• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Halo 4 |OT| Spartans Never Die

I

Izayoi

Banned
BLCKATK said:
I know when I use camo people tend to actually look for me. It's easy to be seen, especially when you are shooting/throwing grenades/moving. Knowing that there are camo users around makes me more aware as a gamer and since release I have seen others adapt to camo (like in Reach) where people were constantly checking corners. So far I haven't seen camo be a game breaking experience but its different for everyone.
Click to expand...
Using it, it certainly felt game breaking to me. You remain completely invisible at range as long as you're standing still/crouched while firing. In places where it's hard to get a visual and there isn't a lot of elbow room (see: Ragnarok bases), you can camp with a short-range weapon and kill and kill and kill and nobody will be able to stop you. It's fucking crazy.
 
M

MinkTANK

Banned
Izayoi said:
To each their own, I suppose. I loved the Pistol in Halo 1, it was probably one of my favorite things about the multiplayer, so to have the DMR as it is now is a dream come true to me (outside of a Halo 1 remake with, you know, multiplayer).
Click to expand...

But.. the pistol didn't have an unlimited range. It also didn't have H4's large amount of aim assist and large hitboxes to boot.
Not to mention it wasn't hitscan.

The DMR is an awful weapon, just because of it's ridiculous range. You should never be able to melt someone cross-map (on large maps) with a spawn weapon in under 2 seconds. It ruins map movement.
 
I

Izayoi

Banned
MinkTANK said:
But.. the pistol didn't have an unlimited range. It also didn't have H4's large amount of aim assist and large hitboxes to boot.
Not to mention it wasn't hitscan.

The DMR is an awful weapon, just because of it's ridiculous range. You should never be able to melt someone cross-map (on large maps) with a spawn weapon in under 2 seconds. It ruins map movement.
Click to expand...
Used properly, the Pistol was not that much different from the DMR as far as range is concerned. It was still possible to decimate people across the map with it. I will give you the difficulty factor, it took a lot more skill to use than the DMR does.

I think the DMR could be "fixed" by slapping a 2x on it (though some might argue it would make it even more powerful as it'd be even easier to use at mid range).
 
M

Monumental

Banned
Izayoi said:
Are you saying that people who actively discuss and analyze the game's mechanics and core systems are fooling themselves into thinking that they are "true Halo fans"? I'd argue that the people here, who dedicate almost as many hours playing the game as they do breaking it down and discussing it with others, are "bigger" fans than those who play it with a passing interest for a month and then move on to the next big thing.

I see this "Well, you spend a lot of time criticizing - you must not be a real fan!" shit all of the time, and frankly, it's a fallacy. Many times, the people who are the most critical are also the ones who hold the series to a higher standard. They expect more than the average person, because they care about it and want it to be the best that it can be. So please, let's hold off on the hyperbole and broad generalizations.
Click to expand...
That's not what I'm saying at all. I do think that hardcore fans are more critical, and that's fine. But when you have someone like Ghaleon saying that he doesn't even want to play Halo 4 anymore...I think there is a line drawn between analyzing aspects of your favourite game and focusing so much on little things that you actually forget that this is your favourite series.

Trust me, I can discuss and analyze aspects of Halo 4 on a fundemental level with anyone here, but I feel a giant disconnect with people who just can't even have fun anymore with the game.
 
J

JB1981

Member
cluto said:
De-scoping was a far better mechanic for keeping snipers and other long-range weapons in check. There's enough leeway with flinch to re-aim your shots and finish off a guy all the way across the map, even if you're being shot. This, combined with the DMR's insane reach, makes the general combat range in Halo 4 way longer than it was in previous Halos. It's for these same reasons that Ragnarok is arguably ruined in comparison to its Halo 3 version.

The super competitive will also argue that re-scoping after being de-scoped is a skill in itself, so getting those long range kills was more demanding of skill, unlike flinch, which is one of the many random factors introduced to the game. There's no skillful way to compensate for random crosshair shaking -- it's not the root of the problem, but it's just another example of the game requiring less skill overall. And I don't understand how calling de-scoping "jarring" is an argument -- there is nothing more jarring than someone shaking your screen with their bullets.
Click to expand...

Honestly flinch is really not that jarring to me. You just adjust to the bobbing reticle. Being pulled out of scope and then having to re enter scope is much worse.
 
M

MinkTANK

Banned
Izayoi said:
Used properly, the Pistol was not that much different from the DMR as far as range is concerned. It was still possible to decimate people across the map with it. I will give you the difficulty factor, it took a lot more skill to use than the DMR does.

