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[GaimeGuy]

Wrestling in general is in decline, in the same way that certain types of TV shows and genres of movies are hot for several years and then fade away.

You know how over the last decade, we've seen the rise of reality TV shows where clashing personalities are placed together and the arising conflict that isn't scripted, but not entirely unplanned, draws viewers in? How shows like American Idol where the fans dictate the course of the program have become popular?

That is exactly what wrestling is all about. Wrestling shouldn't be in the decline. Wrestling has always been about being a dynamic product where the fans and performers participate in a feedback loop, influencing one another's actions, resulting in entertainment. About scripted brawls where punches do get pulled, but people still fall onto their backs and do backlips off of elevated platforms onto the ground for our amusement.

Scripted but not fake entertainment is IN. Wrestling should be popular. Not on the way out. MMA should be supplanting boxing, not wrestling.

 

[SoulPlaya]

This discussion is besides the point, anyway. Guys don't have to be SCSA and Rock, they still got beaten by lesser guys. On top of that, Cena isn't as good as SCSA and Rock.

What's more important, though, is that SCSA and Rock were only on top for a few years (Rock only one, really). Cena has been burying people for SEVEN YEARS. Seven years of the same shit every week for hours at a time. I mean, nothing changes. The same smirk, the same no selling, the same moves. Nothing changes. Now, it's almost like they don't even try to have any coherent storylines around him. Some guy just challenges him, he smirks at them, then delivers the same "RESPECT I WILL WIN" promo, and there it is, you have a Cena storyline.

 

[RBH]

We've been doing it wrong all along, friend. It's a whole new world out there.

http://www.tout.com/m/z5sg41

I hope clyde signs up for tout as well.


Never forget.

 

[billy beane]

I'd actually be fine with Cena as the top guy if the supporting cast was given more and better chances. The problem is nobody is at his level at the moment, and they are doing very little to change that.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

But shouldn't they be trying to do something different to get better? If this formula isn't working for them, then why keep doing it?

PG isn't the problem, though. Things were as raunchy as ever in 2006 and 2007. Cena still sucked, he just made lame ass "you're gay" and "choke on my nuts" jokes. The product has been in decline due to lazy ass storylines, horrendous pacing, pushes that go nowhere. Things were very raunchy in 2002, and that was the worst the product ever was to me. Though, this is probably just as bad, and maybe even worse. Back then, at least, SD! was still pretty good, while HHH buried everyone on RAW.

Perhaps it's out of their control. Why isn't disco music popular anymore? I have no idea. As time passes, interests and hobbies evolve. It's not possible to single out one or two specific reasons why certain things are super popular for several years begin to fade away, it just happens.

 

[Kaladin]

WWE in 2012 is all about building Cena up for Rock vs Cena II at WM next year for the belt. Get used to it.....and whatever else happens is secondary.

 

[Ithil]

WWE in 2012 is all about building Cena up for Rock vs Cena II at WM next year for the belt. Get used to it.....and whatever else happens is secondary.

Vince actually thinks building Cena up further for a year to win the title at WM in a rematch is a blockbuster idea that everyone will love.

 

[SoulPlaya]

I'd actually be fine with Cena as the top guy if the supporting cast was given more and better chances. The problem is nobody is at his level at the moment, and they are doing very little to change that.

It would be cool if Cena was just one storyline, but there were other storylines that were going on, so you could just ignore Cena, and focus on that. It's why people were enjoying the AJ storyline so much, because it seemed like a storyline that the WWE was actually putting effort into, and it didn't involve Cena. Thus, people could do what I did, just not watch the Cena stuff, and focus on that.

Now, however, that storyline has gotten lazy and lost direction, and Cena will likely be inserted into that one, as well.

 

[bangai-o]

maybe in ten years Cena will swerve evrybody at Monday Night TNA and become Hollywood Cena with a black beard and black Cena gear. CM Punk and Danie Bryan debut themselves as his chronies. Dolph Ziggler is forced to hide in the rafters.
edit
one of the TNA superstars is forced into the rafters. Sting.

 

[Novid]

You know how over the last decade, we've seen the rise of reality TV shows where clashing personalities are placed together and the arising conflict that isn't scripted, but not entirely unplanned, draws viewers in? How shows like American Idol where the fans dictate the course of the program have become popular?

