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League of Legends |OT4| No Country for Old Karma
- Thread starter kayos90
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PhillipCostigan
Member
New ultimate skin within the next month.
Also, Arcade Sona, Pool Party Ziggs and AstroNautilus going on sale at 487 before the price increase on April 25th.
Already bought Sona's at the weekend, so I'll get a refund on that. Will buy the other 2 as well I guess, before they hit 1350.
Also, Arcade Sona, Pool Party Ziggs and AstroNautilus going on sale at 487 before the price increase on April 25th.
Already bought Sona's at the weekend, so I'll get a refund on that. Will buy the other 2 as well I guess, before they hit 1350.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Ain't no wards on his side/quarter of the map.
Having said that if he wants more wards he should buy wards.
(P.S. Diana skin in the works. Squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee)
Having said that if he wants more wards he should buy wards.
(P.S. Diana skin in the works. Squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee)
Like you would with most top laners these days. Red pot start and then stack some hp items on him. Only get Blackcleaver if you're on an AD heavy team. Remember that you can get a total of 40 armor and magic resist from his passive alone.
Don't get Tiamat.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Why would I put them bot when we were preparing to defend Baron? There was nothing bot side of the map but Talon being greedy for creeps.
Also the four vision wards were bought like 10 seconds before Chalon died.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Welp, MVP Blue surrendered at 20. Faker on LeBlanc finished like 11/0.
Never seen LeBlanc play that good.
Never seen LeBlanc play that good.
The LCS SUPER WEEK starts in just 8.5 hours from this post.
[Countdown]
[LCS THREAD HERE]
_______________________________________________
This is the last week before the end of season playoffs, which will determine who gets to go on next season.
This is a SUPER WEEK - there will be 20 games played with everything on the line.
All the matches for this week and their time can be viewed at: [Esports Calendar] (set to professional for less clutter)
WHY DOES THE SUPER WEEK MATTER?
The top 2 teams get guaranteed positions to next season, the top 2-6 playoff for two spots in next season, and everybody left afterwards has to compete in the End of Season Regulation tournament to determine the new group of pro teams.
Current Standings
SO WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
As you can see, 2nd place and 6th place are extremely competitive and will be major points of contention.
As for who can still make it, and what it takes:
The Top Three
The Bottom Five
Games this week:
[LCS THREAD HERE]
[Countdown]
[LCS THREAD HERE]
_______________________________________________
This is the last week before the end of season playoffs, which will determine who gets to go on next season.
This is a SUPER WEEK - there will be 20 games played with everything on the line.
All the matches for this week and their time can be viewed at: [Esports Calendar] (set to professional for less clutter)
WHY DOES THE SUPER WEEK MATTER?
The top 2 teams get guaranteed positions to next season, the top 2-6 playoff for two spots in next season, and everybody left afterwards has to compete in the End of Season Regulation tournament to determine the new group of pro teams.
Current Standings
SO WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
As you can see, 2nd place and 6th place are extremely competitive and will be major points of contention.
As for who can still make it, and what it takes:
The Top Three
The Bottom Five
Games this week:
[LCS THREAD HERE]
PorcellainThrill
Member
Just played GP support for the first time.
That was fun.
I was together with a Cait against Ez/Lux (the sexual tension, I know) and we just zoned them out of the game
I got a doublekill out of a Garen tp ganging us on him and Ez, as I already had Chalice I went for Avarice -> Stattik and was the fucking insane poke support.
Ended on 5/4/18, game was won (and really entertaining).
That was fun.
I was together with a Cait against Ez/Lux (the sexual tension, I know) and we just zoned them out of the game
I got a doublekill out of a Garen tp ganging us on him and Ez, as I already had Chalice I went for Avarice -> Stattik and was the fucking insane poke support.
Ended on 5/4/18, game was won (and really entertaining).
PhillipCostigan
Member
If you guys aren't watching the SKTTI vs ahq Korea game on OGN you're really missing out.
http://www.twitch.tv/ongamenet
http://www.twitch.tv/ongamenet
PhillipCostigan
Member
I would be really annoyed as the ADC if someone picked GP as support.
I'm sure you're a good GP player (so I don't want to be deprecating), but a good support on the enemy team should have stomped you. Picking GP as a support just screams of "I'm just gonna pick whatever the fuck I want, so fuck you".
Like it doesn't even sound like you went with any support items like Locket or Aegis. Your items just sound really selfish.
That's not supporting. That's just playing bot lane and buying a few wards here and there.
I'm sure you're a good GP player (so I don't want to be deprecating), but a good support on the enemy team should have stomped you. Picking GP as a support just screams of "I'm just gonna pick whatever the fuck I want, so fuck you".
Like it doesn't even sound like you went with any support items like Locket or Aegis. Your items just sound really selfish.
