Syphon Filter
Member
The crowded market is a good point but i really think the quality after Halo 3 made a lot of people leave.
Halo |OT19| 793 Posts, And None Worth Reading
- Thread starter Ozzy Onya A2Z
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The crowded market is a good point but i really think the quality after Halo 3 made a lot of people leave.
NobleGundam
Banned
Kinda perfect moment for 343 to shine with these new halos coming within these 3 years from now knowing CoD is under a hiatus for their 3 year dev (unsure which franchise or all of them. MW, BO, Ghost).
I don't think Titanfall will out shine Halo bcuz it doesn't really show enough gameplay wise to make me want to stop playing halo for awhile.
CoD MW2 kinda got my attention for quite a bit.But with Halo 2 HD and Halo 5 releasing so soon based on the leaker my body is ready.
I don't think Titanfall will out shine Halo bcuz it doesn't really show enough gameplay wise to make me want to stop playing halo for awhile.
CoD MW2 kinda got my attention for quite a bit.But with Halo 2 HD and Halo 5 releasing so soon based on the leaker my body is ready.
Reach didn't stay at the heights 3 did, but I wouldn't say it lost steam.
People stayed with it through a CoD release, it didn't really take a hit until the second holiday it was out, then when people were done playing those games they came back to Reach.
4 just went straight down (and then as it was going down, people were going back to Reach)
Syphon Filter
Member
COD is not on a hiatus,there is a new one this year. 3 yrs for each dev,sledge has been on theirs since 2011.
NobleGundam
Banned
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Choose your poison:
- Bloom with molasses gameplay and no Power-ups (forgot about this too) -- Reach
- Consistent gunplay with annoying perks -- Halo 4
There's no reason to make H4 look worse by complimenting Reach with a "but" or "at least" statement attached.
This problem stems from people thinking the franchise was being milked with 3 year dev cycles and not enough change between releases, all before CoD came around and shat all over that mentality. It was a shitty period to be a Halo fan who could see the direction this franchise would head if Bungie never got out of the mindset of "casual players first, vocal minority second."
Halo 3's release was a clear indication to me that Bungie didn't give a crap about our input after Halo 2's release. While Bungie was at the helm, "casual" players won the war.
Syphon Filter
Member
I was going to go further just in case something like this was brought up. Reach held it's own but like you said it didn't stay at the heights 3 did and i think the formula changes had something to do with it. It at least still felt like a Halo game,Bungie made sure they didn't go too far into changing things. Halo 4 did however and in a drastic way, then the numbers showed it.
Root of your Halo 2 folder where the .exe is
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Yes, and I LOVE IT.
Tha Robbertster
Member
I definitely agree with you on the first part. Halo should have stayed on its original course. The thing we'll never know it if Halo would have stayed as popular as it was from 2007 till 2010 if it had kept the original formula.
Exactly.
DotA 2 has 7 million unique users every month (and rising) and around 200-400k players at every time of the day. The game punishes you for every mistake you make. It doesn't have a perk equivalent and doesn't dumb itself down for casual players. Apart of it being free, what other reasons would it have to have better numbers compared to Halo.
What it does have though, is:
- An extensive tutorial
- Practice matches vs bots
- Skill matching matchmaking
- In-game guides
- spectator mode that allows you to watch pro play the game
If I'm going to learn hockey, its not with rules that makes it so that everyone will win the same amount of games regardless of individual skills or randomness like "every x minutes the puck has x percent of chances of switching teams." It doesn't teach me how to play/improve and its only fun as long as I don't improve.
Randomness only is good for players who don't learn much about the game and don't invest themselves much into it, casual players.
Contrary to what you might think, casual players are not good for a multiplayer ecosystem if they remain casual players. They will ditch you the moment something shinier is around and they aren't dedicated. Dedicated players is what keeps a game alive.
Dedicated players buy the books, they make machinimas, they create fan art, they create new gamemodes, they create content that spikes interest in the game so newer players will join.
Shake Appeal
Member
Design a game for its best players, and leave everyone else with something to aspire to.
True of chess, true of baseball, true of soccer, true of Starcraft, true of DOTA.
True of chess, true of baseball, true of soccer, true of Starcraft, true of DOTA.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Totally. Continue to offer the room for flexibility and creativity that Ozzy is talking about, too. Let kids play Infection on the Millenium Falcon replica Forge map they made if they want, but don't design the core game around it, and don't put it into matchmaking.
