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League of Legends |OT3| Lizards are red, golems are blue. Give a leash or no gank 4 u

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K

kayos90

Tragic victim of fan death
Blizzard said:
If I recall correctly scy46 used to practically always win top lane with Elise, so I wouldn't be surprised. It's a good thing she isn't more overpowering after that or it would be very unpleasant. As it is, I'd probably rather see an Elise than a Kha'zix.
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why do you spell out his full name?
 
M

Macattk15

Member
Terbinator said:
The jump is so bloody useful to get in and out of situations. Add to that her sort of tanky stats and she's a nightmare.

You mention the laning phase, but she more often than not wins here lane. I've yet to see an Elise lose one anyway.
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I've beaten Elise with Kayle pretty easily after her mana cost nerfs.

Unless Elise gets super fed she also isn't super scary late game. I'd rather deal with her than Xin, Olaf, Kha'zix etc.

And if Elise goes up in the air when you're trying to gank her ... just stand in the center of the damn circle .... she can only come down on champions.
 
T

Telaso

Banned
Taken from the patch notes.

map pings have been throttled to prevent spam
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I dont think i've ever read anything that has made me this happy before. Thank you Riot, thank you so so so so so sso so sososo sos osos os oss much!
 
K

kayos90

Tragic victim of fan death
Holy shit at that Akali play in the patch preview. What the... Was that a level 10 playing?

EDIT: On a side note. I miss Phreak doing these videos...
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
lol just played a match on my smurf account... team with the most AFKers wins... (our Twitch and their Yi played half the match then rq'd or something, Singed never even logged in :p)

iESgoL6Bq1IpY.png


Kassadin was like hooked on blue buff and kept doing ours and theirs one after the other lol
 
K

kayos90

Tragic victim of fan death
zkylon said:
lol just played a match on my smurf account... team with the most AFKers wins... (our Twitch and their Yi played half the match then rq'd or something :p)

iESgoL6Bq1IpY.png


Kassadin was like hooked on blue buff and kept doing ours and theirs one after the other lol
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Rofl, what the hell?
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
Boken said:
Akali changes are nice.

But my god, nerf Vi already.

-You can now single right click items in the item shop to purchase

omg!
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Akali changes make so much sense it's ridiculous it took them this long. I'll probably play her more often now.

And yeah, the shop thing is awesome.
 
J

JesseZao

Member
With the Ice Fists change, I fear more Elise nerfs. I always built it and then people started building Rylai's. I think froga synergizes with my play style better and imo it works better for Elise in team fights (AoE slows while in middle of team).

Once some pro starts building it instead of Rylai's, Elise will get nerfed again.
 
A

Agkel

Member
I'm wondering what other champion has cc's comparable to those of fiddles(silence and fear)
I know chogath does, who else? I'm looking for amount of cc's and not type of cc's. The more the better.
 
W

Wolf Akela

Member
Agkel said:
I'm wondering what other champion has cc's comparable to those of fiddles(silence and fear)
I know chogath does, who else? I'm looking for amount of cc's and not type of cc's. The more the better.
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Amumu - 2
Naut - 3/4
Alistar - 2
Leona - 3/4
Blitz - 3

Really depends on what kind of CCs count for you though. Eg, Blitz' ult is a CC but it's only a 0.5 second of silence.
 
V

Volimar

Member
Wolf Akela said:
Amumu - 2
Naut - 3/4
Alistar - 2
Leona - 3/4
Blitz - 3

Really depends on what kind of CCs count for you though. Eg, Blitz' ult is a CC but it's only a 0.5 second of silence.
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Heimerdinger has two if you count the slow on his turrets with his ulti. And his E of course.
 
A

Agkel

Member
Wolf Akela said:
Amumu - 2
Naut - 3/4
Alistar - 2
Leona - 3/4
Blitz - 3

Really depends on what kind of CCs count for you though. Eg, Blitz' ult is a CC but it's only a 0.5 second of silence.
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Thanks, will look at leona and nauts spotlights, see if one of them catches my eyes.
Ive seen some Nautilus wreck shit up
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
Zyra has 3: a slow moving multiple target snare E that goes through minions, a huge AoE knockup (R) and her slowing ranged plants with her Q.
 
B

Boken

Banned
JustProgress said:
I wonder if Riot ever gets embarrassed at how buggy the game is.

Riot Programming (tm)
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Programmers are always embarrassed about code that has become so huge and so troublesome.

garath said:
Its nice that they make akali's passives work without the weird rune page now but the nerf sucks :(
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What nerf? they scale at precisely the same level. Using the old rune page, you'd have the same magic% and svamp%. roughly.




