Has Ackerson been trialed or anything post mortem? Both program's where inhumane and cruel but his far more so.
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Halo |OT19| 793 Posts, And None Worth Reading
- Thread starter Ozzy Onya A2Z
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Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
No one is handwaving the Spartan-III project away, but yeah, it's gonna have the less focus for a number of obvious reasons.
The main one is that, the main engineers of the project are who? Ackerson is dead already. Even though jacking kids up with chemicals and sending them to die is pretty horrible, they were young teens. Young teens are conscripted for wars all the time, just look at history. Plus they weren't kidnapped. They were mostly war orphans.
There's no major laws being broken with them, except maybe giving them untested drugs maybe. There's less moral issues with the S-III's. Also, the S-III's have been effectively tucked away from view in the Halo universe. The II's were literal poster boys for the UNSC for the war. The IV'S are the poster boys for the post-war era. I imagine any remaining (!!) three's would be brought into the IV program at this point.
Demoncarnotaur
Member
Is that optimus prime riding grimlock? I might for give him for those constructicons.He is winning points with me from Age of Extinction:
Caayn
Member
Very young orphans brainwashed into joining a program which is made to create cheap and expandable Spartans. The S-III had many more victims than the S-II ever had. I don't know how you can view any of the two programs as more humane than the other.
And yet Ackerson is being presented as a guardian angel where Halsey is projected as the rebirth of Josef Mengele. Glasslands clearly displays this.
He is winning points with me from Age of Extinction:
Dinobots :O
Trailer at the Super Bowl holy Guacamole
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
This is what I'm sure most people are talking about when they say Halo 4's gunplay is better than Halo 2, 3 and Reach. It's pretty much a given that the majority of players despise flinch and don't want it to return in Halo 5, as well as hopefully decreasing the aim assist (which is no where near as bad as Halo 2).
For me, consistency goes a LONG way. That's why I personally consider Halo 4's gunplay superior to the games before it, excluding CE and despite flinch. What you said about it being boring can most definitely be true for a lot of players, conscious of it or not, so that's why I think a return to CE's shooting mechanics could benefit the entire demographic of Halo's fanbase. People can say whatever they want about how CE's gameplay looks, but when you play it for a while it just feels right.
Basically, bring back the entire CE weapon set as it was
, except for the Needler,
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
No, I've seen folks criticise the author and comment on her gender in relation to her past works and even her Halo books. If you haven't seen it, fair enough, but it's out there if you look.
The reason why you hear the Halsey hate, and hear Staffan's story come up again and again is because... that's the story. Folks are hearing about different facets of the Spartan II project for the first time, from a very skewed perspective, and are reacting to it. But the end of the story, yeah, you're have seen it brought up again and again, in a bad light, with every one of the characters in this story acting negatively in their own ways.
See, this is speculative bullshit. You are literally making this up. You have no idea if the author knows about the S-III project or how much knows of it. You don't know. There's a clear reference to the the S-III's so that shows she's atleast aware of it, which pretty much proves she does know about it. So you are wrong.
Don't think of me as being rude here but I don't think you are reading the story properly. You even pointed out something that contradicts your point. I'll explain.
You say the author gets things mixed up.
Then you say on page 151 a character, Mal, has the opinion that Spartans (II's) were designed to be expendable, re Naomi and the other Spartans.
Then you say it isn't true.
You do know the difference between the narrative voice (the author) and a character? Right? Characters say things directly and the narrative says things directly - the narrative could, for example describe how something looks, and character could say the exact same thing out loud in mentally to themselves.
There is a difference here. You can have a character think something that is incorrect or skewed. Or even wrong.
Say Mal looked up to Halsey and said "Gee, Halsey treated everyone she ever met with respect and hugged each person and promised to remember them!". That would be the character Mal saying that. Not the author. Not the narrative in which the author speaks to the reader. It's the character.
Characters often will have limited perspectives, so you cannot take what they say for granted.That how stories work. Characters get facts wrong all the time, it does not in any way reflect what the author thinks. You conflate the two. The book clear states "Mal thinks" and you then jump and say the author gets things mixed up. No. That's not how it works. Ask anyone. If you aren't familar with books outside of Halo fiction, then ask someone who is and they will you the same.
