Sweeney Tom
Banned
Looking forward to your posts when Sheamus/Crews, Dana and Charlotte vs Becky and Natty, Corbin/Dolph, Lucha/Dudleys, and Rusev/Titus happen
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June Wrasslin' |OT| Powered by Bluekaveli
- Thread starter blackaroni
- Start date
Looking forward to your posts when Sheamus/Crews, Dana and Charlotte vs Becky and Natty, Corbin/Dolph, Lucha/Dudleys, and Rusev/Titus happen
Lightning Count
Member
I'm staying up late for MITB I'll brew some coffee and watch on the network.
slightconfuse
Banned
Shibata and Okada won. Yessss
Ladder match sounds insane
Ladder match sounds insane
FallingEdge
Member
Not sure how I feel about Naito/Okada.
I need to see this play out.
I need to see this play out.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
KO beat AJ clean on TV. In fact, I think KO is like X-0 against AJ including house shows and not including multiple man matches.
I had mentioned this in the car the other day: they keep calling this the best card ever, but there's actually only 3 matches that are interesting and 5 matches that are random with practically no real build.
There's a PPV tonight? I'll be damned.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
We'll get around to it. Every PPV gets a thread and MITB is one of the Big 4 now (its gotten better buyrates than Survivor Series; so did Elimination Chamber, but they cancelled Elimination Chamber)
Jesus H.Christ, Hogan looks like the third member of Harlem Heat
slightconfuse
Banned
This card looks good
Lightning Count
Member
If i ever go to Japan I will go to see NJPW Live.
So quite a few times I've been in this thread lamenting how Ken Shamrock was a missed opportunity. Sure, in the end that generation produced two of the biggest stars ever at the same time and other quality players like Mankind, HHH, Kane but its also always a shame when someone gets lost in the shuffle.
The other day I finally got to the moment that torpedoed his career forever. The one and only WWF Breakdown. Breakdown is a pretty good show most remembered for the double pin on Austin by the proto Brothers of Destruction but the triple threat cage match for the Number One Contender between Mankind, The Rock, and Ken Shamrock is just about the best possible triple threat cage match you could contest...and it also doomed Shamrock forever.
In the weeks leading up to this show The Rock had started a soft face turn. He saved Mankind from a beatdown (Mankind was a tweener leaning heavily face at the time) and started coming out with the NOD less and less. Breakdown is held in Manitoba and for whatever reason instead of treating Rocky like the heel in this match, or treating all three as faces the crowd decides that Rocky should no longer die and that he's the best thing ever...and boring Ken Shamrock is the heel.
Shamrock...has not one fucking clue how to be a heel. His two big things, explosive moves and snapping, are both going to engender him to the crowd. He's a great interview as proven during the early talk show debates over the UFC but he can't do a heel promo to save his life. Besides rampant steroid/hgh use the guy comes off as a true, boring professional. Dean Malenko is more interesting than he is. Steve Blackman is too.
The next night on RAW the main event is Rock/Shamrock/Mankind versus Taker/Kane and Rock and Mankind spend the five minutes before the match beating up Shamrock and even taking shots at him during the match...pretty much for no good reason. So not only is Shamrock not good at this heel shit but he had no motivation for actually turning heel, that doesn't come until weeks later when the Corporation is formed.
The other day I finally got to the moment that torpedoed his career forever. The one and only WWF Breakdown. Breakdown is a pretty good show most remembered for the double pin on Austin by the proto Brothers of Destruction but the triple threat cage match for the Number One Contender between Mankind, The Rock, and Ken Shamrock is just about the best possible triple threat cage match you could contest...and it also doomed Shamrock forever.
In the weeks leading up to this show The Rock had started a soft face turn. He saved Mankind from a beatdown (Mankind was a tweener leaning heavily face at the time) and started coming out with the NOD less and less. Breakdown is held in Manitoba and for whatever reason instead of treating Rocky like the heel in this match, or treating all three as faces the crowd decides that Rocky should no longer die and that he's the best thing ever...and boring Ken Shamrock is the heel.
Shamrock...has not one fucking clue how to be a heel. His two big things, explosive moves and snapping, are both going to engender him to the crowd. He's a great interview as proven during the early talk show debates over the UFC but he can't do a heel promo to save his life. Besides rampant steroid/hgh use the guy comes off as a true, boring professional. Dean Malenko is more interesting than he is. Steve Blackman is too.
