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[manueldelalas]

It seems the OP is decided, but I ask two things:

Do you have Windows 8.1 with classic shell installed? (if not, do it, like right now).

Do you understand that it's not fair to compare a $500 notebook with a $1500 one?

In my opinion, for the price of a MBP you can buy a competent gaming Notebook, and Windows 8.1 is a fantastic OS once you install Classic Shell, much better than Windows 7. And a SSD HDD will solve the slowness over time problem all Windows computers have.

Plus it's undeniable that for overall use, the PC is the best choice.

 

[Barbacoatl]

Sell the toddlers' iphones, get them tamagotchis and get yourself a proper laptop.

 

[xxracerxx]

Plus it's undeniable that for overall use, the PC is the best choice.

How so?

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

Kinda the exact opposite.

Was a devout Apple fan for a decade. Bought iBook, Powerbook, Macbook, iMac, eMac, Power Mac, etc. Then I realized that while they're very nice machines aesthetically, the OS was becoming less usable, the actual product you were getting for the price was laughable. The Mac Pro was insanely expensive for what you got for years and the new one isn't much of a change.

iMacs are cool, though, even if they lack in certain areas. Planning on buying a house soon and for the bedroom I might buy a used 27 inch iMac.


But about three or four years ago I switched to Windows. Now I roll with a Dell Latitude 14 7000 and a Surface Pro 3. Windows 8 has its problems but a significant amount of them are fixed with touch screens.

One thing that turns me off of Apple products is the split software base between Mac OS and iOS products. MS has a good idea on their hands with combining the marketplaces for their tablets and PCs. The long term goal is to have a combined marketplace for phone, PC, tablet, and Xbox but we'll see if they can actually pull that together.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

As I've asked before, what makes Macs so much more user friendly versus modern Windows?

I don't know if these count as "user friendliness" or "power user features", but:
- Mission Control (née Exposé) for window management and virtual desktops
- pervasive drag-and-drop (I can drag images and text off a web page and into an email or an instant message or Photoshop or or or... )
- Terminal is amazing (functional transparency, can mouse control the cursor in remote shells as well as local)
- network management on laptops (maybe this is finally fixed in 8.1? haven't used it on a laptop)
- Just in general, the OS feels less in my way; I have far fewer "WTF are you doing, computer!?" moments on the Mac (but still more than I want).

To bad Apple changed the Mini so you can no longer do what you did. You can't have a 2nd HD anymore.

Yes, that was an extremely shitty move by Apple.

FWIW, the fusion-drive models can take a 2.5" SSD in place of their 2.5" HDD, and you have the very, very fast PCI-E SSD. But I too am not a fan of the new one. Hopefully the quad core models return when Intel puts one out in a common socket with the other chips in the line that the Mini uses.

 

[Ingueferroque]

Plus it's undeniable that for overall use, the PC is the best choice.

Really, undeniable?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Really, undeniable?

Off topic, but: Reverof Nohtaram.

 

[Ingueferroque]

Off topic, but: Reverof Nohtaram.

Yeah man, memories.

 

[Always-honest]

Kinda the exact opposite.

Was a devout Apple fan for a decade. Bought iBook, Powerbook, Macbook, iMac, eMac, Power Mac, etc. Then I realized that while they're very nice machines aesthetically, the OS was becoming less usable, the actual product you were getting for the price was laughable. The Mac Pro was insanely expensive for what you got for years and the new one isn't much of a change.

iMacs are cool, though, even if they lack in certain areas. Planning on buying a house soon and for the bedroom I might buy a used 27 inch iMac.


But about three or four years ago I switched to Windows. Now I roll with a Dell Latitude 14 7000 and a Surface Pro 3. Windows 8 has its problems but a significant amount of them are fixed with touch screens.

One thing that turns me off of Apple products is the split software base between Mac OS and iOS products. MS has a good idea on their hands with combining the marketplaces for their tablets and PCs. The long term goal is to have a combined marketplace for phone, PC, tablet, and Xbox but we'll see if they can actually pull that together.

Yep, i agree. 27 inch iMac was the only option for me instead of a bareboned Powermac (Mac Pro). And i have to say it is an amazing machine. Bought it maxed out but only because i had some extra money from a taxreturn. Apple really is charging riddiculous prices for silly stuff and that makes them very unsympathetic.
I've been working on Mac mostly for over 20 years now. And while i also have used pc's and windows laptops over all these years, i prefer macs by far.
But Apple themselves are slowly making sure guys like me are switching to Pc's. My laptop is a Windows laptop. And while i still don't like the OS, it does the job. I'd love a macbook but i just couldn't justify the price..

