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Halo 5: Guardians |OT4| You picked a helluva week to join up

G

Gwyn

Member
Forerunner said:
That's actually pretty smart of them. A lot of people want the Reach stuff, but probably wouldn't get it because they don't play enough and there are just too many reqs to get.

It doesn't matter for me because I have anything unlocked, but I can easily see people buying this.
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Let's hope 343 doesn't fuck up like last time. If someone buys this pack they should only get MoR reqs
 
M

Magwik

Banned
Gwyn said:
New pack

Halo-5-Guardians-Memories-of-Reach-REQs.jpg
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This makes things so much easier
 
FUNKNOWN iXi

FUNKNOWN iXi

Member
Trup1aya said:
I just don't like what I perceive is a poorly balanced req item... effective or not. I don't think that really requires much explaination. You can assume that I've been victimized by it, that's fine, excellent argument.

I guess it's agree with Funk/Zoso/exwife approved opinions or you're bad at halo... Ok i got it
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There comes a point where sometimes we must question our own perspectives and biases when there are people with the experience who wouldn't lie or show bias telling us otherwise.

In this specific case (I'm not generalizing as you are), it's very clear you have little to no experience with Spartan Charge + Speed Boost, so it's odd how adamant you were with arguing how unbalanced it is. Want to try an experiment? Make a few raw videos of using Speed Boost and try to get as many Spartan Charge kills as you can, then post them all here. If you really think it's as overpowered as you say, you should have no problem getting tons of kills whenever you use it.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
FUNKNOWN iXi said:
There comes a point where sometimes we must question our own perspectives and biases when there are people with the experience who wouldn't lie or show bias telling us otherwise.

In this specific case (I'm not generalizing as you are), it's very clear you have little to no experience with Spartan Charge + Speed Boost, so it's odd how adamant you were with arguing how unbalanced it is. Want to try an experiment? Make a few raw videos of using Speed Boost and try to get as many Spartan Charge kills as you can, then post them all here. If you really think it's as overpowered as you say, you should have no problem getting tons of kills whenever you use it.
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The bolded: Oh really, interesting concept.

The fact of the matter is, the whole 1HK SC was probably shortest lived sandbox change this game has seen. Simply put, it's clear that a lot of people didn't like what it did to the meta... I'm not alone in this.

Because 3 people on this forum are vocally in favor of it, doesn't mean it was ever a good for the game.

I don't need to create a video to know that I am against anything that encourages sprinting directly at an opponent.

If the item IS underutilized, there are better ways to improve its utility than making it 1HK. Increasing its duration, increasing its effect, decreasing its cost etc.
 
S

Samurai G0SU

Member
Why are we arguing about stupid speed boost?

Can't y'all argue about how the new armor are frauds among us!?

Frauds !!!!!!

Just like that little fucker
forerunner

We must band together and
jump teabag him
till the sun sets 200 times.


Hell might as well have
fata1moose
in there too!!!


Muahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaa!!!!!
 
F

Forerunner

Member
Samurai G0SU said:
Why are we arguing about stupid speed boost?

Can't y'all argue about how the new armor are frauds among us!?

Frauds !!!!!!

Just like that little fucker
forerunner

We must band together and
jump teabag him
till the sun sets 200 times.


Hell might as well have
fata1moose
in there too!!!


Muahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaa!!!!!
Click to expand...

You need to calm down.
 
M

Madness

Member
Speed boost + Spartan Charge became to Halo 5 warzone assault what Marathon Pro and Lightweight and dual akimbo 1887 did for MW2 for a while before they nerfed it too.

I love how people are saying it isn't an issue and yet then post their stats showing 28 spartan charge kills a match. As if that is something to promotr in a first person shooter. Yeah speed boost is a shitty req but making it so that you can equip a speed boost 3 and then just one hit kill from like 5 feet away with a few seconds of sprint is too much. I didn't like the few matches I played where people used it so much that even I started using it. Obviously it became a big issue if they officially decided to remove it. Commendations are temporary. You don't want to screw up the balance the game has.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Madness said:
Speed boost + Spartan Charge became to Halo 5 warzone assault what Marathon Pro and Lightweight and dual akimbo 1887 did for MW2 for a while before they nerfed it too.

