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[Maledict]

I really don't like the idea of being a game up automatically for the final. That doesn't feel right at all to me. I think the current system is good and does what it needs to do, and is much improved over the older single elim tournaments. Until I start seeing the pros co planning about the new system I'm not really going to think it unfair.

Edit: on patch notes, is it me or does this patch basically removed anub and tyrael from the game?

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I cannot fathom a reason for cutting imposing will. Anubarak was already hardly played so not much changes there.

 

[Kioshen]

Removing spell shield on Joh doesn't help either. Only ETC and Muradin are left as multi-purpose tank now.

 

[Maledict]

Removing spell shield on Joh doesn't help either. Only ETC and Muradin are left as multi-purpose tank now.

The entire thing seems weird. Everyone was in general agreement that the current warrior meta was the best it has ever been - I think we saw every single warrior being used during HGC at some point, and most of them barring Rexxar in the clash? Yet not they substantially nerf some warriors, but leave the two most generic, 'always good' warriors completely alone? Feels like they just halved the warrior pick pool, and made ETC even better by comparison that he already is.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Watched the finals fully and I can understand making a boss call when the full team is up but who made the call to not let the boss leash and fully commit. That was dumb.

I also went and found the moment when Cattle broke Glau's heart

 

[Alavard]

So the new hero descriptions on the PTR are very clear with Blizz's intentions for various heroes. For warriors, it literally says if they're a tank or bruiser now.

Anub'Arak: Tank
Artanis: Bruiser
Arthas: Tank
Chen: Bruiser
Dehaka: Bruiser (interesting, because his last rework was supposed to cement him as a solo tank)
Diablo: Tank
ETC: Tank
Johanna: Tank
Leoric: Bruiser
Muradin: Tank
Rexxar: Bruiser
Sonya: Bruiser
Stitches: Tank
Tyrael: Tank
Varian: Tank or Assassin
Zarya: Bruiser

Also, they call Thrall and Ragnaros Bruisers too now, despite them being Assassins.

 

[kirblar]

They both have self-sustain.

 

[scoobs]

Ragnaros is 100% a bruiser. Unkillable god hero.

 

[Alavard]

They both have self-sustain.

Ragnaros is 100% a bruiser. Unkillable god hero.

Oh, I totally get their reasoning. Just saying, they're being explicit about it now. There are some other terms used for the heroes a lot like 'Mage' and 'Summoner' in the new descriptions. We might get a big change to the role system soon I'm thinking.

 

[scoobs]

I think this new in-game UI is only the tip of the iceberg. Big changes are clearly coming.

 

[Alur]

The UI looks great. Probi is muy fun.

 

[scoobs]

I'm watching Mewn play him, he looks amazing (not mewn, but probius)

 

[Kioshen]

That warp thingy looks hard to hit. The range is very close and with the delay, you need people sleeping at the wheel it seems to burst. Watching Cris play Probius made me think it was boring. Maybe because it's probably not his cup of tea.

 

[Celegus]

Man I can't wait to try the new Cho'Gall. Lots of fun looking talents now, before he had some of the most boring ones and many tiers with only one good choice. Hopefully the HP reduction and bonus armor is enough to keep from getting countered too too hard like currently.

 

[Alur]

That warp thingy looks hard to hit. The range is very close and with the delay, you need people sleeping at the wheel it seems to burst. Watching Cris play Probius made me think it was boring. Maybe because it's probably not his cup of tea.

It's not really that hard to hit. Getting the warp fields down is harder than hitting them because of their short range. I had more problems getting a field down in a good position without getting hit than I did getting them to pop afterward. I do feel like maybe the W damage is a bit unreliable and should probably focus on the Q or E, likely the Q.

 

[Ketch]

Hey guys. Sometimes my job really sucks.

 

[Orochinagis]

So when we are gonna get Sondious (Probious in spanish)?

 

[scoobs]

Hey guys. Sometimes my job really sucks.

Its ok, my job always sucks. We had some great games tonight though.

 

[TurtleSnatcher]

Probious is super fun. Super strong and can setup insane combos and zoning

 

[Kioshen]

It's not really that hard to hit. Getting the warp fields down is harder than hitting them because of their short range. I had more problems getting a field down in a good position without getting hit than I did getting them to pop afterward. I do feel like maybe the W damage is a bit unreliable and should probably focus on the Q or E, likely the Q.

I was talking about getting it down where it would have made impact and not necessarily hitting the middle to make it pop. It has insane wave clear however.

Its ok, my job always sucks. We had some great games tonight though.

They were fun stomps for once. I nearly fed a whole country by learning Lucio straight to quick match instead of trying him out in AI mode first but he's surprisingly fun. They succeeded in translating his gameplay from OW to HoTS because most of the skills I learned from there were seamless once my brain adjusted to not being able to escape in 3d. *insert slowpoke pic here*

 

[Alur]

I was talking about getting it down where it would have made impact and not necessarily hitting the middle to make it pop. It has insane wave clear however.