With yosemite, iOs and Os have been becoming closer though, by the way.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

With yosemite, iOs and Os have been becoming closer though, by the way.

Last Apple I had and upgraded was to, IIRC, 10.8 and it added some touch like functions to the OS in lieu of an actual touch screen, it seemed like they should just jump in with a touch screen and call it a day. It's INCREDIBLY easy to use 8.1 with a touch screen.

That and 10.8 broke compatibility with software like Office.

 

[manueldelalas]

How so?

I'm referring here about how all mainstream applications are made to be used on PC first, and Mac second (if there is support at all). To run Office, you can use the awful Office for MAC, use the MAC suite which is incomplete compared to Office, or use Wine (or similar) and run the Windows version, which works well, but it's a workaround.

If you want to play games on a MAC you have to either port beg to infinity or dualboot Windows with it. Plus, you'll get less hardware for the same money.

And this happens with a shit ton of software, and it's undeniably a problem. Most of the problems can be solved with workarounds, but don't come saying that it's a non issue, because it is.

I don't want to insult owners of Apple things here, I'm sure a lot of you are happy with what you have, know the advantages and disadvantages with the system for you and have most or all of the issues solved, but I think it's important to mention that things you take for granted on a PC are difficult to do on a Mac if you are not accustomed to it.

That's what I was referring to.

 

[Always-honest]

Last Apple I had and upgraded was to, IIRC, 10.8 and it added some touch like functions to the OS in lieu of an actual touch screen, it seemed like they should just jump in with a touch screen and call it a day. It's INCREDIBLY easy to use 8.1 with a touch screen.

That and 10.8 broke compatibility with software like Office.

Yeah Office has always been a problem for me. I needed it for Word and excell documents that people sent to me. I don't use it anymore on Mac. Pages, Numbers and programs like that seem to be fully compatible with Office documents. I was kinda surprised with that. Never used those programs before but they were installed on my IMac.
I mostly just use Adobe Software. I don't really use spreadsheet and wordprocessing software much but i do receive documents made by others.
Always the most horrible looking documents possible by the way.

I work a lot with an Intuous Pro and you can use that as a touchscreen. For me iOs and MacOs feel closer than ever.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

I'm referring here about how all mainstream applications are made to be used on PC first, and Mac second (if there is support at all). To run Office, you can use the awful Office for MAC, use the MAC suite which is incomplete compared to Office, or use Wine (or similar) and run the Windows version, which works well, but it's a workaround.

If you want to play games on a MAC you have to either port beg to infinity or dualboot Windows with it. Plus, you'll get less hardware for the same money.

And this happens with a shit ton of software, and it's undeniably a problem. Most of the problems can be solved with workarounds, but don't come saying that it's a non issue, because it is.

I don't want to insult owners of Apple things here, I'm sure a lot of you are happy with what you have, know the advantages and disadvantages with the system for you and have most or all of the issues solved, but I think it's important to mention that things you take for granted on a PC are difficult to do on a Mac if you are not accustomed to it.

That's what I was referring to.

You have a very narrow definition of "all mainstream applications", and regardless, web apps are far more mainstream than desktop apps now anyway. Gmail and Facebook have an order of magnitude more users than Office.

Also, Google Docs seems to work just fine for most people I encounter *shrug* . I haven't used a word processing, spreadsheet or presentation app since college so I can't speak from personal experience, but I do know you can load and save MS Office formats so what's the big difference?

 

[Earthanoid]

I don't know if these count as "user friendliness" or "power user features", but:
- Mission Control (née Exposé) for window management and virtual desktops
- pervasive drag-and-drop (I can drag images and text off a web page and into an email or an instant message or Photoshop or or or... )
- Terminal is amazing (functional transparency, can mouse control the cursor in remote shells as well as local)

For your first bullet, you can swipe from the left on a Win8 machine or Windows+Tab on a Win7 machine. For the second, drag and drop works everywhere on Windows machines too. I don't use Terminal on my Mac but from what I've done it's comparable to the command line.

I use both Mac and Windows quite a bit and they're roughly equivalent, you just need to find where the functions you want are in the other system. Macs being more user friendly is a just a perception that has persisted from Vista and earlier Windows versions (which were legitimately a pain to use in comparison to Macs at the time).

