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Halo: Reach |OT4| This Thread is Not Your Grave, But You Are Welcome In It

B

Barrow Roll

Member
Kuroyume said:
The range of the DMR is excellent and well suited for Halo. It's a welcome addition to the Halo sandbox. Fans love it. It will be nice to see it return to Halo 4 without bloom and a higher rate of fire. Give it some recoil to compensate for the higher rate of fire.
Click to expand...
Yup. recoil would be far more preferable to bloom. Where a bullet lands in expanded bloom is left to chance, with recoil I can at least control where the bullet goes while still having to put forth effort to aim and fire faster while retaining accuracy. Controlling recoil would be more engaging that controlling bloom since one requires that you're always adjusting your aim, while the other pretty much just asks you to stop shooting while that circle in the middle of your screen gets smaller.
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Barrow Roll said:
Yup. recoil would be far more preferable to bloom. Where a bullet lands in expanded bloom is left to chance, with recoil I can at least control where the bullet goes while still having to put forth effort to aim and fire faster while retaining accuracy. Controlling recoil would be more engaging that controlling bloom since one requires that you're always adjusting your aim, while the other pretty much just asks you to stop shooting while that circle in the middle of your screen gets smaller.
Click to expand...
Dual wielding the Halo 2 SMG. What say you now?
 
K

Kuroyume

Banned
The Antitype said:
Part of the reason Hemmo and Pinnacle play so poorly is because they haven't been updated to deal with the increased range of the weapons, and the decreased movement speed.

So it's insanely easy to be caught in open space by snipers and DMR fire, and you're basically toast.

So everybody tries to keep to the periphery as much as possible, which wastes most of the space on the map.

Give me a completely new box canyon map, damnit.
Click to expand...

Hemmo has been updated though. It's not the same map. Much larger and the terrain isn't as flat so the sight lines aren't the same. Is it one of the easier maps to get sniped on? Sure. I don't necessarily agree that you're basically toast though. Strafe, return DMR fire, and use the your armor ability to buy yourself some time.

Pinnacle is pretty damn tight. Plenty of cover. I can see people camping in certain spots but it's not like you can't make your way to them without getting sniped.

Louis Wu said:
One of the flag returns was INSIDE the powerhouse in the Beta; they were moved to the roofs on opposing corners because it played better that way.
Click to expand...

Yet it wasn't THAT much trouble to get it out. I don't get what happened after Halo 2 but it's like they've had this thing at Bungie with making everything easier. I like the challenge of getting a flag out of a tough spot or planting a bomb somewhere that might be difficult. The only excpetion to that is perhaps pulling the core out of some tough spot in Invasion, but that's mostly because of the other team spawning with retarded CQC weapons on top of the objective.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Louis Wu said:
One of the flag returns was INSIDE the powerhouse in the Beta; they were moved to the roofs on opposing corners because it played better that way.
Click to expand...
Right, that was my point. :p

GhaleonEB said:
The flag and flag returns in one-flag are on the roof of buildings because the buildings themselves are poorly designed.
Click to expand...

The building that looks most like it was designed as a base - the titular powerhouse - is now in the middle of the map because it wasn't a suitable flag spawn.
 
P

Plywood

NeoGAF's smiling token!
How about we go back to hitscan Halo 2 land of no bloom/recoil in my precision weapons because I am 1 ton future space soldier that should be able to hold and control a gun which weighs a fraction of my super future space suit.

I'M JUST SAYING BRO
 
ElRenoRaven

ElRenoRaven

Member
GhaleonEB said:
On the AR/DMR topic, it all really comes down to the fact that Halo differentiates between precision weapons which can headshot, and those that cannot. The moment that design decision was made, the automatic/non headshot weapons got hard to balance, because a precision weapon will always be superior once shields are down. Always. To compensate, weapons like the AR need to be powerful and have decent range, otherwise they'll have no role. In Reach, the AR has both range and power. It's actually useful, which irks players who don't think any weapon which doesn't allow headshots do not also require skill. (Which is not true.)(
Click to expand...

Thank you. I mean it too. Thank you for this post.

