Support NeoGAF

[Durante]

How long a socket is around isn't really relevant at all these days, same-socket CPU upgrades haven't made any sense on Intel for more than a decade.

The very simple fact is that a 5820k has 6 cores and a 4 channel memory bus, while a 6700k has 4 cores and a 2 channel memory bus. If you subscribe to the prediction (which is pretty well-founded I'd say) that applications will get increasingly well parallelized in the future, then having more cores and significantly more memory bandwidth is better than having fewer cores and less memory bandwidth.

 

[Hazaro]

CPUs won't get any faster so get just get as many Intel cores and memory bandwidths as you can :')











:'(

 

[knitoe]

Not gonna be a gaming machine, GPU fan won't ever kick into high gear. Mainly CPU heavy work on it, like audio etc.



Really? Surprised to hear this. You think 2011 v3 is gonna be around for longer? Like I said, this won't be a gaming machine, so I mostly care about a high end CPU (and fast SSD + RAM). I'd actually be paying almost exactly the same importing a 6700K or buying a 5820K locally, since the latter is already quite a bit more expensive here.

If it's mainly for work, the 5820K, with 6 core, is the automatic choice unless you have money for the 8 core 5960x. The 6700K is only if you want to save money, and since it's the same price, nope.

 

[industrian]

That new Overclockers UK site design will take some time to get used to.

 

[jarosh]

How long a socket is around isn't really relevant at all these days, same-socket CPU upgrades haven't made any sense on Intel for more than a decade.

The very simple fact is that a 5820k has 6 cores and a 4 channel memory bus, while a 6700k has 4 cores and a 2 channel memory bus. If you subscribe to the prediction (which is pretty well-founded I'd say) that applications will get increasingly well parallelized in the future, then having more cores and significantly more memory bandwidth is better than having fewer cores and less memory bandwidth.

CPUs won't get any faster so get just get as many Intel cores and memory bandwidths as you can :')

If it's mainly for work, the 5820K, with 6 core, is the automatic choice unless you have money for the 8 core 5960x. The 6700K is only if you want to save money, and since it's the same price, nope.

Alright, alright. This is making a lot of sense. I will go with the 5820K after all, then! Thanks for the input!


These are the two Noctuas I can get which are compatible with 2011 v3:
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/product/noctua-nh-d15-1650cm-cpu-coolers-2580255
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/product/noctua-nh-u14s-1650cm-cpu-coolers-2432271

OR the Dark Rock Pro 3
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/Product/2435323

What do you guys think?

 

[knitoe]

Alright, alright. This is making a lot of sense. I will go with the 5820K after all, then! Thanks for the input!


These are the two Noctuas I can get which are compatible with 2011 v3:
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/product/noctua-nh-d15-1650cm-cpu-coolers-2580255
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/product/noctua-nh-u14s-1650cm-cpu-coolers-2432271

OR the Dark Rock Pro 3
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/Product/2435323

What do you guys think?

The Noctua are usually the best performing and most quiet coolers, but they are generally the most expensive. I would go with them. The D15 is currently the best air cooler. The U12S should be fine for moderate overclocking.

 

[jarosh]

The Noctua are usually the best performing and most quiet coolers, but they are generally the most expensive. I would go with them. The D15 is currently the best air cooler. The U12S should be fine for moderate overclocking.

Thanks. The 15 is pretty massive, but so is the Dark Rock Pro. I'll do some googling with the board I'll end up buying to see if there's any issues. But I'll probably go with that one then.

 

[duck_sauce]

Thinking about a gaming pc. I*ve been a console gamer for almost 15 years....so, im going in pretty blind. One thing is for sure.....it is not going to be cheap. The 800€ for a good pc doesnt seem to be true (at least for my build).

I came up with this:


Gygabyte GA-B150M-D3H DDR3 LGA1151
Intel Skylake i5-6500 4x3.2 GHz
2x 4GB DDR3 1600 Kingston

SSD 120 GB Kingston M2 SATA III
1 TB Toshiba SATA III

4096 Ganward GTX 970 28mm

BitFenix Shinobi Midi Tower
be quit! SysPower 500W 80Plus

Windows 10 64

____
1236 €



Is that a good gaming pc for a good price. Is there room for customization? I want a pc that will be able to play current games and is also (to a degree at least) future proof.
Input from experienced pc gamer is highly appreciated.