- network management on laptops (maybe this is finally fixed in 8.1? haven't used it on a laptop)
- Just in general, the OS feels less in my way; I have far fewer "WTF are you doing, computer!?" moments on the Mac (but still more than I want).

I'm not sure what problems you're running into, but I find network management to be more or less the same in both systems. The OS getting in your way is probably a function of you being more accustomed to OSX. I think a lot of people use OSX for a long time then get flustered using Windows because things don't operate exactly the same way, but someone going from Windows to OSX will experience the same thing.

 

[adamsappel]

ITT people compare $1200+ computers to sub $300 computers.

On the other side, people often claim they can spend half the cost of an Apple and get twice the computer.

Yes, you are paying a premium for Apple hardware. I think the build-quality, customer service, OS and ecosystem integration are worth it. I do think Apple absolutely overcharges for RAM.

 

[Aylinato]

On the other side, people often claim they can spend half the cost of an Apple and get twice the computer.

Yes, you are paying a premium for Apple hardware. I think the build-quality, customer service, OS and ecosystem integration are worth it. I do think Apple absolutely overcharges for RAM.

Ecosystem feels suffocating, you can't do things Apple doesn't want you to do. I'm an adult I want what programs I use to be my choice

 

[Dougald]

The OS getting in your way is probably a function of you being more accustomed to OSX. I think a lot of people use OSX for a long time then get flustered using Windows because things don't operate exactly the same way, but someone going from Windows to OSX will experience the same thing.

As a long time Windows/Linux user who bought a Mac last year, you are absolutely right. OSX got "in my way" until I'd learnt how to use it.

In terms of which is better, like most things in life it's a case of the right tool for the job. Horses for courses and all that

Ecosystem feels suffocating, you can't do things Apple doesn't want you to do. I'm an adult I want what programs I use to be my choice

Absolutely not the case in OSX (absolutely the case in ios)

 

[Hoo-doo]

Ecosystem feels suffocating, you can't do things Apple doesn't want you to do. I'm an adult I want what programs I use to be my choice

Like what? I don't think you know what you're talking about.

 

[xxracerxx]

Ecosystem feels suffocating, you can't do things Apple doesn't want you to do. I'm an adult I want what programs I use to be my choice

What?

 

[manueldelalas]

You have a very narrow definition of "all mainstream applications", and regardless, web apps are far more mainstream than desktop apps now anyway. Gmail and Facebook have an order of magnitude more users than Office.

Also, Google Docs seems to work just fine for most people I encounter *shrug* . I haven't used a word processing, spreadsheet or presentation app since college so I can't speak from personal experience, but I do know you can load and save MS Office formats so what's the big difference?

And you are absolutely right, I mean if web browsing is all you do, you might as well buy a Chromebook which costs $200, is lighting fast, the battery last a shit ton and starts in 5 seconds. Even run videos at 1080p without problems.

But my point stands, because if you want to do more than that, you can use a Macbook without problem, but in my opinion, Office is absolutely essential and no, Google Docs is absolutely shit, and trust me, I've tried... and gaming too...

Also, since you brought browsers, how do browsers run on Mac? I remember Chrome being kind of awful (don't know if it's been fixed), same with Firefox, so you are stuck with Safari, which is serviceable I guess...

Again, if you have a Mac, don't take my post as offensive, because chances are you solved all of the problems mentioned, and you are really happy with it, and that's fine with me, and if it lasts you a lot of years, then it's a great buy in my book.

 

[The Real Abed]

Plus it's undeniable that for overall use, the PC is the best choice.

I deny it. What do you think of that? I just broke your unbreakable logic.

Ecosystem feels suffocating, you can't do things Apple doesn't want you to do. I'm an adult I want what programs I use to be my choice

I deny this too. I do things in OS X all the time that I haven't been able to do in Windows using software that just doesn't have an equivalent for various reasons. Exactly what are you trying to do that Apple is apparently keeping you from doing?

 

[Deleted member 12837]

And you are absolutely right, I mean if web browsing is all you do, you might as well buy a Chromebook which costs $200, is lighting fast, the battery last a shit ton and starts in 5 seconds. Even run videos at 1080p without problems.

But my point stands, because if you want to do more than that, you can use a Macbook without problem, but in my opinion, Office is absolutely essential and no, Google Docs is absolutely shit, and trust me, I've tried... and gaming too...