Now, with this knowledge in hand, maybe you'll understand how baseless all these stupid Traviss hating Halo canon comments are? Do you?
One is a clear crime. In this day and age and in the future. Not just a crime, but hundreds of crimes. Kidnapping is a crime. Cloning is a crime. Experimenting is a crime.
vrs
Morally grey area about giving drugs to teens.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, I don't think anyone dislikes Traviss cause she's a woman. I've seen people hurl gendered insults against her, but that's a different kind of stupid.
Anyways, it's cool seeing your analysis, Slightly Live. I still really like the UNSC side of the fiction, just not the Forerunner stuff.
Anyways, it's cool seeing your analysis, Slightly Live. I still really like the UNSC side of the fiction, just not the Forerunner stuff.
Fair enough.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Thanks.
I'm not a fan of everything in the K5 trilogy, far from it. I think a morality story is interesting, but not worthy of an entire trilogy of books - the story alone is weak and the core K5 trilogy doesn't hold up across the three books on it's own.
I think the Halsey stuff is badly handled - from a Spartan II punching the dear doctor (how did it not leave her badly injured or dead?) Halsey, to not presenting an opposing viewpoint (it gets very boring to just hear one side of a complicated issue).
I also doubt we will see the same amount of time and effort looking at the other side of the Halsey issue, and I certainly don't buy that the previous fiction counts as presenting a counter-view.
It's also weird that the trilogy establishes 2 religious nutjob Elites, when they should have stuck with using just one, which would have linked better with Halo 4 better.
Also, I'm very disappointed at the fact that the trilogy brings up story threads without resolving them - its bad story telling and pretty tasteless. Hinting is one thing, but creating them and abandoning them mid-trilogy (like a certain kidnapped ship from Glasslands) is just, well, it feels insulting as a reader. Yes I will buy more Halo books, please don't try to strong arm me into doing so.
Caayn
Member
As I said I understand that Staffan's story is a big part of the book. I never denied that. But does that justify it to bring his story up so often as Karen does? In my opinion that's a definite no. In the beginning I understood, or at least I understood why, how Staffan felt. But with each passing page I grew more and more irritated by him. He can't even touch a doorknob or he gets flashbacks.(exaggerated)
Jup, I'm literally making this up by thinking that Karen Traviss has no clue about the S-III program. /s
It's presented as a fact. If you had just reread that part, starting from "Mal wondered" you'd see why I say that. He wonders about a couple things directly followed by "They were expendable weapons, after all." Written in a different tone than the rest of his thoughts, make me doubt that it even was his thoughts instead of just a comment from the writer.
I agree with you that characters aren't all-knowing. But as a writer you should prevent creating situations, especially when they're completely unnecessary and add nothing to the story, were a character presents something as a fact that's clearly false. Creating the disagreement we know have about the "thoughts" of mal.
Sorry but I'll stand my ground. You haven't been able to change the way I view her stories. And as I said before, I understand that the characters in her stories don't like Halsey or the Spartan II program.
Yeah no. You're deliberately not mentioning the reason why the S-III program was created? Both are extremely inhumane and morally wrong.
Good points. I'd like to add the minimal bloom on the DMR is more detrimental than we think. When it's not making you miss the fifth shot on every other kill, it functions as increased bullet magnetism for the other guy whose reticle isn't even on your hitbox -- but is granted the hit anyway since bloom is increasing his cone of damage. The result is precision being punished and inaccuracy being rewarded in a far more subtle way than Halo Reach. Bloom needs to be completely removed or turned into a pure RoF indicator.I half posted that to spark a fresh bit of revulsion at the aim assist/bullet magnetism levels in Halo 4
They really have to address that plus reinstate de-scoping for Halo 5. Probably the most important issue for Halo moving forward along with the removal of Armour Abilities.
I've seen several posts in the last few months here speak of Halo 4 having 'amazing gunplay' and claim that if you stripped AA's, perks, ordnance and sprint from the game, they'd play it every night. They're the custodians of their own opinions but I personally doubt that would be the case. I think the debate on 'gunplay' needs clarity on Halogaf, particularly in regards to what people actually mean by that word. In general, when I see the sentiment that Halo 4 has brilliant gunplay I interpret that as Halo players being so browbeaten by blooming reticles in Reach that they feel spoiled and disproportionately grateful that the guns in Halo 4 fire bullets straight, uninfluenced by the cadence of the trigger pull. Three years of 3's ambiguous BR spread and two years of having to crouch and pace shots like it's some sort of staid 9-5 have skewed the gunplay debate.
