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[umop_3pisdn]

The problem is the risk of antagonizing those that don't understand your point of view. Those individuals believe it's an even playing field.

"If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat."

I dunno, maybe I can explain what I see happening with a different group that is actively oppressed. The Black Lives Matter movement is having a massive problem with how they are characterized in the media. They've lost the public relations battle. Why? Because of their name. Perhaps they should have gone with "Black Lives Matter Too" as the name. The "too" makes the implications much more obvious since it directly suggests that someone is being left out. There'd still be opposition, don't get me wrong. But I think the movement might have had better success in the public relations battlefield by having a name that is still brief, but yet conveys more information and isn't left open to easy exploitation or misinterpretation. At a minimum, it would have made "All Lives Matter Too" not work since that makes absolutely zero sense and would just be confusing.

Anyways, the opposition has brilliantly reframed the argument and are using "All Lives Matter" as a weapon. It's working quite effectively. A lot of people just don't get it. So then you see paragraph after paragraph written on forum posts, blogs, and news articles trying to explain what Black Lives Matter is and why "All Lives Matter" as a movement doesn't make sense.

The problem is that the typical person isn't going to consume all that. They're not going to think about all the context. I know that some of you are thinking that they should, and you're right. But that's not the world we live in. You can't expect the enemy to fight on your terms. You have to fight on theirs. This is something conservatives figured out a long time ago. They're the masters of framing things into something bite-size. If you have to go through lengthy explanations, you've lost the battle.

"Fuck straight people" is an understandable remark made in frustration that doesn't literally mean we think all straight people need to die in a fire or something - but it isn't going to be received well, and that's just the reality of it. Some of you are probably going to double down and say "fuck their feelings" but they're the ones with the power, so...

I do have sympathy for this argument, don't get me wrong, but humming and hawing over politeness/propriety is what people have used to quiet down pesky minorities since forever.

I do think politeness is important, but it's one of the least important important things. So sometimes I feel like rudeness does sort of serve a function, in that it says something along the lines of "it's not about you and your feelings, and if the worst thing you have to say about what I say is that I'm being rude, then you have it pretty good."

If I seem like I have an adversarial tone, that isn't my intention, it's just that this argument is itself adversarial. And I'm not an activist, so it's all well and good for me to just say things like this, but I can't really act like this is a cause I am championing or anything. It just seems ridiculous sometimes when they get their feelings hurt over something like this and we all have to stop and address that 'injustice'. I mean please. And there's something to be said for having a discussion about that.

 

[R10Neymarfan]

How does everyone here feel about that Daily Beast article regarding athletes in Rio and on Grindr? Apparently caused a shit storm

 

[DOWN]

Y'all waiting on that Frank Ocean album too? I think he's bi or at least he's seemingly said he's non-straight iirc

 

[Thequietone]

How does everyone here feel about that Daily Beast article regarding athletes in Rio and on Grindr? Apparently caused a shit storm

It's disgusting. Some of these athletes come from extremely intolerant countries towards non-heterosexuals and may end up causing something horrible to happen to these athletes that were outed. The article served no purpose other than getting clicks. You don't see articles about heterosexuals having sex at the Olympics. I hope beyond hope that nothing happens to them but history has shown the opposite.

 

[TheAbsolution]

Does it take long to build up a credit score? I'd preferably not want to live at home much longer lmao.

You need at least 6 months to a year to build up a solid history.
Just be responsible and you'll be fine.

 

[R10Neymarfan]

It's disgusting. Some of these athletes come from extremely intolerant countries towards non-heterosexuals and may end up causing something horrible to happen to these athletes that were outed. The article served no purpose other than getting clicks. You don't see articles about heterosexuals having sex at the Olympics. I hope beyond hope that nothing happens to them but history has shown the opposite.

We do have articles about them having sex.

In fact there was several IIRC on orgies and sex within the village

 

[Meicyn]

I do have sympathy for this argument, don't get me wrong, but humming and hawing over politeness/propriety is what people have used to quiet down pesky minorities since forever.

I do think politeness is important, but it's one of the least important important things. So sometimes I feel like rudeness does sort of serve a function, in that it says something along the lines of "it's not about you and your feelings, and if the worst thing you have to say about what I say is that I'm being rude, then you have it pretty good."

