That'd infer full 360 compatibility.
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Let's talk Xbox 720: Xbox World shares everything it knows about the next console
- Thread starter shinobi602
- Start date
That'd infer full 360 compatibility.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
Yeah sadly I doubt we will see XBLA titles be compatible. Which is terrible. But unless they have full 360 compatibility, than they wont work. Only difference between an XBLA game and a Retail one is distribution.
Crysis is an XBLA title and it is arguably the most technically impressive game on the system.
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
A split marketplace would be a nightmare for MS. It's going to be hard to convince 360 owners to jump in on the 720 when they're still anchored to the 360.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
It is a nightmare, but as much as I would love to see BC, I just don't see it happening. Too hard of a technical and cost hurdle.
I'm hoping this is more common with PC and 720 games, while the tablet and phones have their own games. While this looks attractive from a marketing point of view, I doubt many would be happy if a XBLA game on the 720 was held back so it would be easily ported to a tablet or windows phone.
No, but I can only imagine the meltdowns if they aren't BC for at least XBLA games.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
As I said though, there is really no such thing as "at least XBLA games" the only difference is the method in which you play them, disc vs download.
The actual games are still designed to run on the same hardware, and are no less technically advanced. In fact, I personally would call Crysis XBLA the most technically impressive title on the system.
TimeEffect
Member
So if MS adds Blu-Ray does Sony get royalty?
And how likely is AR?
I always thought it would be cool to have Surround Sound headphones and AR/3D glasses bundled in to promote a true next-gen experience that really gets you into a game, but it all sounds so expensive.
I've been hoping for next gen controllers with more input, but I'm unsure if I care for a screen.
Sounds about right that 720 will be a powerhouse. I wonder if it will translate into a similar problem with PS3, though I sense MS will be smarter than Sony about that... I think.
I fully expect Sony to be more sensible with their power and pricing. If MS is doing all this, what is Sony doing?
And how likely is AR?
I always thought it would be cool to have Surround Sound headphones and AR/3D glasses bundled in to promote a true next-gen experience that really gets you into a game, but it all sounds so expensive.
I've been hoping for next gen controllers with more input, but I'm unsure if I care for a screen.
Sounds about right that 720 will be a powerhouse. I wonder if it will translate into a similar problem with PS3, though I sense MS will be smarter than Sony about that... I think.
I fully expect Sony to be more sensible with their power and pricing. If MS is doing all this, what is Sony doing?
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
They'll try their hardest. At the least, I think the last wave games, big names and top sellers will get emulated and some of the lesser knowns will work too as a consequence. Competing with your own cheaper console and its massive, popular library of games is just way too inefficient.
Cross platform purchasing for XBLA would be smart too, if some of the games get ported over instead of emulated.
Well Crysis is considered a GoD game. =p However I agree, XBLA devs should have the same access to the hardware as retail games.
Liquidsnake
Banned
Absolutely.
Crysis is Game on Demand not Arcade.
TimeEffect
Member
How much?
Actually it wouldn't be Sony specifically but the BDA which Sony is a part of.
In reality the amount Sony would receive from MS would be trivial.
Yes. Along with a dozen other companies including Microsoft.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
Nothing Earth-shattering, probably not that different from the amount they get for DVD.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
Fair enough, though my point still stands, aside from size in MB/GB the game is allowed to be, there is no technical difference between an arcade game, like Am I Alive, Perfect Dark HD, Battlefield 1943 etc and the average game you buy like Crysis, Halo or Gears.
There is no magical dividing line between the games.
If the 720 is BC for XBLA games it would be BC for ALL games. And vice versa.
Monumental
Banned
Although you are right that there in no technical difference between XBLA and regular retail Games, you better believe that there will be full and complete backwards compatibility in the next Xbox.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
It can easily be done if MS wants to. They already have a soc inside the slim.
The only reason sony ditched bc is because they had a 600$ monster no one wanted to buy and had to shave every single nickel they could.
gaming_noob
Member
It probably wouldn't be a significant amount in the end even if assuming the Durango will sell the same amount as Xbox 360.
Blu-Ray is owned by the Blu-Ray Disc Association comprised of Sony, Panasonic, Pioneer, Philips, Thomson, LG Electronics, Hitachi, Sharp, and Samsung.
Syphon Filter
Member
XBLA should work,i don't see why it wouldn't. you just use your same gamertag on the new system and download them. If they are taking digital serious then i expect this to work for each new console.
Syphon Filter
Member
I am thinking it will be a universal marketplace where 360 gamers can still buy xbla titles at least for some more years to come. Similar to how sony sold games for ps2 even after ps3 is out.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
The upcoming XBLA game State of Decay uses CryEngine 3, however.
Surface of Me
I'm not an NPC. And neither are we.
I am 99% sure the next Xbox will be BC with 360 games.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
Maybe not 99%, but I'm pretty confident it will be.
Canis lupus
Member
It needs to be fully BC with Xbox1 titles, I need DOAX on my plasma.
Liquidsnake
Banned
I am all in on MS. They have not failed me. Ever.
I had a red ring on my launch 360 after 2 years, but they replaced it for free. Windows CE ran the dreamcast, that system was great but short lived. Other than those two issues I agree that MS have not let me down.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
I really hope you're all right about BC and I can play my vast 360 library on my 720.
However I won't get excited...
I have a feeling I will be re-buying "Full HD Collections" of games like Halo, Gears, Mass Effect etc. while XBLA gems like Perfect Dark HD and Battlefield 1943 will have me needing to plug in an old 360 to run...
God I hope I'm wrong though....
However I won't get excited...
