GymWolf
Gold Member
not for 4k30.
i tried a lot of games with my ex 1070 at 4k30 and that gpu is noticeablt slower than ps5 or sex gpu.
of course then i returned to 1080p because i prefer 60 frames with ultra details but still.
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Is the PS5 GPU Really Underpowered - What Can We Really Expect
i tried a lot of games with my ex 1070 at 4k30 and that gpu is noticeablt slower than ps5 or sex gpu.
of course then i returned to 1080p because i prefer 60 frames with ultra details but still.
SmokSmog
Member
Prepare for another disappointment when PS5 gpu will be trading blows with RX 5700 xt and RTX 2070 in November.
Both PS5 and Xbox SX are not full; RDNA2 gpus, even AMD confirmed that, chips for xsx and ps5 were ready back in late 2019 . RDNA 2 is still in tests. Next gen consoles will be in full production soon.
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Wandering Leopard
Member
I fully agree, (native) 4k/30fps should be the most common resolution next gen for both platforms.
(Native) 4k/60fps will likely be rare except for next gen versions of Doom, CoD etc...
And then I think we'll see a number of checkerboard (faux) 4k / 60fps games.
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DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
You made fun of the secret sauce and now you're doing this with the XsX's Velocity Architecture.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
What? What are u refering to. I have a feeling your misrepresenting what ive said
DntMesArnd
Member
I would say Sony is the first to bail if they aren't making money.
I spent a lot on the Vita at launch, only to see Sony ditch it after like 6 months.
Really pissede off, as I thought it had great potential.
Snake29
Banned
No Xbox, look at their history.They would bail and go full third party and services.
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Gamernyc78
Banned
Gamernyc78
Banned
You would be wrong as ps3 saw support well past its years, even when it was losing tons of money, even when ps4 was released for like three years after. Vita was a different case but six months is hyperbolic. What thy did do after a few years was shift the focus to Japan where it was still selling well and games were still being released up to a few years ago.
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BattleScar
Member
Oh, do you have access to the silicon?
Prepare for another disappointment when PS5 gpu will be trading blows with RX 5700 xt and RTX 2070 in November.
Both PS5 and Xbox SX are not full; RDNA2 gpus, even AMD confirmed that, chips for xsx and ps5 were ready back in late 2019 . RDNA 2 is still in tests. Next gen consoles will be in full production soon.
Kenpachii
Member
Your 1070 wouldn't even run 30 fps at 1080p at ultra settings in newer games that push gpu performance, who gives a shit about lower settings its a next gen machine.
PS5 is underpowered on the GPU front it's not even questionable really. I dunno why this topic starter has the delusion that 9-10 tflop gpu in the PS5 is going to perform like a 2080ti which by the way sits at ~14+ tflops and has like 500-600 gb's dedicated memory unlike PS5 shared memory at lower clocks, it never will. There is a reason even DF didn't burn their bridges with even stating that the xbox series X sits at 2080ti levels, because that would simple be false.
DF + the dev that worked on it
skip to 12:45
5700xt by the way, hovers average 20 on a current gen title. ( heavily favoring AMD by the way )
Welcome in current gen 4k newer titles that actually pushes hardware.
We also don't know what RDNA2 will give us and to what extent it favors those GPU's. As the 5700xt sits at 270 watt peeks, and with higher clocks, u could see all the performance per watt disappear in thin air by simple lowering the wattage to keep things cool. But frankly even if it did move stuff up it won't be much more than what a 5700xt is going to deliver at the end of the day.
That GPU in the PS5 sits pretty much somewhere between 2070 and 2070 super and that's what u should expect.
Now lets get back to power of that GPU and how it compares to last generation:
Xbox 360 vs PS4 = ~7 times gpu performance increase with ~2x increase in resolution.
PS4 vs PS5 = ~6 times gpu performance at absolute best, with 4x increase in resolution ( and then the discussion about double the fps with it oke man )
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how the GPU for a next generation 7 year long period is going to cripple the living shit out of that box when the focus is 4k. It's underpowered as hell for it.
The PS5 GPU towards 4k is what a 1060 is towards 1080p right now.
There is a reason cerny clocked that gpu to hell, they need all the performance they can get.
