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[Shakka43]

(color washed out with the upload)

 

[GymWolf]

The combat in FW is so random. One time, i am taking down 2 huge turtles, aiming at their points, detaching guns - situation UNDER CONTROL like a pro.
Other time a jumping jacks weasels and sawface tooth face robots take me down randomly just like that.
Then You realize that all human enemies have these super awesome helmets, so nobody goes down in 1 shot in the head.

Tsushima looked to me like a very AC busy work game. Is it not? I still have to get it some day.
I loved Death Stranding... which is the biggest surprise when it comes to these games

And the loot system is atrocious. Hard to recognize what weapons and armors are better or not. Then they level too... which you never have materials for.
And all the junk. You constantly hold x on everything to pick everything up

Nothing is random, you just don't like the game combat but it is all pretty clear.

You can literally enter a menu to see what parts are weak to elements etc.

It seems like you enjoy more simple combat systems and not something when you have to switch weapons\elements or hit weak spots.

tsushima combat is elegant but also deep as a puddle, even the stance system is just more damage to a particular enemy type instead of being like nioh system.

 

[GymWolf]

(color washed out with the upload)

wow, now even the ravagers can camouflage?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

ACV has about 10000000000000 times better climbing than this. Even UC4 is better, certainly Lost Legacy which I just played through. It’s just annoying in HFW, worst aspect of an otherwise absolutely phenomenal game, imo.

It’s nothing in ACV

A curated platforming experience means they can direct you down a certain path.

I am not saying it’s amazing in HFW, but platforming isn’t amazing in ANY open world game. It’s just a means to an end

 

[Roman Empire]

My only main complaint with the game is looting.

Would be nice if you just auto-looted and a small icon would pop up on the screen saying you’ve obtained a critical component

Also…they really needed to steal the ghost of Tsushima scavenging system where it doesn’t pause with an animation for looting items in the overworld

The gimmicky animations are cool the first hour of gameplay. Ghost some great choices in simplifying some of its aspects for gameplay purposes, like looting both for resources or corpses, even being able to loot while walking or running past objects.

 

[BadBurger]

But the entire point of introducing five different skill trees was to allow players to play it THIER way. If I am investing literally 50 points maxing out the Hunter tree, I shouldnt have to set traps and use brains. It's like playing as a Mage or Warrior class in WRPGs. If invest in Strength, and fully max out the skills, I want to see that difference in my playthrough. I mean there is literally a Skill tree dedicated for traps. The game is meant to be played the way YOU want to play it.

That's a good point if this is the case. I personally play with a stealth and trap build with a few points in hunter for upfront damage. Maybe try more points in a melee build? Just asking, not sure how it would play out.

 

[rofif]

Fuck this game. I am fighting rock breaker and it’s terrible. You don’t have time to hit him, I am trying to scan him and it’s the first one so before I see his weakness, I have to look at “added to catalogue” for 5 seconds. And he jus poops out of the ground and kills me. And I am like 3 level above that mission

 

[Con_Z_ǝdʇ]

 

[tommib]

Fuck this game. I am fighting rock breaker and it’s terrible. You don’t have time to hit him, I am trying to scan him and it’s the first one so before I see his weakness, I have to look at “added to catalogue” for 5 seconds. And he jus poops out of the ground and kills me. And I am like 3 level above that mission

I would lower the difficulty if you’re not clicking with the combat. No shame in that.

 

[rofif]

Nothing is random, you just don't like the game combat but it is all pretty clear.

You can literally enter a menu to see what parts are weak to elements etc.

It seems like you enjoy more simple combat systems and not something when you have to switch weapons\elements or hit weak spots.

tsushima combat is elegant but also deep as a puddle, even the stance system is just more damage to a particular enemy type instead of being like nioh system.

Man I eat dark souls and bloodborne for breakfast. This is some busy bs. Ready my post above

 

[GymWolf]

Man I eat dark souls and bloodborne for breakfast. This is some busy bs. Ready my post above

Most enemies in souls are way easier than enemies in horizon dude, you can't just circle them to do a backstab or wait behind a shield.

little secret, souls games are not the hardest shit in the universe, i'm kinda good too with these games and i still get stomped hard in horizon.

The enemies being hard and varied and with many weak spots and elemental weakness is what people love about the combat in this game, it is pretty unique.

it honestly feels like you prefer simpler combat systems or you are just bad at this game.