Also, since you brought browsers, how do browsers run on Mac? I remember Chrome being kind of awful (don't know if it's been fixed), same with Firefox, so you are stuck with Safari, which is serviceable I guess...

Again, if you have a Mac, don't take my post as offensive, because chances are you solved all of the problems mentioned, and you are really happy with it, and that's fine with me, and if it lasts you a lot of years, then it's a great buy in my book.

I'm a web developer, probably spend 10 hours every day in Chrome. It's lightning fast. Really, these days the performance differences across desktop browsers, with the exception of really cutting-edge, demanding 3D transforms and graphics, etc, are negligible.

Can you explain why Google Docs is "shit"? I'm curious, it's the first time I've ever heard someone complain about it. What can't it do that Word can? Editing and formatting text seems pretty basic...

 

[anthym]

I switched from using Windows my entire life (from age 5 to age 26) to a OS X on a Macbook Air a few months ago. At first it was frustrating trying to figure out how to do everything. But once you get the hang of it there's no going back. I've never had an issue with it, everything is fast and intuitive, and the trackpad is awesome. Bought mine on sale at best buy for $800.

 

[manueldelalas]

I'm a web developer, probably spend 10 hours every day in Chrome. It's lightning fast. Really, these days the performance differences across desktop browsers, with the exception of really cutting-edge, demanding 3D transforms and graphics, etc, are negligible.

Can you explain why Google Docs is "shit"? I'm curious, it's the first time I've ever heard someone complain about it. What can't it do that Word can? Editing and formatting text seems pretty basic...

Awesome that Chrome problems have been solved.

Gdocs is shit, at least for me. I work with Office mainly, and I open my documents in gDocs, it either changes the format if it's Word, or just doesn't work as intended if it's Excel. And I'm not speaking about complicated stuff, no macros here. I opened an Excel two days ago on my Chromebook, and it changed all the numbers, because in my country we use " . " to separate thousands and " , " to separate decimals, and Excel is fine with that, but gDocs screwed it all up. And it has few formatting options and is missing really basic stuff. I can't work from here (I'm on vacation, but I own the enterprise...), and my only option is to use remote desktop...

If you work with Office, you'll know gDocs will not cut it.

 

[xxracerxx]

Awesome that Chrome problems have been solved.

Gdocs is shit, at least for me. I work with Office mainly, and I open my documents in gDocs, it either changes the format if it's Word, or just doesn't work as intended if it's Excel. And I'm not speaking about complicated stuff, no macros here. I opened an Excel two days ago on my Chromebook, and it changed all the numbers, because in my country we use " . " to separate thousands and " , " to separate decimals, and Excel is fine with that, but gDocs screwed it all up. And it has few formatting options and is missing really basic stuff. I can't work from here (I'm on vacation, but I own the enterprise...), and my only option is to use remote desktop...

If you work with Office, you'll know gDocs will not cut it.

Hey Mac has that!

 

[Junior Mint]

Google docs is shit if you use anything more than the most basic of formatting options. It can't even import the correct paragraph breaks in most documents. It's probably Microsoft's fault for using docx since nothing ever seems to be able to import that file format properly but still.

 

[FauX]

It seems the OP is decided, but I ask two things:

Do you have Windows 8.1 with classic shell installed? (if not, do it, like right now).

Do you understand that it's not fair to compare a $500 notebook with a $1500 one?

In my opinion, for the price of a MBP you can buy a competent gaming Notebook, and Windows 8.1 is a fantastic OS once you install Classic Shell, much better than Windows 7. And a SSD HDD will solve the slowness over time problem all Windows computers have.

Plus it's undeniable that for overall use, the PC is the best choice.

All this. Besides windows 10 is around the corner.

 

[panzone]

I switched from using Windows my entire life (from age 5 to age 26) to a OS X on a Macbook Air a few months ago. At first it was frustrating trying to figure out how to do everything. But once you get the hang of it there's no going back. I've never had an issue with it, everything is fast and intuitive, and the trackpad is awesome. Bought mine on sale at best buy for $800.

This is also my story. I bought my first mac (an Air) last summer (thanks GSOC) and after I understand the system I can't going back, it was an incredible improvement for work.

All this. Besides windows 10 is around the corner.

Windows 10 can be really a turing point for developers who wants to use Windows. I can't believe it will actually have a packet manager.