Halo 4's gunplay has two major, chronic issues:
1) Flinch. I find it difficult to reconcile how players can champion the gunplay whilst strongly disliking flinch; the two are almost inextricable, especially so in the case with Halo 4 where the majority of the maps are large and so medium to long range battles predominate. Disliking flinch is disliking the gunplay.
Flinch completely breaks the relationship between precision weapons and the sniper. A half decent sniper on Halo 4 shoots through flinch with ease and leaves a horrid feeling in the gut of the player who is so casually blained. It also nullifies the nuance of mid range battle; in Halo 2 and 3 it didn't pay to try to incessantly rescope between shots (ala Reach's mid-long range DMR battles) and so a battle ensued that was fought with reduced aim assist. In Halo 4, red reticle range becomes an afterthought because at mid-range a player can simply stay scoped the entire time and enjoy all the benefits of close range aim assist and bullet magnetism.
2) The aim assist levels. I honestly believe that the mass exodus from Halo 4 is in large part due to this. I've gone back to playing Halo 3 occasionally. Every other game I seethe, spit, rage and decry at least one incident that occurs. Reach could often seem like a meditation on whether video games were a leisure activity or a form of mental endurance training. I and many others on here still played these games regularly and near exclusively until the release of the subsequent title. Halo 4 came and went like a transient Gears of War title. 'Boredom', along with frustration, was the most common reason cited. Many things make Halo 4 boring to play for more than half an hour but chief among them must be the listlessness of its weapon combat. Gigantic hitboxes; Hercules-strong bullet magnetism; aim assist so insistent that it actually ruins your grenade throwing arc on an almost game to game basis. The ease with which you can 5 shot a distant opponent with the DMR in BTB is almost insulting it's so straightforward.
Other weapons which undermine Halo 4's gunplay:
The AR: Grossly overpowered, burns through enemies with minimal aiming required. Doubly unbalanced when paired with quick reload (quick reload affects an integral part of the interplay between different weapons and so damages the gunplay in Halo 4. Wasn't mentioned earlier because of the 'all perks stripped out' caveat).
SAW: The AR x2. Pathetically unbalanced and makes Halo 4 seem like a toy for infant school children to play with.
The Beam Rifle: See gif above. Should've been a day 1 patch. Laughable that it still exists as it does.
The Binary Rifle: Somewhat balanced by its scoped laser. But is there much 'play' in using this gun, so to speak? Feels both unsatisfying to kill with and cheap to die by. A Holmesian vision, a sniper for people who can't snipe, added purely for Halo's wheelchair Reich.
Sticky Detonator: Fine in isolation but when considered as a replacement for/re-imagining of Reach's Grenade Launcher suddenly seems very one dimensional and uninspired.
Boltshot: Useless primary fire (which I believe was bugged, would always seem to jam when fired rapidly, as does the 'flagnum'). Essentially served as a pocket shotgun off spawn and no doubt had thousands rifling through the bin for the Halo 4 receipt of purchase.
The Halo series by gunplay:
Halo CE - Projectile based, shot leading, effective strafing, loads of nuance, didn't have to accommodate latency realities. Great.
Halo 2 - Obscene amounts of aim assist. Sweep sniping. Button glitches added depth. Still had fast YY weapon switching, which is a massive plus.
Halo 3 - Terribly frustrating bullet spread which rendered the BR ineffectual at longer ranges and sometimes puzzled at closer ranges. Projectile based, required shot leading which adds depth and nuance to the gun battles. The hardest sniper rifle in the series to use and consequently the most rewarding.
Reach - Bloom, which is obviously awful but did at least add some sort of 'depth' to the gunplay. Featured one of the series' best and most unique weapons, the Grenade Launcher.