 

[SCB3]

They are going for a curated platforming experience. This is not a climb anywhere game. Nor would that make it better. It certainly added nothing to ACV

There are literal ledges that Aloy should be able to climb but cannot cause it’s not colored yellow

AC since Origins still has the best climbing mechanics in these games, hell even Uncharted has better curated climbing sections, this is just a bad version of that

Keep in mind I am liking the rest of the game as well, it just stands out as being outdated that’s all, keep also in mind HZD came out at the same time as BotW, so it’s had a few years of better climbing and platforming to learn from since then

 

[rofif]

Most enemies in souls are way easier than enemies in horizon dude, you can't just circle them to do a backstab or wait behind a shield.

little secret, souls games are not the hardest shit in the universe, i'm kinda good too with these games and i still get stomped hard in horizon.

Nothing intelligent or clever about rock breaker clipping me through rock platforms. No place to hide, no time to shoot him. And nobody told me I must have shock arrows for this mission…. And you can’t blow the freeze or shock canisters without these type of arrows.
Souls is hard but fair. This is… nvm. I will try few more times. I should lower to easy but I am not letting this janky game win.
9 out of 10 my ass

 

[HellforLeather]

Holy shit, what happened to Jim? Is he trans now?

Also, I mean I guess he makes some points but the primary concern I've seen regarding the changes to Aloy's face is that she looks different from the previous game. The changes are subtle but her face looks like a different person.

 

[BadBurger]

Fuck this game. I am fighting rock breaker and it’s terrible. You don’t have time to hit him, I am trying to scan him and it’s the first one so before I see his weakness, I have to look at “added to catalogue” for 5 seconds. And he jus poops out of the ground and kills me. And I am like 3 level above that mission

Assess the scene, think about how to take out the little ones first, and lure the big guy into your traps and trips.

As someone who sucks absolute ass at challenging games I find Horizon ZD and FW pretty easy because they supply a player with tons of offense and defense, it's just up to the player if they use them. It sounds like you're making things harder on yourself than you need to.

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Just deleted a wall of text I've written, but in essence this game doesn't feel as polished as the first. It didn't evolve in the direction I would have liked.
A bazillion arrow combinations and even more stats + skills is not what this game needed. The new additions to gameplay, grapple/rope/glider, are kind of clunky in use. More annoying than fun. There is still nothing amazing in crafting arrows mid battle, or constantly going into slow motion to be able to hit a certain small piece of armor.

 

[GymWolf]

Nothing intelligent or clever about rock breaker clipping me through rock platforms. No place to hide, no time to shoot him. And nobody told me I must have shock arrows for this mission…. And you can’t blow the freeze or shock canisters without these type of arrows.
Souls is hard but fair. This is… nvm. I will try few more times. I should lower to easy but I am not letting this janky game win.
9 out of 10 my ass

Souls have shitty camera system that cause a lot of deaths, clunky platforming\jumping system and compenetrations everywhere, not sure how they are more fair...

Also a lot of enemies attacking from blind spots that you can't avoid unless you already know them, talk about being fair...

 

[rofif]

Souls have shitty camera system that cause a lot of deaths and compenetrations everywhere, not sure how they are more fair...

Also a lot of enemies attacking from blind spots that you can't avoid unless you already know them, talk about being fair...

Rock breaker fight in that level 18 side quest. I am about to break the disc lol

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

There are literal ledges that Aloy should be able to climb but cannot cause it’s not colored yellow

AC since Origins still has the best climbing mechanics in these games, hell even Uncharted has better curated climbing sections, this is just a bad version of that

Keep in mind I am liking the rest of the game as well, it just stands out as being outdated that’s all, keep also in mind HZD came out at the same time as BotW, so it’s had a few years of better climbing and platforming to learn from since then

I don’t think climb anywhere = better by default

The platforming in BOTW or ACV is literally nothing. You press up in BOTW and hope your stamina gauge is good enough. It’s extremely boring

The brilliance of BOTW is the discovery, not the platforming

 

[Woggleman]

Just stop playing and sell the game. It is clear you are not having fun so why torture yourself?

 

[Interfectum]

I don’t think climb anywhere = better by default

The platforming in BOTW or ACV is literally nothing. You press up in BOTW and hope your stamina gauge is good enough. It’s extremely boring

I agree with you here.

My problem is the climbing is not built into the graphics instead layered over a UI. I don't know why they just didn't expand on how they did it before. This feels like such an odd design decision.

I don't see how the bottom picture is a much better solution... it's just littered with ugly UI.

 

[GymWolf]

Rock breaker fight in that level 18 side quest. I am about to break the disc lol

rockbreaker is just an hard enemy dude, it was the same in the first one, i died dozens of times agains him in the first game, there is a quest where you fight 2 of them...

Break his legs so he can't go underground anymore.