The next night on RAW the main event is Rock/Shamrock/Mankind versus Taker/Kane and Rock and Mankind spend the five minutes before the match beating up Shamrock and even taking shots at him during the match...pretty much for no good reason. So not only is Shamrock not good at this heel shit but he had no motivation for actually turning heel, that doesn't come until weeks later when the Corporation is formed.
FlammableD
Banned
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1236281
Thread posted for MITB. You'll have to rely on Blue for your ratings, friends.
Thread posted for MITB. You'll have to rely on Blue for your ratings, friends.
The heel unit that has been dominating the 6 man face offs, bullying and making the same dude tap out every single show for over a month finally get their comeuppance? The bullied instead shows great fighting spirit and makes the bully tap out? Wow, what a cool, feel good wrestling story.
And did you say there is a big, prestigious tournament coming up, the perfect place to build these bad guys back up in? That sounds pretty compelling to me!
In other news the Jr. Tag titles need to be thrown in the bin and Gedo forced to at least try with a new set of teams. Please Gedo.
And did you say there is a big, prestigious tournament coming up, the perfect place to build these bad guys back up in? That sounds pretty compelling to me!
In other news the Jr. Tag titles need to be thrown in the bin and Gedo forced to at least try with a new set of teams. Please Gedo.
Lightning Count
Member
Both awesome and incredibly cheesy at the same time
Shit, I almost forgot there was a PPV tonight.
As per the usual, predictions!
WWE World Heavyweight Champion Roman Reigns vs. Seth Rollins - LOL ROMAN WINS (It might actually be a good match. Crossfit Jesus will probably die for our sins again.)
John Cena vs. AJ Styles - LOL CE-Oh wait, this could go either way? I figure AJ wins this one, then Cena goes and beats him 3-4 times to get back his win, since the future goes through him, etc.
Money in the Bank Ladder Match - Hmm...I'm going with Owens on this one. He seems like the guy to make the most out of it.
WWE Tag Team Champions The New Day vs. Luke Gallows & Karl Anderson vs. Enzo Amore & Big Cass vs. The Vaudevillains (Fatal 4-Way Match) - I'm gonna go w/Enzo and Cass on this one.
U.S. Champion Rusev vs. Titus O'Neil - Rusev TV Champion for Life; So yeah, RUSEV CRUSH.
WWE Womens Champion Charlotte & Dana Brooke vs. Natalya & Becky Lynch - Er...does the outcome even matter here? I'll just go with Nattie and Becky.
Dolph Ziggler vs. Baron Corbin - FFS, this shit's still going on? Corbin wins. Probably with a dick shot.
Apollo Crews vs. Sheamus - Oh hey, something new! Apollo with the surprise win.
The Lucha Dragons vs. The Dudley Boyz (Kickoff Match) - Lucha Dragons win. There may or may not be tables involved.
The Golden Truth vs. Breezango (Kickoff Match) - aka Old People vs Jobbers; Golden Truth probably picks up the win.
As per the usual, predictions!
WWE World Heavyweight Champion Roman Reigns vs. Seth Rollins - LOL ROMAN WINS (It might actually be a good match. Crossfit Jesus will probably die for our sins again.)
John Cena vs. AJ Styles - LOL CE-Oh wait, this could go either way? I figure AJ wins this one, then Cena goes and beats him 3-4 times to get back his win, since the future goes through him, etc.
Money in the Bank Ladder Match - Hmm...I'm going with Owens on this one. He seems like the guy to make the most out of it.
WWE Tag Team Champions The New Day vs. Luke Gallows & Karl Anderson vs. Enzo Amore & Big Cass vs. The Vaudevillains (Fatal 4-Way Match) - I'm gonna go w/Enzo and Cass on this one.
U.S. Champion Rusev vs. Titus O'Neil - Rusev TV Champion for Life; So yeah, RUSEV CRUSH.
WWE Womens Champion Charlotte & Dana Brooke vs. Natalya & Becky Lynch - Er...does the outcome even matter here? I'll just go with Nattie and Becky.
Dolph Ziggler vs. Baron Corbin - FFS, this shit's still going on? Corbin wins. Probably with a dick shot.
Apollo Crews vs. Sheamus - Oh hey, something new! Apollo with the surprise win.
The Lucha Dragons vs. The Dudley Boyz (Kickoff Match) - Lucha Dragons win. There may or may not be tables involved.