 

[Durante]

I don't know how you arrived at that price but I just priced out an equivalent system at 890€. With DDR4. Before Windows, which you get for $40 off software swap.

 

[jarosh]

The OP pairs the 5820K with DDR3 RAM. Any particular reason why DDR4 is only worth it with Skylake?

 

[Durante]

The OP is completely wrong in this regard, socket 2011-3 CPUs simply don't work with DDR3. Probably a copy/paste error.

 

[knitoe]

The OP pairs the 5820K with DDR3 RAM. Any particular reason why DDR4 is only worth it with Skylake?

That's a mistake. X99 is only DDR4.

 

[duck_sauce]

I don't know how you arrived at that price but I just priced out an equivalent system at 890€. With DDR4. Before Windows, which you get for $40 off software swap.

Its an online store in germany. I cannot build a pc myself so i have to rely on these kind of deals

 

[jarosh]

The OP is completely wrong in this regard, socket 2011-3 CPUs simply don't work with DDR3. Probably a copy/paste error.

That's a mistake. X99 is only DDR4.

Ouch. Good to know! And goddamn those X99 boards are expensive.

 

[Hey Im Patrick]

Thinking about a gaming pc. I*ve been a console gamer for almost 15 years....so, im going in pretty blind. One thing is for sure.....it is not going to be cheap. The 800€ for a good pc doesnt seem to be true (at least for my build).

I came up with this:


Gygabyte GA-B150M-D3H DDR3 LGA1151
Intel Skylake i5-6500 4x3.2 GHz
2x 4GB DDR3 1600 Kingston

SSD 120 GB Kingston M2 SATA III
1 TB Toshiba SATA III

4096 Ganward GTX 970 28mm

BitFenix Shinobi Midi Tower
be quit! SysPower 500W 80Plus

Windows 10 64

____
1236 €



Is that a good gaming pc for a good price. Is there room for customization? I want a pc that will be able to play current games and is also (to a degree at least) future proof.
Input from experienced pc gamer is highly appreciated.

If you're going Skylake, you will need DDR4 ram, other than that, the build you came up is pretty much all good. You can upgrade in the future by changing the GPU and PSU. If you want further future proof, I suggest to go for a "K" processor, a Z170 motherboard, at least 650-750W PSU, and a good cpu cooler so you can overclock as well.

 

[Calabi]

Thinking about a gaming pc. I*ve been a console gamer for almost 15 years....so, im going in pretty blind. One thing is for sure.....it is not going to be cheap. The 800€ for a good pc doesnt seem to be true (at least for my build).

I came up with this:


Gygabyte GA-B150M-D3H DDR3 LGA1151
Intel Skylake i5-6500 4x3.2 GHz
2x 4GB DDR3 1600 Kingston

SSD 120 GB Kingston M2 SATA III
1 TB Toshiba SATA III

4096 Ganward GTX 970 28mm

BitFenix Shinobi Midi Tower
be quit! SysPower 500W 80Plus

Windows 10 64

____
1236 €



Is that a good gaming pc for a good price. Is there room for customization? I want a pc that will be able to play current games and is also (to a degree at least) future proof.
Input from experienced pc gamer is highly appreciated.

I'd suggest to get a better(higher watt) power supply for a start. You want the core components to be solid and future proof. Motherboard, PSU and case so you dont have to upgrade them for a while. If you cant afford that much just get a cheaper graphics card and then upgrade it a bit later when you can afford better.

 

[Terbinator]

If you're going Skylake, you will need DDR4 ram...

You can use DDR3 if the board supports it.

 

[LilJoka]

You can use DDR3 if the board supports it.

Would have to be DDR3L ideally and very few boards support it.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Broadwell-E, coming around March next year, is drop-in compatible with X99 chipset mobos.

