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Hearthstone |OT8| Elise's Extremely Irresponsible Field Trip To Un'Goro
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
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Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I think we're going to be like... what was bliz thinking giving shaman so many powerful elemental cards. Mage and priest barely got elemental synergy cards. Shaman got the 2 drop and kalimos... along with several old staple cards becoming elemental.
It's not hard to see why thijs thinks shaman will be top meta again.
It's not hard to see why thijs thinks shaman will be top meta again.
BananasWithGuns
Member
Not really convinced at this point that Shaman will be tier 1. Their early game looks like it's going to be so-so and their card draw will be borderline abysmal, both of which were problems back when Shaman was in the dumpster. I don't think it will be quite that bad but Shaman will definitely be worse off than they have been over the past year or so.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
FormallyFamicom
Member
There will be a lot of Un'goro decks I want to play but I got a feeling I'm only going to end up playing 1/3 to 1/4 of them because of the amount of legendaries and epics required to build stuff this time around.
Per usual, not gonna craft anything until the meta settles so I don't waste dust.
Per usual, not gonna craft anything until the meta settles so I don't waste dust.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Lifecoach apparently was referring solely to the Hunter quest when he was complaining about blizzard not learning from mistakes when previewing the cards?
https://clips.twitch.tv/CrunchyComfortableNuggetsSeemsGood
Really? It seems so terrible to me. I guess designwise it's potentially problematic because the draw rng is so important to the deck that if the deck is good, it'd be extremely unfun, but it just doesn't seem strong enough to be problematic.
https://clips.twitch.tv/CrunchyComfortableNuggetsSeemsGood
Really? It seems so terrible to me. I guess designwise it's potentially problematic because the draw rng is so important to the deck that if the deck is good, it'd be extremely unfun, but it just doesn't seem strong enough to be problematic.
The quest itself probably isn't that bad but if you just pump Hunters and the expansion with 1 drops then people are going to :
A) Make an Aggro Hunter deck which no one likes to play against and is always bad for the game.
B) Make a Quest Hunter deck which zergs you down with 1 drops, when that fails they top deck 1 drops until they meet the quest condition and then zerg you down again but now harder.
It's not fun to play against. It doesn't encourage interesting deck development or interesting playstyle. It further funnels Hunter into the "zerg down the opponent with minions" archetype that's the same shit we have been playing for years.
A) Make an Aggro Hunter deck which no one likes to play against and is always bad for the game.
B) Make a Quest Hunter deck which zergs you down with 1 drops, when that fails they top deck 1 drops until they meet the quest condition and then zerg you down again but now harder.
It's not fun to play against. It doesn't encourage interesting deck development or interesting playstyle. It further funnels Hunter into the "zerg down the opponent with minions" archetype that's the same shit we have been playing for years.
Keyser Soze
Member
It looks like I am going to top out at around 7000 Gold at Un'Goro launch. I missed probably about 5 quests since trying to save every day since Mean Streets of Gadgetzan (December 1). I spent a little bit on Classic sets during that time, which might have put a small dent in the gold.
I think if I saved a bit harder (and nabbed all of the 100g available daily for wins), I might have had 8000-8500, but I am happy with around 70 Free packs coming my way at launch.
I might preorder the packs, but I dont think I am buying any more this go around. That will be 120 total pack at launch - at least three legend cards with my shit pack opening luck (hopefully more).
I have enough dust to craft a handful of cards too, as I have not pressed the button in months either.
I am ready for Un'Goro!
I think if I saved a bit harder (and nabbed all of the 100g available daily for wins), I might have had 8000-8500, but I am happy with around 70 Free packs coming my way at launch.
I might preorder the packs, but I dont think I am buying any more this go around. That will be 120 total pack at launch - at least three legend cards with my shit pack opening luck (hopefully more).
I have enough dust to craft a handful of cards too, as I have not pressed the button in months either.
I am ready for Un'Goro!
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Some reviewers are assuming pirate warrior reigns king and requires all other decks to be able to consistently beat it to be considered for top tier. Seems a little cynical though. But elemental shaman can beat pirate warrior and still be good against the field. However, I think shaman may not be THAT hard to beat because their early game isn't huge like it used to be. They have a lot of high value stuff though, and plenty of healing to back it up.
So I think elemental shaman is the deck to beat, while not being bad versus pirate warrior. If taunt warrior is good against elemental shaman, which doesn't seem likely but... who knows at this point. Taunt warrior is prob tier 1 since it can beat pirate warrior.