If your aim is shit, use explosive weapons that don't need good aiming.

The explosive slingshot, the explosive trap thingy, the explosive spears you get from the 2 black sisters, use the ropecaster to block the enemy so he can't move anymore.

Like other people said, the game gaves you a lot of tools if yopu don't care about precision, and horizon has a fuckload of broken weapons.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I agree with you here.

My problem is the climbing is not built into the graphics instead layered over a UI. I don't know why they just didn't expand on how they did it before. This feels like such an odd design decision.

Well it’s an extremely massive game, I’m sure time constraints played a role

I agree it would have been nice to see them add graphical depictions and assets of areas you can climb instead of using the focus

 

[tommib]

Holy shit, what happened to Jim? Is he trans now?

Also, I mean I guess he makes some points but the primary concern I've seen regarding the changes to Aloy's face is that she looks different from the previous game. The changes are subtle but her face looks like a different person.

He lost me after the first sentence.

I love people complaining about culture wars while feeding more culture wars…

Grow up, Jim.

 

[Low Moral Fibre]

I don't hate the climbing but it is hard to adjust when you think 'oh I can make that jump easy' but because you aren't supposed to jump that way you flail in the air and just fall 50ft down.

The combat is very good but accuracy is even more important than the first one so will probably be frustrating for some. There's a lot of stuff I just don't bother with though like stealth and rarely even traps so probably can be very easy like the first one if you use what you are given.

 

[Punished Miku]

I agree with you here.

My problem is the climbing is not built into the graphics instead layered over a UI. I don't know why they just didn't expand on how they did it before. This feels like such an odd design decision.

I don't see how the bottom picture is a much better solution... it's just littered with ugly UI.

The climbing spots are procedurally generated. In the first one they probably manually made the graphics match the climbing spots for the whole game, and had less climbable areas.

 

[rofif]

rockbreaker is just an hard enemy dude, it was the same in the first one, i died dozens of times agains him in the first game, there is a quest where you fight 2 of them...

Break his legs so he can't go underground anymore.

If your aim is shit, use explosive weapons that don't need good aiming.

The explosive slingshot, the explosive trap thingy, the explosive spears you get from the 2 black sisters, use the ropecaster to block the enemy so he can't move anymore.

Like other people said, the game gaves you a lot of tools if yopu don't care about precision, and horizon has a fuckload of broken weapons.

I just killed him. Lured around rocks and explosive spear. No idea I can break his legs as he is digging with his head. It makes no sense and I hated that fight….
I don’t agree with your defended. Blah blah horizon gives you tools and broken weapons. No. Just no

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Rock breaker fight in that level 18 side quest. I am about to break the disc lol

Just apply the lesson the souls game's taught you with this one

Git gud

 

[GymWolf]

He lost me after the first sentence.

I love people complaining about culture wars while feeding more culture wars…

Grow up, Jim.

dude you liked returnal, it is very strange that you don't like the combat in horizon.

Unless you really hate open world games, give a chance to the sequel when it's gonna be cheap, some big creatures are basically like returnal bosses in terms of variety of attacks and shit, extremely spectacular.

The bloat is there but you can just do the main quest like in any other open world, the bloat is for people who enjoy the game so much that they want more of it.

 

[Woggleman]

I don't want to say much because I got in trouble but Jim is right.

 

[rofif]

dude you liked returnal, it is very strange that you don't like the combat in horizon.

Unless you really hate open world games, give a chance to the sequel when it's gonna be cheap, some big creatures are basically like returnal bosses in terms of variety of attacks and shit, extremely spectacular.

The bloat is there but you can just do the main quest like in any other open world, the bloat is for people who enjoy the game so much that they want more of it.

I finished returnal too.
You give horizon too much credit. It is to janky for what you credit it for

 

[GymWolf]

I just killed him. Lured around rocks and explosive spear. No idea I can break his legs as he is digging with his head. It makes no sense and I hated that fight….
I don’t agree with your defended. Blah blah horizon gives you tools and broken weapons. No. Just no

he dig with the head but he need the legs to actually moves and change place, have you ever saw tremors movies?

when you break a part the focus usually says if the enemy lose some kind of ability.

 

[GymWolf]

I finished returnal too.
You give horizon too much credit. It is to janky for what you credit it for

Dude combat is the only thing that is universally praised by reviews or even people who hate the story, i'm not putting much credit into nothing, you are just bad at the game or don't like the core combat that is much different from most tps games.

If you don't like interesting enemies that request strategy and good aim to be killed you can return shooting mongoloid locusts from behind a wall in gears (wild guess from your avatar).