Yeah his wave clear is god tier. I guess the W value will depend on the other team's melee and your own front line. If he has a good front line he should be able to get value, if not will have to find damage in another way.

I played 3 games and have to say his setup time is actually worse than Gazlowe if you plan on using the damage ult. It takes like 12 or 15 seconds to get your second pylon down after the first, and in the meantime you have to juggle putting it far back enough to avoid enemy damage and far forward enough so that you can do your job. It's a neat little struggle.

 

[brian!]

Played some ptr last night but couldnt really get a handle on probius since all the ones in my games decided to stay in lane all game

 

[Alur]

I didn't get a chance to see how good his push could be (would imagine not great without some support, kind of like Gaz without robogoblin), but the wave clear is A+.

I feel like his damage is really good but getting it out in a team fight seems harder than even with Gaz. That slowing ult, the gate, is hilarious though.

 

[Ketch]

I don't understand how he can any better or even just significantly different then gaz

 

[Kioshen]

They took the advice from starcraft literally: "You must construct additional pylons". I don't see it either honestly after the hype has died down a little bit.

 

[kirblar]

I don't understand how he can any better or even just significantly different then gaz

Gaz is heavily PvE focused. This guy is PvP all the way (he just has good waveclear.)

 

[Alavard]

I don't understand how he can any better or even just significantly different then gaz

The first situation that always pops into my head is Infernal Shrines. Probius can pop down two of his Warp Rifts and a Photon Cannon to cover a large amount of the entrances into the shrine. The enemy team now can't go in those ways or risk taking large amounts of damage. With Gazlowe, sure he can plop down his turrets, but they can be destroyed relatively quickly. Probius's Warp Rifts can't. Lots of other good places for area denial like that too - beacons/dragonshrines, or boss zones on tomb or sky temple.

 

[Ketch]

The rift is his aoe circle? Does it just stay out till it's detonated then?

 

[Alavard]

The rift is his aoe circle? Does it just stay out till it's detonated then?

It lasts 9 seconds if it's not detonated.

 

[Alur]

The first situation that always pops into my head is Infernal Shrines. Probius can pop down two of his Warp Rifts and a Photon Cannon to cover a large amount of the entrances into the shrine. The enemy team now can't go in those ways or risk taking large amounts of damage. With Gazlowe, sure he can plop down his turrets, but they can be destroyed relatively quickly. Probius's Warp Rifts can't. Lots of other good places for area denial like that too - beacons/dragonshrines, or boss zones on tomb or sky temple.

From my games, the problem was both his pylons and his cannon die very easily. If you had one near where someone was going anyway, it may as well just be dead because you can't even make a nest with the cannons like you can Gaz's turrets.

In theory on shrine you could set up the two Pylons behind two diff walls and warp rift entrances, but once those are popped you gotta yolo to get em back in positionj. It's a bit weird honestly. I can't tell if he's gonna be amazing or booty tier because of it.

 

[brian!]

My first impression is that all his stuff has too low health including his own bod, but i was playing gmane and zera so that might factor into it...
He really blows up fast though

Things that seemed useful to me: siege phases w/ his buildings and pylon ult (way less effective when defending it looks like), his warp skill (the one that looks like a pseudo chromiw ult), his own wall ult, and bush control w/ buildings, other than that i havent seen much yet

 

[Alur]

I do feel like his pylons are too easy to kill. A Li-Ming in one game just shit on mine continuously. As for him, not sure. I felt like a lot of my health issues were getting too greedy fishing for W+Q combos, but he is definitely very squishy either way.

 

[kirblar]

I do feel like his pylons are too easy to kill. A Li-Ming in one game just shit on mine continuously. As for him, not sure. I felt like a lot of my health issues were getting too greedy fishing for W+Q combos, but he is definitely very squishy either way.

I just watched 2 minutes of a game and yeah, they need a LOT more health.

He can't be someone based on zone denial if Li-Ming just one-shots everything.

 

[Alur]

They feel like they have only slightly more health than a Gaz turret. I had Arthas and Anub just diving them, not counting the ranged poke from Li-Ming and the like.

 

[brian!]

The pylon/cannon stuff feela gimmicky but i dont know the talents...if he's described as zone controlly it feels mainly in his warp thing

 

[Milly79]

Apparently an Azmodunk brawl was datamined.

 

[Alur]

I want to pull a scoobs and throw out an "I told ya so" re: Varian. Even when he was on PTR it was clear that not only was Warbreaker broken as fuck, but Shield Wall was OP too. Now that it's the go-to, that talent is almost as annoying as the charge stun was. He's still oppressive as fuck, and now instead of just chain stunning you to death he just stays alive forever.