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LordOfChaos
Member
They didn't confirm that. They said it would not be identical to desktop RDNA2, which is pretty well a given, each always do their own customization. That doesn't say or even imply anything about whether that's more or less.
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The Mad Draklor
Member
Velocity Architecture is software-based. Solutions like the 12 channels, coherency engine, and GPU cache scrubbers are hardware-based.
One requires learning how to use it. The other does the work for the developers, making the learning curve relatively flat.
Vroadstar
Member
Your 1070 wouldn't even run 30 fps at 1080p at ultra settings in newer games that push gpu performance, who gives a shit about lower settings its a next gen machine.
PS5 is underpowered on the GPU front it's not even questionable really. I dunno why this topic starter has the delusion that 9-10 tflop gpu in the PS5 is going to perform like a 2080ti which by the way sits at ~14+ tflops and has like 500-600 gb's dedicated memory unlike PS5 shared memory at lower clocks, it never will. There is a reason even DF didn't burn their bridges with even stating that the xbox series X sits at 2080ti levels, because that would simple be false.
DF + the dev that worked on it
skip to 12:45
5700xt by the way, hovers average 20 on a current gen title. ( heavily favoring AMD by the way )
Welcome in current gen 4k newer titles that actually pushes hardware.
We also don't know what RDNA2 will give us and to what extent it favors those GPU's. As the 5700xt sits at 270 watt peeks, and with higher clocks, u could see all the performance per watt disappear in thin air by simple lowering the wattage to keep things cool. But frankly even if it did move stuff up it won't be much more than what a 5700xt is going to deliver at the end of the day.
That GPU in the PS5 sits pretty much somewhere between 2070 and 2070 super and that's what u should expect.
Now lets get back to power of that GPU and how it compares to last generation:
Xbox 360 vs PS4 = ~7 times gpu performance increase with ~2x increase in resolution.
PS4 vs PS5 = ~6 times gpu performance at absolute best, with 4x increase in resolution ( and then the discussion about double the fps with it oke man )
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how the GPU for a next generation 7 year long period is going to cripple the living shit out of that box when the focus is 4k. It's underpowered as hell for it.
The PS5 GPU towards 4k is what a 1060 is towards 1080p right now.
There is a reason cerny clocked that gpu to hell, they need all the performance they can get.
Xbox one X - 6TF
X fans : it's a 4K machine!
PS5 - 10.3TF
X fans : it's underpowered for 4K!
Some X fans really are an embarrassment
alabtrosMyster
Banned
I wish that would be standard, or at least very common, to have access to a fauxK performance mode like we have on the pro consoles now.
alabtrosMyster
Banned
It's a well known technical fact that there is a performance black hole when a GPU hits performances arouns 10.3TF--it cuts down to 10% of the reported computing power (1.03TF)... Cerny should have know this fact when he designed the PS5, this is why MS decided to bite the bullet and spend the extra dollars to get over the bump.
X fans don't always explain this fact clearly because they assume everybody knows by now.
Vroadstar
Member
I think devs based on this current gen and previous gen, most of them prioritize visual side of things, so next-gen I expect they will do the same (I don't blame them and if the game is good I couldn't care less, I'll play them if they are 30fps, faux 4k etc.)
but I do hope we have more games next-gen where there is an option if you want to go performance vs quality mode, I think that's a win win
Tamy
Banned
he is talking about nextgen games, not about lastgen games.
Of course, the PS5 can play lastgen games at 4K with 30 FPS easily. But let's say in 2-3 years or so, it won't be that easy to play Games at Ultra settings in 4K.
Well, let's just wait and see what happenes.
What is that supposed to mean? A black whole in the GPU? So a 10.3TF GPU is a 9.30TF GPU? What? never heard of this
Vroadstar
Member
So he is wrong then and just creating FUD, thanks for calling out his BS while moving the goalpost at the same time
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Velocity also has HW components accelerating decompression and data moving (the latter not to the same degree as PS5 I believe even proportionally to bandwidth): moving that much data around constantly would saturate one or two Zen 2 cores and they stated to have reduced it to a tenth of a Zen 2 core of effective performance hit... so they must be doing HW acceleration of some kind too.
Malcolm9
Member
What? So you are judging Sony support on the Vita alone, rather than all the fantastic support from PS1 to PS4?
