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League of Legends |OT11| going

N

NihonTiger90

Member
Newt said:
Most ADCs build ER over IE. But yeah, Trist and Cait build IE.

Don't go for the same items every game, but your core should always be like IE -> Shiv.

You can build Ez the same way as blue build and swap Gauntlet for Triforce. Even when Gauntlet was strong this build did more damage.
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Hard said:
BF/Pickaxe -> Zeal -> Boots 1 -> Zeal Item -> Boots 2 -> IE -> Lifesetal -> LDR -> Situational
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Thanks, guys :) Hard's build pattern is similar to what I've been doing, but which ADCs are still building IE over ER? I know Graves and Sivir are on the ER route now (and I've adjusted my game as such)
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
drawkcaB said:
I think it'd be interesting to make Lux's ult a full-on kamehameha like spell that needs to be charged for damage.
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so like xerath/varus q?

idk, i never liked those spells

lux is just a big meta beneficiary, thunderlords buffed her laning a shit ton and rito nerfed viktor and azir to the ground, as well as other bullies like syndra and leblanc too.

the two things i think she should get nerfed 100% are e on the ground duration and passive duration. it'd make her laning worse and riskier

nerfing ult cd would also probably be ok since league of lucidity makes it really easy to shoot it on cooldown, but since it's such a core spell i'd rather keep it untouched if possible
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
Calvero said:
That would make her ult even easier to sidestep, assuming she didn't Q you
Click to expand...

...and that's a bad thing, how?


zkylon said:
so like xerath/varus q?

idk, i never liked those spells
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Think long range reverse Sion Q. Charging roots you in place, long charge time increases damage and thins the beam width. Remove the line indicator to give players less time to react. Lux now has to choose between a wide low damage beam or a thin, hard to hit beam that can deal some serious damage.
 
Tizoc

Tizoc

Member
For zky-zky-chan
obt.jpg
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
23qwerty said:
It's already easy enough to dodge if you're not cc'd
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That's a crap argument. The ult has a ridiculous CD when Lux has max CDR.

You can say the same thing about Ez's ult which just got its stupid CD increased. Nidalee needed a rework because of her even-more-than-now spears. Easy to dodge isn't a counter if missing isn't properly penalized.

These abilities all have (had) the same flaw: you need to dodge each one, they just need to hit once.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
drawkcaB said:
Think long range reverse Sion Q. Charging roots you in place, long charge time increases damage and thins the beam width. Remove the line indicator to give players less time to react. Lux now has to choose between a wide low damage beam or a thin, hard to hit beam that can deal some serious damage.
Click to expand...
i don't think that'd feel good for the lux player who's already have zero mobility spells, all her spells have cast times and she has low base ms

like the nerfs i said before were smaller things that wouldn't be like "rework size"

for rework size changes i'd look into her e which is not a fun spell to use since manual detonate isn't as "visceral" as just shooting something like ori q or whatever, and it's kind of a problem point for her since it gives her so much zoning and so much safety in her lane.

so i'd look into maybe rethinking that spell rather than ult. it still needs to be a high cd (for a mage basic spell) skillshot nuke, but type of skillshot, dmg, cc, all that could be changed

it's the one thing about her kit i find really boring to use
 
S

Stone Ocean

Member
Her ult is the coolest part of her kit and her signature spell, you can change anything but that besides number tuning

Giving it a dumb english name was bad enough as it is
 
2

23qwerty

Member
drawkcaB said:
That's a crap argument. The ult has a ridiculous CD when Lux has max CDR.

You can say the same thing about Ez's ult which just got its stupid CD increased. Nidalee needed a rework because of her even-more-than-now spears. Easy to dodge isn't a counter if missing isn't properly penalized.

These abilities all have (had) the same flaw: you need to dodge each one, they just need to hit once.
Click to expand...
nid spears were on like a 2 or 3 second Cd or whatever and could do more damage than a lux ult. I've got no issue with increasing the Cd on lux ult but I don't think making it a charge would be any good
 
C

Calvero

Banned
drawkcaB said:
That's a crap argument. The ult has a ridiculous CD when Lux has max CDR.