The greatest asset of Halo 4's gunplay is its consistency. The bullets fire straight, the reticles for the most part do not bloom, the BR spread is tighter. However, it's also, for the most part, consistently boring. You don't have to think about degrees of leading based on distance. Bullets don't fire straight when fired toward an enemy spartan, they powerfully magnetise towards them. Headshot hitboxes are far larger than they should be.
Firing a gun in Halo 4 just isn't that interesting. They can remove AA's and perks and add all the ranking systems they want for Halo 5 but if the gunplay carries over from 4 then it won't be a game worth buying an Xbox One for.
How would the carbine be in a projectile based sandbox? It wouldn't handle much differently from the version in 4 would it?
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Not a big fan of Staffan either. [spoilers]He is annoying as much as he sympathetic, and we hear more about what he thinks about his ruthless side rather actually see it (the interrogation stuff came close).[/spoilers]
If you can give me a direct quote I can look up the context and settle this definitively.
A crime is a crime, the reasons why a crime is committed doesn't change the fact that a crime was committed. The S-II project was created because groups of smart people were convinced if they didn't do something, billions of folks would die.
Sounds noble? Yeah, maybe, but it doesn't excuse the crimes that were commiited.
S-III's were created because they needed more Spartans and didn't have the time and resources to recreate S-II's. So what? It hardly matters.
The S-III and S-II projects are not on equal terms. One was disproportionately worse, especially in terms of the law as established in Halo's fiction (and even by today's standards).
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Hello no. Nylund one of the weakest Halo writers.
There is someone who agrees with me in this?
(That said, The Impossible Life and the Possible Death of Preston J. Cole is, IMO, one of the best Halo stories, despite having utterly ridiculous things. Perhaps i should read it again)
EDIT i didn't like Silentium any more than... the second book whose name escapes me. One promising start, 2 weak sequels.
Caayn
Member
"Mal wondered what she'd had in mind for Spartans who made it to old age. Maybe she never thought any of them would survive that long. They were expendable weapons, after all. He approached the warthog with the required cation,...."
The bolded part is what troubles me. The previous two sentences were obliviously the thoughts of the character indicated by the words "wondered" and "Maybe". And then you've suddenly got that. Sure it could've been an addition to Mal's thoughts. But that's not how I read it.
It certainly doesn't give a free pass for the committed crimes during the creation and realization of the program.
S-IIIs were created because they needed cheap expendable Spartans and S-IIs were way to expensive to send on suicide missions. This is described in Ghost of Onyx.
No offense, but I think that it's going to be pointless to discuss this morality/humane/law difference between the S-IIs and the S-IIIs any further. We clearly have a different point of view about this subject.
Zeouterlimits
Member
Alright, I'll bite - rank 'em.Hello, no. Nylund one of the weakest Halo writers.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Chomp.
Harvest
Evolutions
Forerunner (1, 3, 2)
K-5 (3, 1, 2)
Fall of Reach
Flood
Onyx
First Strike
Cole
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
All this Spartan-II talk.. I wonder what ever came of m'dude Soren-066! I'm sure he made it off Reach B]
The Carbine was always projectile-based, but in a sandbox of CE weapons I would test it with similar stun effects of the PR/PP and 1 shot less to kill (currently at 7 in H4 I think). Could be interesting, also assuming the movement speed was faster, strafe was better, etc.
The Carbine was always projectile-based, but in a sandbox of CE weapons I would test it with similar stun effects of the PR/PP and 1 shot less to kill (currently at 7 in H4 I think). Could be interesting, also assuming the movement speed was faster, strafe was better, etc.
For H5, they need to make each race of weaponry feel distinct. Forerunner should be hitscan, with least damage and fastest fire rate; UNSC should be projectile based with highest damage, but lowest projectile speed and fire rate; Covenant should be fast projectile based, with moderate damage and overheats for some weapons.
From there, you balance each weapon individually (hitscan/projectile, damage, aim assist/magnitism for special/specific weapons, special traits, etc.), but each race's guns need to be special in their own way and distinguishable from one another, while still being competitively viable.
From there, you balance each weapon individually (hitscan/projectile, damage, aim assist/magnitism for special/specific weapons, special traits, etc.), but each race's guns need to be special in their own way and distinguishable from one another, while still being competitively viable.
