Welfare
Member
Don't know what you guys are talking about with excellent decisions like this:
Wait, the BR is 2.5x normal zoom? Is that an increase from other Halos?
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Halo |OT 21| Battle is the Great Redeemer | LIVE. DIE. RESPAWN.
- Thread starter Plywood
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Wait, the BR is 2.5x normal zoom? Is that an increase from other Halos?
Gabotron ES
Member
Disabling sprint in H4 was pretty easy (sprint=false), obviously it'd be smarter to make the option avaliable to everyone in H5 but you never know.
This is getting beside the point. I'm not denying it was an issue, I also agree that it sucked. However it doesn't mean Halo 4 was a technically broken game.
I've seen a number of people claim that 343 hasn't produced a single working game, however the only game they created the majority of did work very well on the whole (technically at least). Yes it had a few issues, but almost every game has a few issues.
Welfare
Member
They could very easily put an ACOG in that emulated the look of past games.
TriStateTryHard
Member
Coming off of Reach, the number of gametypes in Halo 4 was absolutely disgraceful.
343 loves reinventing the wheel though. Prior to 4, Halo had Flag mechanics that were perfected over many titles. 343 spends their resources on Flagnum. Halo has scope mechanics that have worked flawlessly for multiple titles. We get Flinch and no Descope the first time and now we get Aim Down Sights the second time.
If 343 focused on something other than that wheel they seem determined to reinvent we would probably have 12v12 Invasion where Spartans spawn in Drop Pods and have to destroy a Scarab in the third phase as a space battle rages on in the skybox. But no, we get Battlefield Halo on oversized Midship.
343 loves reinventing the wheel though. Prior to 4, Halo had Flag mechanics that were perfected over many titles. 343 spends their resources on Flagnum. Halo has scope mechanics that have worked flawlessly for multiple titles. We get Flinch and no Descope the first time and now we get Aim Down Sights the second time.
If 343 focused on something other than that wheel they seem determined to reinvent we would probably have 12v12 Invasion where Spartans spawn in Drop Pods and have to destroy a Scarab in the third phase as a space battle rages on in the skybox. But no, we get Battlefield Halo on oversized Midship.
Welfare
Member
So just like with CoD, I can say ACOG is the best scope? Deal.
Oh don't worry. That will probably just be basic BTB in Halo 5.
User 73706
Banned
But with logic like that, how am I supposed to think my subjective standpoints are cold hard facts?
Bad Company 2 is the only game where I've found the ACOG superior to others, lol.
I'm not denying that, I'm saying in comparison to the issues in the MCC it's very minor. And it doesn't show that 343 are technically incompetent.
Flagnum was pretty cool though. It was ridiculous that they took out all the other flag mechanics though.
Also 5 looks nothing like Battlefield. It's obviously a CoD: Advanced Warfighter ripoff
Gabotron ES
Member
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
Uhhh their Christmas 2014 flagship title begs to differ.
I don't see why this is an argument. 343 has failed at the majority of what they set out to do. Halo 4's population bricked faster than any other Halo game.
They then aim to release a game that would most certainly perform better with sustained populations. And instead they gave us MCC.
The 343 defence force can fuck right off untill 343 delivers a functional, competent Halo game. So far we've yet to get that. Untill then they deserve every grain of salt they've been getting.
How Halo 5 will work out is anyone's guess.
Lol
You give 343 so much shit, but your favorite mode is Invasion, you should be embracing 343 with open arms.
Bregmann Roche
Member
Halo |OT 22| Astroturfing And Resume Padding
ViewtifulJC
Banned
niggas getting hype for Invasion
in 2014
in 2014
I think jem/ryn are just young and naive, that's all.
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
FFS, I never said the MCC wasn't a technical mess; I said 4 wasn't!
How much of the MCC's problems are 343's fault, I don't know. However, like I said earlier, I've seen a number of people claim that 343 can't produce a technically competent game which clearly isn't true because the one game they created (almost) on their own was on the whole fine. You can say what you like about the quality of the game but it wasn't technically broken.
I'd also argue that the MCC isn't a very good indication of the technical quality of 5, yet many people are assuming that 5 will be a mess because of how the MCC turned out. Which I think is silly.
I'm not naive, I'm just not fucking negative about absolutely everything 343 related. I actually quite enjoyed 4, I also think 5 looks great. Apparently that means I'm an astroturfer and can't think for myself.
I don't think it worked as a proper competitive CTF gamemode. I just thought it was quite fun in the same way Gungoose CTF is, a casual gamemode.
I'm not denying any of that, the argument I'm making is that 4 wasn't technically broken.
