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[Pimpwerx]

Source: Yahoo! News

Palestinian leaders, whose calls for road map talks have been spurned by Israel, condemned Weisglass's comments.

"I believe he has revealed the true intentions of Sharon. We told the quartet (of U.S.-led peace mediators) eight months ago that the Gaza plan was designed to undermine their road map," said Palestinian Negotiations Minister Saeb Erekat.

Weisglass's message, coinciding with a big Israeli offensive into Gaza, could help Sharon win over far-right foes opposed to Gaza "disengagement" and challenging his grip on power.

"The significance of our (unilateral) disengagement plan is the freezing of the peace process. It supplies the formaldehyde necessary so there is no political process with Palestinians," Weisglass said in an interview published in the Haaretz daily.

"When you freeze the process, you prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state ... Effectively, this whole package called a Palestinian state, with all it entails, has been removed indefinitely from our agenda," Weisglass said.

Weisglass blamed Palestinian suicide bombings and militant violence for the diplomatic vacuum. Palestinians blame Israeli offensives as well as continued settlement activity in the West Bank. Israel captured both lands in the 1967 Middle East war.

Weisglass ruled out talks on critical issues such as Palestinian refugees, borders and the status of Jerusalem in the foreseeable future. "And all this with authority and permission, all with a presidential blessing."

President Bush (news - web sites) in April endorsed Sharon's plan to pull 8,000 settlers from tiny Gaza in 2005 while keeping most of 230,000 settlers in place in the West Bank, displacing the "road map."

Bush has said Palestinians cannot expect to win statehood unless they stamp out militant attacks on Israel.

Weisglass said: "What I effectively agreed to with the Americans was that part of the settlements would not be dealt with at all, and the rest will not be dealt with until the Palestinians turn into Finns."

Well, that guy Weisglass is as big a douchebag as Sharon. There's no ill painful enough that can befall these two pricks IMO. Hamas needs to start targeting them rather than innocent Israelis. That said, this looks like what everyone guessed at before. Israel doesn't want to give Palestine a state, and the have no intentions of relinquishing land. They just wanted US approval to continue doing what they've been doing. I find it ludicrous that they don't take any blame for the continued cycle of violence. As if their heavy-handed attacks, which kill civilians isn't at the crux of the whole matter.

Seems the Palestinian struggle has fallen off the radar lately in light of Iraq and the elections, but things only seem to be getting worse. This Israeli administration's gonna get its come-uppance sooner or later, and it will be a big day of celebration when that happens. Their policies have only served to stir the hornet's nest. Yeah, they temporarily set things back with a raid, but then the militants regroup and just redouble their efforts in the future. It's like the ignorance of thinking a fence will serve to protect the people from these attacks. Peace is the only solution, and neither side is doing a good job of seeking it. But the US shouldn't be taking sides in this issue. Supporting Israel of all sides is just plain stupid. It leaves the Palestinians with very little leverage, especially since Israel continues to refuse them statehood. What the hell can Palestinian leaders do? Oh, and Arafat is an ass, so that doesn't help any. PEACE.

 

[Ripclawe]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3694664.stm

Four years after the eruption of the al-Aqsa intifada, the dominant mood among Palestinians is one of defeat

Its dead and been dead for a while. Israel smartly went after the leadership of the various militant groups, they built the wall(which arafat profited from BTW) and now you have a power struggle in the gaza and west bank that is hurting the palestinians more than Israel.

Whats the big game plan for the militant groups? Its to make sure that it looks like Israel planned withdrawal from the Gaza Strip is a defeat which is why they launched the rockets that gave Israel the excuse to attack again. Just another in a long line of bone-headed moves by the Palestinians going back to when Arafat tried to overthrow King Hussein.

 

[Pimpwerx]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3694664.stm


Its dead and been dead for a while. Israel smartly went after the leadership of the various militant groups, they built the wall(which arafat profited from BTW) and now you have a power struggle in the gaza and west bank that is hurting the palestinians more than Israel.

Whats the big game plan for the militant groups? Its to make sure that it looks like Israel planned withdrawal from the Gaza Strip is a defeat which is why they launched the rockets that gave Israel the excuse to attack again. Just another in a long line of bone-headed moves by the Palestinians going back to when Arafat tried to overthrow King Hussein.

And Israel's continued missle attacks and other raids aren't equally part of the problem? You can't blame the Palestinians (who are really being made to look bad by the militants...who aren't part of the government) without blaming the Israelis for stoking the fires of hate. If all Israel was killing was Hamas or Al-Aqsa, or some other leaders, it wouldn't be a huge deal. It's that they manage to kill more innocents than the guilty. How much collateral damage is there in each of their attacks. Yeah, they might have offed one leader, or two. But in the process, they've killed a handful of innocent bystanders who's remaining family now have a perfect excuse for joining those militant movements.

Both sides are wrong, but who's got greater control over their actions? The Palestinian leadership over the militias, or Sharon, the leader of a democratic state? Palestine isn't an official country. There's no real official leadership. The very statehood (legitimacy) that Israel continues to deny them is the one thing keeping the leadership from having any real authority. It's a huge catch-22. Israel knows the Quarea and the other leaders are powerless in their current state, and thus there's no legit state, and thus Israel can continue to grab land and kill indiscriminately b/c what can Palestine do? Without official statehood and borders, they can't do jack. Any official move by the UN is vetoed by the US. How the hell is that fair? I feel for the Israelis who are equally innocent bystanders in a war between Sharon and the militants. But they are the ones with the power to make it stop right now. They hold the cards. They are holding the cards away from he Palestinians, and any move the international community makes to intervene is blocked by the US, b/c if not, Israel would be guilty of countless human rights violations. I can't believe you don't see the hypocrisy in that. Violence doesn't lead to peace. It only begets more violence, which is the problem.