Orochinagis
Member
Destiny has a personal vehicle for the player:
It's called a shrike.
Hope I can paint it in green or pink.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Casuals were thrown many lines in Halo 3 lol (deliberately inconsistent utility weapon (you know, the weapon you use for 95% of engagements? -> more frustrating gameplay than perks IMO), Equipment, weaker weapons in a sandbox of crazy strong vehicles, etc.).
The problems before Reach were more fundamental in their existence (mechanics + design philosophies), which many fans who don't have that time spent with CE are understandably unaware of. Sure Halo 2 didn't have perks, but it screwed over any fans looking for a skill gap. To me that's equally, if not more, problematic than the sins Bungie/343 committed by adding CoD elements.
Bloom aside, the shooting in Reach was at least more consistent (shot registration, visual feedback, etc.), more powerful and skillful, albeit not by much, than Halo 2 and Halo 3. This was the first time in 6 years that I was able to say that. Now we're facing even more problems on top of the issues that have been lingering for years.
The thing is that first and foremost they have to sell a game, which already has had many iterations, to the general public and to some extent a fleeting userbase. They need some kind of hook, mechanic, original idea to set as bulletin point to sell the game. Which is why games are tinkered with, remixed to death and in most cases loses some of its core originality in the process. It is really tough rope to balance, because stay too much with the old gameplay, it will be criticized as being outdated (Remember that one reviewer criticizing Halo 4 for not introducing ads?). On the other hand, tinker to much it loses some its core principles in the processin the end some praise it, others despise it.
What annoys me about that way of thinking is that often the solution is to only go with the new and improved gameplay, instead of giving the player base a wide variety of options. Yes, people often fall into old patterns, so they go back to player what they were used to without trying the new gameplayhowever pushing and forcing them into that direction can be detrimental in the long run. Instead of looking at compromises and streamlining, give the tools and options to the players. In case of Halo 4, we got a highly comprised game, that pushed in only one direction and the rest, was a whole pile of nothing to fall back on. I mean betting big on one thing is always risky, so do not be surprised when you lose it all and on top of that act surprised that it failed.
Now lets say that they gave us the vanilla Halo 4, but also packed in multiple options for a strip down classic mode and really worked on community features such as Forge, Theater, Spectator modes and morethe eventual blowback would have been less, because people have much more to fall back on, they are willing to give more feedback and could potentially grow and sustain a community. The other big plus is that people will still try the new gameplay and be a tad more forgiving, because it becomes a element in the overall packageinstead of the only element overall.
Pew, I kind of went on rant mode. Sorry about that.
YESSSSS
Developers need to take some ecology classes or something.
Right now the thinking is, "CoD style shooters are super popular because of perks, rewarding kills with more powerful stuff, fast twitch aim and shoot shooting, sprint, etc etc etc" and they emulate that.
But there is still a niche that is completley empty that people want to fill. Halo is slowly leaving that niche and trying to go into CoD territory where it will just get destroyed.
Do what you do best.
Also, lets look at what happened to Halo Reach and Halo 4.
In Halo Reach we had a bunch of armor abilities and bloom that deviated from traditional Halo gameplay. As the game went on, a lot of Armor Abilities were scaled back until in some playlists we were only left with the ones that had a minimal impact on the game (to an extent) It was a pull back from the full customization Bungie originally had. Bloom was also reduced, and classic playlists were clamored for all over the internet.
In Halo 4 we see the introduction of legendary slayer, as well as an overhaul of the global ordnance system, the turbo update, etc etc etc. All these to dial back the changes made. Halo 4 at launch and Halo 4 now are very different. If Halo 4 launched in its current state it would have been recieved better for sure.
Halo games that deviate too much from their core are ALWAYS scaled back.
Of course I know. It just put me in mind of that.
What's with the scope thing on the top?
KK, I'll report back later.
The problem with Halo games has been that they have gotten slower while simultaneously making it easier to land shots. We can argue about sprint, loadouts, or the changing tastes of gamers, but the truth is, it just got boring.
Now, not only are firefights slow, but they are a forgone conclusion based on who got the first shot or who has teamshot. That's not fun.
Now, not only are firefights slow, but they are a forgone conclusion based on who got the first shot or who has teamshot. That's not fun.