That is exactly what wrestling is all about. Wrestling shouldn't be in the decline. Wrestling has always been about being a dynamic product where the fans and performers participate in a feedback loop, influencing one another's actions, resulting in entertainment. About scripted brawls where punches do get pulled, but people still fall onto their backs and do backlips off of elevated platforms onto the ground for our amusement.

Scripted but not fake entertainment is IN. Wrestling should be popular. Not on the way out. MMA should be supplanting boxing, not wrestling.

all true. all true. The issue is the Brand cares about ONE man (before two men in orton and cena) and the rest can blow in the win. That and the fact Vince wants to do the reality product but doesnt want the pro wrestling aspect stuns me.

 

[Ithil]

It would be cool if Cena was just one storyline, but there were other storylines that were going on, so you could just ignore Cena, and focus on that. It's why people were enjoying the AJ storyline so much, because it seemed like a storyline that the WWE was actually putting effort into, and it didn't involve Cena. Thus, people could do what I did, just not watch the Cena stuff, and focus on that.

Now, however, that storyline has gotten lazy and lost direction, and Cena will likely be inserted into that one, as well.

I imagine it will just fizzle out in favour of Punk/Cena. Bryan will hang around, and they'll try to come up with something for AJ to do to capitalize on her popularity, but probably fail.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

You know how over the last decade, we've seen the rise of reality TV shows where clashing personalities are placed together and the arising conflict that isn't scripted, but not entirely unplanned, draws viewers in? How shows like American Idol where the fans dictate the course of the program have become popular?

That is exactly what wrestling is all about. Wrestling shouldn't be in the decline. Wrestling has always been about being a dynamic product where the fans and performers participate in a feedback loop, influencing one another's actions, resulting in entertainment. About scripted brawls where punches do get pulled, but people still fall onto their backs and do backlips off of elevated platforms onto the ground for our amusement.

Scripted but not fake entertainment is IN. Wrestling should be popular. Not on the way out. MMA should be supplanting boxing, not wrestling.

You make several great points, but maybe in the context of today and all the distractions available for us wrestling is still popular? Cable TV viewership has been on the decline for a long time now, a slow decline but a decline nonetheless. There are so many other options for entertainment these days compared to 12-15 years ago. Cell phones, Facebook, online gaming being so huge, Internet in general, NFL becoming so massive, many other factors. Maybe when considering all those factors WWE has to compete with these days wrestling is still popular? Perhaps not as much as back then but not as dead as we think?

 

[pants]

Thanks Keyser! Also lol everyone that bet probably made a profit, I couldnt due to regional blocks.

 

[SoulPlaya]

I imagine it will just fizzle out in favour of Punk/Cena. Bryan will hang around, and they'll try to come up with something for AJ to do to capitalize on her popularity, but probably fail.

They should have kept. . . in it.

Oh, nevermind! So. . . . . close.

 

[Kaladin]

Vince actually thinks building Cena up further for a year to win the title at WM in a rematch is a blockbuster idea that everyone will love.

No, it will be The Rock challenging Cena for the title. The Rock will win the Royal Rumble next year to set it up.

 

[bean breath]

Excited for Raw tomorrow.

 

[SoulPlaya]

No, it will be The Rock challenging Cena for the title. The Rock will win the Royal Rumble next year to set it up.

I can already picture the looks on the superstars' faces when Rock makes his surprise entrance, lol.

Waste a great way of getting new talent over by giving it to a guy who's already the biggest star, lol.

 

[Ithil]

I can already picture the looks on the superstars' faces when Rock makes his surprise entrance, lol.

Waste a great way of getting new talent over by giving it to a guy who's already the biggest star, lol.

Who already won the Rumble before.

 

[Dark Ninja]

Cena will beat Taker at mania the thread will explode in Cena Hate

 

[Anth0ny]

WCW continues to ruin everything - "Are You Serious?" - Episode 24

That was really good rofl

heh

mark

i get it

 

[SoulPlaya]

Who already won the Rumble before.

LOL! You're right.

 

[Kaladin]

Waste a great way of getting new talent over by giving it to a guy who's already the biggest star, lol.

That's exactly what they did tonight, why not do it again?

 

[Net_Wrecker]

Nobody even says "workrate" anymore, eff Puppet H.

 

[GaimeGuy]

This discussion is besides the point, anyway. Guys don't have to be SCSA and Rock, they still got beaten by lesser guys. On top of that, Cena isn't as good as SCSA and Rock.

