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Heroes of the Storm |OT| Pretty sure that Abathur is AFK
- Thread starter Nirolak
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I've played a little bit of Smite. The Arena mode is so fun in that game.... My experience with it is why I'm excited for arena mode to come to HotS.
Loving the Dunk/Blizzard/Flamestrike setup from C9 here.
edit: Super smart "who's fucking up the metagame" math analysis- https://www.reddit.com/r/heroesofthestorm/comments/408k90/in_response_to_chu8_and_our_concerns_a_different/
edit: Super smart "who's fucking up the metagame" math analysis- https://www.reddit.com/r/heroesofthestorm/comments/408k90/in_response_to_chu8_and_our_concerns_a_different/
So someone did the maths and proved Chu8 completely correct!
It is interesting though given Dustin Browders tweet about Kael'thas's win rate being okay. It doesn't *feel* that way right now in games and this number crunching seems to back that up. I know we've talked about it before but I hope win rate isn't the sole measure they are using for hero balance.
(Partly I'm not worried though because, to be frank, they don't tell the truth when talking about upcoming changes. theyve made massive changes to heroes previously after not talking about them at all, or even saying they weren't looking at them)
lol at the people praising that reddit poster who arbitrarily "did the maths" to arrive at a bastardized version of the HotS Logs rankings. I doubt that many people understood his "methodology" or results but because it reaffirms their current FOTM belief the circlejerk continues.
I'd rather sort HotS Logs by Popularity and Win Percent and get the most accurate picture we have available to us.
The only change to Tyrande was to Shadowstalk 3 months ago, aside from the scaling changes. All of a sudden her cc, utility, trait, and everything under Elune but her tits - thankfully they resolved that game-breaking issue - are killing HotS.
It's almost as if the scaling changes buffed other heroes - say, the early-mid game for most warriors - to the point where players can draft more complimentary combinations.
Chain CCs will always be unpleasant no matter who's deleting you.
I'd rather sort HotS Logs by Popularity and Win Percent and get the most accurate picture we have available to us.
The only change to Tyrande was to Shadowstalk 3 months ago, aside from the scaling changes. All of a sudden her cc, utility, trait, and everything under Elune but her tits - thankfully they resolved that game-breaking issue - are killing HotS.
It's almost as if the scaling changes buffed other heroes - say, the early-mid game for most warriors - to the point where players can draft more complimentary combinations.
Chain CCs will always be unpleasant no matter who's deleting you.
Um, so apart from the heroic change (huge) and the scaling changes (even huger) everything else is the same? Are we in an Apple advert here?
"The only thing that's changed is everything"?
The scaling changes benefited her more than almost any other hero (except maybe Thrall), because of how they changed them. Tyrande used to have the lowest starting damage of any support, but the fastest scaling - so she started very weak, but at level 20 had the highest auto attack damage of any support and close / equal to assassin levels. Now, she *starts* with that - that's a huge and fundamental change to how the character worked. Instead of starting very weak and scaling strong to the late game, she's now strong all the way through.
That, combined with the fact that the time to kill heroes has been vastly diminished (hero damage went up much more than hero health) which makes stuns king, means that a character with a superb long range stun and high damage is going to be dominant. Same reason as Kael'thas. The fact that character can also be your teams support and provide map wide vision just adds to the problem...
(If Tyrande didn't have her ult heal she would still be being picked extremely frequently right now - she's very good even without it).
"The only thing that's changed is everything"?
The scaling changes benefited her more than almost any other hero (except maybe Thrall), because of how they changed them. Tyrande used to have the lowest starting damage of any support, but the fastest scaling - so she started very weak, but at level 20 had the highest auto attack damage of any support and close / equal to assassin levels. Now, she *starts* with that - that's a huge and fundamental change to how the character worked. Instead of starting very weak and scaling strong to the late game, she's now strong all the way through.