So top 2 classes in the meta being warrior and shaman makes a lot of sense. But I think there are a lot of interesting things that can upset that. So I remain optimistic.
edit:
I guess hunter quest could get out of hand though.
So I think elemental shaman is the deck to beat, while not being bad versus pirate warrior. If taunt warrior is good against elemental shaman, which doesn't seem likely but... who knows at this point. Taunt warrior is prob tier 1 since it can beat pirate warrior.
So top 2 classes in the meta being warrior and shaman makes a lot of sense. But I think there are a lot of interesting things that can upset that. So I remain optimistic.
edit:
I guess hunter quest could get out of hand though.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
I guess you can play the 8/8 on turn 5 every time you go second or draw firefly going first, if you go for 100% 1 drops. But you're skipping turn 1 and having a weak turn 4 in that scenario, and sometimes having a super weak turn 5 when going first.
It all depends on how strong the deck is after it plays the quest with very few cards left in hand. You could slow it down from 100% 1 drops and plan on playing it turn 7ish, which might be better, but you're still going to be topdecking after you play the quest.
It all depends on how strong the deck is after it plays the quest with very few cards left in hand. You could slow it down from 100% 1 drops and plan on playing it turn 7ish, which might be better, but you're still going to be topdecking after you play the quest.
The Hearthstone GAF Un'Goro card ratings form is ready! Just like last time, I want to keep it limited to active GAF users, so I will be hiding the link to the form. (Note: you will have to sign in with your Google account; this is done to ensure everyone is only able to vote once.)
Quote to reveal:
Thanks to ZealousD for his refining of the 5 star rating system. I just went through and rated all the cards and felt like I was able to give most a pretty fair rating. Surprisingly very few 1s and 5s this expansion, it feels like. Just a lot of really solid cards that should work well in their respective decks but not be too OP.
I'm excited to see what the rest of GAF thinks. Once we get a few responses in, I'll post the spreadsheet again. So go and rate Un'Goro!
Quote to reveal:
Thanks to ZealousD for his refining of the 5 star rating system. I just went through and rated all the cards and felt like I was able to give most a pretty fair rating. Surprisingly very few 1s and 5s this expansion, it feels like. Just a lot of really solid cards that should work well in their respective decks but not be too OP.
I'm excited to see what the rest of GAF thinks. Once we get a few responses in, I'll post the spreadsheet again. So go and rate Un'Goro!
Sulfaras is awful vs aggro. Give up health gain so you can do 8 damage to random low cost cards? Fucking awful. Not to mention that stuffing your deck full of taunts has never been viable. Just completely abandon tempo in a tempo dominated game? And what's it gonna do vs Jades? Deal 8 to a 10/10?
The only good warrior deck post rotation is pirate and it's easily teched against. RIP warrior on ladder.
Dahbomb and I will be starting our stream shortly.
https://www.twitch.tv/zealousdemon
Edit: Sorry guys, my internet keeps dying while I try to stream. Give me a sec to try and resolve.
https://www.twitch.tv/zealousdemon
Edit: Sorry guys, my internet keeps dying while I try to stream. Give me a sec to try and resolve.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Control warrior is just naturally good against aggro decks like pirate warrior. Taunts is just icing on the cake. You don't care about quests vs aggro typically, I think you probably mull the quest away and hope to not draw it.
Against jades I think you have it very wrong. Ragnaros vs jade is strong for closing out the game. And you have plenty of removal options and the ultimate board reset of king mosh to last long enough to win off rag face hits alone. Before then you can actually pressure jade druid at least, maybe not jade shaman, with large health minions for which they have no answers because they don't have hard removal anymore, and naturalize doesn't count.
I feel Mage is going to be Tier 2, but that mostly right.Thijs's prediction about classes power level in Ungoro meta (standard)
Sounds about right tbh, what priest win condition in standard?
Drakonid OP and dragon curve is much better win condition than the quest or even N'zoth
Did it!
Didn't give a 1 to a card because I don't think there here that is a total garbage fire and I thought sometimes "eh, it might be at least be good in Arena" or situational. Didn't give much fives either which will probably be a mistake in hindsight.
Edit.: In other news, I cobbled together this Paladin Dragon-Murloc a while back. Will use it in the last week as a farewell to Brann, Dragons and Anyfin (and probably Curator at least until they introduce new dragons). 4 games, 4 wins, 100% winrate at Rank 22-20! Beat a Patches-less Pirate Warrior with it. Only problem is the dragon activation.