I love how people are saying it isn't an issue and yet then post their stats showing 28 spartan charge kills a match. As if that is something to promotr in a first person shooter. Yeah speed boost is a shitty req but making it so that you can equip a speed boost 3 and then just one hit kill from like 5 feet away with a few seconds of sprint is too much. I didn't like the few matches I played where people used it so much that even I started using it. Obviously it became a big issue if they officially decided to remove it. Commendations are temporary. You don't want to screw up the balance the game has.
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Did you get Funknown's approval to be contrarian to 1HK Spartan charges in the face of halo5's other issues? Do you have video of yourself using Spartan Charge?

If you answered no to either question, you are terrible at Halo, and thus, unqualified to speak on this matter.
 
Z

Zoso Achilles

Member
Trup1aya said:
Did you get Funknown's approval to be contrarian to 1HK Spartan charges in the face of halo5's other issues? Do you have video of yourself using Spartan Charge?

If you answered no to either question, you are terrible at Halo, and thus, unqualified to speak on this matter.
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Wow, u real mad
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Zoso Achilles said:
Wow, u real mad
Click to expand...

Not really. It was funny to me...

YourExWife said:
Like I said, whether or not it takes up a weapon slot is not an argument against. Vehicles don't take up weapon slots either and often make you much more lethal.

Literally any team with half a brain or *any* communication or awareness isn't going to be seriously affected by people with speed boost. Like Zoso said, it's only truly effective against unaware people. Against decent teams / players, you're lucky to get 1 or 2 kills per speed boost req.

The core of the issue is valuation of REQ energy. Without spartan charge kills, speed boost, damage boost, and overshields are all far less effective than even the lowest weapon REQs.

Let's put it this way. If speed boost had the same effects as now, but you weren't allowed to have two weapons while it was active, would that somehow make it more balanced? Or, more likely, would people still bitch and moan because another part of the sandbox is effective instead of being relegated to some niche situational usage? This update is buffing a whole bunch of other REQs that have been shitty since launch, but the speed boost is *too* good? It makes zero sense.
Click to expand...

Vehicles don't take up a weapon slot, but you obviously don't have access to your guns when you are piloting a vehicle. Not really comparable to powerups, which work in conjunction with your Arsenal.

I agree that the issue is valuation. I disagree that the SOLUTION to the issue is to make speedboosts a 1HK.

I'm not arguing that Speed Boost should take up a weapon slot, or disable you access to other weapons. I'm saying that speed boost should not function as a third weapon. IMO, It, like the other powerups, should only provide passive enhancements.

As I've mentioned, there are other ways to improve the items valuation without encouraging people to sprint towards their opponents, which is generally poor practice in halo.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
sir_dany12 said:
Calm down my friends :)
Click to expand...

I'll calm down when:

1) We get oddball, koth, juggernaught, VIP and assym gametypes
2) the high quality forge maps in all areas of MM
3) there's better MM parameter for my friends overseas
4) there's better playlist management in general
5) they add an in game customs browser
6) they get rid of 1HK Speedboosts :)
7) they create a playlist for experimenting w/ setting (no radar, pistol only starts, BTB pistol starts, weapons placements, etc)

i'll never calm down
 
M

Munch Poke

Member
Man I've always loved speed boost, but I've always been a hardcore melee user. Things like Spartan charge and ground pound really make me love 5 that much more. And due to the amount of try harding I've done against really good players I've seen how easily you can be gunned down when you run up. If they are a good shot you've got to get really creative in how you close the gap. And I enjoy being able to use a different style of play.