 

[tommib]

dude you liked returnal, it is very strange that you don't like the combat in horizon.

Unless you really hate open world games, give a chance to the sequel when it's gonna be cheap, some big creatures are basically like returnal bosses in terms of variety of attacks and shit, extremely spectacular.

The bloat is there but you can just do the main quest like in any other open world, the bloat is for people who enjoy the game so much that they want more of it.

I think you’re replying to the wrong post.

Back on topic, I’ll try it for sure when I find it cheaper. I got the platinum for Returnal and absolutely love that combat but I also love the world and the atmosphere - but I love darker stuff, I get a hard on with dark and desperate aesthetics. Returnal is a horror game. Horizon to me looks like a cross between Avatar and Marvel. Just not my thing.

I’m sure it’s a really good game and love seeing people having a great time with it but I also understand people like rofif that don’t click with it. At least he’s complaining about the combat and not graphical tech.

 

[SlimySnake]

That's a good point if this is the case. I personally play with a stealth and trap build with a few points in hunter for upfront damage. Maybe try more points in a melee build? Just asking, not sure how it would play out.

Yeah, i ended up doing that last night. I have the first Tier of the melee build all maxed out and was having trouble building up the resonator charge.

I will just unlearn everything Ive learned from HZD and play the game the way they want me to play it. I just got to the settlement where you get Legendary weapons so hopefully things get easier with a higher DPS.

 

[tommib]

I don't want to say much because I got in trouble but Jim is right.

He actually is but he’s still fuelling the culture wars for YouTube clicks. Also, generalising gamers as incels is not the best look but let’s not derail the thread anymore.

Peace.

 

[Woggleman]

Off topic but battery life on PS5 controllers is even worse than PS4. I have had to take a break for a half an hour while the controller charges multiple times. I am thinking about going down to Best Buy and getting a long cord so I can just power it through USB.

 

[GymWolf]

I think you’re replying to the wrong post.

Back on topic, I’ll try it for sure when I find it cheaper. I got the platinum for Returnal and absolutely love that combat but I also love the world and the atmosphere - but I love darker stuff, I get a hard on with dark and desperate aesthetics. Returnal is a horror game. Horizon to me looks like a cross between Avatar and Marvel. Just not my thing.

I’m sure it’s a really good game and love seeing people having a great time with it but I also understand people like rofif that don’t click with it. At least he’s complaining about the combat and not graphical tech.

I picked the right one, it was just to have your attention.

The plot in the first horizon is pretty bleak, way darker than anything inside returnal, way , way darker.

Don't get fooled by vivid colors, you also have stuff like this

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Yeah, i ended up doing that last night. I have the first Tier of the melee build all maxed out and was having trouble building up the resonator charge.

I will just unlearn everything Ive learned from HZD and play the game the way they want me to play it. I just got to the settlement where you get Legendary weapons so hopefully things get easier with a higher DPS.

I think it’s just a matter of being stuck in an early part of the game and feeling weak because you haven’t unlocked a ton of the skill sets and higher level gear

Need to really focus on hunter and melee above all else

 

[rofif]

Dude combat is the only thing that is universally praised by reviews or even people who hate the story, i'm not putting much credit into nothing, you are just bad at the game or don't like the core combat that is much different from most tps games.

If you don't like interesting enemies that request strategy and good aim to be killed you can return shooting mongoloid locusts from behind a wall in gears (wild guess from your avatar).

I said I finished returnal and souls/ sekiro no problem. No need to put shame in gears of war like games. It’s good fun.

Controls in horizon are not good. You catch o rocks and other stuff, enemies are a guess work, it is a hell of a grand for materials which you quickly run out of.

IMO reviewers are blind and idiots. Just the same way they overlooked first game flaws.

I love that the enemies are interesting and varied. But they all look the same, jump around like crazy and are weak to arbitrary methods which often make little sense.
I finished first horizon two times. I knew what I am getting into. But it’s not fun apparently.

I don’t want to overreact. The game is fine. But it’s not a 10

 

[rofif]

Off topic but battery life on PS5 controllers is even worse than PS4. I have had to take a break for a half an hour while the controller charges multiple times. I am thinking about going down to Best Buy and getting a long cord so I can just power it through USB.

It’s terrible. Like maybe 6 hours for me

 

[kyliethicc]

Stealth armor + stealth cloaking valor surge = OP

Taking down rebel camps like butter lol. Easy XP

 

[isoRhythm]

Man I eat dark souls and bloodborne for breakfast. This is some busy bs. Ready my post above

Git gud...?

 

[GymWolf]

I said I finished returnal and souls/ senior no problem. No need to put shame in gears of war like games. It’s good fun.