What's more important, though, is that SCSA and Rock were only on top for a few years (Rock only one, really). Cena has been burying people for SEVEN YEARS. Seven years of the same shit every week for hours at a time. I mean, nothing changes. The same smirk, the same no selling, the same moves. Nothing changes. Now, it's almost like they don't even try to have any coherent storylines around him. Some guy just challenges him, he smirks at them, then delivers the same "RESPECT I WILL WIN" promo, and there it is, you have a Cena storyline.

I believe the fans started turning on cena around the time of his feud with Jericho in 2005. He went over JBL and won the title at mania 21, but then he proceeded to, well, bury Kurt Angle and Chris Jericho over the rest of the year in the very, very, VERY stale, overcome-the-odds, never-say-die, salute-the-troops-because-I-just-filmed-The-Marine-and-am-a-patriot, way. The corniness of his promos (which completely clashed with the character Cena had gotten over with in the first place), the lack of storytelling or plausible doubt of victory in his matches, the introduction of the STFU when he went over Kurt Angle in a fucking submission match.... that's what caused the crowd to turn on him.

Like, imagine if CM Punk incorporated "I dig crazy chicks" into EVERY promo he did, EVERY RAW, and didn't sell shit in the ring. The fans would first be rolling their eyes at him, but that would turn into boos after 4-6 months.

That's exactly what happened with Cena. His corniness, combined with the complete inability to tell a story in the ring, resulted in the fans turning on him by Summerslam, after he won the title from JBL at Mania.

It only got worse over time.

 

[SoulPlaya]

That's exactly what they did tonight, why not do it again?

Fucking company.

 

[BlazinAm]

Cena will beat Taker at mania the thread will explode in Cena Hate

Makes me wish Kane said yes to beating to the Undertaker at wrestlemania 20.

 

[Ithil]

Makes me wish Kane said yes to beating to the Undertaker at wrestlemania 20.

That would have been really stupid, though, since that was Taker's big return to the Phenom.

 

[SoulPlaya]

I believe the fans started turning on cena around the time of his feud with Jericho in 2005. He went over JBL and won the title at mania 21, but then he proceeded to, well, bury Kurt Angle and Chris Jericho over the rest of the year in the very, very, VERY stale, overcome-the-odds, never-say-die, salute-the-troops-because-I-just-filmed-The-Marine-and-am-a-patriot, way. The corniness of his promos (which completely clashed with the character Cena had gotten over with in the first place), the lack of storytelling or plausible doubt of victory in his matches, the introduction of the STFU when he went over Kurt Angle in a fucking submission match.... that's what caused the crowd to turn on him.

Like, imagine if CM Punk incorporated "I dig crazy chicks" into EVERY promo he did, EVERY RAW, and didn't sell shit in the ring. The fans would first be rolling their eyes at him, but that would turn into boos after 4-6 months.

That's exactly what happened with Cena. His corniness, combined with the complete inability to tell a story in the ring, resulted in the fans turning on him by Summerslam, after he won the title from JBL at Mania.

It only got worse over time.

The fucked up part is that they've felt no real desire to actually create new talent. The idea that the talent just isn't there is nonsense. There are plenty of charismatic showmen with great wrestling ability and great promo skills just waiting to be given an opportunity. Hell, most of those guys are already signed to the WWE. Just give them a chance!

 

[BlazinAm]

That would have been really stupid, though, since that was Taker's big return to the Phenom.

Oh i get that but for Cena to be the man to do everything in the wwe to give Taker his first lost at WM is bullshit. They will probably bring back king of the ring next year so Cena can win that too.

 

[Kaladin]

I highly doubt Cena vs Taker at WM will ever happen. I think Undertaker has one, maybe two more Wrestlemania matches in him and Cena will be tied up the next couple of years with The Rock.

 

[Bowser]

The resemblance is uncanny

 

[SoulPlaya]

I highly doubt Cena vs Taker at WM will ever happen. I think Undertaker has one, maybe two more Wrestlemania matches in him and Cena will be tied up the next couple of years with The Rock.

It's Lesnar this year. . . . . . and HHH again the year after that. The end of the end of an era.

 

[Kaladin]

It's Lesnar this year. . . . . . and HHH again the year after that. The end of the end of an era.

I doubt they will do Triple H again unless it is a retirement match.