K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
Leading shots is cool in some games, but for Halo I prefer the simplicity and cleanness of my bullets going directly where I aim my reticle.
The Henery
Member
Poker Face
Member
if any of you happen to be part of Microsoft Expert Zone, you can get the TitanFall beta a couple hours early by completing a quiz or something.
Reach beta days. Good fucking times.
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
People really want shot leading back??
Gabotron ES
Member
squidhands
Member
Even though he never posts here any more, I'll be forever grateful to Jironimo for getting me an early code.
Devin Olsen
Member
Just a heads up!
goatrope and I will be streaming Halo:CE Co-Op Legendary speedrun all night tomorrow. goatrope currently has the Solo Legendary World Record for the game, so our co-op time should be pretty good.
It'll be a lot of fun, we will have a mic set up and just be talking Halo all night so check it out. It will be on his twitch channel ( twitch.tv/goatrope ) and we will likely start around 6PM Pacific Time.
goatrope and I will be streaming Halo:CE Co-Op Legendary speedrun all night tomorrow. goatrope currently has the Solo Legendary World Record for the game, so our co-op time should be pretty good.
It'll be a lot of fun, we will have a mic set up and just be talking Halo all night so check it out. It will be on his twitch channel ( twitch.tv/goatrope ) and we will likely start around 6PM Pacific Time.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Halo 4 Ragnarok > Halo 3 Valhalla largely in part due to the DMR being a single shot weapon IMO. Map positioning hasn't really changed between games, just the reliability of utility weapons. People call the gameplay ping fests, which is true to an extent, but how extreme is that really? We have sprint. We have other AA's to help with map traversal. We have many vehicles. 3x DMR is hardly an issue as people made it out to be in H4 BTB.
That being said I agree though, a 2x zoom on the DMR would definitely work better than 3x as a spawn weapon, but overall I think any single shot utility weapon is better for BTB than a 2x burst fire weapon (hitscan, 3x, bloom included).
I've beaten this topic to death though and I know I'm probably in the minority, but it reminds me of people complaining about a lack of ammo in Campaign when it's been shown otherwise. I just never had the urge to complain about DMR's in BTB as much as I complained about the BR in H2/H3 BTB.
On dedicated servers, yes. It's better for you too, whether you can see it or not. Stop wanting the game to do everything for you like how you said you want that H2 remake so you can be good again..
Crazy.
Don't worry. I understand that we're not at the point where doing so is a good move to make.
The Henery
Member
I'd totally be down for a 2x zoom, projectile based DMR. Four shot, though, with significantly lowered aim assist from the halo 4 incarnation.
Twould be a thing of beauty.
Halo 3's BR was trash but I put most blame of that to its spread. If there's some sort of shot lead, it should be a 2x single shot weapon.
But really, BTB has a gigantic list of issues than just the primary DMR/BR whatever. From overpowered vehicles to overpowered weapons to offset those vehicles is one obstacle they need to overcome to get it back into a better playing field. Bad gametypes on average/poor maps is another big one.
Burn.jpg
That's good I don't really mind hit scan at all, Would anyone change the Carbine?
Chettler that is the display for the shrike probably.
Shit was cray. Couldn't believe that expert zone thing worked. Got a few others in that way too.
Halo 5 going to have like 83620463 maps in its beta according to that leaker, so hey, could be kewl too.
SHIFTYkiwi
Member
agreed.
Yeah I'm with you. Leading shots seems silly to me in retrospect.
aHebrewMenagerie
Member
speedy just called my 15 year old sister hot, i'm disturbed
Ragnarok Flames
Banned
isnt speedy just a babby himself?
There's absolutely no reason to have hitscan on dedicated servers
Pics?
Lmao.
]
She is though...
Also, I saw the Robocop remake yesterday and and it was really good
Come at me
She is though...
I'm only kind of kidding
Also, I saw the Robocop remake yesterday and and it was really good
Come at me
The Killzone: Shadowfall transport ships are pretty cool:
Hope to see more vehicles being introduced that are not mechs in the next Halo.
A 15 yr old attracted to a 15 yr old isn't that odd. I mean, you could doe that fool for looking at your sister, but the age thing doesn't seem to be the disturbing part... considering.
Ragnarok Flames
Banned
Mario Golf.
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