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[Karu]

First off, to close that particular chapter (early voting habits) as nobody understands what I'm saying and that topic was specifically for the first days, which we are past now. Still want to address people's concerns.

OK so now your argument is back on this whole voting constantly messes up the voting trail, which is only really relevant if someone just votes all the time without any reason.

Any person who goes through voting patterns should check up on the vote post and see if a reason comes with it. It would be easy to track and say on someones flip you can maybe try and form a narrative that supports the truth of the flip.

When you track votes, you shouldn't just look at the vote list, it should have some analysis of the vote posts and reasons given or not given for said votes.

For this reason, I don't think switching votes often will really affect any true vote tracking analysis.

Okay. Other than Capot's start in the game there isn't much irregular, curious stuff happening in regards to voting patterns, so I'll admit that I probably jumped the gun there. My sentiment stands that flipping your vote without much reason can be distracting, but doesn't seem to be much of a problem.


My initial scum read was cornering Cabot, Burb and Kawl. Of those three I think Burb went to the top of my list. His last four posts contain very little.

If you make a post about "there is someone I'm watching, he is most likely scum", and then post a list of your top 4 scum candidates, I think it's logican to assume that the one you think is most likely scum, and the top of your scumreads, is the same person, but if you think that's suspicious, eh, I heavily disagree.

And yes, obviously we need to trust people, but not from the start. My stance on not to trust anyone 100% is because Scums tend to use a tactic, where they try to get to the good books of people they know are town, so that said town might end up trusting them. In a game where we get absolutely zero information from PR's, there is a need to stay vigilant.

Anyway, will re-read the past few pages, and post more.

No reads. Comments on behaviour in general. Wants to post more.

Follows up with...

sorry, I have been feeling a bit burned out for a moment, so I haven’t been really posting since the game start, going to change that now, though.

Originally Posted by squidyj

I'm going to read you as scum whether you're scum or not, you were saved in Archer by Ouro but I would have read you as scum there. It's happened in other places whethere I was following along or playing. so. It's a big headache that's going to throw off my other reads based on interaction with you so I just wanted to push to get you gone early on and then you reacted in a sort of scummy way to the things I and other people are doing which strengthened my resolve to carry forward on my plan.

Sorry, this is just… not good reasoning at all. You want to lynch Cabot because… you will always want to lynch Cabot? That’s just bad and unfair play, even if Cabot is scum (he is not my top town at the moment, at least).

Originally Posted by Royal_Flush

How am I supposed to elaborate on "Has only fluff posts"? Can you point me to any useful Ouro post so far? The only one is where he announces his future yet to be seen if really useful post.

This is… interesting reaction from Royal_Flush when he received a vote from CrimsonFist. Instead of responding to a (imo very valid) point, he instead tries to instantly shift attention from himself to Ourobolus, which is very odd behavior, to the say the least. Why the evasiveness, Royal?

I agree with Droplet, that Crimson has just been… kinda there, flying under the radar. He makes some posts, they seem somewhat agreeable, and then just… fades away a little. Feels bit like how he was posting in the last game he was in, when he was a scum.

Says he's burned out. Fair enough. Comment on squidyj's - admittedly silly post - but well, 'duh. Throws suspicion at Royal, fair enough, but it's very light with no follow up as far as I can tell. Ouro has posted in the meantime, rather eloquently.


Then squidyj votes for Burb, which Burb then responds to...

Okay, hit me. I'm trying my best to understand why you are suspicious of me, but you are either giving overly vague reasons, or reasons that I don't really understand (me saying that we can't trust anyone 100%, or that I thought you meant me as the "most likely scum", because you had then put me as your scum number one.)

Tell me.

squidyj has no substantial follow-up. Burb writes...

That is just my way of play. I read through the posts chronologically, and make comments to the posts that I see. Sometimes it means they are devoid of information from the later posts, but I have done this in literally every game I have played in gaf.

... and disappears.

So all in all - not much at all. Now... at this point in time you could also say that pretty much about me, but well... I have to start somewhere ;-)

UNVOTE: Kawl_USC
VOTE: Burbeting

 

[Karu]

I see just now... there was a tie between 5 different people and my Vote on Burb put him in front. I will be here to change my Vote at any time til the deadline. I'm always a little bit wary of suspicions based on little activity/avoidance (opposed to more meaty "evidence" in form of slip-ups/contradictions/voting pattern etc.) and I'm not sure I wanna lead a lynch based on that alone.

Know that right now you're probably my top lynch candidate.

What do you think of redhood?

The whole "he said he was town repeatedly I kind of silly to say the least in my eyes. So what?