Bregmann Roche
Member
When I was young and naive you know what we did with games that were broken at launch? We buried them in the desert. #InfinitePowerOfTheShovel #Hashtag
Gabotron ES
Member
Invasion was one of Reach's most enjoyable gametypes prior to the zero bloom patch, the sandbox just worked perfectly for Invasion's relatively encapsulated experience.
The gametype is often seen as a mindless shoot gallery but it had a very strong strategic feel to it where teamwork is KEY.
Obviously BTB maps suffered a bit from this so 343 made Dominion, a shitfest of ordinances and some scattered bases with no real flow and substance.
Invasion was dope
yes.
TriStateTryHard
Member
Flagnum shows how little 343 understands the basics of gameplay though. In Slayer gametypes, the only way to win is by killing enemies so players should always have their weapon ready. In Objective gametypes, the only way to win is by controlling the objective so players don't need, and shouldn't have, their weapon ready to fire while they are controlling the objective. It's so simple in my mind.
Comparing to MCC? Why wouldn't you compare to a standard from the previous 10 years? Sure Halo 2 was rough, but every single title from 3 until 4 was 99% free of technical failures. I'll let framerate issues on 2 shipped maps count as technical failures.I'm not denying that, I'm saying in comparison to the issues in the MCC it's very minor. And it doesn't show that 343 are technically incompetent.
Flagnum was pretty cool though. It was ridiculous that they took out all the other flag mechanics though.
Also 5 looks nothing like Battlefield. It's obviously a CoD: Advanced Warfighter ripoff
I don't even know why I am dying.
Just played Oracle on legendary Co-op. The bossfight is awesome. Fuck the haters.
Atleast ORAS isn't broken so I don't have to torture myself with MP anymore. Nintendo wins again.
Invasion was awful bro.
And jem, just stop defending MCC, 343 isn't even defending this travesty. No one cares that you liked 4, or that you're anticipating 5, just stop defending a broken money grab.
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
Jem I don't think you fully understand what a producer is.
The producers of the MCC fucked up by letting that buggy mess release with the Halo name on the front. And they are 343 employees. Doesn't matter if they outsourced it. Someones job was to oversee the project. And it still shipped like this.
343 are hilariously incompetent.
Technical fuckery aside. There's still SMG starts In Halo 2. Back then all we did was complain about them and they got changed finally.
Fast forward ten years and the same complaints are valid.
343 are incompetent.
The producers of the MCC fucked up by letting that buggy mess release with the Halo name on the front. And they are 343 employees. Doesn't matter if they outsourced it. Someones job was to oversee the project. And it still shipped like this.
343 are hilariously incompetent.
Technical fuckery aside. There's still SMG starts In Halo 2. Back then all we did was complain about them and they got changed finally.
Fast forward ten years and the same complaints are valid.
343 are incompetent.
I haven't defended the MCC once, where I have said anything other than that the MCC is a complete mess?
I'm defending Halo 4.
Gabotron ES
Member
1v1 me scrub, Invasion on Spire, 0 seconds capture float time.
I still think Invasion would have worked much better as some kind of spin-off game, with much more bigger development thrown into it. It's obvious the gametype had much more behind it.
Bregmann Roche
Member
You chose poorly. A better option would've been on Boneyard and you spawn as human.
Gabotron ES
Member
TriStateTryHard
Member
On the topic of Flagnum, is there anyone out there that genuinely believes that the player carrying the objective should be able to fire a weapon without dropping it, the one item on the map capable of putting points on the scoreboard? If so, why?
Onikaan
Member
Eh, Halo 4 wasn't without issues though. Whether it was features that were cut altogether, things that were broken, or things coming well after launch.
No working file share till after January, Killcams were broken after launch day and disabled, playlist management lead to the non-Infinity playlist being taken out and not brought back till well after January, Spartan Ops wasn't finished and the second half was brought in later, the Crimson Map Pack had issues with being delayed almost a day, and then it was basically glitched and anyone could download for free (fake 14 day buy and play). I'm sure there is quite a bit I can't recall anymore.
As for whether 343 or MS is to blame here, that's tough. MS is the parent company, they have very little oversight into what actually happens. That's why they created 343 which is a self contained and self running studio. It wasn't some MS suits that made all the decisions, but most likely 343 senior staff. Even if it was outsourced, it was upto 343 to choose capable partners, and then when the components of the games were done, it was likely 343 refining it into a working package and handling everything from launch onwards. I do think Microsoft should be blamed just as much for this though. How did a guy like Ntkrnl say the launch date was November 11th and that it didn't change at all nearly 9-10 months after his prediction. If issues cropped up, launch should have been delayed.
