbacker or PRS.

If the MIM played and sounded equal to the MIA, there's not much reason to get the MIA unless you want to swing that extra $600 because you really want the MIA. And there's nothing wrong with that, either.

 

[Timeaisis]

Thanks, all. I have a friend who has a Fender american strat and he swears up and down it's so much better than the mexican version, even though I don't see it (or hear it much, he has both).

I'm gonna go for what my wallet can handle right now. I was mostly wondering if build quality was up to snuff enough in the non American versions. I buy my instruments for life, pretty much. I'll probably just grab a MIM and upgrade it down the line. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Wag]

That's weird. How long have you been playing it since the adjustment. I assume they put fresh strings on. Strings need a little while to settle in and for the first little bit get out of tune really easily.

A few weeks. I broke a string already. 😀

 

[teruterubozu]

Thanks, all. I have a friend who has a Fender american strat and he swears up and down it's so much better than the mexican version, even though I don't see it (or hear it much, he has both).

I'm gonna go for what my wallet can handle right now. I was mostly wondering if build quality was up to snuff enough in the non American versions. I buy my instruments for life, pretty much. I'll probably just grab a MIM and upgrade it down the line. Thanks for the advice.

Good decision! Yeah you can always upgrade down the line! There's an old Fender joke - kinda xenophobic, but in some ways true - "Made in Mexico Fenders are made by Mexicans, while Made in America Fenders are made by Mexican Americans."

 

[Ether_Snake]

So I'm trying to play my guitar again and I'm just getting frustrated. Every odd time I pick at a cord it sounds bad. I looked at picking hand positioning on the net and I can't do it; they put their hand against the board or hold the pick perpendicular to the strings and I can't do that without it feeling uncomfortable.

I keep thinking maybe I should give up because I don't like ending my evenings frustrated, and maybe trying piano/keyboard instead, but then I tell myself why couldn't I learn this? Just picking at a chord sounds completely inconsistent. WHY

 

[WoolyNinja]

So I'm trying to play my guitar again and I'm just getting frustrated. Every odd time I pick at a cord it sounds bad. I looked at picking hand positioning on the net and I can't do it; they put their hand against the board or hold the pick perpendicular to the strings and I can't do that without it feeling uncomfortable.

I keep thinking maybe I should give up because I don't like ending my evenings frustrated, and maybe trying piano/keyboard instead, but then I tell myself why couldn't I learn this? Just picking at a chord sounds completely inconsistent. WHY

Is this what you're struggling with? (just trying to make sure I'm understanding?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAnIV0tMtrU

 

[Ether_Snake]

Is this what you're struggling with? (just trying to make sure I'm understanding?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAnIV0tMtrU

I haven't tried strumming much, got to play some chord. But I have been trying to just read some tab like the godfather theme and play it one note at a time. It feels like typing with one finger. But the sound produced is very inconsistent, sometimes very loud or barely audible and the rythm is all off because i have to move by hand along the fretboard to find the frets, and I have to try to look at each hand to make sure they're in the right place on the fretboard and picking the proper strings. Very awkward.

 

[WoolyNinja]

Ah - sounds to me like you just need to keep at it. You should slowly start to play the notes more consistently but it'll definitely take time. One thing you could do to practice would be to simply practice on one string. Just pick a fret on a string and push on it and pluck the string with your pick. Then lift your finger and play that note. Then push your finger back on the same fret and play that note again. Keep doing it until bored or until you can consistently play those 2 notes.

 

[Wag]

I posted this in the Guitar thread but I think it's more appropriate here.

I'm forcing myself to learn how to play with a pick after 30 years of just strumming with my hand. To say it's difficult is an understatement.

What is the proper way of holding a pick? Should I keep my hand closed like a fist or leave it open in an "OK" position? I'm finding that sort of a loose fist is what I'm using, but my hand is cramping up anyways. I haven't really decided between the two I mentioned: Fist or OK.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jn_nd5l0yUo

This guy really impresses me. You see he rests his fingers on the pick guard as a guide. I'd love to be able to play this song that way. Right now I can strum the chords (barely with the pic), that's about it.

 

[adamsappel]

So I'm trying to play my guitar again and I'm just getting frustrated. Every odd time I pick at a cord it sounds bad. I looked at picking hand positioning on the net and I can't do it; they put their hand against the board or hold the pick perpendicular to the strings and I can't do that without it feeling uncomfortable.

I keep thinking maybe I should give up because I don't like ending my evenings frustrated, and maybe trying piano/keyboard instead, but then I tell myself why couldn't I learn this? Just picking at a chord sounds completely inconsistent. WHY

Learning to play the guitar is hard. And painful. Don't give up. Practice, practice, practice. Are you starting with simple cowboy chords, played up at the nut? Don't worry about chords that require a lot of stretching yet. Practice the three-finger open chords until you get some muscle memory and can easily switch between them, then start adding in simple barre chords. Learn to anchor your thumb on the back of the neck and to strum/pick in a clean up-and-down motion. As you practice and get better, you will be surprised how light your grip can become, and how "sloppy" you can play and still get the proper sound. Wag, I hold a pick between my thumb and index finger, with the point of the pick at my first knuckle and keep the other fingers open; learning to keep your hand open will make it easier to incorporate picking with those fingers later on, muting, etc.