If soren is the one who still wanted to fight, after the procedures went wrong, I hope he did live I felt genuinely upset for him.
A six shot carbine with a stun effect would be nice, especially in ce sandbox. I'm surprised people don't use it in 4.
I don't think I could rank each one definitely. I'd have to do tranches.
Best Tranche:
Contact Harvest
Silentium
Best of Evolutions
Good Tranche:
Primordium
Cryptum
Thursday War
Decent Tranche:
Glasslands
The Flood
The Fall of Reach
First Strike
Ghosts of Onyx
Not worth reading tranche:
The Cole Protocol
Worst of Evolutions
I think whether you like Bear, Traviss' or Nylund's writing is on style and subject matter points. Nylund hits the closest to the material in the mainline Halo games, but the characterization of some of the main characters is IMO weak and he's occasionally prone to fetishize the technology aspect. Traviss writes more from a character POV, and Bear's high-sci-fi feel is sort of retro in this day and age. Nylund's work also suffers a little for being the first set of novels, as well--in some ways aside from the retcons it feels like a bit too streamlined a universe.
The Cole Protocol was just eminently forgettable, with no one doing much of anything interesting. It felt a lot like knockoff Nylund to me. Bucknell did a better job with "Dirt" in Evolutions, methinks.
"Palace Hotel" is perhaps the most irrelevant piece of fiction Halo has produced. And I say that with the option to nuke Cole Protocol and Halo Legends off the face of the earth.
Soren is the one who defected to the Insurrectionist cause in a fit of being pissy in "Pariah" from Evolutions. Not a great story either, it suffered badly from the short story format I think. The one you might be thinking of is Fhajad-084, who ended up stuck in a bouyancy tank and later worked for ONI.
ElzarTheBam
Member
I've been using these screenshots as wallpapers recently and they're pretty gorgeous.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Well she's right too. He did still want to be a part of the program and fight, but he was just unable to. And shame on you for knocking that story!
Loved this game man. So crazy of an experience for its time.
Interesting list. Maybe I should read the post-First Strike books.
My issue is they never sold me on his transformation from loyal soldier to wanting to get back at the UNSC. I dunno if that was a function of not enough pages or just not enough skill on the part of the author (I'd be resentful in that situation too). Since we're mostly told about his predicament it doesn't really let you get into his mind in the best way I think.
FUBAR McDangles
Member
People are complaining about Nylund now? His action scenes were the best in the series.
First Strike
Ghosts of Onyx
Evolutions
Cryptum
The Flood
Contact Harvest
Glasslands
Silentium
Cole Protocol
Thursday War
Primordium
I haven't read Mortal Dictata yet.
Anyway, First Strike has badass Spartan moments and some very good Cortana sections that really expanded both what we know as well as personifying her more to be a better character. I really enjoyed that book. Ghosts of Onyx was really good, as I liked the Richard Lash(ONI) sections, as well as the Spartans stuff after Onyx actually starts activating. Will's death > everything else in this franchise. Evolutions has its ups and downs, but the ups (Cole, Headhunters, Mona Lisa, etc.) are far better than the downs. Cryptum is Cryptum. Fun ride.
The Flood catches a lot of flak for not doing much with the mythos and contradicting the personality of John a bit, but I absolutely loved the ODST/Silva/McKay stuff. Some of the best parts of the entire line of books were in those sections, IMO. Very, very fun. Contact Harvest is written very well, but the story didn't seem like it had much going on and it seemed like it could have been quite a bit shorter.
Then there is a separation line between the above and the below.
Glasslands was below average in pretty much every sense of the word. No badass Spartan parts, no good Naval battles, no exceptional characterization aside from Lucy, and a disappointing ending. Silentium was better than the second book, but it was a bit of a chore to read. Cole Protocol was written well, but again - the story seemed non-essential. I wouldn't mind seeing Buckell back to write again.
Thursday War was bad. Primordium was terrible.
I need Naval battles in my Halos. I need Spartans doing awesome shit in my Halos. I need characters that are actually interesting to read about. Forerunner saga had flashes of these but not much. Kilo 5 has pretty much none of it from the first two books. The ODSTs are alright, and Osman is handled pretty well, but otherwise it is extremely lacking in my three criteria points.