That, combined with the fact that the time to kill heroes has been vastly diminished (hero damage went up much more than hero health) which makes stuns king, means that a character with a superb long range stun and high damage is going to be dominant. Same reason as Kael'thas. The fact that character can also be your teams support and provide map wide vision just adds to the problem...
(If Tyrande didn't have her ult heal she would still be being picked extremely frequently right now - she's very good even without it).
...
The scaling changes affected every hero such that the base levels are higher so that the power gained from each level can be distributed evenly to arrive at roughly similar, late game values.
Therefore, the point is that the only change made specifically to Tyrande was for Shadowstalk to heal, which the community was clamoring for her to be a viable solo healer, yet the vocal members of the community are all over the place decrying her CC, utility, trait, healing and damage (lol) as being the culprits of her OP nature.
No, she didn't. Kharazim and Li Li had the lowest starting AA damage of any support.
No, she didn't. Rehgar had equivalent scaling, with BW and Morales a very close third and fourth.
No, she didn't. Rehgar had the highest AA damage at level 20.
You can't blindly compare her AA damage to "any support and assassin" because it doesn't factor in attack speed or whether they're an AA hero to begin with...
I don't feel like taking the time to (dis)prove whether hero damage went up "much more" than health but, again, Blizzard's assertion was that the scaling changes affected every hero such that the base levels are higher so that the power gained from each level can be distributed evenly to arrive at roughly similar, late game values.
Well, at least we can agree on two things. Stuns are king. And even though Tyrande couldn't solo heal, she was still a top pick in tournaments because of her CC, trait and ability to grant vision.
I don't think you understand the scaling changes.
Tyrande started off with a very weak AA. Whilst I may have been wrong and it's not the lowest, it was certainly one of the lowest. She had a faster rate of gain than other AA heroes to make up for it, so that as the game went on her damage went up relative to other supports.
The scaling changes have removed that. It has made some characters noticeably better than before because now they are strong from level one - Thrall and Tyrande are the case in point. It absolutely did *not* impact on every character equally - heck, there was even a giant spreadsheet drawn up showing the differences. Unsurprisingly Thrall and Tyrande were two of the heroes who gained the most from the changes. Whilst the scaling change simpacted everyone, they impacted everyone in different ways depending upon their stat growth in the old version of the game.
And she is OP because it is her package of abilities that has combined with the new meta to become the new meta, and the utterly stupid healing power added to Shadowstalk. Without Shadowstalk she would still be ace, but with it she is ridiculous - it was a totally unnecessary change. Heck, even before the scaling changes she was getting banned very highly in pro tournaments.
I honestly don't know what you are trying to argue here. The view that Tyrande is unbalanced and needs nerfing right now is hardly controversial. Her win rate is superior to other heroes, she is the most banned character in tournaments, and I have yet to encounter a pro or streamer who doesn't think she is unbalanced. The last time I remember there being an outcry over a character THIS heavily was the launch version of Kael'thas with the hilarious exploding chain bombs, wipe a team ability. Are you even playing hero league at the moment and not experiencing this, because if so I want to be in your games right now!
Tyrande started off with a very weak AA. Whilst I may have been wrong and it's not the lowest, it was certainly one of the lowest. She had a faster rate of gain than other AA heroes to make up for it, so that as the game went on her damage went up relative to other supports.
The scaling changes have removed that. It has made some characters noticeably better than before because now they are strong from level one - Thrall and Tyrande are the case in point. It absolutely did *not* impact on every character equally - heck, there was even a giant spreadsheet drawn up showing the differences. Unsurprisingly Thrall and Tyrande were two of the heroes who gained the most from the changes. Whilst the scaling change simpacted everyone, they impacted everyone in different ways depending upon their stat growth in the old version of the game.
And she is OP because it is her package of abilities that has combined with the new meta to become the new meta, and the utterly stupid healing power added to Shadowstalk. Without Shadowstalk she would still be ace, but with it she is ridiculous - it was a totally unnecessary change. Heck, even before the scaling changes she was getting banned very highly in pro tournaments.