I'm probably in the minority but I'd rather have the charge stun than the multiple invulnerabilities.

 

[scoobs]

I want to pull a scoobs and throw out an "I told ya so" re: Varian. Even when he was on PTR it was clear that not only was Warbreaker broken as fuck, but Shield Wall was OP too. Now that it's the go-to, that talent is almost as annoying as the charge stun was. He's still oppressive as fuck, and now instead of just chain stunning you to death he just stays alive forever.

I'm probably in the minority but I'd rather have the charge stun than the multiple invulnerabilities.

The parry build is hilarious, particularly against heavy AA teams. You can make yourself invulnerable for like the entirety of a team fight.

 

[Alur]

Yeah I've had it happen to me in two different games. Also had him basically neuter me in one game while I was Li-Ming because he just stood in front getting hit by others while also preventing my spells from getting by him/absorbing them with his invuln. I couldn't do enough damage to beat his CD's.

 

[Ronabo]

Apparently an Azmodunk brawl was datamined.

Probably a March Madness related event.

 

[scoobs]

Valeera continues to be the most cancerous pile of garbage hero in QM

 

[Alur]

Two CORE observations:

1) The newish intro to CORE is amazing. Even the campy voice.

2) Beau not liking the health bar UI changes was a hot take I wasn't expected. All I've seen is praise for it, guess that's why.

 

[Milly79]

I agree with him though and that's the old(er) man in me coming out. I haven't even tried it personally, only seen it, but I'm scared of the UI changes.

 

[scoobs]

Two CORE observations:

1) The newish intro to CORE is amazing. Even the campy voice.

2) Beau not liking the health bar UI changes was a hot take I wasn't expected. All I've seen is praise for it, guess that's why.

this is... CORE!!! Ya, its great. Hands down my favorite part of the show lately is Scott not being able to remember any heroes name... ever. Its incredible. The goofy names he comes up with when he can't think of them is incredibly funny to me

New UI is amazing, I do not understand their negative opinions on it. Classic case of people hating something just because its different. Change is GOOD when it adds to the experience. Being able to see ult timings without pressing tab is huge.

 

[Alur]

It's not anymore intrusive than what was already there would be my argument. Honestly, I think you'd be more likely to not notice it than you would be to be bothered by it.

I agree with him though and that's the old(er) man in me coming out.

Old, mmhmm. Ancient.

 

[scoobs]

Also the kill feed and "on fire" mechanic are fun little additions to make you feel like more of a badass when you're destroying some chumps (and i guess making you feel worse when you're the chump, but still)

 

[Kioshen]

To be honest I'm waiting to play with the UI before making a judgment call on it. It looks clean, sleek but at the same time annoying. It's still less cluttered than other games in the genre but you lose a bit of view of the surrounding area. Being so zoomed in doesn't help.

 

[Milly79]

It's not anymore intrusive than what was already there would be my argument. Honestly, I think you'd be more likely to not notice it than you would be to be bothered by it.



Old, mmhmm. Ancient.

That's why I said old(er). Although I'm probably still the youngest. 😂

 

[Ketch]

I don't know how I feel about all the armor being handed out. I think it's cool on like a hero to hero case, but I think over all it's bad for the game because it's a pretty hidden mechanic that doesn't actually cause a lot of difference in the moment to moment "this is what my hero does".

It's an obscured layer of depth that I feel most of the player base will not recognize and doesn't really add anything except strategic depth (but I do like strategic depth).

I continue to feel like heroes has a schizophrenic design philosophy. The game feels the need to classify everything into three buckets of tank, assassin, specialist. It even goes out of its way to build generic teams of "the right comp" in public match making. But now the tanks are meant to fill very specific niches so that a generic term doesn't loses even more of its already diminished meaning.

What they need to do is just drop all the legacy bull shit stuff. Take off the kiddy gloves and stop trying to pretend to be a simple take on the genre.

 

[brian!]

I dont mind the armor stuff too much i think, depends on what actually happens after it goea live i guess.

To me the worst thing is if you are in draft and you opt to pick a "tank" that has resistences to the enemy damage type, without consideration of the tank's actual base kit...like w/ anub his kit complements being an "anti-mage" very well, that kind of categorization of him is something that makes sense, but the idea of picking jo as anti-auto because of her phys armor when her kit is about setup, waveclear, and disruption is booty to me, like pick her for access to her blind, dont pigeonhole like this.

Tyrael was really good against mages previously but he lost the thing that made it so, like they made him straight up worse against mages w/ this patch, i confused. His kit is still good for it, but the spell armor thing is awfully confusing and weird, he's a super mobile hero who is supposed to dodge spells...