That's not supporting. That's just playing bot lane and buying a few wards here and there.
I played a game where the enemy team had a GP support. My team was a Vayne and a sona or something. I saw the GP didn't buy any wards so I was going to gank after my first back at around 4 min. My bot lane died before I even got there. Then blamed me for not ganking.. Our Vayne even got first blood in a level 1 fight (which was was I was a little behind).
The enemies ended up winning because GP got fed off kills while the adc got all the farm. Our bot lane got stomped. Really the GP support shouldn't win but sometimes it's hard adjusting to the unusual. Takes some teamwork.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Oh sure, it can work because the other team doesn't know how to deal with it if they aren't used to it. Same with the Xin and Panth pub stomp lane, or a "support" Rengar.
It works some times because people are put off guard by it, but really it's a terrible pick.
PorcellainThrill
Member
One game a while ago I got destroyed by the enemies picking 4 adcs and a Swain and going 4 mid for the first 5 minutes. In solo ranked. In bronce.
Well it works for him now, so let him try it until he realises that other champions support better. At least he lets his adc have farm.
You seriously can't force closed mindedness on newer people, and you definitely shouldn't do so in a hostile manner. It's enough to say that support gp isn't that good and why others are better.
Close mindedness tells you that support elise, kayle and leblanc suck and yet they've been proven to work even at the highest level.
Tbh, support gp is still more supporty than support rengar.
You seriously can't force closed mindedness on newer people, and you definitely shouldn't do so in a hostile manner. It's enough to say that support gp isn't that good and why others are better.
Close mindedness tells you that support elise, kayle and leblanc suck and yet they've been proven to work even at the highest level.
Tbh, support gp is still more supporty than support rengar.
PhillipCostigan
Member
It worked because you didn't know what to do.
If you had recognised that 4 ADCs and a Swain all have awful early games, grouped up and picked a fight, you would have stomped them like nothing you've ever seen before. They had a terrible team comp and your team clearly didn't know how to deal with it. You lost because of that, not because it's good.
Same with "support" GP.
As someone who pretty much mains ADC at the moment, there is nothing more infuriating than someone who picks a champion purely because they want to and plays selfishly than someone who takes a legitimate support and works with the team.
Maybe you were properly supporting but nothing of what you said sounds like you did.
I'm not being hostile, I'm just trying to explain it from a point of view other than his own, i.e. the team's and particularly the ADC he's gonna be laned with.
He's played ranked, he's at least level 30, so I'm pretty sure he knows that other champions support better.
Elise works because she's got great initiation and disengage because of her long range hard cc and she doesn't require a lot of items to do her role because of her base stats.
Kayle offers a slow, a heal and a game changing ult that can save your carry's ass in a fight.
LeBlanc is less supporty than the others, but at least she offers hard cc in the form of a root and silence.
But if you want me to say why support GP is bad, sure. He's got zero hard cc, his heal is only a self-heal, his only way of helping an ally is by giving them a small amount of damage and the slow on his ult. He's mana hungry enough to the point PorcellainThrill feels he needs to rush a chalice on him, instead of something that's useful to the team, i.e. a locket.
I wasn't condoning "support" Rengar, it's awful and totally selfish too, but thinking about it even he offers some sort of useful cc. I just hate the solo queue mentality of I'm going to play what I want whether it serves the team or not. Especially from the point of view of an ADC who would really appreciate a good support who actually makes an effort to do that.
You're doing it wrong I've had support gps at times and basically you q and e all the time. One or two crits with any decent adc early game is free kills. Support gp comes down to harass.
Also his ulti is bomb for forcing people in to bad situations especially if they want to run on bottom with half health or very little left. With a jungler they are forced to leave or lose lane while giving deaths.
Ah, just saw this. Excellent. I almost bought Arcade Sona. Will wait for sale and buy then. Happy I bought the Xin skin that's getting bumped. It's a nice skin.
I may play Naut at some point but I'll never play Ziggs. Good enough.
Diprosalic
Banned
so much effort for a first round exit at worlds.
Diprosalic
Banned
PorcellainThrill
Member
That is what happened.
Especially against Ez Lux who are terribly squishy, I went
QEWWQRQQ and they just couldnt outharass me, while Cait was freefarming and also got her Q on them a couple of times when they were slowed from me.
Also the Lux had real trouble hitting her CC as I got 345 base MS plus 3 % from support masteries and 3% from my E and even when she did I just ate them oranges.
However I can see how there would be lanecombos against which this would have been pretty bad.