I have a feeling I will be re-buying "Full HD Collections" of games like Halo, Gears, Mass Effect etc. while XBLA gems like Perfect Dark HD and Battlefield 1943 will have me needing to plug in an old 360 to run...
God I hope I'm wrong though....
alexandros
Banned
Because I am of the opinion that it makes perfect sense, since the technology wars of the next few years will be decided by the ecosystem, not the devices.
Considering how no company has the universal ecosystem you speak of, I don't think it'll effect anyone in any negative way.
Not sure how it makes perfect sense to have everything available on every device within the ecosystem when that's not really phsycally possible unless we wish to restrict everything to mobile/tablet level of complexity. I doubt the 720 and PC owners would be too happy about that.
pharmboy044
Member
I'm not sure why people are talking about the next Xbox not having BC. I thought it was given that due to the hardware being similar it would have BC?
Maybe Sony will make profit next generation.
Shots fired etc...
alexandros
Banned
Well that's the point. Microsoft is in a unique position to bring true unification and finally give people a reason to buy Windows tablets and phones. It would be a unique selling point.
Maximilian E.
AKA MS-Evangelist
Question regarding BC (and other thoughts).
What are the chances or the feasibility that MS puts a 360 SoC in 720?
But also, IF MS would do so, could it not be put to good use, and let the new CPU/GPU handle all the game code?
So for example:
the 360 SoC can be used as the MCP chip was used in the OG Xbox, handling sound, network (perhaps even OS).
At the moment, the 360 SoC is at 45nm if I remember correctly. MS could make it smaller and use it in the 720, to offloading workload and of course, to ensure full BC.
So question, how likely is it that we see 360 SoC in 720?
And can it be used as I "think" it could be? (I don´t see why not though).
(I know that adding an extra chip make the system hotter, more complex and adds extra cost, so therefore perhaps this will be a solution for a second SKU)
What are the chances or the feasibility that MS puts a 360 SoC in 720?
But also, IF MS would do so, could it not be put to good use, and let the new CPU/GPU handle all the game code?
So for example:
the 360 SoC can be used as the MCP chip was used in the OG Xbox, handling sound, network (perhaps even OS).
At the moment, the 360 SoC is at 45nm if I remember correctly. MS could make it smaller and use it in the 720, to offloading workload and of course, to ensure full BC.
So question, how likely is it that we see 360 SoC in 720?
And can it be used as I "think" it could be? (I don´t see why not though).
(I know that adding an extra chip make the system hotter, more complex and adds extra cost, so therefore perhaps this will be a solution for a second SKU)
Barkley's Justice
Member
when did b.c. all of a sudden fall out of assumed capabilities of the 720? it's been almost implied by the rumored architecture, has it not?
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
A unique selling point for the open platform that they just happen to make an OS for. At the same time, it would harm their closed platform that they control in entirety. It's not happening, at least not yet.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
A CPU 8x the power of Xenos would make this relatively feasible. The shift from Xbox to 360 was more cumbersome, going from OOE to in-order.
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
So is it feasible for CELL? Sure, CELL is a more powerful processor than Xenos, but they share some similarities. And people are claiming bc is impossible for PS4 due to the switch to x86
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
They share some similarities, namely the PPE, but on the whole, Cell's architecture is completely different and more complex. SPEs are still very powerful when it comes to processing of data organized in certain ways, they're programmed differently than the PPE, and the memory handling is quite complex. It's not nearly the same as with Xenon (Xenos is the GPU).
JoshuaJSlone
Member
With the worse economy and the lack of success PS3 had at prices over $300, it sounds more insane.BigTnaples said:
Steve McQueen
Member
Damnit..just wanted to play TWD but my 360 broke down :/ Just doesn't wanna start up.
I don't really wanna buy a new system because the '720' might be just around the corner ( and my brother has got an older 20GB model I can borrow that seems to work 'fine', although it produces a lot of noise ). Haven't been keeping up with the rumours, but what are the chances that MS is actually gonna launch a new systeem in 2013?
I don't really wanna buy a new system because the '720' might be just around the corner ( and my brother has got an older 20GB model I can borrow that seems to work 'fine', although it produces a lot of noise ). Haven't been keeping up with the rumours, but what are the chances that MS is actually gonna launch a new systeem in 2013?
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
No parts of the car reflect on the car itself. Only reflections from 'remote' objects are present.
You need ray tracing/path tracing for proper reflectance, and 2nd order illumination, in general.
Brad Grenz
Member
I'm skeptical that the floating point capabilities in any potential x86 solution will be adequate to emulate the 360's beefy vector units. Backwards compatibility is just as out of reach for 360 games as PS3. Perhaps more so because the SPEs could theoretically be included on a PS4 CPU/APU because they're so tiny and modular by design.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
You say this, yet hardware like the Kinect, iPad, Kindle Fire, iPhone, etc are breaking sales records all the time..
Games like Halo, CoD, Borderlands, Assassins Creed, Gears, etc are all also breaking sales records. Not to mention the Steam boom.
The same with movies like Avatar, Dark Knight, Harry Potter, Hunger Games, etc etc etc.
We've also seen a dramatic rise in subscription entertainment like Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, CoD Elite, PS+, BF Premium, HBO Go etc.
It's not like people are so hard off that they aren't willing to spend money, a lot of money in fact on entertainment.
Not to mention all the factors like functionality and longevity that make the consoles of 2013 an entirely different machine than in 2005.. Which you ignored.
Also this is an Xbox 720 thread. The 360 never had an issue moving units at a $400 price point back in 2005, and that was when all it really did was play xbox games and rip CDs, and everyone expected to buy a new one in 4-5 years.... Again, the consoles do exponentially more now and they last up to a decade..
100%