The Golden Truth vs. Breezango (Kickoff Match) - aka Old People vs Jobbers; Golden Truth probably picks up the win.
slightconfuse
Banned
serenewarfare
Banned
Goddammit New Japan, you could have ran with Naito for so much longer. Hell, you could have waited until the Dome to have Okada take the belt back. So many options other than "well, back to Okada".
Sweeney Tom
Banned
It's WCW, and close to WWE, level bad if it's Naito's only reign.
He got to kick out of the Rainmaker and the story makes sense the way it was presented (Naito can't win without interference). He's sold tons of merch. He's winning it again.
Jesus christ you guys are so paranoid.
serenewarfare
Banned
That's the crux of the problem though. You are defining Naito down by telling everyone "he can't win on his own". Okada can afford a loss as much as anyone in that promotion, and Naito actually beating him today without interference would have added to their feud. Now the story is just "Naito's a loser unless he's got his guys to help".
Jimmy King
Member
Between her injury and Total Bellas, I was just thinking how Nikki Bella is the most compelling character in all of the Divas division, maybe WWE... maybe professional wrasslin as a whole right now, yet I know the crowd is still going to chant "We Want Sasha."
This woman probably didn't want to be a wrestler, she probably just wanted to be famous, but she ended up falling in love. Not just with wrestling, but with a man (John Cena), and now all she wants is the respect of the audience and the love of her man, and to share that love with a family. But he denies her this dream, and the crowd denies her of her other dream. But she keeps at it because she's Fearless.
Nikki Bella may be a tragic hero now, but she'll rise from the ashes and become a Champion once again.
This woman probably didn't want to be a wrestler, she probably just wanted to be famous, but she ended up falling in love. Not just with wrestling, but with a man (John Cena), and now all she wants is the respect of the audience and the love of her man, and to share that love with a family. But he denies her this dream, and the crowd denies her of her other dream. But she keeps at it because she's Fearless.
Nikki Bella may be a tragic hero now, but she'll rise from the ashes and become a Champion once again.
Alberto Del Rio is winning the MITB.
New Day is losing their titles but wont be pinned.
Rusev is going to crush Titus.
AJ will lose.
Charlotte and Dana will lose too because its not for the title. Leading to a Sasha vs Becky feud at Battlegrounds where the winner takes on Charlotte at Summerslam.
Roman is leaving Vegas as champion. Probably some wacky shit will happen, but Roman isnt losing the title. Period.
I saved you all 3 hours.
New Day is losing their titles but wont be pinned.
Rusev is going to crush Titus.
AJ will lose.
Charlotte and Dana will lose too because its not for the title. Leading to a Sasha vs Becky feud at Battlegrounds where the winner takes on Charlotte at Summerslam.
Roman is leaving Vegas as champion. Probably some wacky shit will happen, but Roman isnt losing the title. Period.
I saved you all 3 hours.
British Monsoon
Member
And now the emphasis has to be on Naito to respond - the G1's coming up, lots of chances for Naito to prove he can get the job done without interference. Then, presuming he does win the tournament or takes the briefcase off of someone else at a later date, he can prove he's capable of doing it against Okada.
It proved that Naito could win given the right circumstances. The next half year will be all about Naito proving he can do it all on his own, moving his character forward. He's capable of that I'm sure. I expect him to win the G1.
Naito spits at the crowd, beats up cameramen, assaults refs, physically damages the title, has his crew constantly beat down good guys after the bell and more. He's a bad guy.
Bad guys don't get to win clean as a sheet unless your name is Hunter Hearst Helmsley.
FlammableD
Banned
There are quite a few cunty fans in this SHINE crowd from Friday
Lightning Count
Member
Lesnar has plenty of clean wins as a heel.
Monster Heels can get away without too much cheating. Vader types.
Ugh. Why go to an all women's show just to creep. I know that sounds weird ("everyone who goes to an all-women's show is a creep!") but surely that's like....too obvious.
serenewarfare
Banned
It's the Cena problem though. Just because I see Naito beat guys up and down the roster doesn't mean I can buy into him beating the top guy in Okada. The perfect example is when Owens debuted last summer. He beat Cena completely clean in his first match, so even losing the last two matches he still came out looking good to a majority of the audience because you believed he could beat anyone given the Cena win. I don't believe Naito can beat Okada without interference, and that sucks.
I think the idea that a heel can't win clean is bullshit. Sometimes your bad guys just need to be plain better than your good guys. It gives your heroes something to strive towards and overcome, while also adding legitimacy and heat to your bad guys. Nothing's worse than a guy who talks the most shit and can still back it up.