Yes its powerful if you let me get close, but that's the whole point, I play in a style that's not BR burst after BR burst and if you allowed me to get close that's on you. Personally I enjoy the 1hit kill with speed boost charges, but my experience is mostly on FFAS and 4v4s. If it's become that problematic in war zone I'd imagine a simple solution is to raise the cost of speed boost as some suggest. But I do enjoy throwing on four speed boosts at once when I do play warzone so that would be a disappointment for me.

I guess you can throw me in the stack of people who like it, it's not as if in most games I haven't earned the boost or used the req to get it. And if we're talking just about warzone this is a game type that has blades attached to BRs for crying out loud.
 
Z

Zoso Achilles

Member
Munch Poke said:
Man I've always loved speed boost, but I've always been a hardcore melee user. Things like Spartan charge and ground pound really make me love 5 that much more. And due to the amount of try harding I've done against really good players I've seen how easily you can be gunned down when you run up. If they are a good shot you've got to get really creative in how you close the gap. And I enjoy being able to use a different style of play.

Yes its powerful if you let me get close, but that's the whole point, I play in a style that's not BR burst after BR burst and if you allowed me to get close that's on you. Personally I enjoy the 1hit kill with speed boost charges, but my experience is mostly on FFAS and 4v4s. If it's become that problematic in war zone I'd imagine a simple solution is to raise the cost of speed boost as some suggest. But I do enjoy throwing on four speed boosts at once when I do play warzone so that would be a disappointment for me.

I guess you can throw me in the stack of people who like it, it's not as if in most games I haven't earned the boost or used the req to get it. And if we're talking just about warzone this is a game type that has blades attached to BRs for crying out loud.
Click to expand...
Yes, we are only talking about warzone since that is the only place speed boost exists. It was fun while it lasted, but apparently it's much too overpowered and easy to get kills with. Excuse me while I go back to calling in The Answer.
 
M

Munch Poke

Member
Zoso Achilles said:
Yes, we are only talking about warzone since that is the only place speed boost exists. It was fun while it lasted, but apparently it's much too overpowered and easy to get kills with. Excuse me while I go back to calling in The Answer.
Click to expand...

Really? Are they really removing it?

And in FFA Fathom I've had good usage of it. But I've been playing a lot of customs recently, is speed boost not normally on Fathom?
 
FUNKNOWN iXi

FUNKNOWN iXi

Member
Munch Poke said:
Man I've always loved speed boost, but I've always been a hardcore melee user. Things like Spartan charge and ground pound really make me love 5 that much more. And due to the amount of try harding I've done against really good players I've seen how easily you can be gunned down when you run up. If they are a good shot you've got to get really creative in how you close the gap. And I enjoy being able to use a different style of play.

Yes its powerful if you let me get close, but that's the whole point, I play in a style that's not BR burst after BR burst and if you allowed me to get close that's on you. Personally I enjoy the 1hit kill with speed boost charges, but my experience is mostly on FFAS and 4v4s. If it's become that problematic in war zone I'd imagine a simple solution is to raise the cost of speed boost as some suggest. But I do enjoy throwing on four speed boosts at once when I do play warzone so that would be a disappointment for me.

I guess you can throw me in the stack of people who like it, it's not as if in most games I haven't earned the boost or used the req to get it. And if we're talking just about warzone this is a game type that has blades attached to BRs for crying out loud.
Click to expand...
Good points Munch, but your words will fall on deaf ears. It doesn't matter that you were one of the top ranked Sword users in Halo, yet still have difficulty getting in on enemies because of how easy it is to melt people. It doesn't matter that there are loadout weapons with energy bayonets that one hit melee kill enemies. It doesn't matter that people have little to no experience with what they're arguing.

None of that matters. 343 is removing it because it's clearly overpowered. Halo devs are perfect, all the decisions that have been made over the years were for the best. Reach's Grenade Launcher being underutilized was a sufficient reason for removing one of the best weapons in video games despite being in poor locations like the Powerhouse bathroom.

None. Of. That. Matters.
 
