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[markot]

They didnt lay off devs, they just took the whole symbian thing back in house and shut down the foundation that was meant to be steering it.

With no other phone manufacturers using it, it didnt make sense to keep the platform outside or separate from Nokia anymore.

Im guessing that this announcement will be, at most, some kind of shared app store or cross platform usability, or just office and productivity tools for Symbian finally being released after the announcement a year or so ago.

 

[Uncle]

They didnt lay off devs, they just took the whole symbian thing back in house and shut down the foundation that was meant to be steering it.

Uh, yeah they did.

http://www.tietokone.fi/uutiset/nokia_irtisanoo_symbian_kehittajia_pelattya_vahemman
http://www.digitoday.fi/tyo-ja-ura/...-jaavat-pelattya-pienemmiksi/2011533/66?rss=6

About 500 people got laid off, most were Symbian devs. It was supposed to be 850 people, but some of them got new jobs within the company.

 

[industrian]

this with wp7 would be nice

I really want this phone. But what I've heard about the OS and CPU put me off.

 

[YakiSOBA]

As much as I love nokia phones, I have to admit my E71 is utter trash :/

It's so slow when I open txt messages and all that, and I make an effort to delete most of my txts after I receive them... sigh.

Definitely going with an android phone next.

 

[CiSTM]

As much as I love nokia phones, I have to admit my E71 is utter trash :/

It's so slow when I open txt messages and all that, and I make an effort to delete most of my txts after I receive them... sigh.

Definitely going with an android phone next.

Symbian really has runned it's course
I bought E72 to replace my HTC Desire since I needed longer battery life and I was some what happy with it for few months but the it became extremly slow and nothing really worked and I had to reboot the phone every now and then. Then I went back to Desire and while the battery life is utter trash it's still great phone.

 

[spats]

R.I.P. Android 2008-2011.

edit: Symbian user here. I hate that OS with every fiber of my being.

 

[markot]

I really want this phone. But what I've heard about the OS and CPU put me off.

Theres nothing wrong with the CPU >.< and the OS is fine, the only poor thing is the default web browser but its getting updated this month.

 

[CiSTM]

Theres nothing wrong with the CPU >.< and the OS is fine, the only poor thing is the default web browser but its getting updated this month.

OS is awful, it's slow, it's clunky and it's still the same os as the previous Symbian operating systems :lol

You have to go through gazillion sub-menus to find certain settings and usually the setting you tried to find is hidden in some very illogical place. Customisation of your home screen is also painfull and doesn't really make it easier to use your phone. Even simple task like loging into facebook tooks a lot of effort with this phone. There was also many other cons I found during my one day use of the phone.

 

[markot]

Its not slow or clunky, it doesnt have a jillion sub menus...

 

[CiSTM]

Its not slow or clunky, it doesnt have a jillion sub menus...

Yes it is and yes it does. At least when compared to other operating systems. I do have access to Nokia N8 since my friend and sister has it and I haven't found single good thing about it during my inspections of the os. Every major OS out there (iOS, Android, WP7) does what Symbian 3^ does but better and then some. There is no real reason to go Symbian at this point.

 

[ninjapanda]

I'm not certain if adoption of WP7 as their primary OS will turn things around for nokia. It doesnt tie in with their current cross development strategy using qt with meego and symbian. They'll lose the ecosystem they currently control (to one which is currently smaller and out of their control) and all the services they offer will need to be rewritten and updates wont be compatible with their current or legacy phones. Should they choose to diversify and use all three plus S40 they'll bog themselves down changing code for compatibility of services across all platforms and cause fragmentation of third party app development. Also the current featureset of symbian is much more advanced than WP7 at this stage especially with the microsoft enforced restrictions. Unfortunately implementation of the featureset is poor and usability currently suffers as a result. An overhaul of symbians UI or a complete move to meego to maintain compatibility and the current ecosystem would seem more logical in my opinion. But good luck to them whatever they decide to do. Their hardware is still some of the best in the business nomatter the OS imo.

 

[RobotChant]

At first I was like "no one will care for WP7 on Nokia hardware". By that I mean, Nokia and WP7 are bit players in this game at this time.

However I can see Nokia getting involved with MS and using their clout with retailers to get Nokia hardware onto store shelves.