I had a Vita, unfortunately it was completely overshadowed by the 3DS, that's nothing to be disappointed about when Nintendo are the handheld kings.
Kenpachii
Member
So he is wrong then and just creating FUD, thanks for calling out his BS while moving the goalpost at the same time
Vraodstar trying to coop with negative PS5 information:
Everything is xbot that doesn't agree with my PS5 being the fastest super computer ever!
Because sony didn't told me so, but i still did hear it !
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Vraodstar trying to coop with negative PS5 information:
Everything is xbot that doesn't agree with my PS5 being the fastest super computer ever!
Because sony didn't told me so, but i still did hear it !
Fighting against made uparguments sure is fun. Power crown obsessed user dealing with the other side not being complete shit turns into “no it is other side trying to pretend they are the strongest one”. In what universe are people making that argument
?
Kumomeme
Member
GymWolf
Gold Member
Your 1070 wouldn't even run 30 fps at 1080p at ultra settings in newer games that push gpu performance, who gives a shit about lower settings its a next gen machine.
PS5 is underpowered on the GPU front it's not even questionable really. I dunno why this topic starter has the delusion that 9-10 tflop gpu in the PS5 is going to perform like a 2080ti which by the way sits at ~14+ tflops and has like 500-600 gb's dedicated memory unlike PS5 shared memory at lower clocks, it never will. There is a reason even DF didn't burn their bridges with even stating that the xbox series X sits at 2080ti levels, because that would simple be false.
DF + the dev that worked on it
skip to 12:45
5700xt by the way, hovers average 20 on a current gen title. ( heavily favoring AMD by the way )
Welcome in current gen 4k newer titles that actually pushes hardware.
We also don't know what RDNA2 will give us and to what extent it favors those GPU's. As the 5700xt sits at 270 watt peeks, and with higher clocks, u could see all the performance per watt disappear in thin air by simple lowering the wattage to keep things cool. But frankly even if it did move stuff up it won't be much more than what a 5700xt is going to deliver at the end of the day.
That GPU in the PS5 sits pretty much somewhere between 2070 and 2070 super and that's what u should expect.
Now lets get back to power of that GPU and how it compares to last generation:
Xbox 360 vs PS4 = ~7 times gpu performance increase with ~2x increase in resolution.
PS4 vs PS5 = ~6 times gpu performance at absolute best, with 4x increase in resolution ( and then the discussion about double the fps with it oke man )
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how the GPU for a next generation 7 year long period is going to cripple the living shit out of that box when the focus is 4k. It's underpowered as hell for it.
The PS5 GPU towards 4k is what a 1060 is towards 1080p right now.
There is a reason cerny clocked that gpu to hell, they need all the performance they can get.
i know that, i sold my 1070 when the 2070super got out (now i have a 2070super)
and console always use mixture of medium and low setting for third party games, this is not gonna change with next gen if they wanna do 4k30 or 1800p60.
people who think that nextgen console are gonna play third party games at ultra details are deluded.
but if they aim at 4k30 with med-low setting i think it's possible, also better optimization compared to pc and uniformity of performance, i mean you can enter any pc performance topic everywhere and seeing people with the same pc having different performance because you never know how many shit they have installed or os problem that can change optimal performance.
to be fair my 1070 was enough to play re2 remake at 4k30 fps with a mixture of ultra,high and medium setting, not exactly a slouch with a very modern game.
to sum up, i already said in other post around the forum that gpus on both console are already "old" so we are really discussing over nothing my dude.
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Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
.
What is Xbox Series X Velocity Architecture?
Xbox Velocity Architecture promises no-compromise gameplay and cuts load times, drawing the best from Xbox Series X.
www.windowscentral.com
Tqaulity
Member
Sorry but this is one of my peeves...why does everyone use Ultra/max settings on PC as a reference? When it comes to consoles, ultra settings are almost never the target...and they shouldn't be! Ultra settings on PC is typically horribly inefficient and unoptimized. With consoles, developers can select specific settings that give best bang for the buck given the hardware it's running on. Since devs have no way of knowing exactly what PC the user will game on, they can't replicate this for PC skus.