 

[TekGryphon]

Great battery life
Great build quality
They last a LONG time
OS X > Windows imo (obviously that's a personal thing tho)

Smaller battery capacity plus inescapable physics of deteriorating batteries over time combined with non-replacable batteries = great battery life?

What?

Oh, and to the OP:

Google -> Classic Shell -> Install

Congrats, I just saved you from paying a 25-100% markup on technology with two year out of date components and features for the rest of your life.

Edit: If the above 3-steps give you trouble, disregard my advise and grab an Apple and never look back.

 

[panzone]

Smaller battery capacity plus inescapable physics of deteriorating batteries over time combined with non-replacable batteries = great battery life?

What?

Oh, and to the OP:

Google -> Classic Shell -> Install

Congrats, I just saved you from paying a 25-100% markup on technology with two year out of date components and features for the rest of your life.

Edit: If the above 3-steps give you trouble, disregard my advise and grab an Apple and never look back.

I always love when people compare laptops only on pure CPU and GPU power.

I'm the only one who thinks that in a laptop there are other things more important ? Seriously, when you can find me a laptop with a 13h battery, 1,26kg in aluminium instead of cheap plastic and other little useful things like magsafe for 850€ please call me (and I don't even mention OS X, a unix-like system that works, since I understand that it's an incredible advantage only for me since what I do as a developer). I spent months trying to find something better than my Air and since it's a laptop I quite value battery life, dimensions and weight instead of a discrete gpu.

 

[xxracerxx]

I always love when people compare laptops only on pure CPU and GPU power.

It's all that matters to some.

 

[PG2G]

Seems like it'd be best to wait until later in the month and find out what Windows 10 will bring to the table before switching.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

Awesome that Chrome problems have been solved.

Gdocs is shit, at least for me. I work with Office mainly, and I open my documents in gDocs, it either changes the format if it's Word, or just doesn't work as intended if it's Excel. And I'm not speaking about complicated stuff, no macros here. I opened an Excel two days ago on my Chromebook, and it changed all the numbers, because in my country we use " . " to separate thousands and " , " to separate decimals, and Excel is fine with that, but gDocs screwed it all up. And it has few formatting options and is missing really basic stuff. I can't work from here (I'm on vacation, but I own the enterprise...), and my only option is to use remote desktop...

If you work with Office, you'll know gDocs will not cut it.

Got it, thanks for the explanation. Come to think of it, the people I know who need spreadsheets and word processors usually don't go back and forth between Office and gDocs, they just pick one, so the import will never pose an issue. I'll keep that in mind.

 

[Druz]

A dirty Mac vs PC thread. Okay, I'll bite.

OSX is the weakest part of Apple laptops. We can also mention you're screwed if your Macbook fails out of warranty. Good luck replacing that irreplaceable component. Most of its users aren't even using OSX right and don't know it. Features they expect but are missing get thought about for a few moments and quietly accepted. I work on Macs every single day and it's really amazing how much I dislike everything about them.

Price tag is everything including the false sensation that you'd riding on the height of laptop superiority. I'll give you the aluminum shell, nice stuff. Except you still have a standard HDD inside prone to every single thing a HDD is weak to. So don't be one of those idiots saying you can abuse your macbook for the past 5 years and it still works. You don't know what you're talking about. But that's par for the course in an Apple argument. I'm excluding SSDs of course.

Ahhh how did I get here.

 

[xxracerxx]

A dirty Mac vs PC thread. Okay, I'll bite.

OSX is the weakest part of Apple laptops. We can also mention you're screwed if your Macbook fails out of warranty. Good luck replacing that irreplaceable component. Most of its users aren't even using OSX right and don't know it. Features they expect but are missing get thought about for a few moments and quietly accepted. I work on Macs every single day and it's really amazing how much I dislike everything about them.

Price tag is everything including the false sensation that you'd riding on the height of laptop superiority. I'll give you the aluminum shell, nice stuff. Except you still have a standard HDD inside prone to every single thing a HDD is weak to. So don't be one of those idiots saying you can abuse your macbook for the past 5 years and it still works. You don't know what you're talking about. But that's par for the course in an Apple argument. I'm excluding SSDs of course.

Ahhh how did I get here.

Were you aiming for worst post in this thread? I think you got it, especially about the 5 year thing.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

A dirty Mac vs PC thread. Okay, I'll bite.