 

[ninjapanda]

Every major OS out there (iOS, Android, WP7) does what Symbian 3^ does but better and then some.

Thats not true. However in terms of primary functions which are used most like email, address book etc then for the most part then yes I can sorta agree. To my understanding (and I may be wrong because I cant keep up to date with this fast moving industry) S^3 is really the only one currently supporting USB- OTG, GPU support, and complete on screen replication of the OS via HDMI or other monitor out solution?(not 100% sure) Then of course you have different basic things which it can do which others cant like proper microSD support which Wp7 cant, bluetooth file transfer which iOS cant etc. etc

 

[markot]

Thats not true. However in terms of primary functions which are used most like email, address book etc then for the most part then yes I can sorta agree. To my understanding (and I may be wrong because I cant keep up to date with this fast moving industry) S^3 is really the only one currently supporting USB- OTG, GPU support, and complete on screen replication of the OS via HDMI or other monitor out solution?(not 100% sure) Then of course you have different basic things which it can do which others cant like proper microSD support which Wp7 cant, bluetooth file transfer which iOS cant etc. etc

Yep. And an app that gives you a pretty nifty media player os when you plug it into anything with the HDMI, and you can use the wiimote to control it >.>

 

[Walshicus]

Bit misleading title. Windows Phone 7 is very different to Windows Mobile.

Depending on how MS and Nokia revenue split the marketplace... This could be pretty good for Nokia. The problem with most smartphone OS' is getting volume through the application stores. WP7 applications sell quite well.

 

[Xater]

About time Nokia drops the Symbian crap.

 

[davepoobond]

do people still buy nokia phones?

 

[jonremedy]

do people still buy nokia phones?

Last time I saw stats, they were slightly behind Android (all manufacturers) in wordwide sales.

Edit: Smartphones.

 

[Riddick]

If so, that's probably the end of Nokia for me. (I've only ever owned Nokias.)

Same here. I'll take Symbian and MeeGo over Windows phone any day. And btw I like the dozens of submenus. Just because some companies dumbify their OSs to appeal to the masses doesn't mean it's good.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

Symbian is an awful and outdated OS, but I still don't understand why aren't they adopting Android. Like all other manufacuters p, they could do a customized UI and differentate themselves from the competition.

WM7, currently, doesn't make sense.

1) IIRC,it only supports a single CPU, a 1GHz one. This means a high-end only phone. You need at least 3 price tears to cover the smartphone market, if not 4.

2) You can't reskin it. This isn't really an issue right now, since the market isn't saturated, but it may prove to be an issue in the future. I believe Nokia wants to leverage the strenght of it's brand and to somehow make itself unique, no matter the platform.

This may be a MS/Nokia test, with only high end phones launched. Maybe mainsteam ones as well. Nokia will only adopt WM7 if it can achieve extremely high market penetration with it.

 

[giga]

Thats not true. However in terms of primary functions which are used most like email, address book etc then for the most part then yes I can sorta agree. To my understanding (and I may be wrong because I cant keep up to date with this fast moving industry) S^3 is really the only one currently supporting USB- OTG, GPU support, and complete on screen replication of the OS via HDMI or other monitor out solution?(not 100% sure) Then of course you have different basic things which it can do which others cant like proper microSD support which Wp7 cant, bluetooth file transfer which iOS cant etc. etc

This is the same argument people brought up in 2007 when they compared iPhone OS to Windows Mobile and Symbian. People don’t care about this shit when it has the user experience of Windows 98.

 

[tino]

I feel sorry for the Nokia employees, they have two CEO who have made two big mistakes and steer the giant Nokia ship into the wrong place.

First of all, the last CEO made the mistake of aligning with intel for the Meego OS. This is a wrong move. At the present time, any mobile chip that is not ARM is a wrong wrong move. And I have heard rumor of the first Meego handset running on intel 1.6 ghz chip, which is basically the mobile version of Atom! You don't put a freaking Atom in a cellphone.

Second of all, the new CEO is a Microsoft guy, and he made the pack of joining WP7 with MS, presumably for the NA market. As far as I concern, S^3 is like a version 1.0 of a smartphone OS, but WP7 is basically a 0.8 beta version a new smartphone OS. So they are dumping 1 unfinished OS for another.

A lot of Nokia employees will lose job over this.

