League of Legends Championship Series: Season 4
- Thread starter Edwardo
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Dexter is still stuck in Europe due to visa issues. Will probably be here next week.
PLZ stomp CLG into the ground TSM.
Interesting Leona pick into Thresh ... Thresh can flay away Leona when she tries to come in ... and I have faith in Xpecial to do so.
he is really overrated.
more of it comes down to aprhomoo being a bad support who can't hit abilities.
How is he overrated? Did you not watch any of his previous Leblanc / Zed games? He is destroying every he is up against ...
That and he completely outplayed Doublelift trying to dodge his skillshots this game in their duel bottom.
the level of midlaners in na is kinda low (tho getting better) so he seems a bit more beast than he actually is. I mean he's playing against hotshotgg lol
the leblanc stuff that got blown up by reddit is exactly the kind of stuff that makes him overrated. the doublelift stuff was another instance of poor play on the enemy team. he came in on ezreal with hardly any mana and a chain vest. doublelift just didn't dodge right.
And he dumpstered Scarra, Pobelter, Voyboy ....
I know NA mid laners are worse than EU/Asia.
Bjergsen did pretty well when he was in Europe too.
Xpecial is much better than Aphro ... not sure why he thought picking Leona into Thresh was a good idea.
Doublelift had red. If Bjergsen missed his shit he was dead.
doublelift didn't have enough mana for an extended fight, and since he was already going down the blue build ezreal path it would have been a very drawn out fight if doublelift tried to down bjergsen. there was no danger to gragas in that fight.
So who in NA is a better mid laner than Bjergsen if he's overrated? I'm not comparing him to Europe or Asia when I said "Bjerg gonna bjerg" which you jumped all over. Clearly Asia's mid laners are above everyone.
I really don't think anyone in NA can beat him.
Didn't Bjergsen hold his own in the EU LCS also?
http://euw.lolesports.com/eu-lcs/season-3/split1/stats
Looks like it to me if you sort the bottom chart to show mid laners.
Aren't you a big EU fan? You had to watch Bjergsen in games in their LCS match-ups last year. His stats seem to back up the idea that he was perfectly fine against the likes of Froggen, Alex Ich, and xPeke.
I really don't think anyone in NA can beat him.
Didn't Bjergsen hold his own in the EU LCS also?
http://euw.lolesports.com/eu-lcs/season-3/split1/stats
Looks like it to me if you sort the bottom chart to show mid laners.
Aren't you a big EU fan? You had to watch Bjergsen in games in their LCS match-ups last year. His stats seem to back up the idea that he was perfectly fine against the likes of Froggen, Alex Ich, and xPeke.
And what metric are you using to come up with this conclusion? Kills? He got most of the kills early in that game if I recall and he snowballed from there. Weren't they playing EG who appears to be worst team NA currently?
Bjergsen destroyed Pobelter's Ziggs when he faced off against EG.
What did shipthur do that was "better"? Did he do some sweet ass juke out micro'ing his clone on 2 people?
TSM is a team that wins because of their decision making and cooperation, not because of individual play. People freaking out over basic Leblanc play is really just tiresome, and nothing about Bjergsen's technical skill has stood out in these games.
here is genuinely good leblanc play by shiphtur while his team is behind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svuMsfqgUsc
You linked to a 7 minute video.
Nothing stands out about Bjergsen's technical skills. OK.
Haters gonna hate I guess.
Yiliang Peng ‏@CLGDoublelift 44m
TSM is really strong mechanically, especially Bjergsen, and has no weak links anymore. I expect them to be top 2 this season.
Imperfected
Member
The main thing I'm noticing so far this season is that the change in team gold - mostly because of jungler and support income changes - makes objective play and thus shot-calling far, far more important than it's been before. Good coordination and rotations have always been one of those things that separate good teams from great teams; now it's becoming something that separates passable teams from complete failures.
As such, I expect Cloud 9 to have another good year, along with TSM. I actually expect Dignitas to do reasonably well because of this, too, though I think their mechanical and compositional weaknesses will still keep them from going much above average. I'm expecting another great year from Fnatic, but I actually expect Gambit to start slumping more and more as time goes on; they've always had pretty shitty shot-calling when you get right down to it, they're honestly LoL's solo queue ADHD team.
CLG might be able to get something together if Dexter can herd the cats, but I wouldn't hold my breath. As a team, they've always had "personality" problems when it comes to getting everyone on the same page, so even if they do get top-tier shot-calling I don't think they'll ever have the coordination to execute on it properly.
The EG/Alliance split seems to have left both times with an almost entirely clueless grasp of compositions and game flow. They desperately need to completely overhaul the way they approach the game on the strategic layer, because it seems like the components responsible for making that work in the past - and bearing in mind, they only worked at a baseline capacity at the best of times - are no longer together. You've got one team that puts together decent compositions but has eye-poppingly awful shot-calling in game, and another that puts together completely gross can't-win teams but executes them relatively competently. Neither are going to be able to win in this meta.