M

mo60

Member
I managed to face PistIn and his team again and they beat me harder than the first time I faced that team. They couldn't get a 1000-0 finish, but they came close
Screenshot-Original.png


I hope I see less of these types of matches once the matchmaking preferences are added in the MOR update.
 
Y

YourExWife

Member
Trup1aya said:
Vehicles don't take up a weapon slot, but you obviously don't have access to your guns when you are piloting a vehicle. Not really comparable to powerups, which work in conjunction with your Arsenal.
Click to expand...

Like it or not, spartan charge is part of your arsenal. So is ground pound. If you're using your weapons, it's harder when you have a speedboost on. Even harder the more you have active. And, you're not getting an advantage from the increased speed anymore. Vehicles have their own weapons and if you want to use the other two, just jump out temporarily. They also give you extra armored protection and often a strong third attack weapon. What's your point here again?

I agree that the issue is valuation. I disagree that the SOLUTION to the issue is to make speedboosts a 1HK.
Click to expand...

OK. What's your solution? Make SB even lower REQ but without the SC? They already only take 2/3REQ. Make everything else cost more? That would be a huge overreaction to fix a uselessness issue with 1 REQ. What do you suggest?

I'm not arguing that Speed Boost should take up a weapon slot, or disable you access to other weapons. I'm saying that speed boost should not function as a third weapon. IMO, It, like the other powerups, should only provide passive enhancements.
Click to expand...
Other than maybe overshield, how are they passive enhancements? Powerups are and have ALWAYS been active enhancements. They're supposed to give your spartan/armor a distinct advantage to someone who doesn't have them equipped.

The word(s) you're looking for is Armor Mods. Those are the passive enhancements. And they don't cost anything! With old speed boost (and the new, post-update one), once you're at level 5 there's no reason to call in a speed boost if you just enable enhanced thrusters. It gives you a constant enhanced sprint speed and recharges your shields while sprinting (the ONLY advantage to speed boost after the nerf), but it also thrusts you further and recharges thrust faster. Before level 5, 3REQ (or even 2) is just not worth spending on a speed boost.

As I've mentioned, there are other ways to improve the items valuation without encouraging people to sprint towards their opponents, which is generally poor practice in halo.
Click to expand...

*Generally* poor practice, but not always. Generally, it's poor practice to fight two people at once, but if you have an overshield, it might be the right play. Generally, it's poor practice to crouch around a map to try to get sneaky melee or snipe kills, but if you have camo, it might be the right play. Generally, it's poor practice to fight an overshield player by yourself, but if you have damage boost, it might be a good idea. Same pattern with sprinting at the enemy. Without the speed boost, it's probably not a good plan, but with speed boost, you're exploiting your engagement advantage.

I don't agree with the logic in your thinking. Because a powerup allows you to pull off what would normally be a risky play, that means that it's going to encourage people to try the same play when they don't have it enabled? If that's your argument, then you must be talking about morons only.

This whole conversation, it sounds like your reasoning boils down to "I don't like it, at least partially because I don't like Spartan Charge". You don't like that it gives you a "third weapon". I adamantly disagree with this characterization. It's adding potency to an ability you already have, just like all the other powerups. At some point you have to have some actual defense of your position, and mentioning you don't call in REQs does nothing to help your case. The reason people told you to actually try it before you pretend you know what you're talking about is because talking with some type of authority or knowledge about a topic, when you have little to none is just ridiculous.

You accuse us of farming because we use it when we're playing lesser skilled players. You literally don't know what the fuck you're talking about and it shows. If I called in a mantis instead (another terribly shitty to use REQ), would that be ok in your eyes? I don't call in a mantis against other good teams because it's a piece of garbage. I don't call in the current SB against good teams either because it's a waste of REQ energy. I scale my REQ call-ins to the need for the situation. How the fuck you equate that to farming with no evidence to support the claim is just absurd.

