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Hearthstone |OT8| Elise's Extremely Irresponsible Field Trip To Un'Goro

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P

Pooya

Member
if your opponent doesn't kill your 2/2s you have 1 mana the turn after to play the buff +1/+1. You can't get punished too much with that. You deal so much damage.

if they die on opponent's turn you're fine. I didn't see the stream, they don't have a deathrattle right? Silence shouldn't hurt you like mass dispel, only one card punishes it. I guess vanish and frost nova too. If you ramp up to this and get 5 2/2s, it can end the game very quickly. I'm guessing innervating this out doesn't work like that.

It's not so high risk but high reward. I think it's fine, they want you to play pilfered souls or whatever it is called I guess, you can recover your mana with that. It can't backfire that easily. It needs very specific answers to destroy you. That means it's a good proactive card I think unless meta shift in a way that everyone techs against it, the downside isn't very relevant. Fel Reaver MkII.
 
C

CelticKnight

Member
I like the ooze, I'd assume of using it against an upgraded Arcanite Reaper would never get old.

Molten Blade is basically just weaponized Shifter Zerus, though.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
A lot of crazy/interesting cards revealed together.

That new Ooze though... LMAO! Now that's one way to make a super anti Pirate Warrior card. I might even use that over regular Ooze.


Which class is Molten Blade for?
 
P

Pooya

Member
ok, I saw the token, it has deathrattle. So you actually have N'Zoth synergy!!!1

it doesn't change the card much, yeah mass dispel wrecks you, if opponent plays that, good for him, you got me.

the 1 mana potion too removes 2 of them and give the opponent a free wild growth. You might not want to queue into priest with this.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
You could play 29 1 mana minions and be guarenteed to play the reward on turn 5.

Greater than 50% chance you're really sad with your draw on turn 6 though.
 
Y

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
Dahbomb said:
A lot of crazy/interesting cards revealed together.

That new Ooze though... LMAO! Now that's one way to make a super anti Pirate Warrior card. I might even use that over regular Ooze.


Which class is Molten Blade for?
Click to expand...


Warrior of course. They aren't that nice to rogue.
 
G

gutshot

Member
Curious Glimmerroot - Really cool card design. Anti net decking tech. It's also a high skill cap card, meaning experienced players who know the meta will have a better chance of getting the card than the casual player. If you can reliably get a card off of it, (like say 90% of the time or more) then it will see play.

Volcanosaur - Being able to Adapt twice can be powerful, but could be a total flop, depending on what choices you get. And for 7 mana, you probably don't want to take that chance. Likely unplayable in constructed unless Menagerie Paladin becomes a thing and they need some more late-game Beasts. Card could be hilarious in Wild with Brann though. 9 attack minion with Windfury and Stealth? GG.

Gluttonous Ooze - More anti-Pirate Warrior tech. I imagine this will be the Weapon hate card of choice for Control decks, replacing Swamp Ooze or Harrison. Faster decks looking to tech against Weapons will likely still go with the 2-drop though.

Mana Bind - This suffers from the same problem that Potion of Polymorph does, which is that playing around that and Mirror Entity looks the same. This and Counterspell are now like that. Cool card, but too easy for your opponent to play around.

Vilespine Slayer - Kidnapper am cry. Any midrange or tempo Rogue decks will like this card a lot. Don't think Miracle will want to run it. And it's not gonna help with the Quest at all, despite Iksar's claims to the contrary. (I seriously lol'd when he talked about running a deck with Thistle Tea and Wisps to complete the Rogue Quest. Rogues stay losing.)

Living Mana - Awesome card design. It could find a home in token or Egg Druid lists, but there's no way they will be better than Jade Druid, so you probably won't see it played much.

Mirage Caller - A nice card that can be a good play on curve, provided you've something on board. And scales well into the late game, where you can look to copy something like a Cairne. Should help a lot with the Priest Quest. This will definitely see play.

Corrupting Mist - This card could have been decent in Renolock, but since that won't be a deck any more, I don't see this being run.

Lost in the Jungle - aka Living Recruits. This is a nice 1-drop for slower Paladin decks to contest the early Pirate boards and can go in faster weenie Paladin decks as well, so I expect this will see play.

Molten Blade - Fun Trolden material, but not going to be seeing any competitive play. Could be good in Arena though.

The Marsh Queen - Like I already mentioned, the Quest requirement is just so tough to meet and will likely put you too far behind such that the reward isn't going to get you back in the game. A shame, because the flavor with Queen Carnassa is great.
 
M

MonorailCat

Member
Classic HS commentators.

"Pavel drawing for Corruptor. If only he draws his corruptor."

Last card is drawn. No Corruptor.

"Oh, looks like he already played both of them."