So there is an upgrade path for X99 and 5820K should you desire, although the gains are likely to be miniscule in performance.

 

[jarosh]

Ok so this is the new build I put together with the 5820. No GPU, since I'm using my old one and this isn't a gaming system.

Is the MX200 good or can I do better? I went with the Corsair RM750 over the CM V750, because it's supposed to be the quietest PSU out there.

 

[Durante]

I'd suggest to get a better(higher watt) power supply for a start. You want the core components to be solid and future proof. Motherboard, PSU and case so you dont have to upgrade them for a while. If you cant afford that much just get a cheaper graphics card and then upgrade it a bit later when you can afford better.

I think a quality 500W PSU is plenty for a 6500/970 combination.

Ok so this is the new build I put together with the 5820. No GPU, since I'm using my old one and this isn't a gaming system.

You should get a 4x4 (or 4x8) RAM kit, otherwise you're only using half the bandwidth you might be using.

 

[jarosh]

You should get a 4x4 (or 4x8) RAM kit, otherwise you're only using half the bandwidth you might be using.

Gotcha, thanks!

Best I can do is these ridiculous looking "Ripjaws" at 2666:
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/product/gskill-ripjaws-4-4x-4gb-ddr4-2666-dimm-288-memory-3358114

But the Crucial at 2400 are quite a bit cheaper:
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/produc...ries-4x-4gb-ddr4-2400-dimm-288-memory-2754205

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

You could also get 2X 256GB Crucial SSDs and put them in RAID 0 for almost double read/write performance.

 

[jarosh]

You could also get 2X 256GB Crucial SSDs and put them in RAID 0 for almost double read/write performance.

or i could do this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dougISKs2vQ

 

[Durante]

Gotcha, thanks!

Best I can do is these ridiculous looking "Ripjaws" at 2666:
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/product/gskill-ripjaws-4-4x-4gb-ddr4-2666-dimm-288-memory-3358114

But the Crucial at 2400 are quite a bit cheaper:
https://www.digitec.ch/en/s1/produc...ries-4x-4gb-ddr4-2400-dimm-288-memory-2754205

The real-world performance difference in pretty much everything won't be measurable between those.

 

[jarosh]

The real-world performance difference in pretty much everything won't be measurable between those.

Haha. Thanks for micromanaging my build! I think I'm ready to order.

 

[TheChewyWaffles]

Current build:
i7 2600K
16GB ram
P8Z68-V PRO/GEN3
800w PSU
GTX 970 MSI
SSD / HD

Just looking for any upgrade opportunities here. Is the 2600K holding me back or is it still ok if my goal is to run at High or Ultra settings at 60FPS / 1080p?

 

[Durante]

What frequency are you running it at? With a moderate overclock I cannot imagine it holding you back in any game if your goal is "just" 60 FPS.

 

[Sevenfold]

Current build:
i7 2600K
16GB ram
P8Z68-V PRO/GEN3
800w PSU
GTX 970 MSI
SSD / HD

Just looking for any upgrade opportunities here. Is the 2600K holding me back or is it still ok if my goal is to run at High or Ultra settings at 60FPS / 1080p?

New GPU is the only way. 2600k is fine. 6700k will give you a boost in certain games but if you need more frames across the board then GPU is the only answer.

 

[TheChewyWaffles]

New GPU is the only way. 2600k is fine. 6700k will give you a boost in certain games but if you need more frames across the board then GPU is the only answer.

Kind of figured that. The core build has been amazing (put it together in late 2011) and I've upgraded my GPU twice and still seen improvements. From a GTX 570 to a 760 to my current 970. I'll look into a 980ti or even just wait a bit longer. Thanks for your help.

 

[Calabi]

I think a quality 500W PSU is plenty for a 6500/970 combination.

You should get a 4x4 (or 4x8) RAM kit, otherwise you're only using half the bandwidth you might be using.

Yeah, I guess watt usage has gone down now, but if he wants to add extra hard drives or a more powerful graphics card then he might have problems. And I know some low watt PSU used to have problems with doling out enough power to the rails.