EDIT: Also, implying that no opinions that don't agree with certain people are allowed is stupid. I disagree with Unknown on tons of shit, including CE's status as the GOAT ("HERESY!"). Pretty sure he was implying that the fact that we agree on something when we disagree on a bunch of stuff lends credence to his bias argument.
 
T

TCKaos

Member
Why not just bump up the REQ cost of Speed Boost? You can spawn in a shotgun at 3 REQ and it kills in pretty much the same range. Should we all just start spawning shotguns now instead?
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
YourExWife said:
Like it or not, spartan charge is part of your arsenal. So is ground pound. If you're using your weapons, it's harder when you have a speedboost on. Even harder the more you have active. And, you're not getting an advantage from the increased speed anymore. Vehicles have their own weapons and if you want to use the other two, just jump out temporarily. They also give you extra armored protection and often a strong third attack weapon. What's your point here again?
Click to expand...

Well, you brought up the fact that vehicles don't take up weapon slots... As if it were some how analogous (it isn't) to the argument that 1HK spartan charges with Speedboost effectively weaponized the powerup...

OK. What's your solution? Make SB even lower REQ but without the SC? They already only take 2/3REQ. Make everything else cost more? That would be a huge overreaction to fix a uselessness issue with 1 REQ. What do you suggest?
Click to expand...

First we need to recognize that just because YOU didn't have a use fore Speedboost prior to the 1HK, doesn't mean they were generally underutilized.

That said, if they were truly underutilized, I believe that making them a 1HK was actually the huge over reaction.

What's wrong with making them cost 1/2 Req. what's wrong with making them last longer? What's wrong with increasing the magnitude of the enhancement?

Other than maybe overshield, how are they passive enhancements? Powerups are and have ALWAYS been active enhancements. They're supposed to give your spartan/armor a distinct advantage to someone who doesn't have them equipped.
Click to expand...

providing an advantage doesn't mean the effects aren't passive. The powerups themselves aren't weapons. they simply provide opportunities to maximize ones utilization of ones equipped weapons.

The word(s) you're looking for is Armor Mods. Those are the passive enhancements. And they don't cost anything! With old speed boost (and the new, post-update one), once you're at level 5 there's no reason to call in a speed boost if you just enable enhanced thrusters. It gives you a constant enhanced sprint speed and recharges your shields while sprinting (the ONLY advantage to speed boost after the nerf), but it also thrusts you further and recharges thrust faster. Before level 5, 3REQ (or even 2) is just not worth spending on a speed boost.
Click to expand...

No I wasn't looking for this.


*Generally* poor practice, but not always. Generally, it's poor practice to fight two people at once, but if you have an overshield, it might be the right play. Generally, it's poor practice to crouch around a map to try to get sneaky melee or snipe kills, but if you have camo, it might be the right play. Generally, it's poor practice to fight an overshield player by yourself, but if you have damage boost, it might be a good idea. Same pattern with sprinting at the enemy. Without the speed boost, it's probably not a good plan, but with speed boost, you're exploiting your engagement advantage.
Click to expand...

Sure if you have a speed boost that enables 1HK's then yeah, sprinting at your opponent might be a viable tactic. My argument is that enabling this particular tactic is bad for the meta.

I don't agree with the logic in your thinking. Because a powerup allows you to pull off what would normally be a risky play, that means that it's going to encourage people to try the same play when they don't have it enabled? If that's your argument, then you must be talking about morons only.
Click to expand...

Speedboost already allow you to safely pull off what would be considered risky, w/o having 1HK melees attached to it. I'm of the opinion that there was no need to enable THIS PARTICULAR risky behaviors. WA Assualt matches devolving into dozens of people sprinting and SCing all over the place, just isn't fun for me. I don't need to do it more, or make a video to validate my opinion. I simply don't like doing it. Nor do I like seeing it done.

