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[Biff Hardbody]

I love Rome: Total War. Its an amazing game, my GOTY. However, I've noticed that playing certain people online there is a tendency to try uber cheap (and stupid) tactics. The ones I've encountered?

All Archer Army

A player will pick an all archer army. 20 units of arachers, all set to skirmish. From there, your army is basically toast unless you can really multitask well, and you better have allot of calvary to beat them. You see, in Rome archers can run very fast when on skirmish, too fast. Send your calvary or soldiers in to get the archers? They get chewed up by the other 15 or so free units. Even worse then this is the dreaded all cataphract horse archer army. Your calvary can't even get to them because the horses can outrun them.

Fortunately, this tactic is beatable. You have to find cover in trees in loose formation and just sit there while they spend all their arrows. You also need a bit of luck. Incredibly cheap tactic, because the guy litteraly has to do nothing. I did this waiting out counter today in 2VS2, and it was boring as fuck. However, it was sweet revenge to get the filthy cheeser when all his arrows were spent up. He's used to winning his battle at the army menu. Not this time though, fucker.

Next up we have...

All Wardog Army

I've had this done to me twice. Once before, and once tonight. the first time I got trashed by an all wardog army, this time I slaughtered it. You see, the problem with wardogs is when you target them your army goes for their handlers, and not the dogs themselves. So, you kill a hundred handlers but you've got about 3000 dogs running amok, unable to target them. How do you beat them? The same way I did tonight. Stand your ground with your phalanx and let them come to you. They'll get shreaded. This guy litteraly sent thousands of wardogs straight at and around my phalanx, hoping to find a crack and swarm in. No strategy, no nothing. Just selected the whole army with one click and attack. Again, I'm unsure of how anyone enjoys that.

I offed his army very quickly. And I stupidly agreed to a rematch. Little did I know he had something planned for me, something so cheap it would warrant a thread being made here! Yes brothers and sisters, I speak to you of...


The Box!!!

I'm no military historian, but I undestand that Alexander The Great used a type of box formation in his "refusing flanks" maneuvar. However, this wasn't Alexanders box. No, this was a box based on the uber cheap tactic of making a octagon and simply just standing there. Now, if this was an actualy military battle I'm sure someone facing that type of box would just walk past them, since its totally immovable and take the land or city they wanted. But, in Rome you can't do that. I've played against several players who form this type of box, and generally you always find a way to beat them. However, this guy had something entirely new up his sleeve.

I should have wondered wtf he was doing because he took like 14 minutes just to setup his army. See, tonight I chose Carthage. I was trying to experiement with phalanx and calvary, but no archers. This guy saw that and knew I would not be able to stand from far away and shoot at his box, so he made a box that was full of catapults, peltaists, and other assorted mayhem. He truly put allot of work into it.

Unfortunately for him, he didn't do enough. The match began, and he just stood there waiting for me to come to him. He ended up blowing away his own front line with the catapult, and shooting a good deal of his own men in the back when he had all his archers bunched in like that. I managed to make a crack in the one area he didn't have a phalanx with my calvary, and punched through that while I engaed two units of his box with 5 of my phalanx. From there it was clear he had no idea what to do, and I destroyed his skirmisers with his calvary and crushed his broken phalanx with my elephants.

Out of all the games I've played in Rome, this was possibly the dumbest and cheapest strategy I've ever seen. I'm glad I beat it.

 

[Kyouji]

Even though I haven't played any of the Total War games after Shogun, I still love reading about the battles, especially when it's someone with real strategy beating up on cheapasses. Thanks for the enjoyable post.

Now I feel like giving Rome a go myself.

 

[Mr Gump]

So how does this game work multiplayer? Is it just those straight up battles like you do in the single player? Or is there more to it?

 

[AstroLad]

Even though I haven't played any of the Total War games after Shogun, I still love reading about the battles, especially when it's someone with real strategy beating up on cheapasses. Thanks for the enjoyable post.

Now I feel like giving Rome a go myself.

I totally agree with this; that was fun to read and I've never played or seen this game in my life. Kudos!