 

[zero shift]

IMHO the only appreciable jump from your current position is a hexacore, as i7's HT is still a mixed bag for gaming.

I think the jump is not worth it for now. You have a good CPU with a good OC. In your position i would probably wait to see what AMD's Zen and Intel's Skylake refresh will bring to the table.
Or if you can find a cheap i7 5820k, X99, DDR4 combo go for them.

This is crazy. The CPU has lasted as long as a console to me. Playing the high end games at a solid 60fps at 1080p or 30fps + 4K. I hope that my GTX 970 has the same mileage.

 

[Sevenfold]

Kind of figured that. The core build has been amazing (put it together in late 2011) and I've upgraded my GPU twice and still seen improvements. From a GTX 570 to a 760 to my current 970. I'll look into a 980ti or even just wait a bit longer. Thanks for your help.

SLI an option?

Might be the better upgrade path from where you are.
What games do you play?

 

[Matty8787]

Thinking of getting rid of my 2 x 144hz BenQ 24" monitors and opting for a 30" 1440p with G Sync

Worth doing or?

 

[Darknight]

Try it on CPU-Z and see what you get. How did you OC it anyway? Manually? Offset or fixed vcore?


I would go for the 980 Ti, avoid the hassles of crossfire. Also way more efficient.

There's nothing you can do yourself, those prebuilt water cooling kits are sealed and never designed to be opened. You can contact the retailer you bought it from and arrange for an exchange or refund if it's still within the return period, contact Cooler Master to get a replacement unit if it's still under warranty, or try playing around with the fan speed settings. My friend had a Corsair H55 water cooler that had a constant bubbling/ticking noise not unlike a fish tank's air pump. After a bunch of trial and error, I was able to figure out that the noise was lessened or even sometimes gone if the fan speed for the header that the pump was plugged into was set low enough.

I have no idea if setting that has any affect on cooling or long term usage, my friend replaced the Corsair H55 before long.



The R9 295X2 has more raw power than a single GTX 980 Ti, but the 980 Ti is preferable for better overall experience. Lower power consumption, heat generation, and no crossfire issues (sometimes lack of support or poor game optimization). Also, I think it's probably the Nvidia drivers, but the 980 Ti offers more consistent and higher minimum framerates, meaning framerate drops aren't as bad or as often.

Thank you for the info!

Another question for all you guys since the monitor stuff came up.

How is the Asus 28in PB287Q compared to the G-sync monitors? I mean its 60hz 1ms response 4K display. Would G-sync be more important for gaming than this one? There are 2 models one is G-sync and this one is 4K. Which one would be better paired with a 980ti? (for gaming primarily)

 

[wowzors]

How hot does it get at 100% load?

78-79C is the hottest it has ever gotten that I am aware of.

 

[The Lamonster]

ASUS ROG G-Sync 27" 1440p. You won't regret it.

http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/Monitors/25+_inch/55626-PG278Q

Good choice. I'm looking forward to the 9Q.

 

[RS4-]

Kind of figured that. The core build has been amazing (put it together in late 2011) and I've upgraded my GPU twice and still seen improvements. From a GTX 570 to a 760 to my current 970. I'll look into a 980ti or even just wait a bit longer. Thanks for your help.

Only upgrades I've made to my build from 2011, which is similar to yours (I've only got 8GBs instead) has been the 6950 to 970. And a new case, FT02 to Enthoo Luxe.

I actually bought two extra SSDs last month, but I only installed one lol. I don't know what to do about the other.

My next upgrade is probably a 4k tv, and painting the case, interior, and either sleeve my cables or buy extensions. I can't buy fully sleeved cables from Cablemod, as my AX750 isn't supported; and I'm not going to bother with the sleeved ones from Corsair themselves, they're not that great. Leaning towards buying the EK Predator 360, but I don't need WC'ing that bad aside from just aesthetic purposes.

 

[Milestoned]

Is it okay to use two separate PCIe cables for powering my R9 390? I somehow expected it to have one 8-pin and one 6-pin connector, but the 390 has two 8-pin connectors. My PSU (be quiet! Pure Power 630W) came with two cables and two connectors on the PSU. Each cable has one 6+2-pin and one 6-pin. I'm wondering if I can just use both cables' 6+2-pin connectors or if I have to buy a new cable.