But...

I think the mafia are all high activity posters because they see the talk of targeting low activity posters and they get scared so they contribute more. While I think that is good because it could be used as reads later in the game if we don't get them right away, low activity posters aren't good for the town either.

That's quite the claim - somebody already mentioned this, but I wanna consider his entire post history in this game - and is a great way to basically rid an entire group of players (low-post players) of possible guilt. Wat? On the other hand it's almost to obvious, blatant.

While I completely understand your suspicion of me, i knew immediately after I posted the are you in was a dumb move that looked bad. And the people saying that I was loyal to squidy since he called me town also looks bad on me, but i am not loyal to anyone right now. And about the traube post, it was just a silly joke. But I am a townie.

&&

Even though he is right with me being town, I find it a little suspicious. I totally fucked my start up, and it makes sense to find me suspicious. The mafia want to keep me alive because I'm an attention magnet( and I haven't even done any bold predictions yet!)

Admitting fault in own game, but the second claim that the mafia wants to keep him alive is also a very strange thing to throw out there - this was also already called out.

He's asked who he would vote for if the lynch is in 2 hours, answers with..

That's an interesting question! Hm I don't know I don't have any strong suspicions of anyone but maybe you atm, voting for someone just cuz they didn't get any votes yet is strange.

Nothing to go on.

Then 5-6 posts follow that are mostly one-liners that deal with himself and the I'm town joke. If anything he works very hard to get the attention he claims to get anyway. That's quite a lot of fluff, but made... without effort? All in all I could go either way with him - a scum-read seems logical at this point, but first and foremost, whether he is scum or town, it's very much his own fault.

 

[cabot]

With the game underway I am reminded of the wise words of Dwight Shrute
" it's not the person you most expect, or least expect. It's the one you middle expect"
Which I think is true especially for this first vote since this vote can turn into a dogpile situation. And I expect the hurts(mafia) to be fairly active since we are mostly veterans here they know that being inactive makes them super suspicious.

The hurts? never heard that word use before

I just want to state for the record that I did not shout "hello burbeting" and I don't know who did.
That said. lets murder the fuck out of Cabot, that fucker has it coming.

Vote: Cabot

This is right after game start, squidy's first post, I've yet to say anything at this point.

Eh. With only scum having access to extra information this should make them stick out more. In games with PR townies with PRs can stick out because they're trying to hide stuff and stay alive.

I just really wanted to do it.

If I were to rationalize it; in a "normal" game with power roles you get extra info from them and how people respond to them. I wanted to accelerate the conversation.

Scum know who town are, though what does that really do? you can have a player like roy, who in NX essentially played as he would as Town, going after anyone who was suspicious, scum or no-scum. This is a game of vets, it's a likely strategy that will be employed again, for this reason I don't expect a scum to just slip up because they know who is town and who isn't.

.........................................
what
the
fuck?

corn burrito is now my top town.

this is the end of the update.

These two posts came after each other, the first is quoting CB, still trying to figure out what exactly Darryl is doing here.

Oh sorry, I meant squidy.


Listen, at the start of the game people went onto me as defensive, starting with Burb. I re-read the posts, I don't actually come off defensive at all, I ask Darryl for a reason for his vote which is completely adequate considering he clarifies himself as being serious in wanting my lynch, and thats pretty much the only 'defensive' response I give before Burb brings it up as a point. Other than that, there's a bit of vote throwing, which again I cover at some point.

Then after a lot of Darryl posting being Darryl, I just end up with the non-reason of a blind spot. Good, okay. I've been scum 1/6 times, so his read is clearly wrong.

CB at the start was saying a whole lot of nothing while claiming others to be boring. He spends a deal talking about they're being PRs in a game, and follows up on his misunderstanding of it. Then he slates Splinter for not being exciting. Can't say watching someone not understand what this game is, is the definition of exciting blood boiling reading material.


Flush engages with him on the game talk, which seems mildly useless. Ty votes for himself and declares it an incredible way to bring discussion forward, where in reality it makes me make a screwed up face when looking at the monitor, and then squidy asks for 4 lynches, and the slow burn discussion begins on giving out information.

I don't know why we would withhold information, should we really be judging night kills as a real measurement of killing at this early stage in the game? scum could go for the most active townie in an attempt to put weight on his reads which may be completely incorrect, or they could go for the quietest player just to allow some more WIFOM NK dicussion.

The meat and bones of judgement is coming from posts in the game, vote patterns and reads.