 

[Biff Hardbody]

Even though I haven't played any of the Total War games after Shogun, I still love reading about the battles, especially when it's someone with real strategy beating up on cheapasses. Thanks for the enjoyable post.

Now I feel like giving Rome a go myself.

Your very welcome. You should check Rome out. Despite its various flaws like archers being overpowered, its easily one of the top games I have ever played. If you like battles and strategic warfare, its for you.

So how does this game work multiplayer? Is it just those straight up battles like you do in the single player? Or is there more to it?

Basically yes. You can choose to siege or have large battles with up to 6 or 8 people. Teaming up with some of them, or every man for themsleves. Its quite fun.

I totally agree with this; that was fun to read and I've never played or seen this game in my life. Kudos!

Thank you.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Intresting and fun read!

:lol @ The Box

Well done for beating him mate!!!

 

[Biff Hardbody]

Thanks man. Writing this I was afraid I would get the "Its not cheap if you win" response, but fortunately I got some positive feedback. Thanks guys.

 

[Rei_Toei]

Nice read! I'm a total noob regarding Rome: Total War, and these seem cheap tactics, but what are smart tactics? Is it so realistic you actually use tactics from ancient times, or are the best ways to play defined by the gameplay mechanics?

 

[xabre]

I haven't played it in a while but from what I remember the phalanx formation is way too powerful. Now it is all well and good if it is an impenetrable wall of spears (it should be), the problem is trying to flank it. Now take a situation in which one unit of heavy infantry face off against a unit of spearman in phalanx formation. Obviously trying to take the phalanx head on is suicide so the smart thing is to try to out-flank it with another unit of heavy infantry to the side or rear. The problem though, is that the 'effing spearmen in phalanx turn too bloody quickly (far more quickly than they should) and it becomes very difficult to create an effective pincer movement. Even if your lucky and hit the phalanx to its rear, what should be a devastating attack takes too long to take its toll on the phalanx formation and the enemy can quickly organise reinforcements (typically involving more phalanx...oh boy). If you really want to devastate a unit of phalanx you need a full speed, flanking cavalry charge; however cavalry have their own vulnerabilities (such as long range archer fire) and therefore this is not always feasible. I suppose there are other means of breaking up the phalanx such as skirmishers, archers or siege (and therein lies the beauty and depth of the game), but I think for the typical rookie vs veteran the phalanx is overpowered.

 

[bbyybb]

That was a great read, i really must play it. I bought the game, but at the moment i am caught up with Vampire Bloodlines.


Cheers,
bbyybb.

 

[Templar Wizard]

jeez louise, how i love R:TW... so much so i had to stop playing, it was consuming me.
there is no way i could go online with it, my gf would leave me.

great stories there biff, perhaps you could 'campfire' us with some victories of yours...

btw bbyybb, signing your name in a post is perhaps THE stupidest things i have ever seen. we all can see its you

 

[MomoPufflet]

This reminds my of my friend telling me about Age of Empires II tournaments where people would do literally anything to win no matter how cheap. Although most of the cheapass strategies in AOE2 involved rushing the other player 30 seconds into the game and exploiting one type of unbalanced/overpowered unit (like those Korean war-wagons before the patch, or whatever they were called). This kind of crap makes these kinds of games such a chore to play-- mainly the reason why I only played AOE2 with people I knew, with the understanding we wouldn't pull any stupid shit.

 

[tahrikmili]

Total War games totally rock.. Shogun is my favorite of the lot, but Rome was definitely PC GOTY 2004. Even reading battle reports is incredible fun.

 

[Socreges]

I think I may buy this once I get my computer upgraded. It sounds like something I'd really love.

Actually, would someone mind posting the minimum and recommended specs?

 

[Biff Hardbody]

Glad you guys are interested in this game, it deserves it.

