He tried so hard to keep it a secret that it just overflowed within him to a point that he deliberately misgendered her on multiple occasions and made assumptions about the importance of SRS without being trans himself or having any medical credentials. Truly a tragedy.
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Indie game developer Chloe Sagal attempted suicide on TwitchTV, not dead
- Thread starter Wario64
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Don't go using that as an excuse.
There is a thing called honesty in this world.
I would support her if she actually claimed that is what it was for.
This is an excuse, my cousin is trans, very proud and this is utter BS.
What is so hard about saying.
"I am trans, I feel incomplete... please save me and donate to...."
She would have gotten the attention and donations she deserved.
Nope... instead she willingly lied and deceived a large group of people.
There will always be hate towards anything. Deal with who you are and be proud.
There is nothing wrong with being Transgender and asking for help to become whole.
You guys are full of it. She did this to herself.
"I am trans, I feel incomplete... please save me and donate to...."
She would have gotten the attention and donations she deserved.
Nope... instead she willingly lied and deceived a large group of people.
There will always be hate towards anything. Deal with who you are and be proud.
There is nothing wrong with being Transgender and asking for help to become whole.
You guys are full of it. She did this to herself.
Midnight Phoenix
Member
If I will have free money again at the end of the month, I will put them to child charity, cancer curing or other stuff, that can save many lives. But donate money, that some one change his sexuality...I don't understand people and more I don't understand person, that use this way. In my country fraud on people feelings is big problem. People who really need help, can't get it, because of the others lie.
I'm glad you're here to tell trans people how to feel and act.
MiniBossBattle
Member
I was not expecting this kind of twist. I thought she was going to die from metal poisoning which led to her suicide attempt.
mugoldeneagle03
Member
Man this situation is all kinds of fucked up.
As someone who's gone through all of the suicide stuff, talking helps so much. Once you learn to talk and more importantly find someone to talk to everything starts to clear up.
Then I read about all of the other shit and don't really know what to say....Hopefully she gets the help she needs
As someone who's gone through all of the suicide stuff, talking helps so much. Once you learn to talk and more importantly find someone to talk to everything starts to clear up.
Then I read about all of the other shit and don't really know what to say....Hopefully she gets the help she needs
I'm glad you are here to defend lying and scamming to good honest people that deserve to be donating to cause they actually deem live saving.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Some of my best friends are trans, I'm an expert and he's right. Nobody should ever be this disturbed, it's their own fault!
Nobody's defended the scam, just said it's understandable given an obviously disturbed state of mind that one should be helped for rather than be crucified over. Especially given nobody was scammed in the end, which should in turn allow for the real issue to take priority for anyone. If people had gotten scammed of course it would be nice to at the same time look into compensating them but that is a non issue the way things ended.
Of course few of us can do anything about it either way, just talk about how we think we feel about the issue in the little thought we'll give it today.
I'm glad you're here to turn a scam artist into a victim.
I essentially agree with you, but I think it's pretty obvious what is hard about what you suggest. It invites unwanted attention, harassment, insults, etc. I understand why she did what she did, and how she did it, but it was obviously the wrong way to go about it, and now that the word's out, she's made it significantly worse for herself. Can't help but feel sorry for her.
Also, this thread, in general, reads like a slomo trainwreck.
It's one thing to defend being outed as trans, and another to defend the scam.
You can say it's wrong to out her as transgender but also agree that it's wrong that she scammed all of those people.
To say that people want to give her a pass on the scam because she's transgendered is intellectually dishonest.
No, the tabloid journlolists are doing that.
baphomet
Member
I have good trans friends as well. I'm sure they'll think it hilarious they have a white knight out there defending someone who lied and attempted to scam people who thought they were paying for a life saving surgery.
No, your screwed up priorities that make you care more about pronouns than fraud are doing that.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Who might you be talking about?
Yes, because pronouns are the only issue here.
baphomet
Member
Pizzaroll above.
Perhaps you might consider that some of us can see it form the other perspective because we either are or know people who have gone through this?