You can say the same thing about Ez's ult which just got its stupid CD increased. Nidalee needed a rework because of her even-more-than-now spears. Easy to dodge isn't a counter if missing isn't properly penalized.

These abilities all have (had) the same flaw: you need to dodge each one, they just need to hit once.
Click to expand...

I'm fine with an increased cooldown.
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
zkylon said:
i don't think that'd feel good for the lux player who's already have zero mobility spells, all her spells have cast times and she has low base ms
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...she already roots herself when ulting. For a guy who keeps giving the Sion rework glowing reviews I'm sort of wondering if you've ever used his Q even once.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
zkylon said:
i don't think that'd feel good for the lux player who's already have zero mobility spells, all her spells have cast times and she has low base ms

like the nerfs i said before were smaller things that wouldn't be like "rework size"

for rework size changes i'd look into her e which is not a fun spell to use since manual detonate isn't as "visceral" as just shooting something like ori q or whatever, and it's kind of a problem point for her since it gives her so much zoning and so much safety in her lane.

so i'd look into maybe rethinking that spell rather than ult. it still needs to be a high cd (for a mage basic spell) skillshot nuke, but type of skillshot, dmg, cc, all that could be changed

it's the one thing about her kit i find really boring to use
Click to expand...

I think this is a good analysis. The biggest thing that makes Lux oppressive is the ongoing zone control she gets from E. Other than that, like, big deal, she draws lines like everybody else.

Expecting huge design changes to Lux's ultimate is silly. That's like the signature ability of signature abilities. It's not going anywhere.

The other meta thing that's making Lux stronger is Zhonya's being bad right now so you can't just invuln through her bind/ult. They really should do something about that because it kind of has a warping effect on the game that ADCs can get QSS while the AP reset button is so bad.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
drawkcaB said:
...she already roots herself when ulting. For a guy who keeps giving the Sion rework glowing reviews I'm sort of wondering if you've ever used his Q even once.
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what r u giving me shit for dude -__-

her ult has a cast time the same way her other spells do, having to stand still for a full second or whatever would feel really bad on a champion like lux that's already very immobile

sion q works for sion, it doesn't work for lux because they're entirely different champion classes and it makes no sense to rework her signature spell when it's a spell that works and that wasn't ever a problem until rito invented keystones
 
S

Stone Ocean

Member
I dunno why Riot thought a passive extra burst mastery would be a good idea. You guys removed DFG for a reason, you twats, you don't balance burst by giving them more burst.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
i'll continue to say keystones were a huge failure that contributed almost nothing to the game while repeatedly making it worse

now the game is balanced a whole bunch around the op keystones, most champions still use the exact same tree every game and we've had to deal with shit like brand, tryndamere, 5 thunderlords in each team, etc.

pigeon said:
I think this is a good analysis. The biggest thing that makes Lux oppressive is the ongoing zone control she gets from E. Other than that, like, big deal, she draws lines like everybody else.

Expecting huge design changes to Lux's ultimate is silly. That's like the signature ability of signature abilities. It's not going anywhere.

The other meta thing that's making Lux stronger is Zhonya's being bad right now so you can't just invuln through her bind/ult. They really should do something about that because it kind of has a warping effect on the game that ADCs can get QSS while the AP reset button is so bad.
Click to expand...
zhonyas is not really a problem since you wuoldn't really buy zhonyas against lux tbh. banshees is a much better item against her, but with the surge of so many new bruiser items i'm not sure if anyone buys it anymore. maybe adding cdr to it would be a good idea but then sv would be in a wonky place, idk

lux has the problem of being too safe and just being overtuned for the current state of the game.

being too safe has been part of her design from the start but there were ways around it that made her less reliable than she is now. lots of lane bullies got nerfed really hard, specially leblanc and azir, and thunderlords is insanely good for her because of how well it synergizes with her passive. so before you'd be scared of taking trades, now you just auto e detonate e and there's nothing they can do, specially if u have shield.