 

[Wag]

Learning to play the guitar is hard. And painful. Don't give up. Practice, practice, practice. Are you starting with simple cowboy chords, played up at the nut? Don't worry about chords that require a lot of stretching yet. Practice the three-finger open chords until you get some muscle memory and can easily switch between them, then start adding in simple barre chords. Learn to anchor your thumb on the back of the neck and to strum/pick in a clean up-and-down motion. As you practice and get better, you will be surprised how light your grip can become, and how "sloppy" you can play and still get the proper sound. Wag, I hold a pick between my thumb and index finger, with the point of the pick at my first knuckle and keep the other fingers open; learning to keep your hand open will make it easier to incorporate picking with those fingers later on, muting, etc.

Yeah, it's difficult to learn new techniques. Building muscle memory is painful and takes a lot of practice. Right now I alternate fingering drills between the acoustic and electric on different days.

What I find particularly difficult is learning to alternate direction with the pick. I'm so used to just down-strumming with my hand. It's going to take me quite a while to get comfortable with the pick.

 

[NeoForte]

So I'm finally starting to learn my bass I've had for a while. Anyone got any good suggestions for a total noob?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Every odd time I pick at a cord it sounds bad. I looked at picking hand positioning on the net and I can't do it; they put their hand against the board or hold the pick perpendicular to the strings and I can't do that without it feeling uncomfortable.

Perpendicular? That seems not right to me. Which part of the guitar do you mean by 'board'? If you mean the top or the pickguard then don't bother doing that.

I keep thinking maybe I should give up because I don't like ending my evenings frustrated, and maybe trying piano/keyboard instead, but then I tell myself why couldn't I learn this?

Remember that every guitarist started in the same place— so if you like hearing a guitar played well, that guitarist was in the same place you were, where it was painful and frustrating. You just have to stick with it for a little bit and it will fall into place. I think any instrument is going to be the same, though perhaps without the pain of waiting for calluses to form.

First stage: look at your fretting hand, move your fingers into uncomfortable positions; try to hold them there while you look at your picking/strumming hand to find the right string(s) to hit; hit the strings; decide you need to do it again or you want to get the next note or chord; either way, goto 1.

Soon (?) you won't need to look at your picking/strumming hand and all concentration will be on your fretting hand and away you go.

If the pick is too weird, don't use it— try a finger tip or thump tip or the back of a nail. Don't catch the bottom of your nail on the string— it hurts.

What is the proper way of holding a pick?

I hold my hand in a very loose fist— finger tips are perpendicular to my palm— hmm, looks like I'm making a jerk off motion— coincidence? They open up to finger pick. Pick itself is held like in the video posted above.

 

[Wag]

OMG! I've finally seen the light. I can see why playing with a pick can have it's advantages. I'm going to keep forcing myself to play with a pick and play strings in alternate directions.

I wish I could afford lessons but I guess Rocksmith and youtube are going to be it for now.

 

[zbarron]

I hold my hand in a very loose fist— finger tips are perpendicular to my palm— hmm, looks like I'm making a jerk off motion— coincidence?

This is Neogaf so you mean like this amirite?

 

[Ether_Snake]

Perpendicular? That seems not right to me. Which part of the guitar do you mean by 'board'? If you mean the top or the pickguard then don't bother doing that.

Remember that every guitarist started in the same place— so if you like hearing a guitar played well, that guitarist was in the same place you were, where it was painful and frustrating. You just have to stick with it for a little bit and it will fall into place. I think any instrument is going to be the same, though perhaps without the pain of waiting for calluses to form.

First stage: look at your fretting hand, move your fingers into uncomfortable positions; try to hold them there while you look at your picking/strumming hand to find the right string(s) to hit; hit the strings; decide you need to do it again or you want to get the next note or chord; either way, goto 1.

Soon (?) you won't need to look at your picking/strumming hand and all concentration will be on your fretting hand and away you go.

If the pick is too weird, don't use it— try a finger tip or thump tip or the back of a nail. Don't catch the bottom of your nail on the string— it hurts.



I hold my hand in a very loose fist— finger tips are perpendicular to my palm— hmm, looks like I'm making a jerk off motion— coincidence? They open up to finger pick. Pick itself is held like in the video posted above.

Right now I'm trying to strum up and can't do it. If I strum up, I miss cords, or have to push very hard to go up otherwise my pick stays stuck at a chord while going up, it ends up going up one by one not quickly like when strumming down and then skips a chord or stops at a chord :| I can only strum up if I completely change the angle of my wrist before strumming upward, but in videos I see people don't do that, their hand stays the same up and down.

edit: Bah forget this, I give up, tired of spending my time not getting the basics anyway. Done forever. Another failure.

 

[zbarron]

Right now I'm trying to strum up and can't do it. If I strum up, I miss cords, or have to push very hard to go up otherwise my pick stays stuck at a chord while going up, it ends up going up one by one not quickly like when strumming down and then skips a chord or stops at a chord :| I can only strum up if I completely change the angle of my wrist before strumming upward, but in videos I see people don't do that, their hand stays the same up and down.