GhaleonEB said:
This is the trade off I was trying to touch on. If you limit the AR more by increasing the spread for sustained fire, it becomes useless at anything other than super close range. Imagine if an AR user had to fire pulses, and was trading blows with a DMR user. They're even right until the AR user's shields drop, at which point the DMR wins due to its ability to land a headshot; the AR would need several more pulses in order to land the kill. If you limit the AR in this way, it becomes even more of a close range, special purpose weapon, used much less often. It might as well be a shotgun at that point. The only way to make it more useful is to enable it to kill players at decent range before someone can four shot their shields off and land the headshot. Which is what Reach does.

But the reason they were pulled from the playlists was because of how they worked. All that argument does is point out that the playlist designer agrees they were over powered in many situations, which just suppports Dani's arguments. :p
Click to expand...

And this one too. Thank you again. Again you nail it perfectly.
 
T

Tawpgun

Member
Well that was fun reading through. Might as well have everyone consider the big picture.

What does 343 do for Halo 4. Everyone has their own opinions on what makes Halo great. For some its the variety of combat. For others its the tight and refined precision gameplay. For some its 8 v 8 large scale battles. For other its 4 v 4 tactical skirmishes.

I think what they need to do is built the weapon sandbox AROUND the quintessential Halo Precision Weapon. It's ALWAYS the weapon at the top of everyone's tool of destruction.

Also, a problem with AR starts.... the pistol needs to be buffed in Halo 4. I remember AR starts in the beta being decent. The pistol was fun to use. It's not in Reach. I can't stand AR starts in Reach.
 
S

Sibylus

Banned
Tunavi said:
Halo 4 needs bloom, recoil, and bullet spread
Click to expand...
Don't forget bullet drop, no round counter, and iron sights.

Red Halorchestra

The boxart is Master Chief raising a flag over the Reichstag.
 
C

clav

Member
"You left too many games recently. You won't be able to play Matchmaking if you continue to do so."

Well, considering that Invasion Slayer sucks, I left those games. Why am I punished for playing something I didn't want when Bungie is not listening?

Remove that from the playlist damn it.
 
D

Domino Theory

Crystal Dynamics
claviertekky said:
"You left too many games recently. You won't be able to play Matchmaking if you continue to do so."

Well, considering that Invasion Slayer sucks, I left those games. Why am I punished for playing something I didn't want when Bungie is not listening?

Remove that from the playlist damn it.
Click to expand...

"Hey guys, I bought this chainsaw and revved it up and ran it through my leg and it cut my leg off! That's not supposed to happen, WTF!"
 
P

Plywood

NeoGAF's smiling token!
No wallpaper of this chiseled structure?

PhotoshopMe.jpg


For shame.
 
D

Domino Theory

Crystal Dynamics
Hitmonchan107 said:
Yep, Chrome doesn't work well with Waypoint. I missed the entire section of Frankie teasing about the Firefight map!
Click to expand...

Refresh? I had that part cut out for me and I just refreshed and it worked.
 
H

Hypertrooper

Member
Hitmonchan107 said:
Yep, Chrome doesn't work well with Waypoint. I missed the entire section of Frankie teasing about the Firefight map!
Click to expand...
He doesn't really tease the firefight in this bulletin.

I can accept the new WWU ehm... Bulletin. I'm liking bs angel writing style. Let's us see what happens after the 7.7.
 
C

clav

Member
Domino Theory said:
"Hey guys, I bought this chainsaw and revved it up and ran it through my leg and it cut my leg off! That's not supposed to happen, WTF!"
Click to expand...
Bad analogy. You don't agree Invasion Slayer sucks?
 
H

Hydranockz

Member
Hypertrooper said:
He doesn't really tease the firefight in this bulletin.

I can accept the new WWU ehm... Bulletin. I'm liking bs angel writing style. Let's us see what happens after the 7.7.
Click to expand...
I agree, but then I again I loved urk's writing style too (Never did read a Frankie Update wen it was released). Bungie/343i hire funny people.

I like that.
 
B

Barrow Roll

Member
Plywood said:
How about we go back to hitscan Halo 2 land of no bloom/recoil in my precision weapons because I am 1 ton future space soldier that should be able to hold and control a gun which weighs a fraction of my super future space suit.

