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Halo |OT 23| Thruster is Love, Thruster is Life
- Thread starter VisceralBowl
- Start date
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
This place is toxic. One might say it has been poisoned..
Hmm.. There's a certain aura about this place; something feels different, fascinating, even.
Hmm.. There's a certain aura about this place; something feels different, fascinating, even.
Apparently the guy who quoted me did not.
I already said it in this thread but in a nutshell: If the BR is more difficult to use close range then why should it not win the battle? That makes no sense especially in a competitive game.
I played the beta so I know how the weapons operate. In my opinion, the AR is way too close to a BR at close rangle, that I am seeing a lot of AR wins or way too many close battles. I felt you literally had to land every shot of a BR/DMR with no room for error but not be good with the AR and win punishing the good player. Don't even bring up the SMG. The SMG is OP and a killing machine.
The SMG is fantastic. It's like the SAW from 4.
This isn't a good thing.
A viable AR/SMG is needed against the BR, but like he said, one missed shot and you've pretty much lost the battle.
I'm going to disagree. It's one thing to be upset at the fact that ADS makes the automatic weapons much stronger over hipfire, but I can't get behind the idea that just because the BR is a more skilled weapon to use, it should dominate other weapons at every range. The sandbox will heavily suffer with that suggestion. AR would essentially be useless so why even keep it in the game? Each weapon fits a specific role, especially with regards to range (close, mid, long). One of the big issues with BR vs AR in the beta is the fact that there was flinch on hipfire. So it was very hard visually to focus on the targets head while you're getting shredded.
I'm curious to hear what others think though.
It's been posted before, but this thread on Waypoint is relevant to the general discussion here in HaloGAF over the past week.
343I'S INCOMPETENT GAME DESIGN IS KILLING HALO
343I'S INCOMPETENT GAME DESIGN IS KILLING HALO
Welfare
Member
First post in that thread.
God why
I'm going to sign in to give that guy some likes. That was a good read.
In that case, why should a shotgun, sword, or any power weapon win a battle? They aren't that skilled to use. A balanced weapon sandbox isn't weird at all. If a BR player keeps getting wrecked by AR's, that's not the gun's fault - it's his fault for being stubborn. I can agree the AR range when scoped needs a nerf though.
Munch Poke
Member
Daaamn that kid is trying so hard to shit on H5. I have no problem with sprint and the new smart scope stuff. Finally an AR that's completely viable for newer players, and sprints new mechanic really makes you have to think about it's use. And if I get away by running and none of your teammates cleaned me up maybe I didn't deserve to lose that fight after all.
It just seems like everyone wants Halo 2 sequels forever. I was hoping the MCC would absolve that urge. Sadly, not so much.
It just seems like everyone wants Halo 2 sequels forever. I was hoping the MCC would absolve that urge. Sadly, not so much.
The Henery
Member
There was no saving Halo 3's gameplay
There is no other Halo in which plays like that are even possible.
JoeDanny
Member
Angry that he did something you could never even think of? Also dem icicle snipes
I see this as an issue around here too. My take is that I have a soft spot for each and every Halo game that's come out to date to some extent (save Wars and Spartan Assault, neither of which I've really played much of). So when someone says "classic Halo" or "feels like Halo" it's honestly such a subjective thing. Obviously there are unchanging staples--two weapon max, recharging shields, Grunts/Jackals/Hunters as enemies, etc.--but MCC has shown me that there actually is a sizeable amount of variation between the games. As such, the definitive "Halo Experience" will vary from person to person.
I do think game series need to evolve and grow over time. Could you imagine if Super Mario, Legend of Zelda, Final Fantasy games existed today as essentially simple up-rezed versions of their original incarnations? Sports video game franchises are the only examples I can think of that are virtually the same games as nearly two decades ago. That said, change can be good and energizing to a franchise (see ship battles in Assassin's Creed IV), but they can also be misguided and/or polarizing (see removal of map weapons in favor of loadouts and personal ordnance in Halo 4). Halo 5 based on my Beta impressions felt like a natural evolution of the franchise to me--familiar but new, different but fun. It felt like a more natural Halo game than Halo 4 ever did. So while the fanbase' ire toward 343I is somewhat warranted due to Halo 4's state, I still find folks' predisposition to jump all over them for literally every small thing is excessive.
Halo 5 is certainly 343's baby, but I have respect for them for at least obliquely acknowledging that Halo 4 wasn't the game fans wanted it to be. So far it seems like they're at least ATTEMPTING to be proactive about incorporating fan and pro player feedback into Halo 5 (current minimal communication notwithstanding).
The Henery
Member
Good post.
I knew this, but I wouldn't really say bungie has "competitive pc roots." Marathon was basically a quake knock off and didn't garner near as large a competitive scene.
Yep
Welfare
Member
You would have lost the fight had you not sprinted away, think about that.
The new sprint mechanic doesn't make you think about anything except that you can sprint away, and oh wait, here's a new 3 second white bar we have to wait to go down before we can rejoin the action. If anything, you're still running from fights, there is now even more cat and mouse chases/escapes when coupled with thruster, and the nerf mechanic literally delays gunfights as you wait even longer for shields to recharge.
An AR that's viable for new players isn't the issue. An AR that is one of the more dominant weapons in the game at close to mid, is unskilled to use, and gets even deadlier with ADS is the issue.