I now consider those people who are weary of read lists because it could affect a NK choice to be suspicious, I don't see why NKs should matter to us, there should be one a night, thats it. NK is WIFOM territory. Get a grip. It may or may not be more important as we get smaller as a unit, but on D1/N1 it will be a crap shoot.

 

[cabot]

Why post all that though, right? because Darryl said it's irrelevant unless you read it all up until the end.

 

[*Splinter]

That was a bit weird m8

 

[cabot]

Well I'm not happy, cant be fucked m8 please kill me so you can all recalibrate your reads and look more suspiciously at Darryl.

 

[*Splinter]

I'm confused Cab. You pointed out a few really old posts as if you were building to something, then suddenly went into a largely-unprompted self defence. Finally you had a few "reads" that weren't actually reads but criticisms of sloppy play and finally went back to the information-share discussion (and even misrepresented it, I felt).

Basically every part of that is worrying. Quoting old posts looks like effort went in, but then you had no(?) reason to quote them. Unprompted self-defense is obviously troubling. Fake reads are practically a #scumtell. And misrepresenting... You kind of got a Full House there

 

[cabot]

good, kill me and see your read is wrong.

I started re-reading the thread and gave up.

 

[*Splinter]

Well I'm not happy, cant be fucked m8 please kill me so you can all recalibrate your reads and look more suspiciously at Darryl.

(sorry)

 

[*Splinter]

...

If this is just burnout I can empathise, but right now you're doing a Darryl.

Don't be Darryl, Cabot

Real Darryl I mean

 

[cabot]

I don't know what to say, my feelings have been scattered through this game, I have someone coming through saying they'll think I'm scum forever and ever and a number of people reading me incorrectly. I just feel frustrated.

 

[cabot]

You can lynch me and see my flip and work from there, or if I continue on by this phase, I'll seek a replacement.

 

[Burbeting]

I'm sorry, I have just lost all of my enthusiasm for this game due to some things in this game, and outside it. Just not feeling this game at all, but trying to muster up something, anything at the moment.

 

[*Splinter]

I don't know what to say, my feelings have been scattered through this game, I have someone coming through saying they'll think I'm scum forever and ever and a number of people reading me incorrectly. I just feel frustrated.

No one is taking Squid's argument seriously. It's either town acting suspicious to start discussion or scum trying (successfully) to get under your skin.

As for the other people scum-reading you... I don't know how many there are but I know I'm one of them... It's just part of the game :/
I guess you don't usually get scum-read as much as most people. To be honest that's what makes me think you are scum here (and in WW previously). Town Cabot is usually so town it hurts, as soon as I have doubts to your alignment it seems a safe bet you're scum

 

[CornBurrito]

K.

VOTE: Cabot

squidy and a few others scum read you. I town read you, for the most part anyway. Why not seek a replacement now? Why pin it to whether or not you survive?

 

[*Splinter]

Burb too? :/

We'll be going the way of the werewoofs at this rate

 

[cabot]

There's less than ten hours left. Thought a replacement just before getting lynched seemed pointless.

I shouldn't have disclosed that part at all. Apologies

 

[Ty4on]

Burb too? :/

We'll be going the way of the werewoofs at this rate

Maybe they'll turbo their own...

I'm sorry, I have just lost all of my enthusiasm for this game due to some things in this game, and outside it. Just not feeling this game at all, but trying to muster up something, anything at the moment.

What things? Discussion stopping or not going anywhere?

 

[Mazre]

Five hours to go and we're sort of all over the place. Looks like redhood is the only one without a currently active vote.

 

[Ourobolus]

Five hours to go and we're sort of all over the place. Looks like redhood is the only one without a currently active vote.

fluxwavez (1)
mazre 55
fluxwavez 56 (154)
ty4on 314 (348)

cabot (1)
squidyj 60 (377)
cabot 89 (92)
cornburrito 465

ty4on (0)
ty4on 61 (115)

karu (2)
burbeting 64 (110)
ty4on 314 (314)
cabot 351
fluxwavez 392

mazre (1)
cabot 69 (89)
ty4on 314 (314)
royal_flush 400

kawl_usc (0)
karu 74 (451)
crimsonfist 312 (327)
*splinter 329 (443)

*splinter (2)
kawl_usc 88
cabot 92 (95)
cornburrito 254 (337)
ty4on 314 (314)
ourobolus 362

ourobolus (0)
cabot 95 (220)
ty4on 314 (314)

cornburrito (2)
burbeting 110
ty4on 115 (314)
crimsonfist 402

redhood56 (0)
cornburrito 135 (149)
fluxwavez 154 (349)

royal_flush (0)
cornburrito 149 (254)
redhood56 156 (401)
cabot 220 (242)
crimsonfist 276 (312)

squidyj (1)
cabot 242 (351)
*splinter 443

crimsonfist (1)
droplet 269

droplet (0)
crimsonfist 327 (402)

burbeting (3)
ty4on 348
squidyj 377
karu 451

 

[Ourobolus]

Oh, wait. I thought you mean "redhood was the only one that doesn't have any votes." Never mind.