Nobody buys Nokia phone in the US, and hardly anyone brought WP7 (under 2 million worldwide shipped), if you combine these two, why would it make it any more attractive? Is like combining Daewoo and Saturn and make a new Daewoo-Saturn sell it in the same dealer, why would any one care?

 

[ninjapanda]

People don’t care about this shit when it has the user experience of Windows 98.

No I completely agree. Hence y I started off saying the primary functions that most ppl use are superior on other platforms. I was simply disagreeing with the generalisation of the poster I was replying too. I also stated previously that whilst the featureset of symbian is good its useability is bad. In the end it doesnt matter how many things the OS can do if the vast majority cannot figure out how to do it.

 

[Blackhead]

I really want this phone. But what I've heard about the OS and CPU put me off.

the screen resolution is also too low imo. Retina display or bust.

 

[Phantast2k]

I wish they went open platform, kind of. So in addition to offering pre-installed OS, they'd have a special web-shop where they'd let you decide on which hardware you want to combine with which OS (WebOS, Meego, Android, Win7) sort of like Dell of cellphones. This way you could have Nokia's good hardware combined with your favorite OS.
No need for compromises!

 

[Walshicus]

I feel sorry for the Nokia employees, they have two CEO who have made two big mistakes and steer the giant Nokia ship into the wrong place.

First of all, the last CEO made the mistake of aligning with intel for the Meego OS. This is a wrong move. At the present time, any mobile chip that is not ARM is a wrong wrong move. And I have heard rumor of the first Meego handset running on intel 1.6 ghz chip, which is basically the mobile version of Atom! You don't put a freaking Atom in a cellphone.

Second of all, the new CEO is a Microsoft guy, and he made the pack of joining WP7 with MS, presumably for the NA market. As far as I concern, S^3 is like a version 1.0 of a smartphone OS, but WP7 is basically a 0.8 beta version a new smartphone OS. So they are dumping 1 unfinished OS for another.

A lot of Nokia employees will lose job over this.

Nobody buys Nokia phone in the US, and hardly anyone brought WP7 (under 2 million worldwide shipped), if you combine these two, why would it make it any more attractive? Is like combining Daewoo and Saturn and make a new Daewoo-Saturn sell it in the same dealer, why would any one care?

Oh come the fuck on. Version 0.8? Right off the bat MS launched WP7 feeling better than every version of iOS or Android, with a user friendly feature set the others have few analogues to. I have yet to show it to someone and not have them impressed.

 

[crazy monkey]

do people still buy nokia phones?

I have it . I love it. It is awesome. It does what phone is suppose to do.

 

[gcubed]

Oh come the fuck on. Version 0.8? Right off the bat MS launched WP7 feeling better than every version of iOS or Android, with a user friendly feature set the others have few analogues to. I have yet to show it to someone and not have them impressed.

MS can really use some of those impressed people to actually go out and you know... buy the phone.

 

[Earl Cazone]

would love that, nokia hardware is usually great and reliable.
i wonder if they merge the ovi store and the zune store. that way, microsoft could habe that cool turn by turn navi, nokia offers, since their bing app sucks

 

[lunarworks]

You like Symbian? It is outdated trash.

Nope. Hate it. My 5800 does the job for me, but it could be a whole lot better.

I'd just rather not go with WP7. We've finally managed to break away from Microsoft's unbreakable OS headlock on the desktop through mobile devices, and I am not too thrilled at the idea of them trying to get their monopoly back.

MeeGo may not be much at the moment, but Nokia can give it that worldwide push once it's actually available. I'd even go for Android on their phones. Just not WP7.

 

[dofry]

Its not slow or clunky, it doesnt have a jillion sub menus...

There is nothing wrong with Nokia hardware, but...
Symbian.

Slower and clunkier than others. Menus are not that logical, and differ from phone model to the other so you have to learn again where everything is. Functions belonging to the same subcategory are not placed inside the same folder.
Nokia phones are designed for the geek, which many useful irc, vpn, remote desktop apps prove. There is no real UI design with good usability yet. Many of my friends who work there doing this stuff complain that they don't listen, but it's not all about choices. It is just Symbian in general, huge pile of different phone models and a bit outdated software on top of it that isn't designed for all the new features in mind. Symbian is not a pile of shit, but the whole structure is worse to use than Android/iOS/AppStores. Easy of use is now pop.