My CPU won't be here before next week but I startet building today to avoid problems like this. Another weird thing is that my mainboard (Gigabyte Z170-HD3P) is just 305 x 200 mm big. It even says on the box "ATX 305 x 200mm". I thought they all have to be the same size if they're labeled ATX? Didn't encounter any problems until now though, am I fine with this or should I return it?

 

[TGMIII]

Planning on selling my current PC to help pay for a new system. What would everyone's rough idea be for pricing on this PC:

CPU: 2500K
GPU: MSI 6950 2GB
MB: intel DH77KC
RAM: 8GB DDR3
PSU: 750w Corsair
Case: CM HAF-X

Also regarding HBM2. We're not expecting HBM2 cards for at least 6 months at the earliest (unlikely?) but what are peoples expectations for the enthusiast level HBM2 cards? I'm not in a major major need for a new card right now but I've love to get my hands on a 980ti within the next few weeks but would be willing to wait the 6 months if the general thoughts are waiting for HBM2 is going to be worth it.

I understand it's hard predict how they will end up but I'm just interested to see what the thoughts are of people who follow the hardware scene closer than I do.

 

[Foxyone]

Can a SFF business PC work with any GPU as long as it fits? I see that some say the PCI express x16 can only provide 25W, so is upgrading an old office PC a no go?

 

[Wowfunhappy]

Can a SFF business PC work with any GPU as long as it fits? I see that some say the PCI express x16 can only provide 25W, so is upgrading an old office PC a no go?

Kind of. A lot of GPU's need external power connectors. Thus, you'll need to figure out:

-How many watts can the computer's power supply support?
-Are there any free cables coming off of your power supply?

For example, your power supply may have extra connectors coming off of it that can be used to power additional SATA hard drives. You can get an adapter that will allow you to use these with a GPU instead. This is how I got a GTX 970 working in an old Dell.

 

[Foxyone]

Kind of. A lot of GPU's need external power connectors. Thus, you'll need to figure out:

-How many watts can the computer's power supply support?
-Are there any free cables coming off of your power supply?

For example, your power supply may have extra connectors coming off of it that can be used to power additional SATA hard drives. You can get an adapter that will allow you to use these with a GPU instead. This is how I got a GTX 970 working in an old Dell.

240-320W with 90+ efficiency apparently, although I'd only want to put a 750 ti in the thing. I never knew about a SATA to 6-pin; I think it may have a spare SATA cable, although in the case of this one computer, the only solution I've read about so far was adding a 2nd PSU into the slot below the DVD drive to power the GPU because of "lack of 12V power for the graphics card". Still though, it'd definitely have to be a slim GPU with a 6-pin?

 

[Darknight]

You know I hate to bother you guys but Im also trying to sell my old rig to buy something new. Realistically how much could I get for the set up below?

CPU: i5 2500k
GPU: Nvidia Geforce GTX 460 1GB
CPU Cooler: Arctic Cooling Freezer i30
Mobo: Asrock Z86 Extreme 3 Gen 3
RAM: 8GB Ballistix Red DDR3 1333
PSU: Antec True Power 750W
HDD: 1TB WD Black 32MB?
Case: Antec 900 V1
Drive: Lite-on DVD write/reader
OS: May throw in Win 7 Home Premium key if it works

Was thinking $300 but dont want to short sale if it should go lil bit more. I think the CPU is the most valuable piece, then the PSU.(seagate made I think, can handle new set ups) Everything is ok.

 

[MisterNoisy]

Is it okay to use two separate PCIe cables for powering my R9 390? I somehow expected it to have one 8-pin and one 6-pin connector, but the 390 has two 8-pin connectors. My PSU (be quiet! Pure Power 630W) came with two cables and two connectors on the PSU. Each cable has one 6+2-pin and one 6-pin. I'm wondering if I can just use both cables' 6+2-pin connectors or if I have to buy a new cable.