Try a thin pick. A lot of people don't care for them but they felt very right for playing open chords for me.

 

[adamsappel]

edit: Bah forget this, I give up, tired of spending my time not getting the basics anyway. Done forever. Another failure.

We've all been there. It's frustrating. Try a thin, floppy pick like zbarron suggests. Or don't worry about that right now. Move on to getting a good chord shape with a downward strum. Practice scales. Learn the fingerboard note positions. Tune to Open G and play 90% of the Rolling Stones catalog. All of these pieces have to come together eventually. You won't say, "I can strum up and down, now!" and suddenly you're a guitarist. If it's any consolation, before every breakthrough I've had as a student, I suddenly became awful at things I could previously do competently, but then it "clicks" and you won't even remember what the stumbling block was.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Every time I say I give up I put the guitar away then come back five minutes later anyway

Yeah the pick I have is rather sturdy.

I put that away for now. I really liked this fingerpicking lesson, was easy to learn https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7xm_juNcPY

 

[Dynamite Ringo Matsuri]

I'm curious how you guys get good vibrato on the lower, wound strings, especially closer to the headstock. Vibrato on the lighter gauges isn't bad for me, but on the 4th, 5th and 6th I don't find I have nearly as much control. I tend to use multiple fingers to support the bend/release, and use a rocking motion by twisting my wrist.

When I attempt vibrato on say, the 5th or 6th strings, I find that you have to pull down towards the floor to bend the pitch, however, I can't get nearly as good control thru the rocking/twisting method and have taken to wiggling the string to bend down and release again with one finger, typically my middle or ring. Kind of hard to explain with just words but is there a better method than this? Or a video that highlights a good vibrato technique?

 

[Vincent Alexander]

I'm curious how you guys get good vibrato on the lower, wound strings, especially closer to the headstock. Vibrato on the lighter gauges isn't bad for me, but on the 4th, 5th and 6th I don't find I have nearly as much control. I tend to use multiple fingers to support the bend/release, and use a rocking motion by twisting my wrist.

When I attempt vibrato on say, the 5th or 6th strings, I find that you have to pull down towards the floor to bend the pitch, however, I can't get nearly as good control thru the rocking/twisting method and have taken to wiggling the string to bend down and release again with one finger, typically my middle or ring. Kind of hard to explain with just words but is there a better method than this? Or a video that highlights a good vibrato technique?

Paul Gilbert has some really great lessons on string bending and vibrato. On my cell right now, so I can't find the one I want, but even this video is good

 

[Jeff6851]

So I've been playing for about 9 years and I don't feel like I've made much progress for a while. Besides becoming better at chords and understanding scales a bit (learning piano really helped there) I don't feel like I could write a decent melody.

I also have trouble determining notes by ear (like hearing a chord or single note and say "that's an A chord/note" so if anyone has tips that would be great. I'm also looking into getting Rocksmith because I've seen people playing for the fraction of the time as me do things I could never get on my own.

Edit: Are there cheaper alternatives to the Real Tone Cable for PC?

 

[Head of Vengarl]

How do you guys deal with cold hands? I'm tall and skinny so my hands and feet are always cold as fuck.

 

[Dynamite Ringo Matsuri]

Paul Gilbert has some really great lessons on string bending and vibrato. On my cell right now, so I can't find the one I want, but even this video is good

Good stuff. Love Gilbert. I definitely execute vibrato in the exact same manner. I'm pretty good with control on the lighter gauge strings, but the lower gauge strings, and especially lower down on the neck, like say vibrato on the 5th fret or so is where I run into issues, I just get much wider range by not using the rocking/fulcrum method, and was second guessing things.

I guess I just have to keep at it to build that hand strength? I don't see too many vids where people are executing vibrato on the lower range of the fretboard. Lots of players seem to like to rock the higher notes to accentuate bends and stuff. Noticed Rob Chapman has a vibrato vid too so I'll probably check that one out as well.

 

[Vincent Alexander]

How do you guys deal with cold hands? I'm tall and skinny so my hands and feet are always cold as fuck.

Seems like a silly answer, but generally hot chocolate and sitting on my hands. I get cold hands a lot.

 

[Wag]

My hand was starting to cramp up between my thumb and index finger so I started to consciously hold the pick only as tight as necessary. Seems better. I'm just not used to holding a pick yet.

Alternate direction picking is very difficult.

 

[JustHadToJoin]

I was talking to a driver in an Uber and i had my guitar with me and he suggested that the best genre for beginners to learn is blues and classical, because they will give you the most knowledge and range to be able to play anything else.

Now I know you want to play songs that you like in order to stay motivated, but does anyone feel that there is any truth to this?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

This is Neogaf so you mean like this amirite?
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2824/32902293622_d68247b061_z.jpg

I laughed.

but does anyone feel that there is any truth to this?

I totally appreciate where the sentiment is coming from, and while not a terrible idea, I'm not sure it's the panacea your uber driver suggested. Everything is derivative— so pick an entry point and you can work back to the things that inspired it or forward to things it inspired.