Support NeoGAF

[m_shortpants]

I'm not going to get my hopes up.

Time is running.

 

[Kibbles]

Just saw this on Fox 6 Milwaukee, they said no evidence though, just that it is a possibility ???

 

[jfkgoblue]

Just saw this on Fox 6 Milwaukee, they said no evidence though, just that it is a possibility ???

Nate Silver already said it was trash.

No electronic votes in Michigan, in Wisconsin the difference in voting patterns was to be expected.

 

[Rumblebones]

People best hope this isn't true because the implications and problems this could lead to are potentially catastrophic. If there is evidence of state-backed hacking by Russia, it'd be war.

 

[MaulerX]

Just saw this on Fox 6 Milwaukee, they said no evidence though, just that it is a possibility ???

How can people even entertain this crap then? This is looking pretty bad actually.

 

[KingBroly]

People best hope this isn't true because the implications and problems this could lead to are potentially catastrophic. If there is evidence of state-backed hacking by Russia, it'd be war.

There's no evidence behind these claims other than they think it possibly, could be maybe hopefully be lined up with exit polling data.

Nate Silver and Nate Cohn already did number crunching and basically said they were BS claims.

 

[Kettch]

Ehh, less vote share in electronic voting counties isn't much in the way of evidence. It's very possible those counties simply favored Trump more. You need a lot more than that.

 

[thuway]

For this article to hold weight they'd need actual physical evidence something happened. So far this is just making democrats look bad.

 

[Stumpokapow]

Ehh, less vote share in electronic voting counties isn't much in the way of evidence. It's very possible those counties simply favored Trump more. You need a lot more than that.

I mean, we might expect that anyway. Electronic voting isn't randomly assigned. Imagine that counties more scared of vote fraud adopt electronic voting as a hand-waving way to assuage vote fraud fear. Now imagine that because vote fraud is not real and only Republicans are worried about it, Republican counties adopt electronic voting when other counties do not. How would we expect votes to line up by county based on electronic voting? Favouring the Republican? Is this proof of fraud or a logical implication of the very simple theory I just set up predicated on pretty simple assumptions?

 

[DragonSworne]

For this article to hold weight they'd need actual physical evidence something happened. So far this is just making democrats look bad.

Actually, it doesn't. It just needs to spread on Facebook and other social networks and become truth like the rest of the fake news.

Liberals need to embrace fake news, it will serve them well in the short term during Trump's presidency.

 

[RedAssedApe]

RECOUNT THEM ALL. can it ne january yet?

 

[SecretMoblin]

Actually, it doesn't. It just needs to spread on Facebook and other social networks and become truth like the rest of the fake news.

Liberals need to embrace fake news, it will serve them well in the short term during Trump's presidency.

based on this and all the other conspiratorial threads about the FBI and the Electoral College we're already there

whew it's been a ride

 

[janoDX]

This will be the cherry on top of the elections if it's true.

 

[Calamari41]

They could call for an audit in CA if they wanted. I'm sure a lot of votes would get thrown out there. But it's pointless.

Oh, of course. That's kind of one of the problems with a national popular vote. You'd get challenges absolutely all over the place. I mean, Orange County, where I am, went blue this year. Very odd. If it mattered to the election, you can bet the Republican party would be all over the place down here checking the citizenship status of the voter rolls.

 

[Ac30]

Just saw this on Fox 6 Milwaukee, they said no evidence though, just that it is a possibility ???

I'm glad people leaked this to the press with zero credibility so us salty Dems look like we're trying to undermine democracy while the Republicans actually are doing so in NC.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

Trump was right, this election was so rigged!

 

[Movement]

Made front page of The Guardian.

Having consistently led Trump in public opinion polls for months preceding election day in all three midwestern states, Clinton narrowly lost Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, and may yet lose Michigan, where a final result has still not been declared.

Curiosity about Wisconsin has centred on apparently disproportionate wins that were racked up by Trump in counties using electronic voting compared with those that used only paper ballots. The apparent disparities were first widely publicised earlier this month by David Greenwald, a journalist for the Oregonian.

However, Nate Silver, the polling expert and founder of FiveThirtyEight, cast significant doubt over this theory on Tuesday evening, stating that the difference disappeared after race and education levels, which most closely tracked voting shifts nationwide, were controlled for.

Silver and several other election analysts have dismissed suggestions that the swing state vote counts give cause for concern about the integrity of the results.

Still, dozens of professors specialising in cybersecurity, defense, and elections have in the past two days signed an open letter to congressional leaders stating that they are “deeply troubled” by previous reports of foreign interference, and requesting swift action by lawmakers.

“Our country needs a thorough, public congressional investigation into the role that foreign powers played in the months leading up to November,” the academics said in their letter, while noting they did not mean to “question the outcome” of the election itself.