so something's gotta get nerfed. i personally would hate to see her ruined or drastically changed. that's why the things i'm thinking of are smaller and try to hit her laning rather than her midgame since her midgame wasn't problematic before, while her laning is now really high tier thanks to shield+thunderlords trades.

nerfing passive and e durations makes her laning more abusable while not making a big difference for her midgame, so that's what i'm leaning towards. nerfing her ult cd a bit could also be acceptable in a world where everyone takes cdr runes+lucidity+cdr items
 
P

Peanut Butter

Member
The greatest feeling in League is waiting in queue for 7 min, getting your primary role, having someone dodge at the last second, wait another 6 min in queue, and then end up getting your secondary role.


giphy.gif
 
G

garath

Member
Levi Ackerman said:
The greatest feeling in League is waiting in queue for 7 min, getting your primary role, having someone dodge at the last second, wait another 6 min in queue, and then end up getting your secondary role.


giphy.gif
Click to expand...

We need to play more. Haven't seen you on last few nights :(
 
D

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
Quonny said:
why are velkoz and bard the perfect champions

riot sometimes you make me hate you but damn i love me some velbard
Click to expand...
I'm increasingly convinced that Bard is one of the least fun support champions to play against. Really dislike how he turned out, because he embodies the design process of passive power. All the sustain, all the mobility, and lacking an interesting play pattern.
zkylon said:
i'll continue to say keystones were a huge failure that contributed almost nothing to the game while repeatedly making it worse

now the game is balanced a whole bunch around the op keystones, most champions still use the exact same tree every game and we've had to deal with shit like brand, tryndamere, 5 thunderlords in each team, etc.
Click to expand...
If people are running five Thunderlords on the team they're probably doing something wrong. Watching a Poppy and Malphite hit each other for 25 seconds with no threat of killing each other because of Undying was one of the most disappointing things I've seen in the game. Expect to see more Warlord's Bloodlust soon. People have been pretty slow to catch on to its power.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
dimb said:
If people are running five Thunderlords on the team they're probably doing something wrong. Watching a Poppy and Malphite hit each other for 25 seconds with no threat of killing each other because of Undying was one of the most disappointing things I've seen in the game. Expect to see more Warlord's Bloodlust soon. People have been pretty slow to catch on to its power.
Click to expand...
not saying it's currently 5v5 thunderlords, but i've had plenty games of 9 or 10 thunderlords a few patches back when thunderlords was super dominant

it's too late now but i almost feel like i want rito to roll back the mastery changes to s5 completely
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Quonny said:
k shen is kinda perfect too

8-2 with shen
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Shen still has the fundamental problem that he's a ninja tank with a magic floating sword pet. Like it's a good thing I stopped caring about the power fantasy of my characters because Shen has a totally dysfunctional power fantasy. I literally bought the samurai skin so that I wouldn't have to think about that as much.

Other than that he's pretty great.
 
H

Hard

Banned
Tbh if they want to nerf Lux they should lower the cost of banshees just a smidge. Lux's strength is the ability to catch and burst squishy targets. The passive plus the stats means if she can't do that in one spell rotation she's basically useless for like 6 seconds.
 
N

Nekofrog

Banned
My biggest issue with Bard (outside of the hitbox on his Q sometimes doing some really, really weird things) is still the hidden damage behind him. I guess it's not so much that it's hidden, it's more that unless you are aware of the damage output of Bard yourself because you play it or something, it's really hard to gauge exactly how hard he's going to hurt because of the nature of his kit.

For a company who's motto seemed to be "better clarity in game" all last year, Bard is kind of a big ? in the face of that.
 
T

TheFlow

Banned
Hard said:
Tbh if they want to nerf Lux they should lower the cost of banshees just a smidge. Lux's strength is the ability to catch and burst squishy targets. The passive plus the stats means if she can't do that in one spell rotation she's basically useless for like 6 seconds.
Click to expand...
That would be awesome if they did.

Mr boots plus banshee cost reduced would give lux a struggle
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
pigeon said:
Needs a new fucking tailor then.

But that's why I bought the skin.