OSX is the weakest part of Apple laptops. We can also mention you're screwed if your Macbook fails out of warranty. Good luck replacing that irreplaceable component. Most of its users aren't even using OSX right and don't know it. Features they expect but are missing get thought about for a few moments and quietly accepted. I work on Macs every single day and it's really amazing how much I dislike everything about them.

Price tag is everything including the false sensation that you'd riding on the height of laptop superiority. I'll give you the aluminum shell, nice stuff. Except you still have a standard HDD inside prone to every single thing a HDD is weak to. So don't be one of those idiots saying you can abuse your macbook for the past 5 years and it still works. You don't know what you're talking about. But that's par for the course in an Apple argument. I'm excluding SSDs of course.

Ahhh how did I get here.

What Mac laptop has a HDD in it? Those have been gone for years across the lineup haven't they?

 

[Junior Mint]

Macbook Pro (non retina) still has them. I own a Macbook but Apple should be ashamed of themselves for still selling that thing. I feel bad for anyone that ends up buying one.

 

[bms2993]

I think they are expensive because Macs are built so precisely and never skimping out when it comes to build quality. Frankly, I grew up from the Mac and am now a Linux user. My job demands it.

 

[Schlep]

I'm the only one who thinks that in a laptop there are other things more important ? Seriously, when you can find me a laptop with a 13h battery, 1,26kg in aluminium instead of cheap plastic and other little useful things like magsafe for 850€ please call me (and I don't even mention OS X, a unix-like system that works, since I understand that it's an incredible advantage only for me since what I do as a developer). I spent months trying to find something better than my Air and since it's a laptop I quite value battery life, dimensions and weight instead of a discrete gpu.

I definitely prefer the Surface Pro 3 for my line of work. The ultra portability of it, stylus input, and Windows makes it much more useful in a corporate environment and for travel. Each person is going to find which features are most useful to them.

 

[manueldelalas]

Got it, thanks for the explanation. Come to think of it, the people I know who need spreadsheets and word processors usually don't go back and forth between Office and gDocs, they just pick one, so the import will never pose an issue. I'll keep that in mind.

But even if I pick Google Docs, everyone still uses Office, and I need to share documents, so format will still be a pain in the ass, and trust me, I've tried using gDocs, Libre Office, Gnumeric (the Linux version is competent), Abiwords, even some cheaper paid suites (Corel and IBM...). I always come back running to Office which is a truly great software in my opinion. The Mac version being shit is a deal killer to me.

But if OP is already invested in Apple's ecosystem and wants a Macbook, then he should buy it, but if he asks for advice on an Internet forum, advice he shall receive. All in saying is that the transition can be harsh, and OSX is not without annoyances and quirks of its own.

 

[panzone]

I definitely prefer the Surface Pro 3 for my line of work. The ultra portability of it, stylus input, and Windows makes it much more useful in a corporate environment and for travel. Each person is going to find which features are most useful to them.

The Surface 3 was a close call during my choice. It's an incredible machine.

 

[Arcteryx]

A dirty Mac vs PC thread. Okay, I'll bite.

OSX is the weakest part of Apple laptops. We can also mention you're screwed if your Macbook fails out of warranty. Good luck replacing that irreplaceable component. Most of its users aren't even using OSX right and don't know it. Features they expect but are missing get thought about for a few moments and quietly accepted. I work on Macs every single day and it's really amazing how much I dislike everything about them.

Price tag is everything including the false sensation that you'd riding on the height of laptop superiority. I'll give you the aluminum shell, nice stuff. Except you still have a standard HDD inside prone to every single thing a HDD is weak to. So don't be one of those idiots saying you can abuse your macbook for the past 5 years and it still works. You don't know what you're talking about. But that's par for the course in an Apple argument. I'm excluding SSDs of course.

Ahhh how did I get here.

oh man, you fucked up for sure son:

Don't worry, I won't make you do all the math, so here's a hint:

Spoiler

it rhymes with seven

 

[delirium]

What Mac laptop has a HDD in it? Those have been gone for years across the lineup haven't they?

Non Retina MBP still have a HDD in them. Apple is selling them as new right now: http://store.apple.com/us/buy-mac/macbook-pro

 

[Aureon]

Because capitalism failed.
Realistically, because people will pay that price, and they have functionally no competition in their niche.

I think they are expensive because Macs are built so precisely and never skimping out when it comes to build quality. Frankly, I grew up from the Mac and am now a Linux user. My job demands it.