Just because you don't see an issue with sprint or ADS, doesn't mean there aren't any. And no, we don't want Halo 2 forever. If you're referring to classic style game play, we haven't gotten that in a mainstream Halo release since 2007. The "Halo-needs-to-evolve" crowd has been rewarded with their changes in the last two main games, soon to be three this November.
I was hoping the failures that were Reach and Halo 4 would absolve that urge for massive change to the base game play, sadly, not so much.
Halo 4 wasn't the game anyone wanted it to be, I come from CoD and this is my view on some 4's systems:
Ordnance drops - killstreak rewards in CoD are fair because they are easily countered, with perks, equipment, AA lock-on launchers. You can also just kill a guy on a killstreak to prevent him from getting anything. How do you counter ordnance drops, power weapons like Forerunner Cannon? By quitting the game, that's how.
Loadouts - 7 primary weapons, and only one of them useful pre-turbo update. Being able to spawn with a shotgun as a secondary weapon. Again, having shotgun as a starting weapon is fair in CoD because all other weapons kill in a blink of an eye. Useless perks, dumbest progression system I've ever seen, ugly cosmetical rewards. Only good thing about 4's loadouts is no more AR starts.
Killstreak rewards and loadouts are bad idea on their own, but they were also horribly implemented in Halo 4. They forgot about one thing, balance.
Welfare
Member
This made me laugh out loud. Fantastic post.
I refuse to acknowledge the game even exists anymore. Don't plan on loading it up in the next few months either. What a shame.
Pics pls.
Pretty cool. Bungie always did a lot of extra stuff to give their maps life, especially for people who liked to glitch out, or go where they're not supposed to.
CreateNowSleepLater
Member
You look at that Halo 3 video a few pages back and go look at Halo 5 and tell me why people are upset. it's literally Halo in name only. The one thing that also made 3 great and slowed down with Reach was the almost zero gravity for vehicles. It made for some absolute crazy BTB shit which I feel is a lot more "realistic" now but not as fun IMO.
CreateNowSleepLater
Member
10/10
I mean, I assume you're talking about the boltshot, right?
Because you couldn't actually spawn with a shotgun.
Yea, the DMR being the only precision weapon that was useful before the turbo update was preeeeettty dumb.
Halo 4 on the MCC is great. Weapons on maps and no ordnance drops fixes most of the problems for me.
PROh1bited
Banned
Or being able to spawn with Plasma Pistols. Pretty much rendered vehicles useless in BTB.
On playing through all the games on MCC, I think the bigger issue was the frailty of vehicles in general. Sure, getting plasma pistoled was annoying, but the vehicles are like tissue paper, which made getting EMPed a much bigger deal than it probably would have been otherwise.
Halo 3 hog is a wrecking machine if there aren't proper weapons on map to take care of it.
Boltshot isn't exactly a shotgun, but it's OHK and has spread, just like shotguns. Short range fusion rifle, maybe? It was ridiculous before nerf.
Welfare
Member
It's either happening this month or we just get the update with no beta.
Yep. My feeling playing the multiplayer is that vehicles got more powerful until Reach, where they took a substantial nosedive that Halo 4 alleviated in some ways but severely compounded in others.
To me the best option is to make vehicles powerful but craft maps that don't make pedestrian movement forced into killing fields; in that respect I think Halo 4 did well, although they probably went too far in closing up vehicle routes.
Either way, there's so much that goes into vehicle balance. "Spawning with plasma pistols" is certainly an easy complaint but I don't think it really acknowledges all the factors involved.
The beta was a mix of classic and modern. I enjoyed it. Maybe I'm just getting older, but I'm fine with this direction now. Whenever people bash H5, they just give reasons why it's not Halo 2/3. Well no shit. Who's to say this style of Halo can't be competitive? It's already miles ahead of H4 with the return of equal starts, static timers, weapon balance, map control, and emphasis on teamwork. On top of that.. a spectator mode, its own eSports league, a competitive tier system..
Oh, but sprint and smart scope, right? It's automatically shit. I could understand all the hate for H4, but not this. Once/when/if MCC is fixed, no doubt I'll be enjoying the classics. But I'm ready for Halo to move on to a more "modern" take. It's inevitable anyway.
inb4scrandycasual
Oh, but sprint and smart scope, right? It's automatically shit. I could understand all the hate for H4, but not this. Once/when/if MCC is fixed, no doubt I'll be enjoying the classics. But I'm ready for Halo to move on to a more "modern" take. It's inevitable anyway.
inb4scrandycasual
link1201
Member
As it should be.
And the Halo 3 BETA Hog was like being Gandalf riding Shadowfax at the Battle of Helms Deep.
I enjoyed the beta and my biggest gripe, which hopefully will be fixed, is just weapon balancing. The SMG was just the bane of my existence. I could deal with the others staying as is, but a tweak is sorely needed for the SMG imo.
RowdyReverb
Member
Can 343i please blatantly copy the Hotwire mode from Battlefield: Hardline for BTB? That shit is too fun. It would be like that one-off KotH game type where the Warthog was the hill, but with multiple hills.
Leyasu
Banned
I bought my og xbox for halo, and have loved the series. But the beta was something else. Those few week were the best halo that I have played... The game was amazing!
There are some things I want to see implemented before I buy it though. If they put in what I want, then I can see me playing this exclusively until halo 6 drops.
The MCC is a mess beyond compare. But fuck me they have something special on their hands with halo 5.
NobleGundam
Banned
What was it like playing Halo 3 Beta, guys?
Never had the opportunity to play it.
Never had the opportunity to play it.