About the phalanx. I have to disagree that its overpowered. It may actually be underpowered. I hear what your saying about the turning, perhaps it should be a little slower. But honestl,y unless you are engaging them so they can't turn they should be able to lift up their spears and turn if their well disciplined soldiers. I can definitely see the Spartans turning really quickly if they were ordered too, but your right...I wouldn't see town militia doing that. Still, I think they did a pretty good job with it. Especially in its weakness on uneven ground and in forests. I cry when I fight with my phalanx in there. Also, I've found when I've hit a phalanx hard with a calvary charge from the back, that was it (that's how I beat "The Box" last night).

The reason why I say a phalanx may be underpowered is because of a common tactic to beating it online is the All calvary rush. In this the opponent picks an all calvary army and rushes them straight in against the enemies phalanx. 1 unit of cataphracts will break 1 phalanx formation in Rome. Yes, the calvary rush will take heavy losses (which is why its a stupid tactic and I'm happy when calvary rushes my phalanx), but the rush will break the phalanx formation and the rest of the rush will finish it off. Rome: Total Realism changes this, a unit of heavy cataphract rush will not break the phalanx. There is much talk about which is more realistic, the phalanx that breaks under rushes, or one that can hold (within reason). People are divided on that viewpoint, but I like the Total Realism version more because it forces players to be more strategic and true to life.

I've found the smartest way to beat it is to engage it in a defensive manner (to minimize losses on your side) from the front so it can't turn, and pepper it with skirmishers while your calvary flanks it. This is actually the best way I've found to beat it, and from what I'm reading in "The Generalship Of Alexander The Great" its true to history. Historically, phalanxs were feared for not just what they could do, but their look. It was a wall of steel coming at you. Terrifying. Anyhow, one of the first reports I read about beating the phalanx was through the use of skirmishers. At one period of time, A Spartan phalanx unit was completely decimated by slingers and peltaists. From there, Greek warfare realized that peltists and slingers were a necessary part of a successful army and used them to suppliment their phalanx. Believe it or not, when I changed this aspect of my army (I didn't use peltists before reading it), my victories went up.

So yes, Rei_Toei, Rome is pretty realistic. You can use warefare strats and hope to have an edge. However, its still a game and some things don't work the way they should. Don't laugh, but I started playing allot better after I watched the Hannibal special on the history channel. My tactis became more about surrounding the enemy. A nice thing about Rome is the enemy can tell when its surrounded, and the morale will lower dramatically.

Socreges, I'm not sure of the recommendations but I remember reading the developer said its a very friendly game pc wise. Don't know if thats true. Try the demo, its out there (although it can't compare to the finished games fun).

As for more war stories, they say a picture speaks a thousand words. Here's my war elephants (which are way to fucking fun to use) showing what they think of "The Box".

One other problem with Rome is that the replays are bugged. They don't always give you exactly what happened. I have no clue why. In my replay of this fight, hey show an elephant dying and I am certain I never lost one. Also, there was no catapult shot into his own front line, and I distinctly remember that happening. Ah well, its still an awesome game.

 

[tahrikmili]

One other problem with Rome is that the replays are bugged. They don't always give you exactly what happened. I have no clue why. In my replay of this fight, hey show an elephant dying and I am certain I never lost one. Also, there was no catapult shot into his own front line, and I distinctly remember that happening. Ah well, its still an awesome game.

I believe this is because the replays record total damage sustained by unit and not by each model, so your unit may have sustained enough damage to kill an elephant but since it was distributed among the elephants evenly, none died, but in the replay they die one by one as damage accumulates.

I'm not sure about this, but this is what I figured, by myself.

 

[Biff Hardbody]

That makes sense. Thanks for explaining that.

 

[Zelda-Bitch]

Biff, you are badass in your Total Romedom. I suck. You would eat my army for breakfest surely, though admittedly I'm sort of a noob to the genre in general. Anyway, I have to say I'm pretty souped up to play again. Maybe I'll watch a couple History channel shows of ancient battles and get some ideas. Thanks for the post man. Made my day.

 

[Biff Hardbody]

Heh, thank sman. Believe me, I'm not that good and have had my fair share of beatdowns. The cool thing about Rome is that just one mistake can change the tide of a battle. I've had games where I did everything right, and then I made some dumbass move because I thought I had it in the bag, 3 minutes later my whole army is routing. Goes both ways though, so that's why I say its cool.