I'M JUST SAYING BRO
Click to expand...
+1

However, recoil is a much more preferable solution to appeasing those that cry about precision weapons being dominant weapons instead of bloom.

In a perfect world precision weapons wouldn't be gimped and full auto weapons would actually be made into something worth using. Holding down a trigger and running forward while aiming at any part of the body isn't satisfying.
 
D

Domino Theory

Crystal Dynamics
claviertekky said:
Bad analogy. You don't agree Invasion Slayer sucks?
Click to expand...

It was a perfect analogy.

Invasion Slayer sucks when you're Elites, but that's not the point. You went into an Invasion playlist and got Invasion Slayer because of the votes. What else were you expecting? Zombies? And you quit because it sucked? That's no excuse, period. Your quitting ruins the experience for everyone else so you got punished (or warned, rather) for doing so.

You blame Bungie for getting Invasion Slayer in an Invasion playlist? Lol.

Deal with it.
 
C

clav

Member
Domino Theory said:
It was a perfect analogy.

Invasion Slayer sucks when you're Elites, but that's not the point. You went into an Invasion playlist and got Invasion Slayer because of the votes. What else were you expecting? Zombies? And you quit because it sucked? That's no excuse, period. Your quitting ruins the experience for everyone else so you got punished (or warned, rather) for doing so.

You blame Bungie for getting Invasion Slayer in an Invasion playlist? Lol.

Deal with it.
Click to expand...
Invasion Slayer shouldn't be on there. It doesn't make any sense. My experience was already ruined.

If I want to play Invasion, I play Invasion, not slayer.
 
D

Domino Theory

Crystal Dynamics
Barrow Roll said:
+1

However, recoil is a much more preferable solution to appeasing those that cry about precision weapons being dominant weapons instead of bloom.

In a perfect world precision weapons wouldn't be gimped and full auto weapons would actually be made into something worth using. Holding down a trigger and running forward while aiming at any part of the body isn't satisfying.
Click to expand...

I don't know if people would like this, but I suggest it as a temporary fix for Halo: Reach until Halo 4 where there shouldn't be any bloom whatsoever: remove reticle bloom when non-scoped, keep bloom when scoped in. That way you only deal with bloom in long range situations which is much more tolerable and you don't really have to mess with the balance of the sandbox.
 
Hitmonchan107

Hitmonchan107

Member
Domino Theory said:
Refresh? I had that part cut out for me and I just refreshed and it worked.
Click to expand...
I had to refresh like ten times, but it finally worked.


Hypertrooper said:
He doesn't really tease the firefight in this bulletin.
Click to expand...

I meant the inaugural E3 bulletin. On Chrome, it cuts off right before the Beaver Creek photo.
 
T

The Antitype

Banned
claviertekky said:
"You left too many games recently. You won't be able to play Matchmaking if you continue to do so."

Well, considering that Invasion Slayer sucks, I left those games. Why am I punished for playing something I didn't want when Bungie is not listening?

Remove that from the playlist damn it.
Click to expand...

Just take the 15 minutes to play Firefight or something.

I did the same thing. I don't disagree with the banning policy, because quitting games hurts your team, ruins other people's fun.

But I played a TON of Invasion Slayer, I went along with it. Eventually I got tired of it and said 'Fuck it, I'll take the punishment'.

I'm not going back into that playlist without at least 3 or 4 friends.


A27 Tawpgun said:
Well that was fun reading through. Might as well have everyone consider the big picture.

What does 343 do for Halo 4. Everyone has their own opinions on what makes Halo great. For some its the variety of combat. For others its the tight and refined precision gameplay. For some its 8 v 8 large scale battles. For other its 4 v 4 tactical skirmishes.

I think what they need to do is built the weapon sandbox AROUND the quintessential Halo Precision Weapon. It's ALWAYS the weapon at the top of everyone's tool of destruction.

Also, a problem with AR starts.... the pistol needs to be buffed in Halo 4. I remember AR starts in the beta being decent. The pistol was fun to use. It's not in Reach. I can't stand AR starts in Reach.
Click to expand...

AR/Pistol starts are fine for the smaller maps.

Pistol/DMR starts are fine for larger maps.

AR/DMR starts would be PERFECT for larger maps.
 
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