Nobody's defending the scam; What people are defending is the needlessly way her trans status was revealed.
SuperAndroid17
Member
oh? which ones
Gentleman Jack
Member
My understanding of her situation is that her parents were not there for her, not surprising since the description of her hometown is repeated as 'rural.' Now on top of being an outed trans in that community she's got a hospitalization to pay for. Her absolute worst fears have come true and it'll be a miracle if she trusts anybody ever again. Desperation and isolation can very easily corner people into very poor decisions, so it troubles me how proudly and loudly some posters continue to express their utter lack of sympathy for her situation.
faceless007
Member
I don't see anybody actually defending the scam.
DiscoJer
Member
I donated money (albeit not a lot, $5) knowing there was probably more to the story than she said. I'm not upset with her for not being fully honest, that's probably something not easy to admit, even though there were two pioneers of that in the gaming industry (Dani Bunten and Jennell Jaquays).
I'm actually irked at IGG, they closed her KS, yet I never got a refund or a notification they closed it. Maybe because it uses paypal they simply kept the low donations to fund the processing fees of the larger donations (since paypal takes a cut, period).
LOL if this is the actual story, this person is complete scum.
rocketknight
Member
I'm not defending her lying, but again. For trans people, reassignment surgery often is lifesaving surgery. She lied about the type of surgery, but not how badly she needed it.
Lol, "white knight." I'm sure your "trans friends" (who you probably made up) will find the views of another trans person just hilarious.
It's hardly needless when it's a pretty integral part of the story.
And this isn't really much of a revelation, either. Anyone who watched the indiegogo pitch video should have been able to tell that Chloe was born a male. They should have also known it was a scam because the story made zero sense.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
What?! You should definitely ask for a refund, that can't be right.
I'm actually kind of curious as to what her situation is like. There are standards of card for trans individuals, and SRS is usually one of the later things involved. Dealing with depression and related issues is suppose to be one of the first steps.
Regardless, that doesn't excuse the lack of tact displayed by both the Destructoid author and some of the people posting in this thread.
It's a very difficult situation given the sensitivity of the case, especially considering what happened here.
I'm struggling to understand just what happened, but must say that while her state of mind cannot excuse what Chloe Sagal did (Including the suicide attempt, which as things go ranks up there in the list of totally irrational things to do), it does go a heck of a long way to explain it.
It's clear we're looking at someone with severe depression here. Someone who is trying to face down the worst battle I can imagine, against themselves. This is a person who clearly felt like she couldn't face herself, let alone the world, and made some horrible errors of judgement to try to put that right.
It's all too simple, especially in hindsight to say that Chloe should've told the truth from the outset, but if it was, she would've done so. I cannot believe for a second that if she honestly was of a solid state of mind that she would've faced up to people, told the truth, and probably got just as much support as she did when she pulled this stunt to get funding. Yes, she would've faced the usual backlash too, but opinions are just them and she would've had plenty of support.
The problem is, and the reason why I have struggled to even make a post, is that I haven't a clue how she must've felt. This is a horrible way to put it I know, but she has not accepted the hand she was dealt by nature (Which by rule is random, and isn't always correct), and that must raise some serious mental hell. Even the strongest willed people would find it hard and this clearly has hurt enough to drive her to the point of attempted suicide, so we know that it's really not been fun for her. Yes, she knew what gender she should be, but does she know why (does anyone)?
The fact is she's clearly been struggling for a while, struggling not only financially, but mentally, and this has resulted in a very, very stupid move. A move that didn't make any sense to someone with reason, but reason doesn't work properly when you have severe depression which I believe she suffers from. Of course like most lies it was caught out, but with scant regard as to the reasons why, and has pushed her to the very edge, hence we're here.
Now, the truth's out, whether she like it or not, and in the end, it will be a release, because (I hope), she'll get help, and realise that there are plenty of people out there who will understand her, maybe not her exact situation but the mental effects of it, and will help her through and make her a better person. Depression is one of those illnesses that has almost infinite causes, but almost universal effects. When you fight yourself, you often feel like you cannot win. You question yourself, and the deeper you get, the worse the questions get. Eventually, unless if you can stop yourself, or get help to do so, you hit breaking point.