The new patch is coming in two weeks or so, said to have allot of changes. I'm interested to see what they do.

Oh yeah, if any of you are interested in this time and warfare, I have to recommend "The Generalship Of Alexander The Great". Fantastic book, it details Greek warfare from the beginning to the two major players, Dionysius and Jason, Alexander's dad Phillip, and then the man himself. Its really cool to read it and see the units in the game being described in detail and their origins and tactics.

 

[xabre]

The new patch is coming in two weeks or so, said to have allot of changes. I'm interested to see what they do.

Wow that is good news. I though they were going to leave the community in the learch again like Medieval (one patch then they expected you to buy the expansion). I'm going to have to start playing this game again; had some great online battles with it.

 

[mumu]

That was a very interesting read. The Box pic looks great. How long is the average battle?

 

[Biff Hardbody]

They are also coming out with Rome Total Realism 5.0 around next week!

The biggest thing in 5.0 is gameplay, and not neccesarily new units, in fact were staying away from adding new units until 6.0.

Expansion into the east
Reworked unit combat (let me make it clear that i'm not referring to the AI, although the AI will respond differently)
Updated generals
Rome is now unified and reacts much more realistically- especially in regards to expansion and warring.
Hundreds of bug/glitch/stability fixes (including the stuff migrated from the 4.12 patch, thanks tommh)

Maybe:
Latin recordings (depends on Shigawire mainly)

I can't wait.

mumu, its hard to say. I play 2VS2 online allot and batles can be 20-40 minutes.

I played two kick ass battles today. I've noticed people REALLY love horse archers, so if you plan on going online you better get good at defending them. My best advice is to simply wait them out. Sending infantry against them is generally futile, and calvary isn't much better unless you have superior numbers.

I played against the Seluecids and Parthia. Man, both teams had so many guys I couldn't believe. The seleuicd's had 2 armored war elephant units which I managed to takeout with my catapult, 1 just in time. Parthia totally wrecked my Roman teammate with a combination of horse archers, cataphracts, armored camels, and elephants.

I managed to wreck the Selucids and reform my entire army so it faced Parthia just in time.

The pic doesn't show it, but Parthia had two units of Elephants at 11O'clock as well as 1 unit of armored unit of camel archers. I had my calvary covering my flank, but I knew the camals would probably scare the horses, and if they didn't the elephants would trample them. So, I got my cataplut in position just in time and managed to take out the two units of elephants first, and then wail away on the camels as well as they were a hair in front of us.

From there I simply held my position while he ran his horse archers around me in a caravan. When he started to run out of arrows, I sent the calvary in and he was finished. Horse archers are tough, but if you play smart you should be ok.

If anyone plays online, let me know. I'm always up for some fun.

 

[LakeEarth]

These games are so awsome, but I suck so bad at them. I just can never get good, so I give up quick. Oh well! :lol

 

[Fifty]

:lol Way to go Biffy. Fun to read the posts, even if my computer can't run the game. If it could, I'd be right there with ya. Oh yeah, and those War Elephants look totally badass.

 

[Die Squirrel Die]

I haven't even got past the training yet. Maybe once the summer comes I'll sit down and get some playtime on this. I got slightly distracted by making my cavalry run places and then have the chase camera on them. I felt like I was making my own Ride of the Rohirrim from the Return of the King.

 

[AndoCalrissian]

Holy crap, you guys have convinced me to at least give the demo a shot!

 

[Biff Hardbody]

 

[Fifty]

Biffo, more pictures of the elephants!

Although, I really don't think you can top that first one. That could go in national geographic...natural's beauty at its finest.

 

[Biff Hardbody]

Elephants are a gamble. On one hand, armored war elephants are easily the most destructive unit in the game. I've seen them plow through numerous units of infantry like they were nothing. It's hysterical. Plus, they can take an army that is on the brink of defeat and make them winners again. They are the only unit I've seen that can just level the battlefield.