Nokia has always had this problem, and they now had to choose if they stay with Symbian, or make a whole new OS collaboration with Maemo+Linux=MeeGo platform. They chose to use both, at least for now. I think going also with MeeGo is a good choice, and I hope the end of the year phones having that OS are good ones. We have to wait and see.

 

[industrian]

the screen resolution is also too low imo. Retina display or bust.

640 x 360 does seem a bit low imo.

 

[ep85]

Nobody buys Nokia phone in the US, and hardly anyone brought WP7 (under 2 million worldwide shipped), if you combine these two, why would it make it any more attractive? Is like combining Daewoo and Saturn and make a new Daewoo-Saturn sell it in the same dealer, why would any one care?

I think the counterpoint is that each company has what the other is lacking. The reason WP7 doesn't sell is because they didn't launch with a must-have device. The reason Nokias don't sell is because they have a OS that has roots from 10 years ago. That and they don't seem to like playing with US telecom companies since I can't even remember a flagship phone released on subsidy in the US.

All they need is one device, that pushes boundaries, to make the union successful.

And to those who think Symbian is going away because of this union, think again. Symbian will be their low-end smartphone OS. Meego is the OS that needs to watch its back.

 

[industrian]

Easy of use is now pop.

The funny thing is that Nokia were once the kings of mobile usability. For my honours project I did a lot of web usability stuff for mobile web and 8/10 of all papers I came across on the subject were by Nokia.

The entire mobile market has been turned on its head in recent years. But making computer systems (whether they're smartphones or desktop based) easy to use is for everyone's benefit. Apple's designers are on the button when it comes to this, everyone else is playing catch up.

 

[Fatalah]

Has Nokia ever made a phone that's not GSM? Nokia CDMA models are definitely needed to help Microsoft crack the US market.

 

[tino]

Oh come the fuck on. Version 0.8? Right off the bat MS launched WP7 feeling better than every version of iOS or Android, with a user friendly feature set the others have few analogues to. I have yet to show it to someone and not have them impressed.

WP7 is like the Scott Pilgrim of the mobile Operation System, people have made up their mind to ignore it before it was even out.

BTW I am being nice to compare WP7 to SP. WP7 is nowhere as polish.

But the fans are equally rabid though. :lol:

 

[jagowar]

I think the counterpoint is that each company has what the other is lacking. The reason WP7 doesn't sell is because they didn't launch with a must-have device. The reason Nokias don't sell is because they have a OS that has roots from 10 years ago. That and they don't seem to like playing with US telecom companies since I can't even remember a flagship phone released on subsidy in the US.

All they need is one device, that pushes boundaries, to make the union successful.

And to those who think Symbian is going away because of this union, think again. Symbian will be their low-end smartphone OS. Meego is the OS that needs to watch its back.

Agreed..... where would android be right now w/o the "droid" brand? (probably right next to wp7 because android was not doing too well either before the droid line and its marketing campaign).

 

[gcubed]

Agreed..... where would android be right now w/o the "droid" brand? (probably right next to wp7 because android was not doing too well either before the droid line and its marketing campaign).

well, the only provider that offered android before that was tmobile, so it went to a larger provider and got more sales. WP7 had a huge ad campaign, and is on ATT ... and is where its at.

also, the name windows is still attached to it, no matter how different it is, it will always have the stigma of windows mobile.

 

[faridmon]

do people still buy nokia phones?

The only Mobile phones I ever had is Nokia ones. I love Nokia.

 

[Kabouter]

do people still buy nokia phones?

Yes, I bought one last year, it's not a proper smartphone though, I have no interest in those.

 

[industrian]

Nokia are still the No. 1 cell phone company in the world iirc.

 

[LCfiner]

Nokia are still the No. 1 cell phone company in the world iirc.

in unit sales, not profits. and the sales numbers (and profits) keep dropping year after year. they definitely need an improved OS platform

 

[teiresias]

Meh, I think the investors probably would look upon this move as pretty shady and not inspiring confidence at all. It simply says to them that their CEO is more beholden to his old company than the well being of his new company. Not the most inspiring move in the world for him to make.

 

[industrian]

in unit sales, not profits.