I'm sounding overly patriotic here but I believe NA is a lot better this season than they were. With LCS they're actually practicing regularly and evolving their strats. I'm optimistic that curse and maybe dig/TSM would have a good showing. coL would do real well once they get their late game together too.
my point is that before pro players used them, these unconventional supports wouldve been laughed at. and they are still looked at quizzically in champion select.
your list is nice and all, but I have to respectfully say that they make you focus on the wrong things. I also have to say that, before pros played them, you never wouldve taken them seriously, even though you couldve dissected their kits the exact same way.
supporting isnt JUST about cc. it's about being useful in the lowest gold position. This is usually through cc, but it can also be through free stats or early game dominance.
support isnt all about hard cc - nunu, soraka were all things at a point in time. my darling babe sona is a massive lane bully, and she doesnt have ANY cc until level 6. why is that? because her poke damage is incredible of course.
now pull this to GP - he gives free stats and has a point and click harass that can do reasonable damage. later on, he has a global slow and free stats. in a way hes a nunu type that trades adc stats for laning presence.
tl;dr - people need to be more open minded, or at least be less categorical in their rejection of certain champions in certain roles
and take your dirty lcs talk to the lcs thread
play w/ us more :3
@adc support relationship
as a person who's mainly comfortable with adc, all I really care about is that my partner is cognizant about their role and interacts with me in a meaningful way. I care more about feeling like I am able to perform freely (cs and harass being fought for in a good way, information being fed to me in a good way). Like the gp I laned with in ranked established good presence, fought for brush control, warded well, called out when his ult was up (essentially keeping an eye on other lanes while performing at bot) and could intimidate the other lane by popping his e (are they going for harass/all in? is he speeding up a jungler for a gank? loud sound scary). as an ad that's what I care about. he can level q for poke or if against a more sustainy lane, level e for the all in.
like despite him not being terribly optimal he doesnt really detract from the lane in an important way. he might run into some trouble itemwise, but it actually opens up choices in a nice way. building dmg/crit vs. aura still puts him in a similar support positioning style, floating around the fights and going ham when it's allowable.
I remember before gp's slow was nerfed he was a reaaaly strong jungler. In S2 this meant that he was supposed to perform with low gold
oh but phillip brings up a good point which is this idea of losing at champ select. like the "meta" is decided by pros to a large extent, and while a lot of it is translatable universally to the game (gold distribution, positioning of lanes with objectives in mind and types of champs played in these types of lanes, etc.) a lot of it doesn't really translate to casual play. at the same time, people will get on your dick if they don't feel like this meta is being respected, there are a lot of examples of people who snowball games from bad attitude. like if an ad doesn't recognize the good qualities of whatever support is being picked, ur gonna have a bad time, but that's kinda true of any person who picks op without noticing the particularities of a champ.
ermahgerd derna. Where did you see that?
Let's see.
* First two weeks - open beta test, all champions are unlocked, IP boosts are in effect.
* They have Russian tech support, also implementing payment ways which are popular in Russia.
* Free transfer period - two weeks (17.04 - 30.04)
instant fail
Xisiqomelir
Member
So I bought Singed and apparently he gets to use Tear too.
Not that I'm complaining, but is there any kind of use for Athene's like this?
Not that I'm complaining, but is there any kind of use for Athene's like this?
kiunchbb
www.dictionary.com
Depend on the situation. For ap I usually dont like getting T2 boot until after my first major item, since T2 boot only give magic penetration, it doesn't help you farm because minions have no magic resist. However if you are playing a bursty mage, and enemy is stacking magic resist, it might be a good idea to go for T2 boot early.
For ad, early game damage>attack speed, so boot isn't that useful here. More of the trade will be hit & run, so you never take advantage of the attack speed that come with the T2 boot.
In top lane, people love to rush T2 boot, since 2x dorans + Ninja tabi or Mercury tread can help you dominate the lane.
PhillipCostigan
Member
My point is not that no cc means no support, my point is that it's a hell of a lot more useful than what GP offers. Soraka and Nunu don't have cc, but their kit is designed to support. GP's isn't, and the free stats he gives are pretty much useless because of how low they are.
How is GP going to help you if you get dived on by a Leona, or a Thresh? He'll eat his orange and be on his merry way because he can do nothing to help you in that situation.
Nunu's basically a walking phantom dancer with a slow that's not tied to his ultimate, and he has a better ultimate for a support situation. Soraka doesn't have cc (outside of her silence) but she gives a colossal amount of sustain to keep you in lane and potentially save your life. Sona's stun is only available at 6, yes, but she also has a heal, innate auras and a move speed boost which can help disengage.
GP offers none of that. He gives a petty amount of AD, and some poke. In that case, why not pick Janna who gives more AD, a shield, a knock up, a slow and a great disengage ultimate that heals? Even Nami gives you more damage than him, while also bringing a lot of cc for your team and a heal. Karma has a team wide shield and speed boost, as well as a root and even, if not more amounts of poke as GP, even if she is underpowered.