I mean, yeah it's hard to commentate and count cards. But thats why there are two of them ...
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Shaman stays winning. Theirs is still the best quest. The only drawback is the 1 mana and card you have to use at the start of the game. After that, Murlocs is a pretty strong archetype to play anyway.

And then your 5 mana card gives you an 8/8 on the turn you play it, while also refilling your hand to give you all you need to finish the game. It sounds insanely good.

Meanwhile, Hunter and Rogue have to really make their decks a lot worse just for the quest, and then have to play a potentially 5 mana do nothing card, for eventual rewards down the line, despite not having any comeback tools to help with late the game.

And Priest gets an anti-aggro reward with a quest that seems unlikely to complete by the time aggro kills them. Even if pirates die off from the new anti-pirate tech, Murloc Shaman is going to kill them more than fast enough.
 
G

gutshot

Member
ZealousD said:
Vilespine Slayer is a candidate for a bounce deck in rogue.
Click to expand...

The problem is you are going to be anti-tempoing yourself if you keep bouncing this back to your hand. That's generally not ideal unless you have a really good late game win condition and I'm not sure Crystal Core is it.
 
G

gutshot

Member
thepotatoman said:
Shaman stays winning. Theirs is still the best quest. The only drawback is the 1 mana and card you have to use at the start of the game. After that, Murlocs is a pretty strong archetype to play anyway.

And then your 5 mana card gives you an 8/8 on the turn you play it, while also refilling your hand to give you all you need to finish the game. It sounds insanely good.

Meanwhile, Hunter and Rogue have to really make their decks a lot worse just for the quest, and then have to play a potentially 5 mana do nothing card, for eventual rewards down the line, despite not having any comeback tools to help with late the game.

And Priest gets an anti-aggro reward with a quest that seems unlikely to complete by the time aggro kills them. Even if pirates die off from a the new anti-pirate tech, Murloc Shaman is going to kill them more than fast enough.
Click to expand...

I think Priest's might be better. That reward is so insanely good and the requirements not all that hard to meet. Especially with the cards they are getting this set (Oracle, Mirage Caller, Turtle taunt).

Warlock's also isn't bad. The Quest won't be hard to complete in a Discard Lock deck. It remains to be seen whether two free 3/2s each turn is too slow though.

I agree that the Hunter and Rogue ones are the worst revealed so far.
 
W

wiibomb

Member
the hunter quest is only bad because hunter doesn't have a reliable way to draw all those raptors, but we have seen only 2 cards so far from hunter to know if we will get more, if there are more ways from this set to make hunter play those raptors, it can become really good.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
gutshot said:
I think Priest's might be better. That reward is so insanely good and the requirements not all that hard to meet. Especially with the cards they are getting this set (Oracle, Mirage Caller, Turtle taunt).

Warlock's also isn't bad. The Quest won't be hard to complete in a Discard Lock deck. It remains to be seen whether two free 3/2s each turn is too slow though.

I agree that the Hunter and Rogue ones are the worst revealed so far.
Click to expand...

7 deathrattles is a lot. How are you going to find the mana to play them through fighting off aggro? There's almost no room for spells or healing at all if you want that playable with 5 mana to spare by turn 8.
 
C

Crosseyes

Banned
Man one thing's for sure I'm gonna have a real hard time deciding what to spend my 3200 dust on from the sylvanas and rag rotation. Who knows if the meta will be cancer in a few months but this is looking like a real fun first few weeks with all the quest stuff.
 
M

Mobius and pet octopus

Member
I am trying to play a damn card last second and it shuffles... wtf blizz

And I lost because of it...

Lost to a 3-4 year old bug...

edit:
jesus christ... 4 cards left in deck. 2 of them win me the game. Of course over the next two turns I get the 2 cards that don't win the game.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Just got a chance to see all the new cards:

Volcanosaur: Solid card for Arena, probably too slow for Constructed though it is a beast. You need some good combinations of discovers for it to really make an impact but it's definitely possible. The base stat distribution at 5/6 is good though so that definitely helps it out but this is mostly an Arena card that Kripp will get super salty over.

Gluttonous Ooze: This card is at least a 4... can be stretched to a 5 in a Pirate Warrior meta. This card punishes Pirate Warrior super hard, there's no two ways around it. It also deleted Toxic Swamp Ooze from the game. I think in most of my control decks I will replace Ooze with this card because I get the slightly heavier body and the armor gain which is valuable.

Molten Blade: This card is good but not great. Mostly because Warrior already has access to some of the best weapons so they might as well just play that. This does allow you to get some edge case weapons like Truesilver GG, Gladiator's Longbow and some of the Shaman weapons like Doomhammer that can help you out. Can really only see play in Control Warrior, you can't have it sit too long in your hand as a Pirate Warrior.