No working file share till after January, Killcams were broken after launch day and disabled, playlist management lead to the non-Infinity playlist being taken out and not brought back till well after January, Spartan Ops wasn't finished and the second half was brought in later, the Crimson Map Pack had issues with being delayed almost a day, and then it was basically glitched and anyone could download for free (fake 14 day buy and play). I'm sure there is quite a bit I can't recall anymore.
As for whether 343 or MS is to blame here, that's tough. MS is the parent company, they have very little oversight into what actually happens. That's why they created 343 which is a self contained and self running studio. It wasn't some MS suits that made all the decisions, but most likely 343 senior staff. Even if it was outsourced, it was upto 343 to choose capable partners, and then when the components of the games were done, it was likely 343 refining it into a working package and handling everything from launch onwards. I do think Microsoft should be blamed just as much for this though. How did a guy like Ntkrnl say the launch date was November 11th and that it didn't change at all nearly 9-10 months after his prediction. If issues cropped up, launch should have been delayed.
I'm okay with them being able to use a handgun, honestly. It gives them at least some way to defend themselves at range. But there is a nice trade off between dropping the flag and letting the enemy team know where you are, but you can use your gun again vs not letting the team know where the flag is and being undefended.
Well please tell me what I'm doing wrong.
I've completed Halo CE, 2, 3, ODST and Reach solo legendary and have had none of these problems.
Well yeah, if you want an automatic weapon to just wildly spray at enemies like a degenerate. Precision rifles are severely limited.
Don't get me wrong. I'm already 3/4 through Halo 4 right now. But most of the fights are needlessly drawn out because you burn through ammo so quickly. If I recall correctly many of the reviews said the same thing two years ago
Seems to take at least one magazine to take out a Knight's shields. It takes a few more shots to get the headshot because of the second of invincibility and their tendency to teleport and start the whole process again. I rounded up and said two. But it's not much less
ViewtifulJC
Banned
playing Halo 4's campaign
I'm not wholly against it. Like I said, I think the normal system is more competitive as it forces proper teamwork, however in social playlists I think it's fine. It means you can far more effectively score a cap on your own, which is nice when playing in a playlist with very little communication.
Also don't most games allow you to shoot whilst holding the flag?
No... I'm talking about Halo 4's file share issues.
That wasn't my point at all.
Although interestingly enough, Quake allowed you to shoot any weapon whilst holding the flag...
He keeps brushing off file share as not a big deal, which is MCC...which is 343...
The point is, 343 has done very little to instill any kind of confidence in the handling of this franchise, so why defend them at all? Not saying you should shit on them either.
Zeouterlimits
Member
I think most games slow you down when you aim down the sights too.. you're on to something here.
Quick, someone check sprint!
Bregmann Roche
Member
Every time Halo 4's MM servers Join in Progressed me onto the losing side of a 4-0 CTF game 10 seconds before the final cap I reminded myself of how technically unflawed 343's work on that game was.
I did the same when it repeatedly placed me into games in which I had neither teammates nor opponents.
The only difference between 4's launch and MCC's is that 4's biggest MM problems were fixed within a couple of weeks and MCC's persist.
That you don't remember the problems does not mean they didn't exist. Nor does it mean that 343 deserves the benefit of the doubt for Halo 5.
I did the same when it repeatedly placed me into games in which I had neither teammates nor opponents.
The only difference between 4's launch and MCC's is that 4's biggest MM problems were fixed within a couple of weeks and MCC's persist.
That you don't remember the problems does not mean they didn't exist. Nor does it mean that 343 deserves the benefit of the doubt for Halo 5.
TriStateTryHard
Member
Normally, I am very much against trade offs in core Halo mechanics, like you shouldn't have to lower your weapon in order to move at full speed like you do with sprint, but when you are carrying the one item on the map that can put points on the scoreboard I think you should have to take the moment required to drop the objective before you can return fire.
Worked fine in quake and UT, why can't I use all my guns while carrying the flag?
In Halo 4 you always know where the flag carrier is, right?
Yeah, upon more thought I prefer the old method of nobody knowing where the flag is as long as the person is carrying it - but that person is now unarmed.
Prinz Eugn
Member
It's not even an almost, Certain Affinity did a huge portion of the multiplayer for 4.
It's less assuming and more basic pattern recognition. Their last game is a buggy mess, and it's the same company managing, if not working on things directly. From what we've seen about their policy (which might very well be up to MS and not anyone at 343i), they apparently are A-okay with releasing a broken, buggy mess of a game.
We can hope that situation will change, but being worried that it won't is far from silly.
Okay, but...
This is an example of trying to spin something actually terrible for the game in the most positive light possible. "They removed a core feature and replaced it with something worse across the board, but at least it was goofy 'fun'!"
yaaaaaaay.
I mean, why even do this?
When "not technically broken" is the bar you've established... that pretty much tells us all we need to know.
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