On the other hand, they cost a hell of allot and are easily spooked. Incendiary pigs that cost $200 can blow away your $2700 Elephants. A well placed catapult shot and your elephgants are done. And, if flaming arrows hit them they will route (although it takes a hell of allot of arrows). If your elephants go, your basically screwed because your army is nod oubt much smaller then the other army because you bought elephants.

They are a win big/lose big unit.

Last night I faced my first real big test in awhile. I noticed the guy I ussually partner up with kept fighting against Egypt. Call it fate or whatnot, but he was getting extremely pissed because the Egyptians kept hammering him. Now, I've beaten Egyptians plenty of times, I had just done it before we teamed up. So, I didn't understand why he couldn't handle himself since he's pretty good. Then I saw the "new" type of Egyptian army he's been facing.

6 units of archers, 6 units of Pharohs Guard spearmen, 8 units of desert calvary no doubt beefed up in stats with the leftover cash from the 10,000 you get. This is a gigantic army. Why is it so good and hard to beat?

1st, the archers. Egypt gets 40 more archers per unit (120 compared to the 80 of other armies). So, its like you are fighting 9 units of archers, not 6.

2nd, pray that he does not use Egypt's chosen archers. These are armored better then many infantry!!! They can fight like heavy infantry and shoot better then Cretian archers (who are some of the best archers in the game).

That's not the worst though, the worst is the desert calvary. These are incredibly cheap, so he can stock up on 8 units of them (which is enormous). Not only are they fast, but they have a bonus against ANYTHING armored. They are also great after the initial charge when it turns to melee? What does this mean? It means that although they are not on par with other armies heavy calvary, their superior numbers and armor bonus will have them crush heavy units of Campanion and Praetorian calvary. Their melee attack is also better then most other armies light lancers. In short, they are a bitch to play against.

It took me some time to figure out how to beat them, but with the help of some guys from twcenter I think I did. I've changed my macedonian army to play to its strengths more, while takinga page out of the large units of calvary book.

For one, although Macadonia phalanx stats are average at best compared to the Greeks, Egyptians, and even seleucids, they have the largest amount of soldiers in each unit. Historically, the Macadonian army was based on calvary and phalanx. So, instead of playing it like I had the past, a mixture of units, almost like a Roman strategy I changed it. I made sure to get a full 20 units, 8 of them being phalanx, even though 6 of them aren't the best. 3 of the best archers money could buy, and the rest 9 units of calvary (8 light, 1 heavy).

I destroyed a Roman army that had a very similar setup to Egypt. All Archers and heavy calvary. This was really tough, because his heavy calvary massacred my light calvary. He had superior numbers and stats in that exchange. From there had had about 8-10 units of archers stand around in a circle and pelt me with arrows. I assumed group position, took cover in the trees (thank God for the trees) and let him shoot over and over. At one point he got impatient and tried to flank my phalanx and get behind it, but I turned and destroyed his entire calvary. From there he had nothing but the archers, so I let him just spend time and shoot at my units. It started to rain, so his fire arrows litteraly had no effect, couple that with the group formation and trees, the arrows did nothing to me. Eventually, he had no choice but to send his archers in towards the pahalanx, and they were instantly slaughtered and routed.

I faceed a very similar army to mine in the Selucids, setup was near identical. After betaing them, I feel good about going against Egypt. Here's a pic from the battle as I've engaged tehir phalanx and have my Calvary launching an attack from behind after some careful placement.

