davidpdong
Member
xclosermoo pls...
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League of Legends |OT3| Lizards are red, golems are blue. Give a leash or no gank 4 u
- Thread starter SouthernDragon
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xclosermoo pls...
To be fair, I played really really badly those last few games. Trying to force things where I shouldn't and costing our lane advantage or setting us behind. I'm also guilty of playing what I want in a given role (ergo, all the Thresh games last night).
And Varus isn't necessarily a bad pick since my lantern makes up for your mobility in lane. The problem was the hard dive their team(s) had (e.g., the fuck we do about an Olaf?) coupled with Varus being immobile. Honestly, the games were lost before those problems actually mattered though.
It's more an issue with that 1000 Health is just worth more than the Armor/MR. Of course, it doesn't help that the GA passive now costs _1100g_ (1500g worth of stats, 2600g cost) while Warmog's passive is practically free (2640g worth of Health on a 2650g item).
It's ~2300g worth of stats for 2150g. You're really just better off getting more Health from Warmog's so the Armor/MR aura is more EHP in the end, however.
In all honesty, we should only ever take the free-est of free Barons. Otherwise, we basically fuck it up somehow when half the team stays, the other half engages, and I'm split-pushing like a moron elsewhere.
crackbabyjr
Member
Too bad everyone has a different trigger of when to turn and fight or stay and it ends up being a mess.
Schmattakopf
Member
Mine is when someone else says "fight" in Mumble.
Jazzy Network
Member
I don't go with that because I fact a lot of other things such as Madred's, if Smite is up, how many people are engaging, how many people we have as well as our damage output, etc.
It has a dumb name.
My trigger is entirely dependent on what I feel like our damage is. And then hoping that we didn't blow all our cooldowns trying to get Baron and then enter the fight with Baron buff but no cooldowns available, making the entire thing kind of pointless.
Generally speaking, I'm fine either way, just as long as everyone does the same thing. I just think we have a lot of misunderstandings about our collective damage (in both directions) along with the whole "BETTER BURN IT FASTTTTT" that happens at low Baron health when contested which leads to bad situations.
Honestly, I just err on the side of the jungler.
You should run 5-smite so you can all just get Baron whenever Kiunch wants.
I did that last night, except I got their AP carry as Zed (Lux who was waiting to steal)...either I or someone else managed to kill a second player also, so it was a 2 for 1 in our favor and presumably was enough for my team to push. It could have been bad if I had messed the kill up though. I did have QSS to get through at least one snare etc. for the kill.
I did that last night, except I got their AP carry as Zed (Lux who was waiting to steal)...either I or someone else managed to kill a second player also, so it was a 2 for 1 in our favor and presumably was enough for my team to push. It could have been bad if I had messed the kill up though. I did have QSS to get through at least one snare etc. for the kill.
There's plenty of outside factors determining whether or not to engage or finish baron. I just find 3k as a number that fits with over half the encounters. 3k is enough that if 4+ people on your team are burning it with smite up (why isn't smite up when doing baron? -_-), it will die just about when the fight actually starts. 4k is about the point where if you disengage and fight, then if the other team decides to try and finish it they effectively CC themselves for about 3 seconds while you wail on them. Madred's is unreliable so I never factor it until after the procs occur. Other factors like the number of enemies showing up on your doorstep should be known ahead of time due to proper warding/death timers and should affect the initial call of doing Baron so you don't have to make tough decisions on the spot when Baron is near-dead.
Keys to victory.
Jazzy Network
Member
3k is also an arbitrary number though. Since we don't know when in the game we are on. All my points can be used for any stage of the game. 3k is a small number late game, but can be a bigger number early on.
How early are we talking about? I feel that you're talking about a 15-25 minute Baron is when it's a real problem. I think that's more on the initial call of the baron, and not about the engage/disengage. Like I would be asking why did we try to do Baron that early when they have a good chance of contesting us for it at 3k hp. With the damage around that level, taking a tower or two, maybe inhibitor, would still be the better objective call if a chance for baron had arisen that early.
Jazzy Network
Member
You can always sneak one in. You have no idea how many times I know for a fact we can easily sneak Baron in but don't mention it because I know no one would agree with me. That and everyone is off doing their own thing which is fine. I do it too. We just don't have Good communication and massive egos.