I honestly don't know what you are trying to argue here. The view that Tyrande is unbalanced and needs nerfing right now is hardly controversial. Her win rate is superior to other heroes, she is the most banned character in tournaments, and I have yet to encounter a pro or streamer who doesn't think she is unbalanced. The last time I remember there being an outcry over a character THIS heavily was the launch version of Kael'thas with the hilarious exploding chain bombs, wipe a team ability. Are you even playing hero league at the moment and not experiencing this, because if so I want to be in your games right now!
RumblingRosco
Member
Well, I play VS AI a little to wrap up quests quickly so I can go enjoy ARAM more.
Fuck KT in ARAM btw. I see now why he is OP in that mode. Can't imagine him in ARAM with his pre-nerf chain bomb shit.
jaundicejuice
Member
Map voting is a terrible idea because then the community will boil the rotation down to just a few maps. I'd rather play a map I dislike every now and then versus the community playing the same few ad-nauseum. It's like how Counter-Strike's map rotation can be boiled down to Dust1, Dust2, Office and Aztec. You can probably name any fps with map voting and the game gets boiled down to 3-4 "classic" maps. I'd rather avoid that and just have Blizzard change up the overall rotation every few months when they add a new map or re-add an old one.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
I will say that as Abathur, laying fully buffed slowing mines all along the paths between lanes on Towers of Doom has to be one of the most satisfying things ever. I can practically hear the other Team's Nova bitching through the screen. The other is walking a Sonya through mines and dropping 3 locusts in her then getting the last hit on her with a slap
I'm addictied to the Ravage/Shield build on Kerrigan now too. Sustain, wave clear, and increased Ravage range almost makes up for the fact that I'm a scrub who misses Sprint
I'm addictied to the Ravage/Shield build on Kerrigan now too. Sustain, wave clear, and increased Ravage range almost makes up for the fact that I'm a scrub who misses Sprint
I love this fucking map so much.
It really spotlights the current endgame issues on the traditional ones- the game is much better when teamfight win doesn't guarantee a game win in the late game.
Tempo Storm gonna put em in loser's bracket, where they'll beat BRFC and TS both to ultimately triumph because C9 is the John Cena of HOTS.
They only ever give a fuck when they are out of options.
jossueinacoma
Member
Hey Gaf, I'm part of the production team at eSportsarena, how's the production/stream looking on your guys side?anything look cheesy or just not good?
On the mechanics side? Everything's been good for me. The PiP is amazing.
jossueinacoma
Member
Cool. Yea we noticed PIP has become a Fan favorite.
Wot m8
It's been a long time since I've seen a stomp that hard. C9 almost had their level 20 talents before Tempo had their level 16 talents. The dragon knight dancing in the middle lane was cruel... Really not sure what was going on with Tempo though - their shot calling was terrible, and they gave up numerous dragons for no reason at all. Maybe Srey isn't gods gift to the game...
I love K1Pros Falstad build (normal build but Tailwinds at 4 and the shorter trait cooldown talent at -6, plus Epic Mount at 20). It sacrifices power for massive team control abilities, but I really don't think it would work in solo queue.
I love K1Pros Falstad build (normal build but Tailwinds at 4 and the shorter trait cooldown talent at -6, plus Epic Mount at 20). It sacrifices power for massive team control abilities, but I really don't think it would work in solo queue.
jossueinacoma
Member
What I don't understand about muradin is why he got to keep his escape when all the other abilities similar to it lost it - in particular Falstad. The fact he can survive practically anything with his jump is soooooo annoying.
(And yes, his numbers possibly need shaving slightly. He does a surprising amount of damage, brings a ridiculous amount of control and is harder to kill than Johanna nowadays after the scaling changes).
(And yes, his numbers possibly need shaving slightly. He does a surprising amount of damage, brings a ridiculous amount of control and is harder to kill than Johanna nowadays after the scaling changes).
I don't think the ability works right if you can interrupt it- it's because it's airborne.
Brfc
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