FlammableD
Banned
Those are the worst people, the creeps in the wrestling scene
and some gaming side threads
These guys are just being smarky cunts, "what was that" shouts, not only cheering the heel team over the face team, but even on that heel team chanting for Viper whenever Rhia was tagged in, and "You're not Viper" chants
I would love to know the number of Viper matches they watched from her Stardom tour. Or their ICW On Demand receipt.
Sweeney Tom
Banned
Weren't you one of the people praising Owens beating Cena (a single time lol)
By the time AJ Lee was finishing her run Nikki was the more interesting performer. Better character, tried harder in the ring, had more interesting things to say out of it.
She doesn't even have a character.
British Monsoon
Member
When Naito DOES beat Okada without interference, I doubt you or anyone else will be saying how unbelievable it is that he actually defeated the top guy. Besides, let's not ignore that he kicked out of the Rainmaker as clean as can be.
serenewarfare
Banned
It's less that if he does I'll complain it's unbelievable, and more of when they are having the actual match it makes it harder to buy nearfalls and intensity. Like I have no confidence if that match gets booked that he'll win, so why should I be excited for the match?
Jimmy King
Member
bjork, I'll forever love you for hating the Rock, but you're in the wrong here
The most depressing thing about Dominion Wars was that rather than improving their junior heavyweight tag division, their heavyweight tag division is now as bad as their junior heavyweight tag division. The fucking Briscoe Brothers and Bullet club's resident jobber and his dollar store knockoff that nobody's heard of are your heavyweight tag card guys?
EVIL is a complete and utter joke, and I don't know why anyone would buy into him. He is Bray Wyatt. He talks all this big shit and never, ever wins when it matters. He's a fucking loser because of how badly they've booked him. And like Bushi, he beenfits from being in LIJ and does not benefit LIJ itself. I don't know how anyone can defend his booking beyind 'he's supposed to be a jobber' because he can't win when it matters. Proven time and time again. If you look that goofy, you better back it up in the ring. And EVIL doesn't.
Shibata wins. Great. This just means Shibata is stuck in the mid-card for a long time though.
King Jobber, (the title EVIL is aiming for) made one of their highest potential for a big heel tap out. I get the story was that Yoshi-hashi was being harassed by Sanada, and I get that people dug it. I'm fine with Sanada winning this tag match but the biggest jobber in NJPW just made Sanada tap out. He tapped out the silent heavy of LIJ, the guy who looks the most ready for a push out of that faction aside from the already pushed Naito. He was made to tap out by Yoshi-Hashi. Not a fluke pin, not a sneaky little cheat and pin, he got tapped out.
I'm sure Sanada will have a strong G1, but people aren't going to forget about it. Imagine Randy Orton in 2003 getting tapped out by Stevie Richards.
Her character was arrogant heel.
Which is what Sasha Banks is. And everyone seems to like that.
EVIL is a complete and utter joke, and I don't know why anyone would buy into him. He is Bray Wyatt. He talks all this big shit and never, ever wins when it matters. He's a fucking loser because of how badly they've booked him. And like Bushi, he beenfits from being in LIJ and does not benefit LIJ itself. I don't know how anyone can defend his booking beyind 'he's supposed to be a jobber' because he can't win when it matters. Proven time and time again. If you look that goofy, you better back it up in the ring. And EVIL doesn't.
Shibata wins. Great. This just means Shibata is stuck in the mid-card for a long time though.
King Jobber, (the title EVIL is aiming for) made one of their highest potential for a big heel tap out. I get the story was that Yoshi-hashi was being harassed by Sanada, and I get that people dug it. I'm fine with Sanada winning this tag match but the biggest jobber in NJPW just made Sanada tap out. He tapped out the silent heavy of LIJ, the guy who looks the most ready for a push out of that faction aside from the already pushed Naito. He was made to tap out by Yoshi-Hashi. Not a fluke pin, not a sneaky little cheat and pin, he got tapped out.
I'm sure Sanada will have a strong G1, but people aren't going to forget about it. Imagine Randy Orton in 2003 getting tapped out by Stevie Richards.
Her character was arrogant heel.
Which is what Sasha Banks is. And everyone seems to like that.
mechashiva
Member
I talked to him about these in Dallas and said it was a dumb idea without knee pads.
He said yeah but he didn't get into this business to stay young. I like Riddle but hope protects himself a bit more.