I hope the books evolve to be better in the future.
First Strike
Ghosts of Onyx
Evolutions
Cryptum
The Flood
Contact Harvest
Glasslands
Silentium
Cole Protocol
Thursday War
Primordium
I haven't read Mortal Dictata yet.
Anyway, First Strike has badass Spartan moments and some very good Cortana sections that really expanded both what we know as well as personifying her more to be a better character. I really enjoyed that book. Ghosts of Onyx was really good, as I liked the Richard Lash(ONI) sections, as well as the Spartans stuff after Onyx actually starts activating. Will's death > everything else in this franchise. Evolutions has its ups and downs, but the ups (Cole, Headhunters, Mona Lisa, etc.) are far better than the downs. Cryptum is Cryptum. Fun ride.
The Flood catches a lot of flak for not doing much with the mythos and contradicting the personality of John a bit, but I absolutely loved the ODST/Silva/McKay stuff. Some of the best parts of the entire line of books were in those sections, IMO. Very, very fun. Contact Harvest is written very well, but the story didn't seem like it had much going on and it seemed like it could have been quite a bit shorter.
Then there is a separation line between the above and the below.
Glasslands was below average in pretty much every sense of the word. No badass Spartan parts, no good Naval battles, no exceptional characterization aside from Lucy, and a disappointing ending. Silentium was better than the second book, but it was a bit of a chore to read. Cole Protocol was written well, but again - the story seemed non-essential. I wouldn't mind seeing Buckell back to write again.
Thursday War was bad. Primordium was terrible.
I need Naval battles in my Halos. I need Spartans doing awesome shit in my Halos. I need characters that are actually interesting to read about. Forerunner saga had flashes of these but not much. Kilo 5 has pretty much none of it from the first two books. The ODSTs are alright, and Osman is handled pretty well, but otherwise it is extremely lacking in my three criteria points.
I hope the books evolve to be better in the future.
Ragnarok Flames
Banned
Halo 4.
You should take a first person shot in 4k and mutimonitor viewThanks for this. Finally was able to run H2 in eyefinity and 4K
Halo 2 4K:
Halo 2 (7680x1080)
And why not Halo SA while I'm at it
Yeah for horrible image compression
It's clear that both Halo 2 and SA aren't made with multi monitor set-ups in mind.
You should take a first person shot in 4k and mutimonitor view
2nded.
Find some cool place in the campaign and just stop and take a screen or two. I mean, nothing wrong with more than just a few (at least...I'm not on mobile, so idk about those who are). Maybe just post one and then some links.
Halo 5?
You should take a first person shot in 4k and mutimonitor view
Somewhere where you can see the library from quarantine zone in the background. Maybe right on the edge of the wall where Sacred Icon starts.
h3 speedrun - http://www.twitch.tv/mistermonopoli
Man_Flannel
Member
Ok, so I haven't read any of the halo books but have spent a few hours on the halo wiki and find the forerunner/flood stuff pretty interesting. The UNSC stuff is pretty good to, but I feel the bigger picture stuff is more compelling.
Anyways, anyone want to recommend some Halo books? As far as I can tell the older stuff was all UNSC stuff but the newer books are Forerunner?
Also, anyone know if they are coming out with a giant box set or something?
Anyways, anyone want to recommend some Halo books? As far as I can tell the older stuff was all UNSC stuff but the newer books are Forerunner?
Also, anyone know if they are coming out with a giant box set or something?
aHebrewMenagerie
Member
I ran into DeadlyCyclone on the way into the Hy-Vee in Ames. lol
Is it worth watching? He's playing on easy...
Read Greg Bear's books. The only author whose stuff I've read, but very good. I like his style. Flows very well, advanced without being confusing, etc. The dialogue could have been somewhat better, but I'm not going to pass judgement on it without having read more.
Still, read Bear's stuff. It's usually pretty highly recommended in places I ask.
Two banned members. Two outlaws. Two bad-asses.
Over now.
I'm more interested in his stream setup, honestly. Is someone off-camera updating his times on the fly in the graphic?
Man_Flannel
Member
You need to watch more speed runs bro. He just pushes a button for the splits.
User 73706
Banned
Where there's a helpful smile in every aisle!
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