I think the DMR could be "fixed" by slapping a 2x on it (though some might argue it would make it even more powerful as it'd be even easier to use at mid range).
Click to expand...
Agreed, but the pistol's range was a lot smaller, the DMR can hit from end to end on Longbow on H4 and the same on Hemorrhage on Reach. Whereas the pistol's max was a little more than tele to tele on Blood Gulch (See: http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=tr_Ps_HV1r8).

Forgive the messiness of my writing if you can, my phone hates being useful.
 
ToyMachine228

ToyMachine228

Member
Started my solo legendary run this weekend and the campaign is blowing me away all over again. The way the Forerunner buildings feel alive, the music, the scope of everything, the attention to detail...It really does feel like a space epic for the first time in franchise history. And 343 is just getting started. Can't wait to see where we go and what is new in 5 and 6. Keep the new stuff coming!
 
I

Izayoi

Banned
MinkTANK said:
Forgive the messiness of my writing if you can, my phone hates being useful.
Click to expand...
It's all good, I understand what you're saying.

I don't know if there's a good fix for the problem, other than capping the range. I like the idea of a non-sniper weapon that is capable of engaging targets across the map, but I'm not sure if being able to spawn with one is the right call.

This of course wouldn't be a problem without ordnance, as now the entire enemy team can be rocking two sniper weapons and spawning with a weapon that can't reach would be absolutely miserable. They've painted themselves into a corner and without a total rethink of ordnance and long range weapons, I doubt we'll see anything change.

My suggestion would be to make the BR a default spawn weapon (or maybe bring back the old Pistol, nerfed slightly obviously - give it the same shots to kill and kill time as the DMR, but give it a range cap) and remove ordnance from the game entirely, or at least remove sniper weapons from ordnance drops and place them only as spawns on the map. Remove the DMR from starting loadouts and have it available on the map or in ordnance drops. I doubt that it would ever happen, but there you go.

Jake Tower said:
I've never been a Halo multiplayer gamer (prefered Firefight)... is it even worth playing if I don't grind out the XP to get perquisites?
Click to expand...
You can buy the DMR after one (maybe two) match(es). That's all you need, really.
 
V

vatstep

This poster pulses with an appeal so broad the typical restraints of our societies fall by the wayside.
I have a couple of 2XP codes that I won't be using. They're from Doritos bags, though, so it's certainly possible that some thug already used them (the codes are on the outside). Quote to reveal.
 
I

Izayoi

Banned
Monumental said:
That's not what I'm saying at all. I do think that hardcore fans are more critical, and that's fine. But when you have someone like Ghaleon saying that he doesn't even want to play Halo 4 anymore...I think there is a line drawn between analyzing aspects of your favourite game and focusing so much on little things that you actually forget that this is your favourite series.

Trust me, I can discuss and analyze aspects of Halo 4 on a fundemental level with anyone here, but I feel a giant disconnect with people who just can't even have fun anymore with the game.
Click to expand...
My mistake. Halo 4 makes a lot of changes to the formula, it's possible that even someone who is a huge fan of the series could be turned off by just a few, especially if they've grown attached to old ways (it took me a long time to come to terms with the fact that Halo 1 multiplayer was never making a return). I agree that quitting because of flinch seems a little extreme, but I'm a bad person to judge because neither de-scoping nor flinch have ever been a problem for me. It could really make the game unplayable for him, who knows?
 
P

PeterVenkman

Member
Izayoi said:
My mistake. Halo 4 makes a lot of changes to the formula, it's possible that even someone who is a huge fan of the series could be turned off by just a few, especially if they've grown attached to old ways (it took me a long time to come to terms with the fact that Halo 1 multiplayer was never making a return). I agree that quitting because of flinch seems a little extreme, but I'm a bad person to judge because neither de-scoping nor flinch have never been a problem for me. It could really make the game unplayable for him, who knows?
Click to expand...

Has there been any indication that 343 is going to create some kind of "Classic" or "test" playlist with possible changes? I for one would love an opportunity to play with set weapon spawns or de scoping included.
 
A

Archpath1

Member
he's a good theory, what if ordinance was tier based,
3 tier lvls based on power of weapons
instead of 3 options to pick it would be 2 options - weapons / grenade,powerup
you still build it up but you can chose to pick or keep building till next tier for better odinance
 
S

SPEA

Member
IOnEI Falcon said:
Man! The disappearing weapons is totally bumping me out. Got an ordinance for a sweet SAW. Let's do this! Get killed by a tank. Go back to where I died and my SAW is already gone...

