League of Legends Championship Series: Season 4
- Thread starter Edwardo
- Start date
Olaf is Nintendude's favorite jungler ... he just is medicore.
Riven did 1v1 Mundo and kill him in the bottom lane later on in the game when he was behind.
Riven wasn't the best pick but I don't think I've seen Zionspartan on Shyvana before. Have seen him play Nasus but I don't think that would have gone any better. I think Riven is his most played champion also. So it was a game of comfort picks?
I think Riven was there to Windslash as many people as he could after Jinx ult to give Katarina those resets ... like they did in that one teamfight they won.
Man C9 is a good teamfighting team.
Imperfected
Member
Not to downplay Elise's value, but a lot of it has to do with the fact that so many games have had two or more jungle bans. Of course you're going to have the junglers - especially when you have multiple new/role-swapped junglers - falling back on comfort picks like Elise in that situation.
The bigger thing this highlights is how thoroughly uncreative most of the current spat of North American junglers are when it comes to their picks. Banning out Vi and Olaf really shouldn't cause this much of a breakdown in picks and bans. There are a lot of junglers that work now with the Spirit Stone item changes, it's more than a little embarrassing that they're acting like the pool has been reduced to three picks.
(Though, again, a lot of that has to do with the current crop of NA junglers being a bit out of sorts due to Dexter's visa issues, the Xsmithie/Zuna role swap, etc. The one that disappoints me most is honestly TheOddOne; yes, Elise is his favorite champion, but once upon a time he knew how to use mana-expensive junglers.)
Imperfected
Member
Aphro-Lift is actually a solid lane, but there really isn't a bot lane in the game strong enough to shine when there's less-than-zero threat in the mid lane. Hotshot can't discourage jungle pressure, he can't discourage mid lane roams, and he can't roam effectively himself; at this level of play having a mid laner who can only really huddle under tower and CS causes much more harm than it would in solo queue, there's a ripple effect on all the other lanes.
That said, I don't actually expect Link to do much different when he gets back into the mid lane. He's better than Hotshot, but it's not like he's a Top 3 NA mid or anything.
Bjergsen deserves the MVP vote. There's an easy way to rationalize these things: is there a player in the game who's good enough they force you to ban champions you would never ban against another team? If so, they're probably not "overhyped" so much as actually a big problem. Bjergsen's Zed, Leblanc, and Fizz are all ban-worthy... and they're all non-meta bans. That's a pretty big deal.
Yeah, I wish oddone would play chogath or something. I want to see a champion without broken mobility/horrendously overloaded kits played.
I don't actually agree that Elise's kit is overloaded when you break it down compared to other modern champ designs. I think the major problem is that leveling one skill levels both her main damage skills. It spikes her damage way too early. Either making her spider abilities level with her ult level (similar to Karma, Nidalee) or swapping venomous bite to either E and W and then adjusting values would go a long way to balancing her. Riot likes to talk about giving themselves more "levers" to balance champions when they do reworks for problematic kits, but they messed up by binding Neurotoxin with Venomous bite - it's one less lever they can adjust.
Stone Ocean
Member
Elise isn't really OP as much as she is the absolutely safest jungle pick right now. She's Lee Sin 2.0, if shit goes your way you can buy damage if not go full tank, you never have to be worried about getting out-smited thanks to spider Q and you can just initiate from a distance with a proper Cocoon. Nerfs won't change anything unless you delete her from the game, she's recieved nothing but nerfs ever since she started seeing competitive play and is still around.
I agree!Wolf Akela
Member
Are they playing on the latest patch?
prodystopian
Member
Vi is similar, and I really like that. It would be nice to see more junglers, but I like picks that allow the jungler to make item decisions depending on the game rather than a more standard build path.
It takes awhile for pros to bring new champs into the mix. With the recent spirit stone change we're going to see new junglers but it will take some practice before they bring it in. Dominate is already bringing Pantheon and Wukong in. Gragas is getting some action as well. We'll see some new ones soon.