The discussion around Quinn's look is pretty interesting to say the least. Personally, I did expect a more lithe and nimble looking design. That sort of thing is just more visually appealing to me. Many people are angry about that same thing.

bla bla shes a product of the anti sexualisation movement
wtf why does she have armor she looks like a man etc

here is ironstylus' response (the designer)
Some quick context:

Quinn used to be a guy, then I turned her into a woman. That woman is a ranger, she's prepared for a fight, she's wearing thicker armor but not plate aside from key places where she would have to interact with an enemy's face.

Quinn was not designed to be in a skin-tight outfit. That was tried, and look, again, like a woman with a cape, in a skin tight outfit, which had been worked to death by Zyra, Syndra, Elise, and Diana. She does not care about looking feminine, she cares about utility. Baggy fatigues which have hardened pockets, knee pads to dig into the ground to take a shot, no exposed flesh to take a graze.

A functional Demacian helmet which adds sleekness is a design choice. It's Valkyrie, it's a motif, and it's a visual landmark. She has a gauntlet reminiscent of a falconer's glove which is armored because Valor has armor on his talons, to again, interact with an enemy's face. He can do damage to even thick leather.

Her hood is collapsed, she has essentially a themed parka with a bird motif, Functional but themed.

She has what equates to kevlar, thickened material able to resist a blade. She has Demacian signifiers all over her, and bird motifs worked in. She is functional but fantasy.

Regarding femininity, I was called out long ago when Sejuani released for making the reasoning that Sejuani might wear less clothing so that "you can tell she's female." That is an invalid argument and a sad excuse to design a particular way. A ranger, an elite, doesn't care whether you can tell they are a female or a male. They are interested in getting the job done, and having the gear to do so. We gave Quinn that gear and did not embrace the traditional route of the tight-clothed standard fantasy ranger. She's a new ranger for a new time. She hits the Demacian notes but plays off of them. That is the rational behind similar armor themes to Garen and Jarvan. That's how we establish she's in the military proper, but not standard in uniform.

For reference, take a look ad Deunan Knute from Appleseed. She has no boob or breastplates. She is completely covered with a half-helm. She has short hair. She is a bit more masculine, that's the goal. She is not a waif, but she is agile. She has small breasts, a tighter frame, but is fairly androgynous. That's what we wanted to portray, and I feel we hit that.

Honestly, I feel I owe no excuses. You know my history, you know my goals. I design the women in armor. I do not design the over-sexualized, the seductress, or the siren. Different artists gravitate towards different styles and themes. When this champion came along, I opted to work on it because I felt I could bring a different take. Initially, she did start out as a traditional fantasy ranger, and actually was melee at the time. However, that was not the route we wanted to take. That was standard, it was conventional, and it was boring. I drove away from it and made something rugged in the new direction we're trying to take our style. Fantasy, but not traditional fantasy.

This is my take. If you don't like it that's perfectly fine. I, like all artists, design with particular design and form language as my signature. You might have noticed Zyra, Syndra and Elise were designed by the same artist. Sexy bodies, integrated clothing/biology, dark females. Same with artist for Nautilus, Ziggs and Lulu. Friendly shapes, opposing colors, offbeat characters. Just like game designers have similar flavor to their champions across the board artists have similar common expressions.

If you want a traditional archer, with a traditional fantasy get-up, with a traditional build, and a traditional design where female form expression trumps practically fighting the fight, I am not your guy, and I'm glad to admit that. That's my strength, that why I work on what I work on.

I do not abide by the established or the expected, neither does Riot on the whole. It is not our job to abide, it's our job to challenge the convention and question traditional execution.

Thanks for the feedback. Thanks for understanding where we're coming from. This isn't just me. This is part of something larger. Pendulums will swing, you'll get your stripped down heroes. Quinn is not one of them and we're proud of that.
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http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=34628088#34628088

and here is an incredibly well thought out and elucidated response on reddit
I think the negative reaction against Quinn's design is reasonable, if a bit misdirected and incoherent. We should take it seriously. This isn't about "OMG NO BOOBS". It's more thoughtful than that.
Some parts of the reaction are silly, yes. Quinn wasn't "covered up", Quinn is still a ranger and AD carry rather than a tank. But the ideas behind the criticism of Quinn's look are basically sound, though IronStylus adequately responds to them.