And can we boot people in Halo 4? Some jackass team killed me in their ghost TWICE and I couldn't get rid of him. He also ran over two of my team mates once each...what the hell...haha!
Click to expand...
This is the first Halo since 2 that has really grabbed me. I love pretty much everything about how its deseigned except for what you just mentioned. That's the one thing that really really bothers me. I really hope they think about adjusting the despawn times.
 
LowParry

LowParry

Member
Do weapon drops on maps change over time if no one picks them up? I'm running into a lot of wrong weapon pick ups when the icon says it is a particular weapon. (Example: Spot sniper icon. Pick up. It's a SAM rifle instead).
 
G

GrizzNKev

Banned
kylej said:
A+
Click to expand...

Thanks.

-PXG- said:
I've said it for years:

Random effects undermine balance, team work, competition and in some cases, skill itself

Unpredictable elements and personal unlockables and EXP have ruined competitive multiplayer. Besides having less time to play, it's these things that prevent me from enjoying mutliplayer over a long period of time. I just get sick of the bullshit and mindlessly filling up bars.
Click to expand...

I too am beginning to tire of these things. At least Reach limited the filling of bars to things that didn't modify the gameplay in any way.

kittens said:
Yeah, those posts hit a lot of the key reasons I really don't like Halo 4. Unfortunately, "RIP Halo" isn't hyperbolic.
Click to expand...

The worst part is that we all saw it coming. I was willing to throw it aside during the launch hype but now that I've had my fun it's time to dig into the things that could make this game better.

Monumental said:
Sprinting, chosing your own starting weapons, tayloring your abilities to your own playstyle, killcams to see how you can improve, join-in-progress, playlist per gametype, weapon balance, plasma pistols to take down overpowered vehicles, feel of the weapons, jump height, and a million and a half other things that define the online play experience.

And yet you come to a hardcore online community and you read shit like "Flinch is breaking what defines Halo and I can't play online like this", it just makes you sad. Like seriously. It's time like this where if I was a developer, I'd say fuck it. It's like if your wife got a pimple once and you filed for divorce. It's so damn petty.

And there are thousands of different features and systems at play to define what makes this game Halo and fun, and yet the "hardcore community" is typically the shallowest, where they always break the damn game to one feature and how it's ruining everything.

Dual Wielding is no longer Halo.
Lack of Hitscan is no longer Halo.
Bloom is no longer Halo.
Armor Lock is no longer Halo.
Flinch is no longer Halo.

Times like these I pity those who think they are true Halo fans, when millions of "clueless noobs" are out there and enjoying the game just fine. I rather play with those that just wanna play for fun.
Click to expand...

No. Just no.

I am a fan of Halo more than I am a fan of any other form of entertainment or media. Someone else already said this, but that's why I'm highly critical of the game.

I've grown up with the franchise. It has defined my relationship with video games. I will still try to sell anyone on any Halo. I've put far more hours into the series than any other games. Visiting Bungie's studio, interviewing Frank and Kiki at this past E3, and getting to meet some other devs from 343 who showed up to the midnight launch in Redmond are among the most exciting moments of my life. The love I have for these games and the memories I associate with them give me the justification to complain as much as I want to about the things I don't like.
 
A

ATF487

Member
Monumental said:
Sprinting, chosing your own starting weapons, tayloring your abilities to your own playstyle, killcams to see how you can improve, join-in-progress, playlist per gametype, weapon balance, plasma pistols to take down overpowered vehicles, feel of the weapons, jump height, and a million and a half other things that define the online play experience.

And yet you come to a hardcore online community and you read shit like "Flinch is breaking what defines Halo and I can't play online like this", it just makes you sad. Like seriously. It's time like this where if I was a developer, I'd say fuck it. It's like if your wife got a pimple once and you filed for divorce. It's so damn petty.

And there are thousands of different features and systems at play to define what makes this game Halo and fun, and yet the "hardcore community" is typically the shallowest, where they always break the damn game to one feature and how it's ruining everything.

Dual Wielding is no longer Halo.
Lack of Hitscan is no longer Halo.
Bloom is no longer Halo.
Armor Lock is no longer Halo.
Flinch is no longer Halo.

Times like these I pity those who think they are true Halo fans, when millions of "clueless noobs" are out there and enjoying the game just fine. I rather play with those that just wanna play for fun.
Click to expand...

I'd like to think there's some sort of middle ground we can come to, where people have legitimate complaints without thinking the sky is falling. You're right, it's good to have perspective but it doesn't mean that people can't have opinions about the direction the games are heading in.