At the end of the day, there's only one person who can really beat depression, and that's yourself, but there's no reason to suffer the cause in silence. Once you can face that, you can face yourself and realise that as stupid as it sounds, you're better working with instead of against yourself. In this case, I hope Chloe gets the help she needs, and comes out of this a stronger person, and more importantly realises that it doesn't matter a jot what others think of her, or how they judge her, but she needs to be certain of herself and once she does, the world will be a lot less scary to face.
So yes, I condemn the actions, but forgive the person, and hope that we hear from a much happier person once she gets the help she needs to understand herself and faces the world as a proud person, not as someone who felt unable to fully confront the truth, or herself.
baphomet
Member
Yes, I made them up because obviously only YOU actually know trans people and their thoughts. I'm not going to mention her name, but she's quite well known around the world.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Indie dev makes crowd funding campaign for life saving metal shrapnel removal surgery, campaign is cancelled by indiegogo, then allowed back up, then cancelled again, then a long while later said person attempts suicide, then we find out the money would go towards transgender surgery or whatever that's called and some journo presents himself as a hero for only now after finding out the suicide attempt failed presenting the truth because he doesn't want people to feel bad for someone who according to him didn't wanna be helped and only fixated on surgery. And he couldn't call the authorities and present the truth before saving everyone (like Project Zomboid running a campaign willing to donate 100% of some days of sales to the cause) the trouble because he somehow got super involved in this whole mess and that person threatened suicide if he told anyone.
Something like that.
She will likely wish she wasn't. But that's ok, the Internet got justice!! FUCK YEAH US!!!
I think everyone here is glad she didn't commit suicide. There isn't much to talk about in the meantime as there is no new news.
No, I don't. But using them as objects to prop up your own views in an argument is quite gross, as well as unconvincing. Which is why the post you quoted was mocking the whole "friends" thing, and how "some of my best friends are [x] /but I have [x] friends" is almost always uttered as a joke in modern society.
Gentleman Jack
Member
First post has all the info you need current to this morning. Now it's gaffers starting to lose their cool and throwing bullshit accusations at each other. Chloe's alive if that's the update you were looking for, but apparently she's outed as trans.
Wow, that's fucked up... Forgetting about the fact that there are actually people out there who need money to battle legitimately fatal medical conditions: Isn't this a crime? Fraud?
Wikipedia said:
Yeah, I'm a torn here.
She did a number of very shitty things to a number of people, but obviously is/was not in a healthy state of mind either. However, my guess is that had she done something illegal she would be at least fit enough to stand trial and would probably end up guilty of the actions she took. They were deliberate steps, albeit desperate too. I think she knew that what she was doing was wrong, though.
I also thinks she needs help, and fast. Hopefully this mess is the catalyst for that.
It's not really personal gain. Gender Dysphoria is a real condition that can often lead to lifelong depression and/or suicide. Particularly if the individual in question has other issues too.
Not fatal in the same sense as cancer, but it's certainly not like they intended to blow it all on iPods and Xboxs.
She is in transition, she has some emotional issues. She scammed people and is very much in need of help. I think these are all factors, but not as directly related as most people will perceive. Of course she knew any mention of her transition would cloud the conversation. I worry in keeping this all a secret she severely hurt the efforts she was hoping to protect, not just for her, but to all those in transition.
I just want to say to those in the community who are in transition, you're going through a very public process that many people will shame you for, and which takes more courage than anyone who criticizes you has. But be upfront about it, don't be ashamed. And there will be people who will support and help you.
This, this is just ugly all around and should be reduced simply to someone with issues who needs help.
I just want to say to those in the community who are in transition, you're going through a very public process that many people will shame you for, and which takes more courage than anyone who criticizes you has. But be upfront about it, don't be ashamed. And there will be people who will support and help you.
This, this is just ugly all around and should be reduced simply to someone with issues who needs help.
The AMA, APA and many, many other organisations take the view that gender surgery is a life saving operation.
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