This whole conversation, it sounds like your reasoning boils down to "I don't like it, at least partially because I don't like Spartan Charge". You don't like that it gives you a "third weapon". I adamantly disagree with this characterization. It's adding potency to an ability you already have, just like all the other powerups. At some point you have to have some actual defense of your position, and mentioning you don't call in REQs does nothing to help your case. The reason people told you to actually try it before you pretend you know what you're talking about is because talking with some type of authority or knowledge about a topic, when you have little to none is just ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Yeah you're free to disagree. Yes my argument does hinge around the fact that I have preexisting issues with Spartan Charge. Mentioning I don't call in many Reqs was in response to the Zoso's notion that Req MUST be called in to counteract the use of other Reqs. Generally, the loadout weapons do a good enough job at that.

You accuse us of farming because we use it when we're playing lesser skilled players. You literally don't know what the fuck you're talking about and it shows. If I called in a mantis instead (another terribly shitty to use REQ), would that be ok in your eyes? I don't call in a mantis against other good teams because it's a piece of garbage. I don't call in the current SB against good teams either because it's a waste of REQ energy. I scale my REQ call-ins to the need for the situation. How the fuck you equate that to farming with no evidence to support the claim is just absurd.
Click to expand...

Yeah that would be absurd if that was an actual accusation I was making. I said that people have differing ideas of fun. I wouldn't find Spartan charging bad player fun... Just like I don't find farming bad players fun. People have differing ideas of fun. I was commenting on the preconceived notion that I would actually enjoy this if I spent more time with it. I've done and seen enough of it to know that its not for me.


EDIT: Also, implying that no opinions that don't agree with certain people are allowed is stupid. I disagree with Unknown on tons of shit, including CE's status as the GOAT ("HERESY!"). Pretty sure he was implying that the fact that we agree on something when we disagree on a bunch of stuff lends credence to his bias argument.
Click to expand...

What I was getting at was, first Funknown suggested that we shouldn't be having this discussion since there are other problems with the game. Then he suggested that I must be presenting this opinion purely out of a need to be contrarian, as if it's unfathomable that someone would genuinely have an opinion that is different from his. Then his buddy Zoso Achilles seemed to suggest that I have this opinion because I'm bad at the game. So my comment was more or less aimed at that fact that I was approached in this manner, while those who agree with him get the red carpet treatment.
 
FUNKNOWN iXi

FUNKNOWN iXi

Member
Trup1aya said:
What I was getting at was, first Funknown suggested that we shouldn't be having this discussion since there are other problems with the game. Then he suggested that I must be presenting this opinion purely out of a need to be contrarian, as if it's unfathomable that someone would genuinely have an opinion that is different from his. Then his buddy Zoso Achilles seemed to suggest that I have this opinion because I'm bad at the game. So my comment was more or less aimed at that fact that I was approached in this manner, while those who agree with him get the red carpet treatment.
Click to expand...
cJiZX6C.gif
 
Y

YourExWife

Member
Trup1aya said:
Yeah that would be absurd if that was an actual accusation I was making. I said that people have differing ideas of fun. I wouldn't find Spartan charging bad player fun... Just like I don't find farming bad players fun. People have differing ideas of fun. I was commenting on the preconceived notion that I would actually enjoy this if I spent more time with it. I've done and seen enough of it to know that its not for me.
Click to expand...


Sure YOU may have fun, sprinting around Spartan Charging bad, inexperienced players... But that type of thing isn't fun for me. Is that so hard to believe? I mean, some people think kill farming is fun {the way this is written implies that you're making a commentary on the previous sentences} ... Different strokes...
Click to expand...

Your unclear prose (which definitely seems to be an issue in this discussion, as this isn't the only instance where you've had to clarify something that should have been simple to say the first time) very much implied that you were essentially equating the two. Having one statement follow the other in a non-dilineating fashion with no way to know you were making a comparison or simply adding to your list of things you don't enjoy is not my fault.


Just like it wasn't Zoso's fault when his response to the whole 4+6=10 convo was in reply to your actual words on screen, not the thoughts that happened to be in your head.

If you can't deal with folks replying to what your words actually say, you might need to slow down or do something because you're not doing any favors.
 
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