I never suggest sneaking one in because we never have wards top-side, or a pink readily available to place in the pit. I know it's done easily, but it's a very high risk play that if gone wrong, goes very wrong.
I originally had 2-3 but that felt too low but ... then again, 2-3s is a lot of damage if your ADC is moderately farmed. I think the bigger issue for the analysis will be team comp. Like, I'd feel more comfortable dropping 3000 Health in 3s with some multiple low cooldown champs involved (e.g., Kha'zix, Elise, Kat, Eve, etc.) as opposed to longer ones.
Then lets work on it. I think I'm going to go back to playing top lane instead of dicking around with ADC/Support picks.
;___;
Yeah, I need to stop pushing lane well beyond my ward counts
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Since I went onaq losing streak with Xin and finally won after game 6, I'm gonna see how long I can go on for with this winning "spree".
Game Two of Uber Pro Xin Training Spree is on!
And blocked in character selection!
Will have a warm up game with Yi first!
Game Two of Uber Pro Xin Training Spree is on!
And blocked in character selection!
Will have a warm up game with Yi first!
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Jazzy Network
Member
That's Cuz I'm not Lulu support. Would be fine if I was.
All I can see is the game lobby. Music is playing and I can hear game sounds, and the ticker at the bottom scrolls to tell me what song is playing, but I can't see the game at all.
Obviously this needs to happen so we can sneak Barons in and satisfy Kiunch's needs.
I think I'm going to try and do more with the twitch account I made, like make videos of my solo queue with more thinking out loud stuff. Ideally, voicing it out will make me think about things more and also improve my gameplay/strategy. At the same time, my girlfriend will probably start thinking that I'm finally going crazy from playing this game so much.
I would for the GAF games too, but I foresee mixing up commentary & team chatter and things would probably get very confusing/annoying.
Edit: Like here's a video of a game I played last night on Eve against Akali mid. http://www.twitch.tv/mercviper/b/361871026
I feel like I probably should've lost that matchup once 6 hit, but I took advantage of Eve's early game being slightly better than Akali's and pushed her out of lane to gain a 2 level advantage with Rammus' help. Game kinda snowballs from there with me roaming and ganking. It also didn't help we caught their invade early and stopped that 1-0 with the kill going to our adc.
The vid is pretty silent because I just don't talk (since there isn't a need to, internal voice and all that), but there's plenty of things I could add to later videos during the gameplay like voicing out why I leave Akali for Rammus to finish off in one of his ganks etc.
The quality is low because I'm dumb and didn't change the setting, and the time is misleading because I forgot I was streaming it and surfed GAF after the game.
I actually watched this. I wish I would record my own matches to watch later. I could probably speed up my learning process through critiquing my own play.
I think you did good against an Akali that by all rights should have been able to wreck eve post 6. You held on to your early game advantage and roamed well. GJ!!
Honestly the only major fault I'd point out is the CS. You missed a lot of last hits, especially in that early game. I do realize you were trying to stealth more than last hit quite a bit as well so it's only a mild critique. I'm not really one to talk anyways. I usually end in the 160-200 range with assassins as well.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Sorry, fixed that. Have to manually swap sources.
Yeah my CS on Eve blows. If I could work on anything that would improve my gameplay a lot it would be to manage better CS on Eve while continuing to harass the enemy mid. The problem is actually getting the CS as Eve.
I find that last hitting for CS to not push the lane leaves you open to a lot more harass. It also causes you to go in and out of stealth, negating the majority of your passive's benefit. The other alternative is to clear the wave fast, and at the lower levels it drains the majority of your mana pool to do so and to recuperate the mana you need to stay stealthed for the next wave at least. Unfortunately, I find the best time to clear the wave early is after the opposing mid has cleared theirs. They normally won't be around to harass you back, but you give up a great roaming chance to do this, plus probably need to head bot/top to chase the other mid as they've probably roamed.
What I do instead is try to spend my mana bullying the opponent out of lane so I gain the XP advantage, and then let my CS suffer because theirs does as well.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
Slight issue during my warm up match using Yi.
Got it sorted, and the Xin-athon is on!
Game #2
Winning Streak Total : 1
Let's do this!
It's so good it doesn't feel like a choice in item build in the current meta, just something mandatory that everyone has to get.
Exactly.