Again, the goal for any game isn't to just run at max resolution and max frame rate in every case. So to say for example that a 10 TFLOP PS5 GPU can't run Red Dead Redemption 2 at 4K/60 because even the RTX 2080 Ti can run it at 4K/60 fps is just WRONG! First of all, it's entirely incorrect to say that the RTX 2080 Ti can't run RDD2 at 4K/60 fps in the first place because of course it can...at some slightly adjusted settings below the max. Second, Rockstar would optimize the game in terms of resolution/settings/and frame rate to run best on PS5. So, yes it may be accurate to say that the PS5 cannot run the PC version of the game at max settings at 4K/60 but it can still absolutely run the game with some mix of settings at 4K/60fps. Remember if the Xbox One X can run it at native 4K/30fps, then of course the PS5 (and XSX) can run it at 4K/60fps with headroom to spare.
So to this point of the quote above, so what the PS5 can't easily run a game at ultra 4K 2-3 years from now. That is a meaningless statement. Dev won't be targeting that anyway and it doesn't mean that there won't be amazing looking games running great on the hardware in 2-3 years.
Anyway, please stop making blanket statements like card X cannot game Y at this resolution and setting as if the GPU performance was only based on 1 set of settings! Please!
Caio
Member
Prepare for another disappointment when PS5 gpu will be trading blows with RX 5700 xt and RTX 2070 in November.
Both PS5 and Xbox SX are not full; RDNA2 gpus, even AMD confirmed that, chips for xsx and ps5 were ready back in late 2019 . RDNA 2 is still in tests. Next gen consoles will be in full production soon.
Are you sure ? Didn't MS confirm RDNA2 ?
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Tqaulity
Member
Are you serious right now? Please tell me you are not basing that 6x for PS5 over PS4 looking at the raw TFLOP rating (10.28/1.8)? You really have not been paying attention at all have you
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
When I stopped chasing Ultra in gaming on PC my life literally became much easier.
SmokSmog
Member
Both consoles will have most of RDNA2 futures.
alabtrosMyster
Banned
I have yet to read someone saying that the PS5 is obviously the fastest (however there are good reasons to think it's SSD is faster than any consumer SSD available at the moment, it is addressed at a much lower level than PC SSDs, and the PS5 has dedicated APIs to ensure it's taken advantage of, people try to figure out the actual benefits of this approach).
As for the GPU, I see plenty of xbox fan alluding that this is the fastest GPU ever made, so on and so forth, and that cutting ~18% from that makes the PS5 extremely weak and outdated... which makes no sense at all (I am nice here).... I mean, it clearly can't compute as much, but it remains to be seen how this turns out in the real world.
There is nothing the sx will be able to do that the PS5 won't do, and from time to time they may have to dynamically lower the resolution to something like 1800p (assuming both consoles run the game at 4K in normal times, and the sx holds it all the time).
Or they go from ultra to a mix of ultra with high settings? Have you seen how the games we have now look? the lighting models are getting pretty good, even without RT.
The PS5's SSD could in theory enable the system to keep less objects in memory, in essence giving the PS5 more RAM to store assets, which in the end allows for higher density of whatever you choose in a game at any given moment, this would also make a difference in how games look, or how they are designed around specific bottlenecks... The sx will do this, but to a much lesser extent (you can see how MS handles the messaging around their SSD, they know it's an important part of "next-gen" and acting as if having half the bandwidth on this means nothing is disingenuous).
So calm down, and stop acting as if you found god or something.
V4skunk
Banned
I don't think they are using rdna1.
Prepare for another disappointment when PS5 gpu will be trading blows with RX 5700 xt and RTX 2070 in November.
Both PS5 and Xbox SX are not full; RDNA2 gpus, even AMD confirmed that, chips for xsx and ps5 were ready back in late 2019 . RDNA 2 is still in tests. Next gen consoles will be in full production soon.
For instance the ps5 gpu is up to 2.2ghz.
On a 5700xt 2.2ghz is a super heavy over clock.
No way Sony are stressing an rdna1 gpu like this in console form factor.
Rdna2 is the only logical way to achieve 2.2ghz in a safe way.
The Mad Draklor
Member
"With software to complement". It's still software-based if you need to use software to take advantage of the XSX's features. Plus, 2 hardware components vs. 5 in the I/O (Kraken decompression chip, coherency engine, two co-processors for memory maping & file I/O, and DMA controller) + 12 lanes + GPU cache scrubbers is not even close..