 

[redhood56]

I've been busy with irl stud should be posting a lot in 1 1/2-2 hours!

 

[redhood56]

1-2/2 hours. I was only half laying next attention while typing that.

 

[redhood56]

1 1/2 - 2 hours. I'm so stupid.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Redhood, I want to lynch you.

 

[redhood56]

Redhood, I want to lynch you.

💔

 

[Ty4on]

Redhood, I want to lynch you.

I just feel he'll flip townie and we would have learned nothing. I'd there anyone you'd read differently if I flipped town?

I'm also curious what your opinion of Corn is. He just came and posted a pseudo OMGUS vote and still hasn't contributed much.

 

[CornBurrito]

He just came and posted a pseudo OMGUS vote and still hasn't contributed much.

Blame burb and cabot. Reading about demotivated people makes me significantly less motivated.

Also it is hard to vote for anyone. My main suspicions are on red or Royal. But their flip won't really help me figure out other players. But nobody really seems super linked.

 

[*Splinter]

I just feel he'll flip townie and we would have learned nothing. I'd there anyone you'd read differently if I flipped town?

I'm also curious what your opinion of Corn is. He just came and posted a pseudo OMGUS vote and still hasn't contributed much.

What do you think this means?

 

[*Splinter]

Actually maybe I misunderstood you.
So err, what did you mean?

 

[Ty4on]

What do you think this means?

What Corn's vote means? Well if he is scum he's being very lazy, but he might want to get a bored Cabot out before her turns into a threat.
As a townie I don't see what use his vote has if any. If be wants to vote out inactive/unmotivated players we have better choices than Cabot. Burn has given up, Mazre is acting like scum Mazre in NV and of course you.

 

[*Splinter]

Also Corn why do you still town read Cabot? Anything specific or just "the feels"?

 

[cabot]

It could be because I'm watching Kevin Bridges and I'm slowly losing the will to live

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I just feel he'll flip townie and we would have learned nothing. I'd there anyone you'd read differently if I flipped town?

I'm also curious what your opinion of Corn is. He just came and posted a pseudo OMGUS vote and still hasn't contributed much.

You do mean if you flipped town, right? If so, I'd probably read... well, I checked back on the thread, and I'm actually not sure. Trying to find something in your interaction with others, you've become one of the people who lean scum for me right now, actually.

Vote: Ty4on

I think if you flipped Town, my scum read of CrimsonFist would ease up a bit.

CornBurrito still seems the same as I'm familiar with. cabot's pulling a Darryl and it's the same response as Darryl garnered from townies, despite Darryl being a townie as well.

 

[*Splinter]

What Corn's vote means? Well if he is scum he's being very lazy, but he might want to get a bored Cabot out before her turns into a threat.
As a townie I don't see what use his vote has if any. If be wants to vote out inactive/unmotivated players we have better choices than Cabot. Burn has given up, Mazre is acting like scum Mazre in NV and of course you.

Yeah fuck this post and everything in it

VOTE: Ty4on

 

[CornBurrito]

What Corn's vote means? Well if he is scum he's being very lazy, but he might want to get a bored Cabot out before her turns into a threat.
As a townie I don't see what use his vote has if any. If be wants to vote out inactive/unmotivated players we have better choices than Cabot. Burn has given up, Mazre is acting like scum Mazre in NV and of course you.

Yeah I'm super scared of Cabot. You caught me.

 

[Ty4on]

You do mean if you flipped town, right? If so, I'd probably read... well, I checked back on the thread, and I'm actually not sure. Trying to find something in your interaction with others, you've become one of the people who lean scum for me right now, actually.

No, a hypothetical where red flips town. Despite being attacked so much the interactions with him were really light. Mostly just "yeah, that town claim was suspicious".

Vote: Ty4on

I think if you flipped Town, my scum read of CrimsonFist would ease up a bit.

CornBurrito still seems the same as I'm familiar with. cabot's pulling a Darryl and it's the same response as Darryl garnered from townies, despite Darryl being a townie as well.

I have pretty much never interacted with Crimson so I don't quite follow. Is it because we look like scum buddies?