Controls in horizon are not good. You catch o rocks and other stuff, enemies are a guess work, it is a hell of a grand for materials which you quickly run out of.

IMO reviewers are blind and idiots. Just the same way they overlooked first game flaws.

I love that the enemies are interesting and varied. But they all look the same, jump around like crazy and are weak to arbitrary methods which often make little sense.
I finished first horizon two times. I knew what I am getting into. But it’s not fun apparently.

I don’t want to overreact. The game is fine. But it’s not a 10

Who ever said that the game is a 10?

the first horizon was my gotg and FOR ME it was a 11/10, but realistically it was a 7,5-8 game.

Disagree on the how you describe the combat, there is little to no guess since you can literally scan any part of the machine to know the weakness and it is pretty logic that shooting off a cannon from an enemies disable that cannon or shooting a flamable container with a fire arrow cause a fire explosion, i hate to say this, but i think you are playing the game in the wrong way.

Maybe watch some advanced player to know why you are failing so much, i'm playing at the hardest difficulty and having the time of my life, and if i die 20 times against a mob, it's always my fault, the game is pretty fair and gives you a fuckload of tools to handle any situation.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

I played almost all day today and yesterday. As someone who didn't like the first one that much I must say that this one is exceptionally good.

Yes, there are bugs (for a Sony first party game: a lot). Yes, climbing is so laughably bad that I'm amazed it was actually implemented like this. But the sense of exploration is so, so good. I think it's the closest to Breath of the Wild that I've ever felt in any game.

Graphically it's strange. It's the first video game that the closer you get, the better it looks. During normal gameplay it can look amazing one second then just okay the next. But every time you open photo mode and zoom in on the detail it's just mind blowing. Lighting can be atrocious, especially indoors (caves, ruins). I hope this is the last generation where RT is not standard.

OK, going back to exploring.

 

[Fess]

It’s nothing in ACV

A curated platforming experience means they can direct you down a certain path.

I am not saying it’s amazing in HFW, but platforming isn’t amazing in ANY open world game. It’s just a means to an end

Well we can agree to disagree. For me it’s frustrating, it’s that one thing that constantly annoys me.

 

[GymWolf]

Off topic but battery life on PS5 controllers is even worse than PS4. I have had to take a break for a half an hour while the controller charges multiple times. I am thinking about going down to Best Buy and getting a long cord so I can just power it through USB.

Not sure if worse but sure is shitty.

 

[SlimySnake]

I think it’s just a matter of being stuck in an early part of the game and feeling weak because you haven’t unlocked a ton of the skill sets and higher level gear

Need to really focus on hunter and melee above all else

Yeah, I mentioned this earlier. It's likely just an unfortunate side effect of introducing RPG elements to the weapon, gear and skill upgrades. Im pretty much fully maxed out on the Hunter skill tree missing only a couple of upgrades that I dont need.

However, I do think there is something about enemy aggression that needs to be tweaked. In HZD, they introduced the Ultra Hard difficulty post game with adjusted enemy behavior to make them more aggressive, attack in unison, and various other changes that have come over to the Normal difficulty this time around. I dont mind a challenge. I beat this difficulty twice just last month and since then have beaten Returnal over 50 times, but I do think it needs a bit of tuning for the first playthrough.

From the Wiki of HZD:

The Ultra Hard difficulty also introduces the following changes:

• Multiple enemies can attack simultaneously.
• Enemy perception range (both visual and auditory) is greatly increased.
• Machines and humans are harder to knock down using the heavy spear attack.
• The Thunderjaw's Disc Launchers are no longer especially vulnerable to Tearblast Arrows.
• Machines that were more inclined to flee will now prefer to fight. This applies to Striders, Broadheads, Chargers, Grazers, and Lancehorns.
• Humans will attack more frequently.

The bit about the Grazers and Lancehorns stood out to me because those fuckers were straight up charging me in HFW just yesterday. I was like what the hell lol

 

[Putonahappyface]

Will this be fixed soon with a patch?

 

[SCB3]

I don’t think climb anywhere = better by default

The platforming in BOTW or ACV is literally nothing. You press up in BOTW and hope your stamina gauge is good enough. It’s extremely boring

The brilliance of BOTW is the discovery, not the platforming

There some truth in that, I enjoyed the puzzle aspect of climbing stuff on the older AC games

This just feels clunky and outdated, again compare it to Uncharted for example that also has this kind of climbing and it just feels better

A bit of polish on that area and it’s a masterpiece imo, it’s more annoyance that takes away for me rather than completely ruins the game, it’s a serviceable but could be better situation