Mana Bind: This is a cool card that looks better than it actually is. Yeah it's basically the same play around as Counter Spell, but even if you get a 2 mana spell from it that's still good because Mage has many ways to exploit 0 mana spells like with Antonidas or Mana Wyrm. Of course less potent now with Flamewaker gone but this is yet another secret that Mages can throw in their Secret Mage deck if they want.

Mirage Caller: This is actually a bad card if you aren't comboing it or putting it in that DR quest for Priest. Yeah it does count for your DR quest and yeah it can combo with Velen for some shenanigans... but tempo wise you are still playing a god damn Razorfen Raptor. Luckily you can just use it on a powerful DR and get some value out of it but this card is on the weak side of playability.

Vilespine Slayer: Finally Rogue gets a powerful Tempo removal and this one is kinda nuts. The combo is hard to get at 5 mana but the pay off is massive. You essentially getting a 5 mana assassinate effect for 2 mana if you pull off the combo. Good candidate for that bounce Rogue deck too though I think this card is good enough to be played in standard Rogue decks.

Lost in the Jungle: Solid 1 drop for Paladin. Alleycat is a good card and this is a good card too. Unfortunately this does not get the benefit from the Grimey Goon hand buff mechanic so this fits into its own category of weenie/buff Paladins that is maybe supported by Small Time Recruits and Steward of Darkshire. Definitely a card to look out for.

Corruption Mist: People say this is like Doomsayer but unlike Doomsayer you can play minions into it. Meaning that once the Warlock has casted this spell, you can just have your on field minions go face/trade and then you can play new minions after it. So in a lot of ways it's weaker than Doomsayer but it can still remove large threats or take the edge off from early aggression. Will be experimenting with it in a control Warlock deck as I always do.

Living Mana: I have no idea how this card works. So if you play this at 5 mana, you get 5 2/2s on the board but then next turn you only have 1 mana since your mana crystals are on the board? And then on turn 10 you get to have 7 2/2s on the board and 3 mana left over? Seems like something that can get punished pretty severely but it's an interesting effect. I won't speak too much on it because I don't know exactly how it works as I have not seen any videos on it.

Hunter Quest: This is an interesting one and one that makes their previous 5 drop a lot better. You clearly need a lot of 1 drop cards in your deck. You can probably play the Pirates package with all those 1 drop Pirates and Patches, the 1 drop beasts, Argent Squire, Abusive Sergeant. There are enough decent 1 drops to play... question is how will you refill your hand playing all these 1 drops by turn 5 if you don't have that 5 mana card to refill yourself with? Hunter still lacks card draw outside of that card so it makes it tricky to use this quest. Also turn 1 you are still not playing a 1 drop card because of the quest. Seems a bit awkward but the pay off is at least nice... 5 mana 8/8, stuffs your deck with 1 mana 3/2 draws to reflood the board with.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
gutshot said:
Mike Donais clarified that Glimmerroot always shows 3 class cards, unless your opponent has no class cards in their deck.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Competitiv...lers_journey_to_ungoro_revealed_card/dfcddpc/
Click to expand...
That makes it a lot harder to predict but still not that difficult.

They can't really give 3 correct answers. Like if you are going up against Paladin it's not going to show Consecrate, Truesilver and Tirion because all 3 of those will likely be in the deck. So it will be like Tirion, Divine Favor and Ragnaros Lightnlord. You would still maybe pick Tirion but if they had an aggressive start by turn 3 you can make the read that they are playing an aggressive deck without Tirion.
 
M

Mobius and pet octopus

Member
wiibomb said:
that is slighty more difficult.

I gotta say I love this card, but this is getting really close to the line where hearthstone starts getting cumbersome with text mechanics, the team gotta watch that
Click to expand...

Once you understand how a card works, the length of the text is not that important tbh. It's probably one of their wordier cards but we're like 3-4 years into the game's lifespan, it was bound to happen sooner or later.

I think if it was a more complex card that you had to constantly refer to to understand completely, then sure the text is a bigger issue.
 
W

wiibomb

Member
Mobius and pet octopus said:
Once you understand how a card works, the length of the text is not that important tbh. It's probably one of their wordier cards but we're like 3-4 years into the game's lifespan, it was bound to happen sooner or later.

I think if it was a more complex card that you had to constantly refer to to understand completely, then sure the text is a bigger issue.
Click to expand...

even if the effect is well known once a person understands it, the text is important for people other than the dedicated player, you and me will understand it, but a new person or a person who isn't well enough in the loop will get lost with all the text there..

the card is so close to being one joke card from the twist in the texts, it is not there yet, but that design is really reaching an stretch.

you can invent new mechanics, new single wordings, new type of cards, but stretching the text effect design leads to Yugioh type situations eventually
 
Z

ZealousD

Makes world leading predictions like "The sun will rise tomorrow"
The card is an epic. That means somebody is more likely to be able to understand it if they are playing it.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
That awkwardness when you play that card and you guess wrong.

LMAO!