Would like to keep the Water Package in Paladin once the Year of the Mammoth hits. Tirion + Rag are probably two of my favorite late-game cards after Grom and Jaraxxus. Hopefully I can come up with something that I'll like.
BananasWithGuns
Member
Thanks for putting the work gutshot, will be filling it out later tonight.
Do you guys want to make any predictions of which cards are going to be OP and get nerfed? Every full Expansion since GvG has had some nerfs, and I don't expect this one to be an exception.
What poll? I looked back a few pages and didn't notice one.
What poll? I looked back a few pages and didn't notice one.
Gutshot hid it in the post, you have to quote it.
I think the stuff that might get nerfed is the quest if some of them end up being too good. The Druid quest comes to my mind... like you can just throw it in Jade Druid right now and then just go ham later on. It might even enable some cheesy combo like Juggler -> Panda -> Panda. It should've been "Played" instead of "Summon" so that it's not something you can use in Jade too.
Nothing really strikes to me as supremely over powered in this expansion but there are still some cards in MSG/OG/Karazhan that are still too powerful:
Maelstrom Portal, Thing from Below and of course Patches.
Arcanologist is sort of a stupid card too to be honest. Like I didn't rate it as a 5 but it's a really silly card to print in general. If a deck relying on Secrets becomes tier 1 then Arcanologist would be a prime target to be nerfed.
What is striking about this expansion is the amount of 1 drops that Hunter has access too. Singularly none of the 1 drops are too powerful (except Jeweled Macaw, that's a bit silly) but combined they can be problematic.
SonicXtreme
Member
lifecoach is coked up af all the time right?
I don't remember how Zealous defined it but 5 for me is "meta warping" and probably too good to exist. It's the Dr Balanced, Shredder, Patches, pre nerf STB, Mysterious Challenger, Mad Scientist, Sylvanas, War Axe, Swipe, Fireball etc.
I don't use archetype defining because plenty of cards are obviously archetype defining like the quests. The quests are all very integral parts of archetype decks that you can't play without. So the quests being good depend entirely upon those decks being good or not... not that the card is auto include in those decks.
I don't use archetype defining because plenty of cards are obviously archetype defining like the quests. The quests are all very integral parts of archetype decks that you can't play without. So the quests being good depend entirely upon those decks being good or not... not that the card is auto include in those decks.
Yeah I think mine will have a ton of misses too.
The elementals I'm buying high on, there's no quest that they need to work so if Aggro is dominant they can put in the usual 1 drop suspects to survive and already have Tar creeper into the 3/5 divine shield to stop them then after that both Priest and Shaman have heals to utilize.
Quests... I don't know. I really hope they're good but it's gonna come down to if you can spend turn 1 and a card doing nothing. There are quests that I could see both being the 5-star 'must have to play this class' down to 1-star 'playing this turn one means you die turn 5'
5 Stars - Insane. These cards are the most powerful cards in the set. The meta can shift by their very presence. They are the superstar cards of the best of the best decks. They may be able to singlehandedly move the power of a deck a couple tiers higher in the meta reports than they would otherwise. When people think of the defining cards of the set, they think of these cards. When people call for nerfs, they think of these cards.
Here were the cards we rated 5 stars from MSG in our re-review.
Patches
Pre-nerf STB
Drakonid Operative
Kazakus
Aya Blackpaw
Abyssal Enforcer
I would say I still agree with most of them being 5 stars. Abyssal Enforcer might be borderline.
Here were the cards we rated 5 stars from MSG in our re-review.
Patches
Pre-nerf STB
Drakonid Operative
Kazakus
Aya Blackpaw
Abyssal Enforcer
I would say I still agree with most of them being 5 stars. Abyssal Enforcer might be borderline.
Not true other priest n mage deck is weak af
At least if you play elemental in priest and mage you can curvestone and win
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
I'm sure people will eventually find some sort of deck that completes quests relatively quickly and is fairly solid on its own. That's the scariest thing about quests, and is hard to test for.
Maybe someone will find an insane OP use for Hemet or Shadow Visions, if not now then maybe 3 expansions from now. They're at least the type of thing that ends up being nerfed in MtG.
Maybe Crackling Razormaw for a card that seems conditionally super overstated on a condition that seems far too easy to meet. That's the one I'd put my money on being nerfed, or at least popularly called to be nerfed. Strong first two turns that only take two cards worth of resources are always going to be good, unless the new tauntstone somehow solves the curvestone problem.