Personally I'm enjoying the game a lot. I don't know if I like some of the COD changes to multiplayer but it's still Halo to me.
 
B

blamite

Member
CcrooK said:
Do weapon drops on maps change over time if no one picks them up? I'm running into a lot of wrong weapon pick ups when the icon says it is a particular weapon. (Example: Spot sniper icon. Pick up. It's a SAM rifle instead).
Click to expand...

I don't think so, but there's a somewhat common issue where ordnance drops just get labaled as the wrong weapon. For me the most common form of this bug is seeing every ordnance drop say it's a Spartan Laser, including grenades.
 
G

GrizzNKev

Banned
blamite said:
I don't think so, but there's a somewhat common issue where ordnance drops just get labaled as the wrong weapon. For me the most common form of this bug is seeing every ordnance drop say it's a Spartan Laser, including grenades.
Click to expand...

I actually think it's most common in dominion. When a base gets a resupply multiple times in a row, ordnance will be overwritten with a new one but the icon won't change.
 
K

kittens

Unconfirmed Member
daedalius said:
Just can't get enough in the OT eh?
Click to expand...
My post count in the Halo threads has dropped dramatically. I've complained a bit and made plenty of snide remarks, but I've mostly kept my mouth shut. In the case of the line that you quoted, I was just responding to a conversation that was already going on without me.

And yes, in a very real sense, traditional Halo is dead. GrizzNKev pointed out many of the reasons I feel that way. I'm glad you like its replacement, but I sure don't.
 
N

Neuromancer

Member
Did the Halo 4 quiz on the dashboard, and what the fuck at #5:

i0EcNgq0e60Cl.jpg
Click to expand...

LLShC.gif
 
Y

Your Best Amigo

Member
I was playing Slayer Pro on Haven earlier and I tried to assassinate somebody and while it did the animaion it said that I committed suicide. What up with that?
 
P

Pooya

Member
Your Best Amigo said:
I was playing Slayer Pro on Haven earlier and I tried to assassinate somebody and while it did the animaion it said that I committed suicide. What up with that?
Click to expand...

apparently there is an assassination bug? I got killed by the guy I was assassinating too once, he got out and melee'd me instead.
 
G

GrizzNKev

Banned
miladesn said:
apparently there is an assassination bug? I got killed by the guy I was assassinating too once, he got out and melee'd me instead.
Click to expand...

Exactly this just happened to me. I got an assassination, pulled into 3rd person to watch it happen, and suddenly the guy I was killing had punched me dead. Wut.
 
E

enzo_gt

tagged by Blackace
I've gotten out of an assassination too. I reckon it's when a rollback occurs right after you input the assassination.
 
T

Timedog

good credit (by proxy)
How cum I can't find anybody in matchmaking as shitty as me? :(

I think I reversed an assassination once by unknowingly going into sprint right as the assassination was starting.
 
R

rakka

Member
enzo_gt said:
I've gotten out of an assassination too. I reckon it's when a rollback occurs right after you input the assassination.
Click to expand...

reminds me.

playing a real laggy game once in reach, someone started assassinating me, and i pummelled him. then the announcer called out "showstopper". hehe
 
N

Not a Jellyfish

but I am a sheep
So the code that makes all Specializations available to you to choose from...I put it in and selected Engineer as my first, completed it and boom it is only showing Operator and Wetwork now.

Is this correct?

If so fuck that, Engineer tactical upgrade shows incoming ordinance drops well guess what?

It is horribly broken, it keeps the initial ones on screen, had like 8 on screen at once and none of the weapons where still there anyway. Terrible.
 
T

TheOddOne

Member
Not a Jellyfish said:
So the code that makes all Specializations available to you to choose from...I put it in and selected Engineer as my first, completed it and boom it is only showing Operator and Wetwork now.
Click to expand...
Happend to me too yesterday. I just went to the dashboard, restarted Halo 4 and all the specializations where there. So, try that.

I think it might be a bug or something.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Rumor: 343 Industries Will Only Supervise Development of Future Halo Games
Rumor Platform 2 3
104
7K
StreetsofBeige replied
Xbox announces that future Halo games will be developed on Unreal Engine 5
4 5 6 7 8
369
13K
King Dazzar replied
Halo: The Master Chief Collection development has ceased. Reason was due to lack of microtransactions
News 2 3
118
8K
StreetsofBeige replied
First Details on Halo Infinite Canceled Campaign Expansion
Rumor 2
88
6K
the_master replied
How would you feel is Bungie and 343 Studios collaborated on a Destiny-like game set in the Halo universe?
36
1K
Clintizzle replied
Top Bottom