I'd still keep an eye on him. My read on him is really soft and I've townread scum like that before.

 

[*Splinter]

What Corn's vote means? Well if he is scum he's being very lazy, but he might want to get a bored Cabot out before her turns into a threat.
As a townie I don't see what use his vote has if any. If be wants to vote out inactive/unmotivated players we have better choices than Cabot. Burn has given up, Mazre is acting like scum Mazre in NV and of course you.

You're claiming there are several players less motivated than the guy actively seeking lynch/replacement. Burb is unmotivated but battling through, what is this cheap shot supposed to achieve. I've also suggested similar, and when I read this shit my first response was to close the thread. I don't know why you mentioned Mazre, he's been travelling without thread access most of the day.

It's been kind of a slow D1, but you are actively shutting it down with a post like this and I don't like it

 

[Ty4on]

Yeah I'm super scared of Cabot. You caught me.

Nah, but if both are town he's a better target for scum than red.

 

[CornBurrito]

Nah, but if both are town he's a better target for scum than red.

How so?

 

[CrimsonFist]

Vote: Ty4on

I think if you flipped Town, my scum read of CrimsonFist would ease up a bit.

I'm curious about what link you're seeing between us too.

 

[Ty4on]

You're claiming there are several players less motivated than the guy actively seeking lynch/replacement. Burb is unmotivated but battling through, what is this cheap shot supposed to achieve. I've also suggested similar, and when I read this shit my first response was to close the thread. I don't know why you mentioned Mazre, he's been travelling without thread access most of the day.

It's been kind of a slow D1, but you are actively shutting it down with a post like this and I don't like it

What am I shutting down?

Cabot at the very least posted some thoughts, Burb just said he was bored while Mazre made a typical anti town post:

Five hours to go and we're sort of all over the place. Looks like redhood is the only one without a currently active vote.

 

[Ty4on]

How so?

Red will probably be an easy scapegoat D2 while Cabot (especially if he gets more motivated) could get discussion going. He'd also be a much more curious night target than Red.

 

[*Splinter]

You're claiming there are several players less motivated than the guy actively seeking lynch/replacement. Burb is unmotivated but battling through, what is this cheap shot supposed to achieve? I've also suggested similar, and when I read this shit my first response was to close the thread. I don't know why you mentioned Mazre, he's been travelling without thread access most of the day.

It's been kind of a slow D1, but you are actively shutting it down with a post like this and I don't like it

The bolded, Ty. You are trying to shut down anyone that's shown weakness.

 

[Burbeting]

What things? Discussion stopping or not going anywhere?

It's not really my job to point at the things causing it, would be rude.

---

I feel that the votes on Ty4on right now are bit too bandwagony in many respects. Not sure what *Splinter is going for in his vote right, for instance.

 

[Ty4on]

The bolded, Ty. You are trying to shut down anyone that's shown weakness.

That's true. I touched on it in my first post:

The first thing I want to say is that I don't think we should ignore the prospect of a policy lynch for this game. Without any investigation roles, it Traitors can easily lie low and avoid any particular scrutiny, while others can easily distract us with nonsense and anti-Crew behavior.

When all we have are reads amd instinct, I will treat any kind of behavior like that as a scum-tell. It's a bit distracting in games like power roles, but the effect that stuff has against Town would be amplified in a game where we're all navigating in the dark.

I wanted to go out guns blazing and attacking the first post, but I agree.

I've been far too scared of hitting a townie in other games, but in this one especially it's inevitable.

What weakness are you thinking of though?

 

[Ty4on]

It's not really my job to point at the things causing it, would be rude.

---

I feel that the votes on Ty4on right now are bit too bandwagony in many respects. Not sure what *Splinter is going for in his vote right, for instance.

Note that before Flux' I had gotten zero votes from people not named Ty4on. Not sure what it means.

 

[CornBurrito]

Red will probably be an easy scapegoat D2 while Cabot (especially if he gets more motivated) could get discussion going. He'd also be a much more curious night target than Red.

That's a big if.

 

[Ty4on]

That's a big if.

There are multiple ifs there...

You've really not pressed a lot of people so far. Most of the posts I remember are similar to this one. A short, hostile response. A far cry from your long posts in DR.

 

[Ourobolus]

What am I shutting down?

Cabot at the very least posted some thoughts, Burb just said he was bored while Mazre made a typical anti town post:

While I don't really understand the people jumping on Ty4on for his earlier post, this one is sticking out to me - Mazre was calling out the fact that the day is ending and we don't have a clear path and that one player hasn't cast a vote. Hardly anti-town.