Portugeezer
Member
Holy shit, first 12 win arena and it was with my boi Rexxar!
Feelsgoodman, deck didn't seem good enough for 12 but I managed in the end. Piranha launcher is amazing in arena.
Feelsgoodman, deck didn't seem good enough for 12 but I managed in the end. Piranha launcher is amazing in arena.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I'd rate Hemet a 4 in PW and 2 everywhere else.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, I wouldn't say Hemet is worth just throwing in every deck, but I'll be suprised if there isn't an insane use for it somewhere sooner or later, particularly in a deck that only has something like 4 cards that cost more than 3 mana.
It'll be annoying if Pirates get any buffs from this expansion, like from Molten Blade, Golakka Crawler, or Hemet. I don't know if those make the cut, but Pirates certainly don't need any extra help.
It'll be annoying if Pirates get any buffs from this expansion, like from Molten Blade, Golakka Crawler, or Hemet. I don't know if those make the cut, but Pirates certainly don't need any extra help.
Yeah, I say Abyssal Enforcer is 4* in constructed, if only based off how often I see him compared to the others.
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
Bored waiting on new cards and after the month rolled over so I'm back to trying out c'thun decks.
Rolling C'thun druid and so far so good. Brann can make this deck OP, but I can curve win without him.
Only problem is if I have a shitty starting hand against aggro I sometimes can't get to my taunts fast enough.
Rolling C'thun druid and so far so good. Brann can make this deck OP, but I can curve win without him.
Only problem is if I have a shitty starting hand against aggro I sometimes can't get to my taunts fast enough.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Not even sure on what I want to play before the expansion hits. Maybe something around brann. Most of the meta decks are boring af.
Lot's of janky stuff to play if you are just farting around. Over 30% of my matches against Priests and Druid today. All of them running different tech cards or versions. Kind of bizarre, but that is the first of the month for you. 5-1 vs. Priest so I can't complain. Helped me winstreak into rank 15 so I can experiment without too much worry until I hit shamanstone/Piratestone/Jadestone.
I don't know about a 5 but Devilsaur is essentially a 3 mana Nerubian Egg which is a good card in Wild. Great target for buffs and board wide effects that Druid/Paladin have and of course Zoo decks can now play that Egg into that Raptor for a double Adapt.
Nothing surprising about Jeweled Macaw getting 5s. In most cases it's a better Webspinner. Far superior on a top deck or played later on when you have more mana to play. It's fasted and sometimes you may get a follow up 2 drop from it to fill your curve.
And everyone played Webspinner in their Hunter decks, still do in Wild.
Fire Plume Heart as a quest reward is pretty good and has synergy with the quest requirement and class it is in. If you are playing a Control Taunt Warrior then you have extremely good match ups against aggro decks which the quest reward actually sucks at. But Taunt Anti Aggro Warrior is bad against Midrange/Control decks but the quest reward helps against that a lot.
With this quest CW will now not lose against Control Warlock decks. That's why people are big on that quest.
SonicXtreme
Member
looks like will play hunter quest in standard, in wild murloc shaman, taunt warrior, reno or maybe not reno quest priest. is that 0/3 egg good enough for egg druid? i don't think so. how about that 4 mana card? i also don't think so. elemental deck may be good but very expensive, only people who pump tons of dust into the expansion will have success with it whereas the hunter quest only requires the quest and a handful of expansion cards. taunt warrior will mostly be old cards, not even sure if it's good enough. perhaps with elise as an extra ace in the hole. priest might require elise as well for end game besides zoth. perhaps that tar creeper 1/5 will be ok for my inner fire wild deck, since that deck is basically made to target the small minion aggro stuff anyway.
all in all most win conditions for standard are very wonky. i don't think they will be consistent enough for the most part when ones like hunter are so easy to achieve. for instance the priest quest in standard is garbo. in wild it's solid tho
all in all most win conditions for standard are very wonky. i don't think they will be consistent enough for the most part when ones like hunter are so easy to achieve. for instance the priest quest in standard is garbo. in wild it's solid tho
I've never been so doubtful about judging a card a 1* or 5*
I ended up just rating very few cards at 1* and very few at 5*
It is so difficult to know how the meta will evolve with so many ideas thrown at this expansion
Ok I subbed to your twitch channel and your card review is still not up yet. Did I sub to the wrong channel?
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I räted ozruk as 1, that card sucks.
Unless the issues got fixed?
Portugeezer
Member
Is it possible to get Druid quest legendary as a random beast from infest/stampede/jeweled thingy?
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