 

[boiled goose]

If when controlled for other factors these differences disappear then it's probably nothing..

 

[CheDominik]

Oh, of course. That's kind of one of the problems with a national popular vote. You'd get challenges absolutely all over the place. I mean, Orange County, where I am, went blue this year. Very odd. If it mattered to the election, you can bet the Republican party would be all over the place down here checking the citizenship status of the voter rolls.

As a non Americaan, the fact that you don't have compulsory IDs and that this even is some partisan, controversial issue is just weird. How can you prevent people from voting 100s of times if there is no way to check their identity?

 

[Calamari41]

As a non Americaan, the fact that you don't have compulsory IDs and that this even is some partisan, controversial issue is just weird. How can you prevent people from voting 100s of times if there is no way to check their identity?

It's something I've never understood either, and which has frustrated me as I know several non-citizens who vote without a second thought. But many are very passionate about the topic, and I'm sure they'll be happy to explain their side of it.

 

[SpeedWeed]

I find it slightly convenient that the states that lost HC the election just happen to be the only ones that have been vote hacked. And by convenient, I mean unlikely.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

Let's just take the L for the next 4 years.

Um.... as much as I would accept it if Trump won.... that's only if he won fair.

If he didn't win fairly.... then we need to investigate. Not just because it would be voter fraud, but because Donald Trump is a scary fucking person.

"Taking the L" means something much more than "we have a shitty president" in this context.

George W. Bush was taking the L.

If we lie down for Donald Trump, that's going to be super fucking bad.

 

[MetalGearZed]

Why the hell not? recount that shit

 

[Aztechnology]

I feel like our country would rather accept the outcome even if it had been hacked and ignore this than look into it further because of the potential embarrassment.

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

I find it slightly convenient that the states that lost HC the election just happen to be the only ones that have been vote hacked. And by convenient, I mean unlikely.

I don't think there's anything here, but I don't know that that's unlikely.

If a foreign power were interfering in our elections, they'd want a result that would be plausible and have an explanation - like what happened. They wouldn't push the country towards a landslide for Trump. They'd mess with a few counties in crucial states.

 

[Stumpokapow]

It's something I've never understood either, and which has frustrated me as I know several non-citizens who vote without a second thought.

I'm a non-citizen, explain how I could do this.

 

[Omzz]

Sure I'll watch another election night on CNN

KEY RACE ALERT...

Wisconsin TOO CLOSE TO CALL
Florida TOO CLOSE TO CALL

 

[SpeedWeed]

I don't think there's anything here, but I don't know that that's unlikely.

If a foreign power were interfering in our elections, they'd want a result that would be plausible and have an explanation - like what happened. They wouldn't push the country towards a landslide for Trump. They'd mess with a few counties in crucial states.

It would have to be a conspiracy of enormous magnitude for this to be tho, to me it seem like grasping for straws akin to the crazy right wing conspiracies against the Clintons.

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

It would have to be a conspiracy of enormous magnitude for this to be tho, to me it seem like grasping for straws akin to the crazy right wing conspiracies against the Clintons.

I mean, it was clear Russia got involved during the campaign and had a preferred candidate. Would it really be that much of a stretch to assume they might go further?

(They probably didn't and even if they did I'd prefer Hillary just take the L because the aftermath of something like this might actually be worse than a Trump presidency)

 

[Oberon]

I mean, it was clear Russia got involved during the campaign and had a preferred candidate. Would it really be that much of a stretch to assume they might go further?

(They probably didn't and even if they did I'd prefer Hillary just take the L because the aftermath of something like this might actually be worse than a Trump presidency)

Why would it be? And how could it be worse than a falsely elected idiot president?

 

[SpeedWeed]

I mean, it was clear Russia got involved during the campaign and had a preferred candidate. Would it really be that much of a stretch to assume they might go further?

(They probably didn't and even if they did I'd prefer Hillary just take the L because the aftermath of something like this might actually be worse than a Trump presidency)

True. I'm just a lowly peasant but even I know that if you were going to cover your tracks on this you would also rig a few states that you knew Trump was going to lose no matter what. That way it wouldn't look so obviously sus. It just seems like they are desperately looking for some explanation on why the polls got it so wrong in thiose states when the answer is quite simple.

 

[DR2K]

Don't call it a recount. Call it a democracy religious freedom checks and balances for the troops and god is great act.

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

What would it be? And how could it be worse than a falsely elected idiot president?

Because the country would be so intensely divided over this (more than it is now, somehow)? Do you think Trump's voters and the Republican Party would sit idly by? Do you understand what kind of precedent it could set for future elections, federal, state, and local?

If there was slam dunk, obvious proof that this happened maybe it wouldn't be bad. But people would have zero faith in our institutions if this happened. Imagine the reaction re:Watergate, but significantly worse.