What is Xbox Series X Velocity Architecture?
Xbox Velocity Architecture promises no-compromise gameplay and cuts load times, drawing the best from Xbox Series X.
Time is money. If developers don't need to spend as much time learning how to take advantage of the hardware, then that gives them more time focusing on actual game development:
Think of the Spider-Man demo vs. the State of Decay demo. Spider-Man loaded on a slower PS5 devkit in 0.8 seconds. State of Decay took around 10 seconds to load on the Series X and you still see pop-in. Obviously, if Velocity Architecture was used on SoD, then loading times would be faster and there would be no pop-in. But that's the thing. You're not going to get those 1-2 second load times with no pop in unless developers take the time to take advantage of it. This is a stark contrast to the PS5's "It just works" solution.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
I think 4k/60 will be more common than some think. Not every title, of course, but I don’t think it will be rare
As far a I know the Spider man demo was modified for PS5.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
Its weird how bioshock infinite runs @ 1080p @ kinda 60fps on current gen, but doom eternal and modern warfare shit all over it visually.
Which is why we will get far better then just current gen games @ 4k 60fps on next gen.
Which is why we will get far better then just current gen games @ 4k 60fps on next gen.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
I guess those 360 ports of games like Forza Horizon 2 never happened...
...oh wait...
...they did. Well into 2014, at that.
Really, this is why you shouldn't use fanboy tactics. They're incredibly easy to disprove with something called facts
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
I guess those 360 ports of games like Forza Horizon 2 never happened...
...oh wait...
...they did. Well into 2014, at that.
Really, this is why you shouldn't use fanboy tactics. They're incredibly easy to disprove with something called facts
Zoo Tycoon and State of Decay are the example that MS did not have droughts in the final year Xbox was in the market and Xbox 360 was around the corner, when Xbox 360 had the Xbox One in its rear view mirror, and now when XSX is coming up and saying that it is just the same as Sony’s first parties supported PS1, PS2, PS3, and PS4 throughout their lifetime including the timeframe shortly before and after the successor has been announced?
Roronoa Zoro
Gold Member
Fanboy tactics? I never said anything you disproved. I won't call you a fanboy though because YOU view that as supporting a system well. I simply dont. If you're satisfied with the support MS gives late gen then good for youI guess those 360 ports of games like Forza Horizon 2 never happened...
...oh wait...
...they did. Well into 2014, at that.
Really, this is why you shouldn't use fanboy tactics. They're incredibly easy to disprove with something called facts
prinz_valium
Member
I guess those 360 ports of games like Forza Horizon 2 never happened...
...oh wait...
...they did. Well into 2014, at that.
Really, this is why you shouldn't use fanboy tactics. They're incredibly easy to disprove with something called facts
MS released Xbox One games on X360 2 years into the generation.
ROTR or Screamride for example.
GymWolf
Gold Member
same, you just put down shadows, occlusion and lights\reflections at high instead of ultra and ta-daaaa 10 to 20 frame gain r even more.
of course i keep texture, chara details and all the raw details on ultra because for me they are the most important things and i don't want any compromise, but sometimes texture on ultra or high are literally the same so i have space to gain even more performance with high textures.
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Tqaulity
Member
I agree. People aren't thinking this through but we will see a large percentage of game at 4K/60fps on the next gen consoles. There are a few key factors contributing to this:
- Both consoles will have a large percentage of their catalog consisting of legacy titles from previous generation consoles. Many of those titles technically can work at 4K/60 fairly easily. These include backwards compatible titles
- There are also a large number of titles from smaller studios that are not AAA and will not utilize most of the hardware potential of next gen. Those titles will have plenty of headroom to pushing resolution and framerates
- New to this generation, devs can now push 120fps thanks for HDMI 2.1. We may be seeing a number of titles pushing like 1080p/120fps, particularly those smaller titles or titles with an eSports push. A game optimized for 1080p/120fps or 1440p/120fps can probably push 4K/60fps as an option as well
Neo_game
Member
I know few guys mentioned it but just like CU since PS5 is lesser but runs faster I am not sure there will be much difference. Microsoft minecraft was running at 1080P which suggests that the RT is not going to what people think. As devs will try to hit 4K or close to it and other gfx features will be given more importance along with fps.