Kotetsu534
Member
Elise isn't an NA speciality pick - bengi, DanDy, KaKAO etc value her extremely highly. She's the "only does everything" of professional jungle play:
- Extreme duelling power from early game onwards. Has single target damage some AP mid mages struggle to match with just HG/SS.
- Ranged auto-attacks - there is no other elite jungler that sieges as well as her in the first 20 minutes of the game, and only Gragas can challenge her later than that (when he gets nerfed though...). Arguably there are compositions that are viable only because of her ranged autos (a bit like the old Nunu comps used during mid-late S2).
- Can solo dragon earlier and safer than any other top jungler.
- Ranged hard CC.
- Can gank effectively from unusual angles with multiple gap closers (spider E and Q).
- Can tower dive safely before first base with proper use of E (superb for 1v2 lane scenarios).
- Retains relevance regardless of falling behind thanks to huge base damages.
- Mana user but spider-form is mana free, and she has high DPS and sustain in it thanks to spiderlings anyway.
The problem is that they've tried nerfing her numbers as much as they can - to the point where she's average in the hands of normal players (a bit like Olaf during his S2 heyday) - but she's still absolutely dominant in the hands of the best players and teams.
I enjoy watching her played well though, just like I enjoyed watching elite TF players during S2, so I don't care too much if she's nerfed.
- Extreme duelling power from early game onwards. Has single target damage some AP mid mages struggle to match with just HG/SS.
- Ranged auto-attacks - there is no other elite jungler that sieges as well as her in the first 20 minutes of the game, and only Gragas can challenge her later than that (when he gets nerfed though...). Arguably there are compositions that are viable only because of her ranged autos (a bit like the old Nunu comps used during mid-late S2).
- Can solo dragon earlier and safer than any other top jungler.
- Ranged hard CC.
- Can gank effectively from unusual angles with multiple gap closers (spider E and Q).
- Can tower dive safely before first base with proper use of E (superb for 1v2 lane scenarios).
- Retains relevance regardless of falling behind thanks to huge base damages.
- Mana user but spider-form is mana free, and she has high DPS and sustain in it thanks to spiderlings anyway.
The problem is that they've tried nerfing her numbers as much as they can - to the point where she's average in the hands of normal players (a bit like Olaf during his S2 heyday) - but she's still absolutely dominant in the hands of the best players and teams.
I enjoy watching her played well though, just like I enjoyed watching elite TF players during S2, so I don't care too much if she's nerfed.
Wolf Akela
Member
Maokai makes an appearance on IEM. Wat.
Wolf Akela
Member
Barely. Forgot if mid or support though.
No.
Expect no more than 20 champions. Sucks, I know, especially with 120 characters in the game. Well, welcome to the exciting world of pro competitive LoL.
Stone Ocean
Member
Which patch are today's matches on?
Stone Ocean
Member
Interesting. So sad I missed Diamond playing nerfed Eve :/
He needs to stream again so I can understand his build. BotRK sounds weird
He said for that game everyone on the enemy team had like 30 armor vs 45 mr so the early game of eve was actually buffed favoring ad.
Oh no. someone else playing Panth? They need to stop this or he's getting nerfed. Don't need the Riot eye on him. He's my most successful jungler this season.
overpow's playing him mid doe
Stone Ocean
Member
He's being played mid though.
Stone Ocean
Member
Rekkles' CSing is fucking crazy.
Stone Ocean
Member
What does that item even do
Terbinator
Member
Everything.
this game is genuinely fun and unpredictable in a non-throwy manner
fnatic's making some big mistakes and roccat playing very well, it's pretty cool
it's fun
I wish it had a better build path tho. vamp scepter is trash
fnatic's making some big mistakes and roccat playing very well, it's pretty cool
I seldom buy it on ad comps
it's fun
I wish it had a better build path tho. vamp scepter is trash
Reminds you of Stark's Fervor.
I feel that just comes from the internet and its ability to beat dead horses. That doesn't escape LoL, cheering for ward kills got annoying real fast too.
I can agree with the pauses but really other than that it's mostly great.
I feel like people focus too hard on the negatives :I