 

[Rentahamster]

I'm a non-citizen, explain how I could do this.

Go to a polling place that only cross references via name and address, forge the signature.

 

[Joni]

It would be incredibly scary if this turned out to be true, especially as it is not actually clear how this would be resolved.
And it would be bad for electronic voting, which should be the future.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

If the Republicans lost and had a chance to win by doing a recount, do you think they would actually do it?

I'm pretty sure they would just let the other team win and try again 4 years later. I mean they are some good old boys right? I say the Dems should just let it slide.

Signed: -Trump-

 

[Stumpokapow]

Go to a polling place that only cross references via name and address, forge the signature.

Sorry so in this scenario I am going to go to the polling place, pretending to be someone else by stealing their name and address, forging their signature, and I better hope they haven't already voted or don't end up voting later, or else I'm probably going to get arrested and deported from the country and potentially have my life's work ruined, and in exchange I get to maybe fake one vote? This seems like a pretty bad move for me.

 

[GameAddict411]

Why would it be? And how could it be worse than a falsely elected idiot president?

If a foreign nation did it, then it's an act of war. If it local people did it, a civil war could break out considering how divided the country is currently. It's the difference between stability and instability. Quite honestly, it's not comparable to trump presidency. The US becoming unstable would mean the whole world would be unstable.

 

[Rentahamster]

Sorry so in this scenario I am going to go to the polling place, pretending to be someone else by stealing their name and address, forging their signature, and I better hope they haven't already voted or don't end up voting later, or else I'm probably going to get arrested and deported from the country and potentially have my life's work ruined, and in exchange I get to maybe fake one vote? This seems like a pretty bad move for me.

Yep. There's nothing to cross reference the signature with (from the polling places I've observed) so they can't tell its forged. If you see that there's already a signature in place, just say you were mistaken and walk out. It's not like there's a security guard on the alert to pounce at the first sign of fraud. If the real person comes in later, there's no way to trace it back to you. If you feel that the future of the country and perhaps your life is in danger if your candidate doesn't win, that could be enough incentive for some to risk their career. Assuming they're here legitimately. If they're not, then it wouldn't matter either way.

The risk is low because it's unlikely you'll be caught. It's a bad move for you because you have a lot to lose. Is that the same for everyone though?

 

[Night Angel]

Great title edit.

 

[Poster#1]

She should take the L and move on.

 

[MetatronM]

Yep. There's nothing to cross reference the signature with (from the polling places I've observed) so they can't tell its forged. If you see that there's already a signature in place, just say you were mistaken and walk out. It's not like there's a security guard on the alert to pounce at the first sign of fraud. If the real person comes in later, there's no way to trace it back to you. If you feel that the future of the country and perhaps your life is in danger if your candidate doesn't win, that could be enough incentive for some to risk their career. Assuming they're here legitimately. If they're not, then it wouldn't matter either way.

The risk is low because it's unlikely you'll be caught. It's a bad move for you because you have a lot to lose. Is that the same for everyone though?

Say you were mistaken about what, your own (supposed) name?

Also, I don't know what your polling stations where like, but here in NYC there absolutely were security guards.

 

[Spiral Insanity]

She should take the L and move on.

Even if there was real fraud? Get out.

 

[LiK]

Please do a recount. I need it. Trump hasn't even started and he's already a fuckhead.

 

[Stumpokapow]

Yep. There's nothing to cross reference the signature with (from the polling places I've observed) so they can't tell its forged. If you see that there's already a signature in place, just say you were mistaken and walk out. It's not like there's a security guard on the alert to pounce at the first sign of fraud. If the real person comes in later, there's no way to trace it back to you. If you feel that the future of the country and perhaps your life is in danger if your candidate doesn't win, that could be enough incentive for some to risk their career. Assuming they're here legitimately. If they're not, then it wouldn't matter either way.

The risk is low because it's unlikely you'll be caught. It's a bad move for you because you have a lot to lose. Is that the same for everyone though?

Okay but even if I'm not caught, the fraud is trivially detectible. So where are all the fraud detections?

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

Do it.

There's nothing else to lose at this point.

 

[TBiddy]

Times like these I'm glad I live in a country, where every single vote is counted by hand.

 

[Drifters]

Yeah I doubt this will happen.

 

[KingBroly]

Even if there was real fraud? Get out.

Here's Silver's string of data:
https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/801221546685661184

Going by what Nate Silver said, his basic "sanity" check would only cause a possible red flag in Wisconsin without controlling for race and education (these are the key demographic shifts that favored Trump in this election). Even without controlling for those factors, it wouldn't change anything in Pennsylvania, nor would it do anything in Michigan since they don't have electronic ballots.

 

[somecrazymember]

Usa has become a big joke in just a few months