That sure explains a 40% profit margin on hardware.

- pervasive drag-and-drop (I can drag images and text off a web page and into an email or an instant message or Photoshop or or or... )

You know, i just realized Win8 also has this. I had no clue.

 

[ersocaster]

Try quality.

I have a MacBook Pro from 2007 that has been through hell and back that still functions like a champ, and has outlasted 3 family PCs to date. Sure, it's more expensive, but you get what you pay for. I feel dualbooting with ease adds a huge value to it aswell, and was hugely helpful for many of my projects.

If I remember correctly, two or three PC manufacturers actually rank higher in quality for laptops, ASUS being one of them, with the rankings being based on rate of failure.

 

[TekGryphon]

I always love when people compare laptops only on pure CPU and GPU power.

Funny, I said nothing about either. Only specific thing I mentioned was the fixed batteries which make Apple devices noticeably inferior after 12-16 months and worthless after 24.

But it's interesting that you mention the CPU and GPU as if they're insignificant components. Same argument iPhone6 users use, but it's funny because those aren't the first things I would mock.

I could point out that their pixel density is a third less, resolution always a tier lower, two thirds less RAM, for years lacked a gorilla glass equivalent, have proprietary and inferior chargers, and late by two years on a whole host of secondary and tertiary features in comparison to Android flagships.

But, to back it all up - I'll throw out this caveat. If it's 2015, you're using Windows "8", and still don't have Classic Shell or any other equivalent then stop, get up, and go to the Apple store. You're life will be so much easier without these incredible complexities in your life.

 

[bms2993]

Because capitalism failed.
That sure explains a 40% profit margin on hardware.

R&D is costly. More so than you might think.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

Funny, I said nothing about either. Only specific thing I mentioned was the fixed batteries which make Apple devices noticeably inferior after 12-16 months and worthless after 24.

But it's interesting that you mention the CPU and GPU as if they're insignificant components. Same argument iPhone6 users use, but it's funny because those aren't the first things I would mock.

I could point out that their pixel density is a third less, resolution always a tier lower, two thirds less RAM, for years lacked a gorilla glass equivalent, have proprietary and inferior chargers, and late by two years on a whole host of secondary and tertiary features in comparison to Android flagships.

But, to back it all up - I'll throw out this caveat. If it's 2015, you're using Windows "8", and still don't have Classic Shell or any other equivalent then stop, get up, and go to the Apple store. You're life will be so much easier without these incredible complexities in your life.

So you swapped GPU and CPU for mobile device RAM and resolution/pixel density as if those are any more helpful in demonstrating real-world performance (both raw and "perceived") of devices with vastly different hardware and software architecture. Got it.

Also weird that the resale value of my Apple devices holds up incredibly well after 3-4+ years (of heavy use -- as I said before, I'm a software dev) despite your assertion that after 24 months the battery becomes "worthless".

 

[LeleSocho]

So don't be one of those idiots saying you can abuse your macbook for the past 5 years and it still works. You don't know what you're talking about.

The irony here is stronk.
I changed my 4 years old plastic MacBook because i wanted something shinier and it worked flawlessly until the last day i had it, i'm sure the fucker would still work if i still had it.

for years lacked a gorilla glass equivalent.

Apple started using GG with the iPhone 4, now i don't remember when the original GG started to be featured in other phones but i'm sure it wasn't much earlier.

 

[Servbot24]

A dirty Mac vs PC thread. Okay, I'll bite.

OSX is the weakest part of Apple laptops. We can also mention you're screwed if your Macbook fails out of warranty. Good luck replacing that irreplaceable component. Most of its users aren't even using OSX right and don't know it. Features they expect but are missing get thought about for a few moments and quietly accepted. I work on Macs every single day and it's really amazing how much I dislike everything about them.

Price tag is everything including the false sensation that you'd riding on the height of laptop superiority. I'll give you the aluminum shell, nice stuff. Except you still have a standard HDD inside prone to every single thing a HDD is weak to. So don't be one of those idiots saying you can abuse your macbook for the past 5 years and it still works. You don't know what you're talking about. But that's par for the course in an Apple argument. I'm excluding SSDs of course.

Ahhh how did I get here.

Amazing. I don't know that there's a single accurate point in this post. I'd like to think the part about your own occupation would at least be correct, but even that doesn't make any sense given how off everything else is.