Maybe it's a monetization strategy.
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he's a weird thing, it's riot in a weird position of like having a character with a unclear identity but that ppl have grown attached to so they can't just change him too much

Hard said:
Tbh if they want to nerf Lux they should lower the cost of banshees just a smidge. Lux's strength is the ability to catch and burst squishy targets. The passive plus the stats means if she can't do that in one spell rotation she's basically useless for like 6 seconds.
Click to expand...
that wouldn't do anything

neither mids nor adcs buy defensive items and graves and quinn and lee sin and shit just buy maw and ignore it

i kind of would like the aegis conversation to be back so maybe we can consider removing that item from the game and rebalancing champions around this scary new aegisless world

they should probably take a look into mr itemization overall cos spirit visage vs banshees is a weird thing and aegis is the recurrent issue of invisible power

also if u just want to nerf one champion you shouldn't buff an item, that's not very efficient and potentially pretty problematic for the game as a whole
 
K

Kenai

Member
dimb said:
I'm increasingly convinced that Bard is one of the least fun support champions to play against. Really dislike how he turned out, because he embodies the design process of passive power. All the sustain, all the mobility, and lacking an interesting play pattern.
Click to expand...

I dunno, it doesn't seem all that bad to me. He does have mobility but not in combat per se unless you count casting shrines directly on people, but that severely limits his sustain unless they are pre-placed, and if they are pre-placed that means you had time to plan for them, and so on. His Q is on a pretty low CD late game, but outside of his Meep Autos (which I agree are pretty strong early with FQC + TLords and could probably stand a nerf if TLords is gonna stay around as is) and ult that's all he's realistically going to be doing in a team fight.



Nekofrog said:
My biggest issue with Bard (outside of the hitbox on his Q sometimes doing some really, really weird things) is still the hidden damage behind him. I guess it's not so much that it's hidden, it's more that unless you are aware of the damage output of Bard yourself because you play it or something, it's really hard to gauge exactly how hard he's going to hurt because of the nature of his kit.

For a company who's motto seemed to be "better clarity in game" all last year, Bard is kind of a big ? in the face of that.
Click to expand...

It doesn't seem that hard to gauge to me. His Meeps are pretty easy to see, and if you can see them you know his auto is going to hurt a la Sheen or TF ect. And then there's his Q. Not having dmg on 3 of his spells means you can plan around those two despite them individually being a bit more unique than average.

Despite that, I wouldn't mind a mechanic like Meeps being on a longer timer but they get a faster reduction via Chime collection. Makes his early laning phase less oppressive (doing so much dmg for "free" so often is annoying) while it is still relevant later.

And I am still annoyed that Janna hasn't been touched this whole time. I absolutely despise laning against her because she is so safe and risk free, she remains incredibly safe at all stages of the game, and has had the top support win rate and kept it since the pre-season dust settled months ago. Even worse, her entire kit is designed to be this way: safe and passive. At least for other similar "passive" champs like Sona and Soraka and Tahm you can either focus them or their ADC but for Janna you can do neither cause she will just fart you away or periodically shield her ADC to push the lane/shrug off the harass if you dare doing anything besides sit there and twiddle your thumbs.

I am not gonna act like Soraka and Sona and stuff don't have issues to work on too but thos are actually being worked on sometimes! Outside of her global passive that changed when every other one did she has largely the same kit she's had since I started playing 4 years ago to boot, and she was pretty relevant then too. At least acknowledge this trending situation Riot plz, so annoying.
 
L

Leezard

Member
Nekofrog said:
My biggest issue with Bard (outside of the hitbox on his Q sometimes doing some really, really weird things) is still the hidden damage behind him. I guess it's not so much that it's hidden, it's more that unless you are aware of the damage output of Bard yourself because you play it or something, it's really hard to gauge exactly how hard he's going to hurt because of the nature of his kit.

For a company who's motto seemed to be "better clarity in game" all last year, Bard is kind of a big ? in the face of that.
Click to expand...

I think his damage is fine. His Q hitbox is way too big though. It's the most bullshit hitbox in the game right now.
 
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