 

[Biff Hardbody]

More info on Total Realism 5.0

A small list of stuff present in 5.0:

- General mod 2.0 (by Tommh)
- Total Combat for RTR 4.0 (by Macroi)
(the two previous mods are mixed with the raccomandation of UglySori)
- Revamped combat, especially in regards to elephants, ranged units and armor ratings
- Unofficial patch 4.1.2
- Unified Rome (optional) - also increased Roman realism (increased pila damage, removal of ethnic roman cavalry etc)
- New Province 2.0 (by Linedog)
(with the slave bug corrected)
- East Extension (by lionskin), to western china/burma by 6.0
- Aral Lake, Caspius, Arab Gulf land-sea flickering bug corrected
- Minimap corrected
- disaster.tga corrected (new extended dimension)
- Hellenic walls
- Gallic heavy auxilary and thracian cavalry
- Hundreds of bug fixes including:

Roman slinger fire sounds
Cost of velites, adjustment
Experienced mercenaries
Greek and Ptolemaic walls
Siege time, adjustment
victory conditions, adjustment
distance to capital, adjustment
increase of slinger range and damage
superior range of eastern bows vs. western bows
eventually rechecking historical names (cities, units, leaders)
eastern unit upkeep, adjustments
further reduction of squalor, more buildings to counter
removal of horde formation for sarmatian archers, rendered cantabrian circle useless
increased ammo for elephant and chariot riders
increased damage for pila and javelins, might be covered by total combat
armor adjustments for spartan hoplites, increase
armor adjustment for elephants, decrease
adjusting the roman cavalry, probably increase in cost and upkeep to compensate for lack of historical counterparts
adjustment of lybian spearmen stats, increase
possibly re-adjustment of population growth
public baths and paved roads fix for parthians and pontic

changed name Pluvium to Turris Libisonis (this is the only city I found in History Atlas in that part of Sardinia)
Extend Liguria region and move Genua to its actual position
Eliminated underline from city and region names
Renamed Segesta with Luna (this is the most important city in Apuania) - change only in region_and_settlement_names.txt otherwise game crash)
Change Neapolis to Paestum in Lucania (Neapolis was in Campania)
Renamed Bovianum with Corfinium (this is the most important city in Apuania)
Change Istria with Histria
Change Boianum with Aemilia
Change Corinium in Dumnonium region with Isca (this is the most important city)
Renamed Asturica in Cantabria as Flaviobriga
Tribus_Sakae is now rebel
Parthia belongs to Parthians
Moved general Phraotes in Elymais
Replaced climates.tga with Totoro ones
Modify Aral Lake and Persian Gulf following Totoro files
Eliminated some ine straight vertical borders in some eastern area. Thanks to Totoro
Change Panonia_Inferior in Pannonia_Inferior

Arsakia -> Ecbatana
Sythia_Minor -> Chorasmia
Doura_Europus->Dura-Europos
Sogdia->Sogdiana
Exetended Carmania
Persis capitol is Pasargadae
Added Khorasan (capitol Hecatompylos)
Baktria -> Bactria
Karmania -> Carmania
Renamed Parthia with Hyrcania (capitol Saramana)
Zadrakarta->Saramana
Pura is now capitol of Gedrosia
Dragiana -> Drangiana
Arachosian capitol is now Kapisa
Gedrosias capitol is now Pura
Carmania capitol is now Harmozeia
Kandhar replaced with Phrada
Gandhara -> Gandara
Aria Eliminated
Introduced Massagetes

Renamed Domus_dulcis_domus-> Locus_Gepidae and introduced an entry for its region in the strat.txt
Added some settlements missed in strat.txt (like Pripet, Boihaemum, Dalmatia and others)

Adopted (partially) the suggestion of timur and the correction of Totoro to the map.

- I also modify in many provinces the list of buildings (the most part of them have now a wall to protect)
- All the provinces have now a garrison (east extension included)
- Added ports to Lake Aral
- Corrected the names of some generals (eliminate duplicates)
- In general made slaves stronger
- Modify parthian region (now there are 5 regions: Media, Elymais, Hyrcania, Khorasan, Persis)
- Added a new trade route and ports in Arabian Gulf
- Added Roman_Formation_Mod_050 (by DTMK) to modify the first Triple Line Formation and made it like the one used by Roman legions during the Republic
- Added complete fire projectile fix by DARTH VADER to correct the lag produced by fire projectiles

About the TOTAL COMBAT mod. This is basically a mod that changes the stats for certain units, and in an excellent fashion IMO. Especially for archers. Info on it below-

JAVELIN UNITS:

In RTR 4.1, javelin attack values range from 7 to 14 points, depending on the unit. Since this seemed to be a very broad range (especially considering all the units are throwing the same type of weapon), I have consolidated the values and awarded all javelins a base attack value of 9. I have also given all javelin throwing units the "armor piercing" ability.