I'd really like to know if buying Chain Vest or Negatron Cloak instead of Giant Belt is ever worth it now.
To be fair, it's hard to argue against Health. I mean, literally everyone can use it. Armor/MR are limited by actual damage types and then there's true damage.
Just off that factor alone, Health should probably not that cost efficient while also being so universal.
It's been awhile since I played Eve but I generally just accept that I might have to give up early cs against people with ranged harass. I know that I can afford ~12 Hate Spikes (assuming no regen) at low levels so I can spend about half of my mana pool every wave and still be fine. I just try to make every single Q used count. After around Level 6, you should have the Mana pool to use Q for every cs and not care.
Besides that, I'll harass and just sacrifice a cs or two to try and establish a lane position. If all else fails, I know I can cs really well under tower so I always have that plan to fall back on.
njean777
Member
Maybe I am not building right, but I always go GA over Warmongs on all my ADC's (if the game happens to get that far) I always build armor/MR last. For bruisers I go Frozen Mallet on Vi if needed, and GA over Warmongs.
Sorry about the double...
davidpdong
Member
I believe, as the jungler, the closer baron is to dying, the less I want you to burst it because I am currently doing the maths in regards to my burst, smite, and our consistent dmg.
If a team comes to contest or steal, you blowing all your CDs to finish baron makes the situation a 50/50 plus we dont have our CDs up anymore for the fight. If an enemy jungler comes in for the smite its much better to turn on them instead of burst to try to kill baron most of the time.
MOSTOFTHETIME!
If a team comes to contest or steal, you blowing all your CDs to finish baron makes the situation a 50/50 plus we dont have our CDs up anymore for the fight. If an enemy jungler comes in for the smite its much better to turn on them instead of burst to try to kill baron most of the time.
MOSTOFTHETIME!
I was being a little facetious in my response. Scy's gone over the cost-efficiency between warmog's & GA already. To quote:
There was another one about utility of GA and synergy with escapes in the champion kit or something, but I'm too lazy to look it up.
Re: Vi specifically, I think Mallet + Warmog's are pretty much core to her build. Seeing you leave them as optional choices feels kinda wrong to me.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
First Xin win of the night.
I now have a streak! Gonna take a short break and then continue.
13/8/11
Not my best performance, but the team was pretty solid.
njean777
Member
Well I always build Bloodthirster,boots of swiftness,black cleaver,trinity force, zephyr,FM. Or switch black cleaver for Maw if needed. If jungling go Spirit of the Elder Lizard or whatever it is called, and drop FM.
From the matches I have played, I do so much burst they rarely have time to even target me before they are already dead. Not getting cocky at all, just is from what I have observed playing Normal.
Mine hasnt gotten very dirty, I have owned it since it came out.
To add to the GA talk, GA is a fine bruiser final item since they'll be so hard to kill even at just 30% Health due to their stats anyway. But it's also not that great without Health behind it.
The Armor/MR is practically negligible on GA and flat Health offers more survivability against raw burst damage. Once you die with a GA, it's not too hard to kill you again once you're back up. The exceptions being if you can easily get away from the fight.
Put another way, GA helps once you get caught and die, Warmog's always helps.
Unless you're going full on crazy assassin (Brutalizer -> BT -> BC -> LW), Warmog's + Frozen Mallet is just insanely good on her. To be honest, even if you are going full-out assassin, you'll still get them.
With the sustain that you get from it, it's hard to say no to Warmog's first, honestly.
The Armor/MR is practically negligible on GA and flat Health offers more survivability against raw burst damage. Once you die with a GA, it's not too hard to kill you again once you're back up. The exceptions being if you can easily get away from the fight.
Put another way, GA helps once you get caught and die, Warmog's always helps.
Unless you're going full on crazy assassin (Brutalizer -> BT -> BC -> LW), Warmog's + Frozen Mallet is just insanely good on her. To be honest, even if you are going full-out assassin, you'll still get them.
With the sustain that you get from it, it's hard to say no to Warmog's first, honestly.
Slightly Live
Dirty tag dodger
And game three begins.
I wanted to maybe talk during the game, but that involves setting up the mic and that's being a pain. Maybe next time.
I wanted to maybe talk during the game, but that involves setting up the mic and that's being a pain. Maybe next time.
Dorans blade, ring, shield, boots then warmogs then a late ga if you ever reach there
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