That's what I meant. My phone in Taiwan is a cheap Nokia phone I got when I stepped off the plane. They're ubiquitous mobiles throughout the world and get the job done well.

and the sales numbers (and profits) keep dropping year after year. they definitely need an improved OS platform

Nokia right now do things their own way in regards to software. All they have to do is take a step back and reconsider if this is the right course for their Premium products. Their other phones, such as the one I use, will continue to be popular throughout the world irregardless of fancy operating systems and user interfaces. And they continue to get cheaper to manufacture and to sell.

 

[Blackhead]

Nokia right now do things their own way in regards to software. All they have to do is take a step back and reconsider if this is the right course for their Premium products. Their other phones, such as the one I use, will continue to be popular throughout the world irregardless of fancy operating systems and user interfaces. And they continue to get cheaper to manufacture and to sell.

It's already been pointed out a couple of times that the popularity of Nokia phones is going down... Chinese and Indian competitors are manufacturing and selling cheaper phones to boot.

 

[industrian]

It's already been pointed out a couple of times that the popularity of Nokia phones is going down... Chinese and Indian competitors are manufacturing and selling cheaper phones to boot.

I doubt the Chinese/Indian competitors will be big names outside of their respective countries. But then again those two countries are a colossal marketshare of the world's mobile phone market.

But these are entry-level phones we're talking about. A new OS won't do fuck all for phones that's main objective is messaging, calling and basic internet connectivity.

 

[numble]

I doubt the Chinese/Indian competitors will be big names outside of their respective countries. But then again those two countries are a colossal marketshare of the world's mobile phone market.

You're not describing reality though. In 2010, a Chinese company called ZTE came out of nowhere and knocked RIM off of 5th place, and even passed Apple and is now 4th place. And they have been doing well (according to Reuters) in other markets. They nearly doubled marketshare while Nokia lost 7% and sold fewer phones year over year. You can even buy ZTE products at the US carriers now.

Strong sales also of cheaper cellphones in China, Africa and Latin America helped to lift China's ZTE Corp to the fourth-largest position

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/28/us-cellphones-market-idUSTRE70R0NI20110128

ZTE is not even dominant in China. I don't know too much about the manufacturers there, but it's possible that these other China guys will also do well if/once they go global.

The low-cost market is a race to the bottom. That's why Nokia's profits have been pretty low and flat compared to smartphone makers.

 

[Magni]

N95 was my first smartphone (followed by a Hero and now an Omnia 7), I really want a Nokia phone for the hardware, but I hate the software (at least, now in 2011 I do). Nokia HW with WP7 would be the best

 

[industrian]

You're not describing reality though. In 2010, a Chinese company called ZTE came out of nowhere and knocked RIM off of 5th place, and even passed Apple and is now 4th place. And they have been doing well (according to Reuters) in other markets. They nearly doubled marketshare while Nokia lost 7% and sold fewer phones year over year. You can even buy ZTE products at the US carriers now.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/28/us-cellphones-market-idUSTRE70R0NI20110128

The low-cost market is a race to the bottom. That's why Nokia's profits have been pretty low and flat compared to smartphone makers.

I know about ZTE. My girlfriend works for them.

I can see a lot more Chinese companies emerging in a similar fashion in many different IT sectors in the next few years. But Nokia would have to fuck up real bad in order to drop to below 2nd place within the next 2-3 years.

 

[Riddick]

You're not describing reality though. In 2010, a Chinese company called ZTE came out of nowhere and knocked RIM off of 5th place, and even passed Apple and is now 4th place. And they have been doing well (according to Reuters) in other markets. They nearly doubled marketshare while Nokia lost 7% and sold fewer phones year over year. You can even buy ZTE products at the US carriers now.
http://i.imgur.com/4lqAk.jpg

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/01/28/us-cellphones-market-idUSTRE70R0NI20110128[/url]

ZTE is not even dominant in China. I don't know too much about the manufacturers there, but it's possible that these other China guys will also do well if/once they go global.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/bD6S2.jpg
The low-cost market is a race to the bottom. That's why Nokia's profits have been pretty low and flat compared to smartphone makers.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/Np468.png[/QUOTE]

I for one am glad I'm a fan of a company that doesn't rip off its customers like Apple does hence the low profit. That's why Nokia is so popular and Apple can only succeed in USA where it bombards its customers with ads in order to sell its products.