Why doesn't Sharon offer Palestine statehood on the grounds that Palestine agree to cooperate with neighboring countries to help stamp out the militant elements? So then it's a win-win. A constructive approach to ending the violence rather than the unilateral bullshit that is nothing more than a cheap land grab. PEACE.

 

[Xenon]

Wow .. Pretty sad. Anyone else notice how both presidential candidates mentioned protecting Israel without one word about the Palestinians during the debate last week. I guess nobody is going for the Palestinian-American vote.

 

[Caddle]

Who didn't see this coming? Looking back the germans did the same thing to the jewish population, now they are in turn doing it to the palestinians. Yet they always bring up the Holocaust whenever someone disagrees with them.

 

[enjoy bell woods]

Hey Caddle, not all Israelis are Jews. And get this, not all Jews support Israel.

 

[sprsk]

Who didn't see this coming? Looking back the germans did the same thing to the jewish population, now they are in turn doing it to the palestinians. Yet they always bring up the Holocaust whenever someone disagrees with them.

western jews != israeli jews

 

[enjoy bell woods]

western jews != israeli jews

This too.

 

[Firest0rm]

Hey Caddle, not all Israelis are Jews. And get this, not all Jews support Israel.

True, there are those who are actually against Israel.

 

[Forsete]

Someone said "Sharon is a national suicide bomber"

 

[Ripclawe]

And Israel's continued missle attacks and other raids aren't equally part of the problem? You can't blame the Palestinians (who are really being made to look bad by the militants...who aren't part of the government) without blaming the Israelis for stoking the fires of hate.

oh yes I can, Palestinians would be in a lot better position if they didn't give Israel the rationale to attack every single time. Even Arafat is calling on militants to stop shooting rockets but they are more interested in bragging rights and killing Jews than truely fighting for statehood and its people.

If all Israel was killing was Hamas or Al-Aqsa, or some other leaders, it wouldn't be a huge deal. It's that they manage to kill more innocents than the guilty. How much collateral damage is there in each of their attacks.

hamas leadership are not exactly known for their bravery, so they hide out among civilians hoping Israel wouldn't shoot at them, that has been proven wrong.

Any official move by the UN is vetoed by the US. How the hell is that fair?

Its very fair considering the latest resolution drawn up was one sided as usual against Israel, making no reference to rocket attacks by palestinians. It would be really hard for America to keep vetoing resolutions if they were actually fair.

I can't believe you don't see the hypocrisy in that. Violence doesn't lead to peace. It only begets more violence, which is the problem.

All I see and have seen following the Palestinians is decades of duplicity and stupidity, they are in the position they are in because of it.

Why doesn't Sharon offer Palestine statehood on the grounds that Palestine agree to cooperate with neighboring countries to help stamp out the militant elements? So then it's a win-win.

But you just said

The Palestinian leadership over the militias, or Sharon, the leader of a democratic state? Palestine isn't an official country. There's no real official leadership. The very statehood (legitimacy) that Israel continues to deny them is the one thing keeping the leadership from having any real authority. It's a huge catch-22.

But lets go with that, it will never work and they would never even attempt to stamp out the militants.

 

[Fatty Melon]

oh yes I can, Palestinians would be in a lot better position if they didn't give Israel the rationale to attack every single time. Even Arafat is calling on militants to stop shooting rockets but they are more interested in bragging rights and killing Jews than truely fighting for statehood and its people.

Same can be said for Israelis. If they would stop demolishing homes and killing civilians (34 this week...) Hamas wouldn't be able to use this as justification for suicide bombings.

hamas leadership are not exactly known for their bravery, so they hide out among civilians hoping Israel wouldn't shoot at them, that has been proven wrong.

Israeli forces are also known for using Palestinian human shields or using civilians as bait. Look it up. Of course they deny it but over 35 human rights groups back the accusation.

 

[bionic77]

If there is no plan for statehood now, where exactly does Isreal see this thing ending? Do they plan on occupying Palestine forever?

 

[Ripclawe]

If there is no plan for statehood now, where exactly does Isreal see this thing ending? Do they plan on occupying Palestine forever?

The plan is to get out of Gaza, that will lead to a bloody power struggle and the possiblity of Egypt coming in to bring the place to order which the palestinians do not want. But what does Israel care at that point. What is happening now is that militant groups want to say they pushed Israel out and Israel is using the rocket attacks to put a beating on the groups to the point any claim of pushing Israel out is just ridiculous.

Israel wants the palestinians to fight among themselves, at that point whoever is left will be dealt with.

 

[sc0la]

The leadership on both sides is fucking scum.

this is a cycle fueld by severe retardation and egotistical masturbation.

As long as kids on both sides are dying over the powerstruggles of thoughtless adults I have absolutely no sympathy for either "cause"

 

[ge-man]

Yeah, no kidding. I think the situation would immediately improve if Sharon and Arrafat were to disappear tommorrow. This conflict is impossible to instiguish because it is imbedded in the institutions of Isreal and Palestine. The leaders need to change or be removed if anything postive is going to occur.