Roccat's put on some hopeful performances. Their shot-calling has been good, but not immaculate, and it's more their compositions that have been netting wins. I expect them to hit a speedbump once the other teams have time to figure out their champion pools and playstyle, but hopefully they still have good enough strategic play to hang in there even once they do.
People are probably going to focus mostly on the XDG role-swap, but honestly that's not what's sinking them. They've always had extremely high levels of individual play and spectacular pick-ban phases, but awful in-game play calling - hence 'Vulcun Throwbargains' - and what we're seeing is just that chronic problem magnified by changes in the way the game is played. They need better shot-calling, even if that means dropping someone for a player with a lower level of individual skill to get it.
As such, I expect Cloud 9 to have another good year, along with TSM. I actually expect Dignitas to do reasonably well because of this, too, though I think their mechanical and compositional weaknesses will still keep them from going much above average. I'm expecting another great year from Fnatic, but I actually expect Gambit to start slumping more and more as time goes on; they've always had pretty shitty shot-calling when you get right down to it, they're honestly LoL's solo queue ADHD team.
CLG might be able to get something together if Dexter can herd the cats, but I wouldn't hold my breath. As a team, they've always had "personality" problems when it comes to getting everyone on the same page, so even if they do get top-tier shot-calling I don't think they'll ever have the coordination to execute on it properly.
The EG/Alliance split seems to have left both times with an almost entirely clueless grasp of compositions and game flow. They desperately need to completely overhaul the way they approach the game on the strategic layer, because it seems like the components responsible for making that work in the past - and bearing in mind, they only worked at a baseline capacity at the best of times - are no longer together. You've got one team that puts together decent compositions but has eye-poppingly awful shot-calling in game, and another that puts together completely gross can't-win teams but executes them relatively competently. Neither are going to be able to win in this meta.
Roccat's put on some hopeful performances. Their shot-calling has been good, but not immaculate, and it's more their compositions that have been netting wins. I expect them to hit a speedbump once the other teams have time to figure out their champion pools and playstyle, but hopefully they still have good enough strategic play to hang in there even once they do.
People are probably going to focus mostly on the XDG role-swap, but honestly that's not what's sinking them. They've always had extremely high levels of individual play and spectacular pick-ban phases, but awful in-game play calling - hence 'Vulcun Throwbargains' - and what we're seeing is just that chronic problem magnified by changes in the way the game is played. They need better shot-calling, even if that means dropping someone for a player with a lower level of individual skill to get it.
well leona into thresh is still a decent matchup, plus the ezreal leona combo is pretty beast.
also scarra, pobelter and voyboy aren't particularly all that great but yea, he's pretty much the best na mid right now, even tho I feel like shiptur and mancloud and hai are pretty good when they're on point. that doesn't mean he's overrated, his leblanc game against voyboy was just simple outplays on his part, but nothing too impressive (I don't know why reddit loved his super simple leblanc double chain combo and felt like it needed a move-by-move explanation...)
I mean I feel like a lot of it is just tsm fanboys hyping it up but as someone that plays leblanc regularly I didn't see anything too impressive. while again as a syndra player watching his syndra is always impressive. or like faker with orianna and gragas, I can see him play them 10x times better than me and I'm amazed at it. leblanc is just a flashy champion that maybe for people that don't play her often seems more complicated than she really is. I mean curse fell for the clone trick when they had patched that out a bunch of patches ago...
well not really a big eu fan, I actually like all the regions I watch about the same, for different reasons (na is about personalities, eu is about super midlaners, korea for me is about supports).
and yeah I think he's great and I love his syndra, I'm just saying that his lane opponents are pretty lacking which can make him look better than he is. he could hold his own against the big mids but doesn't really deserve this hype around him only because he outplayed voyboy or something. that's all
What hype doesn't he deserve though? He's coming into one of the most popular NA teams with high expectations for his performance against his lane opponents. He has done exactly that.
And he obviously has made TSM better than it was previously.
I haven't read anyone hyping him up to be someone to bring down Faker ...
I'm not even a TSM fanboy ... I like them, C9 and Curse (less so with Dominate on the team) ... dislike the rest.
he's just hailed as the second coming of faker when all he did is beat voyboy in lane with leblanc
I mean for me bjergsen is like lmq or quantic or eg.na. you just lose a lot of cred when you move to an (arguably) weaker region
we'll see how it goes, but reddit goes too crazy sometimes
I don't think he is hailed as the 2nd coming of Faker at all ... just because people make highlight videos of his plays etc.
He's the "new toy" ... that's how it works. He's also only 17 ... so he has plenty of time to hone his skills even more.
Also he did more than beat voyboy in lane. There isn't anyone they've played against who has looked impressive against him mid. You don't need to downplay his abilities so much.