Two reasonable criticisms here.
First, critics of Quinn's appearance are concerned that her armor doesn't match the "ranger" trope -- and defenders of Quinn (I am one) have to grant that it really doesn't match it. The critics expected a lightly armored, leathered, more rugged tracker or agile falcon-user with green accents. Instead, Quinn has bulky and heavily padded legs, white plate accents on her hips and shoulders, a heavy gauntlet on her right hand, and a very functional but heavier crossbow. This bothers people who expected a more typical ranger in League rather than what looks like to them like a foot-soldier

We were prepped for a ranger by IronStylus. I also think that part of the argument is that these two things (typical fantasy ranger, IronStylus) run against each other -- that a character as armored as Quinn is would not behave like the ranger/tracker that she is supposed to be. Most importantly, nothing in the journal's visual elements clued us in that she was going to be this heavily armored (even if in leather, and even if people who know what IronStylus does should have expected it). I think that if a side-peek at her helmet or her leggings placed to the side of the journal as she wrote it would have done a lot of work here -- that or use the words "Demacian ranger" somewhere to hammer the point in.

Anyway, this leads some people to conclude that Quinn was "covered up" -- that is, a) she was heavily armored so as to avoid "sexualizing her," and b) that this hurt the clarity of her role and character because the armor is contradictory to her skills. For people who dislike the rhetoric of the anti-sexualization faction in League and other media, this appears as if a paranoia about female sexuality has ruined what would have been a good character.
I don't think Quinn was "covered up". IronStylus explained all of the elements of Quinn's armor and those explanations make sense (pads to kneel for shots, gauntlet for punching). But I think it's worth treating the criticism here fairly. People wanted a tracker/ranger and were surprised when the amount of armor and stylization on Quinn ran counter to their expectations of what trackers and rangers look like. We should respond to these criticisms by pointing out the functionality of that armor for a ranger (as IronStylus did) or showing that the typical ranger elements of fantasy aren't essential or are contrary to League's ethos of what a Demacian ranger would be like (even the mages of Demacia are armored so we shouldn't be surprised that its rangers are).
And second, even if we dismiss the "covered up and therefore not a ranger" thing, some critics still wish she had some more obviously feminine characteristics. This doesn't mean the same thing as sexualized - they just want some more gendered elements.

IronStylus adequately responded to these critics (he wasn't going for the typical ranger, and he was going for androgyny). So he's fine. And I can even point out some great elements that still manage to show this is a woman (the armor accents on the hips, for example).
But you could at least take the criticism seriously. It doesn't help discussion to frame the other side's opinions as buffoonery. Nor do arguments that "Quinn's different therefore good," or "Quinn isn't sexualized therefore she's good" work here. No one is saying that Quinn's armor wouldn't work for some character. The criticism is that for this character -- "ranger" -- it doesn't fit. (I do think it fits, but saying so isn't as simple as "GD all dumb misogynists").

I'm going to refer to some of Magic: the Gathering's concepts of what a ranger is. Some of Magic's rangers are scantily clothed, for sure (sylvan ranger - http://i.imgur.com/z3Fv6np.jpg). But knowing this is IronStylus, the following is what people might have been expecting.
Frontier Tracker Daybreak Ranger - http://i.imgur.com/UglySbV.jpg
Those above are closer to typical fantasy rangers. I think the last one especially is cool. But Quinn isn't from typical fantasy. As a commenter below says, we already have elements of typical fantasy rangers in Ashe. We don't need to double up. (And that I think is one of the biggest arguments that defenders of Quinn have). Quinn is a Demacian. This is Magic's idea of a Demacian ranger.
Ranger of Eos - http://i.imgur.com/oqiSSv1.jpg
I expected something more like Daybreak Ranger out of Quinn. But now that I see what Riot was going for, I appreciate the kind of ranger that Quinn is.
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http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/18hg5l/ironstylus_on_quiins_looks/c8ev0yy
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
garath said:
Its nice that they make akali's passives work without the weird rune page now but the nerf sucks :(
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It's not really a nerf since you don't have to waste runes/masteries to get useless AD and you can instead use those slots to boost your mpen and AP :)
 
H

Horse Detective

Why the long case?
I just started playing this game yesterday...

How do I choose a ranged champion? Is that even what they are called? I don't like fighting up close.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
Sean! said:
I just started playing this game yesterday...

How do I choose a ranged champion? Is that even what they are called? I don't like fighting up close.
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Hah, you can go more of the autoattacker (something like a hunter/archer in most games) or the mage type.

Ashe/Tristana are two cheap options on the first kind and Annie/Ryze are cheap options on the second one.
 
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