SHIELDS:

Awarded +2 to small shields, +3 to medium shields and +4 to large shields. This gives shield carrying units better defence against archers and slingers from the front and shield-side (they are vulnerable to peltasts due to the javelin's AP ability). Units are still vulnerable to missile fire from their non-shield side and the rear. This added shield defence also means that battles will now last longer. Therefore, I have returned all swing rates to normal speed. The shield bonuses were not applied to cavalry units, since a man on horseback is unable to use his shield as effectively as a man on foot.

ARCHERS:

Returned all archer units to their former sizes. In 4.1 Gaius reduced the size of archer units in an effort to reduce their power on the battlefield. While the idea is perfectly logical, in my opinion this method has two significant shortcomings:

1) It doesn't really deal with the issue; namely, that arrows are overly effective against heavily armored units. In vanilla RTW, a unit of archers is fully capable of devastating a unit of armored hoplites. Not only is this highly inaccurate with regards to history, but in gameplay scenarios it all but renders armored troops obsolete on the battlefield. If armor offers little or no protection against missiles, then lightly armored or unarmored troops will always be preferable to heavy units due to their increased speed, mobility and endurance. Merely reducing the number of men in a unit of archers does nothing to alter this situation. In RTR 4.1 it now takes two small units of archers (rather than one normal sized) to devastate a unit of hoplites, but the end result is still the same - and just as unrealistic as it always was.

2) It isn't fair to the archers. Due to the small unit size, archers can now tolerate far fewer casualties. This means that archery units are now disproportionatly more vulnerable to missile fire, cavalry and seige units than they otherwise would be.

As far as the Attack Rating of archers, I fail to see why Warband Huntsmen in Gaul (AR of 15) should have an attack that is TWICE as deadly as a Scythian archer (AR of 7). I see no justification for such a huge difference in AR among archer units. I have given all archer units a base AR of 6, with elite or highly specialized units receiving an AR of 7. Naturally, these values can always be increased through training.

SPEAR UNITS

There is also an enormous discrepancy between the values awarded to the AR of spear units. They range from an AR of 3, on the low end to 16 on the high end. These values are IMO, rather absurd - especially on the low end. Consider that even an untrained peasant with a knife has an AR of 3! Because of this, the base attack for spears has been raised to a minimum of 7 (only slightly higher than entry-level archers). This should also further highlight how rediculously overpowered archers with attack ratings of 12 to 15 were in the first place.

DEFENSIVE SKILL FACTOR

When assessing a unit's total defensive value, three factors are taken into consideration. Armor, shield and the unit's Defensive Skill Factor. This last number is presumably a measure of the unit's skill in self defense. The DSF is not taken into consideration when the unit is attacked by ranged fire. Barbarian units have been given the virtual shaft in this department, since the majority of their units only receive a paltry value of 2 for their DSF. To put this in perspective, even Carthaginian peasants get a 3 for DSF. Personally, I give the barbarians more credit than that. I have raised several of the Barbarian units to what I feel is a well-deserved DSF of 5, which takes into consideration their fierceness and dexterity.

Mod will be out next Friday. Probably with more stuff listed like new units.

 

[Talas]

Woah, awesome battles Biff, congrats.

Did you beat the Egypt guy?

 

[Biff Hardbody]

I ended up doing pretty good against people who used Egypt, haven't lost in awhile. But, I haven't faced an army quite like the one that was just pure destruction. I think I could take it though.

I'm really excited about the new total realism mod...I think archers are pretty much overpowered, and it fixes that supposedly. Next friday can't come soon enough.

 

[xabre]

How would that mod work online though? Couldn't you only play against people with the mod, severly restricting your ability to find a game?

 

[Biff Hardbody]

Couldn't you only play against people with the mod, severly restricting your ability to find a game?

Yes, unfortunately.