If Bjergsen was on Fnatic in xPeke's place they'd probably still be the same team scorewise.
but but but her mana costs
well I was specifically talking about the leblanc game but in general he hasn't done anything amazing in na to earn so much hype.
like he's one of my favorites from eu since I love his syndra play, the moment he was 17 he managed to carry cw from last to fourth or something like that, so it's not like he's without merit, but people got too carried away I think
specially since he's supposed to be one of the main shotcallers for tsm and they couldn't break out that c9 game
Imperfected
Member
There would probably be less of a focus on Bjergsen if, y'know, Alliance/EG hadn't been a complete non-starter. You've got to hype something (from the broadcast perspective, I mean), and only so many people are going to tune in when you analyst's big question is "How many more games can the teams we were talking up to be serious championship contenders lose this week?"
C9 hasn't changed much and Fnatic has only replaced Rekkles - which is a pretty big deal, but has been brewing for so long that everyone's sick of hearing about it - so at the end of the day you aren't going to put asses in the seats with the narrative of "Good teams still good, bad teams still bad", which is pretty much what we've got going on so far.
EU's at least got the "How far can Roccat go?" story to fall back on, but NA's having to try to talk up Dig going better than .500 for a change as being a big deal to make up for EG being such a huge disappointment.
C9 hasn't changed much and Fnatic has only replaced Rekkles - which is a pretty big deal, but has been brewing for so long that everyone's sick of hearing about it - so at the end of the day you aren't going to put asses in the seats with the narrative of "Good teams still good, bad teams still bad", which is pretty much what we've got going on so far.
EU's at least got the "How far can Roccat go?" story to fall back on, but NA's having to try to talk up Dig going better than .500 for a change as being a big deal to make up for EG being such a huge disappointment.
Should be fun to watch! Hopefully..
Could also be completely terrible to watch. I hope they do some cool stuff though.
Also true! i'm just excited there isnt a Jinx in this game.
Yeah.
I really think they need to drop Zuna ... move Xmithie back to Jungle and find a new ADC.
So what's the strategy behind the Soraka/Urgot lane? Missed the laning phase, but it doesn't look like it panned out well. Was it just EG going for a poke comp, or was there something more behind it?
Hate that the shoutcasters feel the need to say things along the lines of "Well, Urgot and Soraka won't be able to win most games" though. It's just the second week and I'm already sick of the established range of picks. There's no reason to further discourage unorthodox picks, especially right after they win a game.
Decent game from what I saw though.
Hate that the shoutcasters feel the need to say things along the lines of "Well, Urgot and Soraka won't be able to win most games" though. It's just the second week and I'm already sick of the established range of picks. There's no reason to further discourage unorthodox picks, especially right after they win a game.
Decent game from what I saw though.
Urgot is mana intensive but pokes really well. Soraka acts as a mana battery for him to trade well and provides long term sustain. If the enemy team isn't good about hard engaging they'll get away with it.
Urgot is just a really bad champion currently .... Soraka also viewed that way (at least against other viable supports) but she was necessary so Urgot could spam spam spam his mana spells.
Urgot's range is really low and the majority of his damage relies on you landing a relatively easy to dodge skill shot. That and his ult is just weird to be on an "ADC" ... you don't generally want to swap places bringing you closer to the enemy team regardless of who you are putting into your team.
So, shiphtur versus Bjergsen.
Bjergsen got a solo kill on him as of yet.
Kata is not AD. :S
Bjergsen got a solo kill on him as of yet.
Kata is not AD. :S
lol typo
I know this comment is a week old, but Elise needing nerfs is so painfully obvious that the only reason I can think of for why nothing's been done about 6 months now is that Riot is testing a partial rework. If I had to wager a guess, spider form skills will now level with Spiderform (R) level and that would require a significant retuning if her numbers.
Outside of incompetence it's the only thing I can think of.
Burgerface
Neo Member
Dat horn, great game by TSM
It was a bad comp tbh that didn't take into account the enemy picks at all. No reason to run Riven/Kat/Olaf because they're all damage dealers who are doing for different things, and none of them are going to beat out their respective match ups.
Bjergsen had an easy time because he was running a single target assassin vs. a team fight one in lane. NA teams have to be smarter with their picks.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
WHAT THE FUCK WAS DAN DINH ON ABOUT?
Bloody shits?
Bloody shits?
No. Reginald threw up blood 3 times last night and he went to the ER.
Dan Dinh ‏@EpikGamer 13h
@Geniusbean88 he threw up blood 4 times and started talking about dying.
Danny Le ‏@Shiphtur 12m
gg to TSM, @Bjergsen outplayed me at all phases of the game. Ill get my revenge soon we play each team 4 times :d
He sure did Shiphtur. He sure did.
Incoming Vlad pick.
edit : knew he'd do it. hope he doesn't get the same pain from Leblanc as he did on Riven.
they were meaning for teamfights and actually managed to win one with like 6-7k less gold when things went their way
I dunno what the bans were but leona jinx and riven are both strong lanes and katarina sucks in lane but can play more passive (aka don't go 1v1 against zed at level 6)
Yup, it was such a bad play from Shiphtur. The instant they both get level 6, he initiates an 1v1 fight by himself.