I wouldn't care if someone picks GP in any other role. He's not a fantastic champ at the moment, but hey neither is Fiora. But would I play Fiora as a support? Absolutely not, because it gives an impression that I just don't give a shit and I'm just going to play who I want because fuck it.
That's the impression I got here, and that was reinforced by what he built. Being a poke bot isn't supporting. If someone cared about supporting and was actually going to put effort into a game, they'd pick someone better equipped to support the ADC and the rest of the team.
How is GP going to help you if you get dived on by a Leona, or a Thresh? He'll eat his orange and be on his merry way because he can do nothing to help you in that situation.
Nunu's basically a walking phantom dancer with a slow that's not tied to his ultimate, and he has a better ultimate for a support situation. Soraka doesn't have cc (outside of her silence) but she gives a colossal amount of sustain to keep you in lane and potentially save your life. Sona's stun is only available at 6, yes, but she also has a heal, innate auras and a move speed boost which can help disengage.
GP offers none of that. He gives a petty amount of AD, and some poke. In that case, why not pick Janna who gives more AD, a shield, a knock up, a slow and a great disengage ultimate that heals? Even Nami gives you more damage than him, while also bringing a lot of cc for your team and a heal. Karma has a team wide shield and speed boost, as well as a root and even, if not more amounts of poke as GP, even if she is underpowered.
I wouldn't care if someone picks GP in any other role. He's not a fantastic champ at the moment, but hey neither is Fiora. But would I play Fiora as a support? Absolutely not, because it gives an impression that I just don't give a shit and I'm just going to play who I want because fuck it.
That's the impression I got here, and that was reinforced by what he built. Being a poke bot isn't supporting. If someone cared about supporting and was actually going to put effort into a game, they'd pick someone better equipped to support the ADC and the rest of the team.
Silence and slow are both cc.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Sorry, should have specified that they don't have hard cc. I did actually explain why their cc is useful though so brownie points for me.
i dunno i mean everything in gp's kit can be useful for a support, janna or ali are pretty much the only good counters to your ad being out of position and dived on, gp can sit in front, which is what he does a lot of the time anyway for zoning, and body block skillshots and cleanse the cc. this idea that supports are supports to compensate for errors from the ad is prtty bad, even if it's really nice to have those types of supports around sometimes. I mean you go into your lane w/ gp support, or any support, and you adjust accordingly.
but like obviously you want your lane to be related to the enemy lane in some way, I think gp is pretty useless against soraka for example
it's pretty unfortunate though that you can write him off so easily or that you classify him as a poke bot when he brings other things to the table. I think that's a pretty normal attitude to have tho, but the main bad thing here is the idea that if someone cared they would have picked someone else, a lot of this has to do w/ communication at champ select tho, hence losing at champ select
like prolly from complexity kind of brings this conversation to the pro scene, where unexpected characters have the benefit of not being played against constantly, but where he also aims to extract particular strengths from unorthodox characters. ziggs brings a lot of dmg at level 1 for example, and you should aim to take advantage of that as a team, etc. I think it's perfectly valid to look at gp's kit and decide that you don't think he's strong enough, but he's by far not a character that will lose your lane for you if he's played right, and he's definitely a character that contributes and fits a support role, like all his skills fit in that way
but like obviously you want your lane to be related to the enemy lane in some way, I think gp is pretty useless against soraka for example
it's pretty unfortunate though that you can write him off so easily or that you classify him as a poke bot when he brings other things to the table. I think that's a pretty normal attitude to have tho, but the main bad thing here is the idea that if someone cared they would have picked someone else, a lot of this has to do w/ communication at champ select tho, hence losing at champ select
like prolly from complexity kind of brings this conversation to the pro scene, where unexpected characters have the benefit of not being played against constantly, but where he also aims to extract particular strengths from unorthodox characters. ziggs brings a lot of dmg at level 1 for example, and you should aim to take advantage of that as a team, etc. I think it's perfectly valid to look at gp's kit and decide that you don't think he's strong enough, but he's by far not a character that will lose your lane for you if he's played right, and he's definitely a character that contributes and fits a support role, like all his skills fit in that way
Yeah, I mean in general I agree with you. But also to super nitpick Sona does have a slow before 6, it's just that Tempo kinda sucks and requires Power Chord. Also also tell me more about Diana skin plz kthx.
Not going to deny that either but in draft vs certain combos gp can take on the lane for himself.
Synergeries and counter always decide if character choices are shitty. Most people with skill can make anything work anywhere.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Maybe we just gotta agree or disagree on it, but I don't think any of you would ever prefer or be happy with GP over a proper support when push came to shove. And I still don't think he was legitimately putting any effort into supporting, but who knows.
As for the Diana skin, IronStylus said on the forums there's one in the works. That's pretty much it.
As for the Diana skin, IronStylus said on the forums there's one in the works. That's pretty much it.
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