And yes to more complexity in the card designs. This is definitely a skill tester card. Not a huge one but it's enough where someone who doesn't fully understand or the range of the decks/classes in the game can get punished for using it. HS being a digital card game means they can design complex card without actually having a huge wall of text. Kazakus is a very complex card but all the range of options in that card are not listed on the card.

Imagine if they listed everything Kazakus could do on the card... it would make YGO cards look brief and to the point in comparison.
 
W

wiibomb

Member
ZealousD said:
The card is an epic. That means somebody is more likely to be able to understand it if they are playing it.
Click to expand...

of course, but that's not my point, there are clearly people who understands yugioh, that doesn't mean it is well designed.

my point is the famous design space team 5 always talk about, this card is getting close to stretching that space in the card text effect.

also, being epic doesn't mean casuals can't play it.

Dahbomb said:
That awkwardness when you play that card and you guess wrong.

LMAO!
Click to expand...

I'll be laughing so hard when I totally fail the card.

BTW missing the effect on this card can be potentially crippling since the 3/3 stats are pretty below the curve on mana

Dahbomb said:
And yes to more complexity in the card designs. This is definitely a skill tester card. Not a huge one but it's enough where someone who doesn't fully understand or the range of the decks/classes in the game can get punished for using it. HS being a digital card game means they can design complex card without actually having a huge wall of text. Kazakus is a very complex card but all the range of options in that card are not listed on the card.

Imagine if they listed everything Kazakus could do on the card... it would make YGO cards look brief and to the point in comparison.
Click to expand...

exactly this.

Kazakus is a very complex card, that doesn't stretch the effect text design as much as this one. kazakus is really a simple effect, don't have duplicates? you can now make a spell, which options? doesn't matter, I understood the concept.

with this one there is a kind of awkward effect. "If it is in you opponents deck" is kind of awkwardly designed.



as I said, I love it, but imo, the card is almost stretching the text design
 
C

charlequin

Banned
The text is really not very complicated. It's less than twenty words. The mechanic might be unclear on first read but will become extremely clear once you play it even once or twice. It only actually matters if you're the one playing it, too, so if your opponent runs one it doesn't actually even matter if you understand the exact details of the text, just that they could get a free card off of it which would be one that's in your deck.
 
S

Szadek

Member
Dahbomb said:
That awkwardness when you play that card and you guess wrong.

LMAO!


And yes to more complexity in the card designs. This is definitely a skill tester card. Not a huge one but it's enough where someone who doesn't fully understand or the range of the decks/classes in the game can get punished for using it. HS being a digital card game means they can design complex card without actually having a huge wall of text. Kazakus is a very complex card but all the range of options in that card are not listed on the card.

Imagine if they listed everything Kazakus could do on the card... it would make YGO cards look brief and to the point in comparison.
Click to expand...
You mean like this:
300
Click to expand...
 
W

wiibomb

Member
I really want them to make a weird effect when we chose the wrong one or the correct one...


for the added awkwardness when we fail it.
 
M

Mobius and pet octopus

Member
wiibomb said:
even if the effect is well known once a person understands it, the text is important for people other than the dedicated player, you and me will understand it, but a new person or a person who isn't well enough in the loop will get lost with all the text there..

the card is so close to being one joke card from the twist in the texts, it is not there yet, but that design is really reaching an stretch.

you can invent new mechanics, new single wordings, new type of cards, but stretching the text effect design leads to Yugioh type situations eventually
Click to expand...

It's not even close to yugioh. And it's not even complicated like yugioh. The end user just plays the card and the game handles the rules. It's a very straight forward card tbh.
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Szadek said:
You mean like this:
Click to expand...
Yeah, to put everything Kazakus can do on a card would eclipse the text in even something like that. We are talking about

YGO isn't a digital card game so it has to put EVERYTHING in the card text to avoid rule confusion. If YGO was made into a digital card game with keywords and stuff it would've cut a lot of its text down. We are talking about 3 choice options leading into 29 spell options. That's a lot to print on one card. Not to mention that without Keywords you would also have to explain what Discover does.
 
P

Peléo

Member
wiibomb said:
even if the effect is well known once a person understands it, the text is important for people other than the dedicated player, you and me will understand it, but a new person or a person who isn't well enough in the loop will get lost with all the text .
Click to expand...

I don't think this is true. The main advantage of digital card games over physical card games is the transfer of game resolving responsibility from the player to a computer. Cards don't need to have extremely detailed and accurate depictions of their effects and interactions since the computer is the one who dictates their behaviour. They will do the same thing every time, regardless if a player is or isn't aware of the rules. Through experimentation and repetition a player will eventually be able to deduce their effect.

Obviously, Hearthstone designers should aim for clarity, simplicity and consistency in their game. But I think it's ok to have a few more complicated or convoluted cards as long as it leads to more interesting and complex game situations.
 
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