My CPU won't be here before next week but I startet building today to avoid problems like this. Another weird thing is that my mainboard (Gigabyte Z170-HD3P) is just 305 x 200 mm big. It even says on the box "ATX 305 x 200mm". I thought they all have to be the same size if they're labeled ATX? Didn't encounter any problems until now though, am I fine with this or should I return it?

Use both PCI-E cables from your PSU, yeah. As for the motherboard, it should still fit in a standard ATX case.

 

[jarosh]

Long shot, but is there a way to use my Windows 10 upgrade on a new system? I have Windows 7 on this machine and obviously am eligible for the free upgrade but I don't want it on this machine. Since I'm building a new computer, I would need it there...

 

[kennah]

You know I hate to bother you guys but Im also trying to sell my old rig to buy something new. Realistically how much could I get for the set up below?

CPU: i5 2500k
GPU: Nvidia Geforce GTX 460 1GB
CPU Cooler: Arctic Cooling Freezer i30
Mobo: Asrock Z86 Extreme 3 Gen 3
RAM: 8GB Ballistix Red DDR3 1333
PSU: Antec True Power 750W
HDD: 1TB WD Black 32MB?
Case: Antec 900 V1
Drive: Lite-on DVD write/reader
OS: May throw in Win 7 Home Premium key if it works

Was thinking $300 but dont want to short sale if it should go lil bit more. I think the CPU is the most valuable piece, then the PSU.(seagate made I think, can handle new set ups) Everything is ok.

300 is a bit low, but honestly, put a new gpu in and you're good to go for another couple years.

 

[BolognaOni]

240-320W with 90+ efficiency apparently, although I'd only want to put a 750 ti in the thing. I never knew about a SATA to 6-pin; I think it may have a spare SATA cable, although in the case of this one computer, the only solution I've read about so far was adding a 2nd PSU into the slot below the DVD drive to power the GPU because of "lack of 12V power for the graphics card". Still though, it'd definitely have to be a slim GPU with a 6-pin?

The PCIe on the MB might be limited to 25w if it was never meant to take a graphics card. If it was, then I'd imagine it can do 75W. If you're not sure about what the MB can do, then it would be best to get a card with the external 6p connector.

Does the power supply give an amperage breakdown per rail at all? How much capability is there on the 12V? If it's 18A+ you're probably set, and possibly still fine with a bit less than that.

Unfortunately, ratings on power supplies are a gray area. Once you get to the margins it's really tough to tell if something is good or not. Which is why most people prefer to just comfortably oversize.

 

[BolognaOni]

Long shot, but is there a way to use my Windows 10 upgrade on a new system? I have Windows 7 on this machine and obviously am eligible for the free upgrade but I don't want it on this machine. Since I'm building a new computer, I would need it there...

I take it the win 7 install is locked to that machine? If so, MS still usually lets you transfer if you tell them the MB died.

Once you upgrade to 10 you'll no longer have a product key, and license is tied to that hardware (usually the MB is the key component you can't change). Not sure how lenient they are going to be about moving the free license.

So I'd suggest installing 7 on the new machine first, activate it, tell them the old MB died if you need to, and then upgrade that one to 10.

 

[Wowfunhappy]

240-320W with 90+ efficiency apparently, although I'd only want to put a 750 ti in the thing. I never knew about a SATA to 6-pin; I think it may have a spare SATA cable, although in the case of this one computer, the only solution I've read about so far was adding a 2nd PSU into the slot below the DVD drive to power the GPU because of "lack of 12V power for the graphics card". Still though, it'd definitely have to be a slim GPU with a 6-pin?

This is what I used to get a GTX 970 to work in my old Dell Inspiron 530. The 970 required TWO 6-pin power connectors, and my Dell's crappy PSU only had one.

As you can see, the adapter I linked above takes _TWO_ SATA power inputs and converts them into a _SINGLE_ 6-pin power connector. This worked PERFECTLY for my 970.

Since the 750 ti only takes a single 6-pin, I think this adapter would work, provided you have two free SATA power cables.

If someone more knowledgable about this stuff could chime in here, that would be great. I only know what happened to work for me.