 

[SoulPlaya]

I doubt they will do Triple H again unless it is a retirement match.

If only there was someone left who would be perfect for a last Taker match. Someone whose gimmicks fits in well with Takers, and would allow for tremendous fan service to send them both off the right way. If only.

And no, it's not Mick Foley.

 

[Kaladin]

If only there was someone left who would be perfect for a last Taker match. Someone whose gimmicks fits in well with Takers, and would allow for tremendous fan service to send them both off the right way. If only.

And no, it's not Mick Foley.

I agree that the finale should be Taker vs Kane at Wrestlemania 30. I don't know if the streak should end, but if it does, I'd want Kane to do it.

 

[BlazinAm]

If only there was someone left who would be perfect for a last Taker match. Someone whose gimmicks fits in well with Takers, and would allow for tremendous fan service to send them both off the right way. If only.

And no, it's not Mick Foley.

Kane... what do i win!
edit: beaten

 

[Keyser Soze]

If only there was someone left who would be perfect for a last Taker match. Someone whose gimmicks fits in well with Takers, and would allow for tremendous fan service to send them both off the right way. If only.

And no, it's not Mick Foley.

 

[billy beane]

If only there was someone left who would be perfect for a last Taker match. Someone whose gimmicks fits in well with Takers, and would allow for tremendous fan service to send them both off the right way. If only.

And no, it's not Mick Foley.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

If only there was someone left who would be perfect for a last Taker match. Someone whose gimmicks fits in well with Takers, and would allow for tremendous fan service to send them both off the right way. If only.

And no, it's not Mick Foley.

 

[BlazinAm]

How much validity was there to the rumor of Sting going to the wwe?

 

[SoulPlaya]

You know what's funny? It would serve as a great new way to install the next big "scary guy" and give him legitimacy for the next twenty years. However, they've built no one up to be that credible guy, and don't look to be doing so, either.

 

[Kaladin]

How much validity was there to the rumor of Sting going to the wwe?

Sting was made an offer, but Dixie Carter matched it and he signed on for one more year, just like he always does.

 

[SoulPlaya]

How much validity was there to the rumor of Sting going to the wwe?

Sting himself said that he was close, and that he would have faced Taker.

I don't know why people want to see Sting vs. Taker, though. During the crow days, sure, but Sting hasn't really done the crow gimmick since 98.

 

[MegaKungFuRadio]

Sting himself said that he was close, and that he would have faced Taker.

I don't know why people want to see Sting vs. Taker, though. During the crow days, sure, but Sting hasn't really done the crow gimmick since 98.

No reason he couldn't come back and crow it up.

Mysterio came back masked.

 

[Ithil]

Sting himself said that he was close, and that he would have faced Taker.

I don't know why people want to see Sting vs. Taker, though. During the crow days, sure, but Sting hasn't really done the crow gimmick since 98.

It's the spectacle, and I'm sure he would have revived the crow gimmick for it.

 

[Kaladin]

It's the spectacle, and I'm sure he would have revived the crow gimmick for it.

I can only imagine how awesome Sting's WWE debut would be.....they would play it up all night to be Undertaker, till the overrun of Raw where it is revealed to be Sting.

 

[sf2fanatic]

This asshole right here is the reason the WWE continues to suck.
We need to track him down and make an example out of him.

Cena will beat Taker at mania the thread will explode in Cena Hate

 

[billy beane]

Sting himself said that he was close, and that he would have faced Taker.

I don't know why people want to see Sting vs. Taker, though. During the crow days, sure, but Sting hasn't really done the crow gimmick since 98.

It's probably one of the biggest dream matches wrestling fans have left. There aren't too many left.

 

[Chuckl3s]

Just got back from Money in the Bank. Awesome show.

 

[SoulPlaya]

It's the spectacle, and I'm sure he would have revived the crow gimmick for it.

What spectacle, though? Sting's gimmick was never that he had weird, mysterious powers. His gimmick wasn't even that he was scary. I would have liked to see it too, but I still think the WWE would have ruined the spectacle, and he would have just obviously jobbed. Plus, the time has just passed, unfortunately. We're talking two years FROM NOW, and Sting would be too old and banged up for a really good match.

You know, though, I always wished that Taker had taken on this guy.

They could have really built him up as a credible challenger, and spectacle is what Muta is all about in many ways.