If I seem like I have an adversarial tone, that isn't my intention, it's just that this argument is itself adversarial. And I'm not an activist, so it's all well and good for me to just say things like this, but I can't really act like this is a cause I am championing or anything. It just seems ridiculous sometimes when they get their feelings hurt over something like this and we all have to stop and address that 'injustice'. I mean please. And there's something to be said for having a discussion about that.

Hold up - if I gave the impression that I value propriety and politeness to such a great extent, then I want to emphasize that I think otherwise. I'm in the military, so I hear and say offensive things on a routine basis. There are many times where I have to be curt because something needs to get done immediately and I don't care about people's feelings. I fully appreciate the value that rudeness sometimes brings.

When a white guy comes in and boohoos about how bad they have it because they just had their first taste of not getting their way, then I'm all in on calling them out on how they're privileged. Be rude about it, mock them, have all the laughs, I don't care. Maybe they'll grow as a person. But the moment you make a remark like "fucking white people" then you've lost me. That's a bridge too far for a lot of people.

 

[umop_3pisdn]

A part of me thinks we should all be saying "fucking white people" constantly.

 

[Meicyn]

Not going to lie - I'm a hypocrite and say it in jest within my circle of friends. I also refer to most of them as breeders who are ruining the planet with their overpopulation while they call me a fag, so we're all basically terrible people.

 

[Zero²]

Ever since I read the Black Butler manga I can't seem to understand the word "fag" the same way. Never knew it had that other meaning, or maybe it was from that, that it originated?

 

[Elitist1945]

Y'all waiting on that Frank Ocean album too? I think he's bi or at least he's seemingly said he's non-straight iirc

He wrote a letter talking about a relationship he had with a man. He's fine imo.

 

[Henchmen21]

Ever since I read the Black Butler manga I can't seem to understand the word "fag" the same way. Never knew it had that other meaning, or maybe it was from that, that it originated?

Well before it was used as a slur against our community, it was originally meant "a bundle of sticks". That's all I know about it.

 

[Salarians]

Y'all waiting on that Frank Ocean album too? I think he's bi or at least he's seemingly said he's non-straight iirc

I don't think I've ever heard his music but I like looking at his face.

 

[Pamplemousse]

Can someone teach me what football is?

 

[RatskyWatsky]

Everyone watch The Katering Show on Youtube.

 

[You Know Nothing]

Everyone watch The Katering Show on Youtube.

Words to live by.

Season 2 is even better than the first. The placenta episode. lordt

 

[Salarians]

Can someone teach me what football is?

.

 

[RatskyWatsky]

Words to live by.

Season 2 is even better than the first. The placenta episode. lordt

I literally screamed throughout that entire episode. And it was her real placenta too!

 

[umop_3pisdn]

Everyone watch The Katering Show on Youtube.

Season 2 is so good ashdfhgfhsdfhsg

I was going to meditate but now I am just being a giddy ninny instead.

 

[Kater]

Y'all waiting on that Frank Ocean album too? I think he's bi or at least he's seemingly said he's non-straight iirc

RIP Down (he'll be back tho, right?)

He looks good. Didn't know he was queer.

 

[Aarglefarg]

This is what Frank Ocean wrote about it, in the picture he posted.

And referring to Prince, Frank Ocean wrote this earlier this year:
"he was a straight black man who played his first televised set in bikini bottoms and knee high heeled boots, epic. he made me feel more comfortable with how i identify sexually simply by his display of freedom from and irreverence for obviously archaic ideas like gender conformity etc."

 

[Crayons]

Can someone teach me what football is?

Football is a sexual sport that straight men use as an excuse to get jumped on top of by other sweaty, large men, I believe.

 

[Zero²]

.

Yummy 😋

 

[Jeels]

Thanks Meicyn for adding some perspective.

The discussion has gone back and forth at this point, and I am tired and know I won't convince anyone, but I'll leave it at this: You are free to think it's okay to say what you are saying (if it makes you feel better...?), but what you are doing isn't to the benefit of yourself or anyone else. Saying "fuck straight people" isnt going to change institutional issues of inequality, it isn't going to help someone who has been preexposed to bigotry and hatred to gain new perspective, it isn't going to help the life of a hurting gay person, and it isn't going to bring people together. If that's your way of protest or "sticking it back" to society or whatever, have at it, but enjoy wallowing in that sorrow instead of trying to actually change the world. I'd rather stick to positive change like what we see in this own thread (Frank Ocean posted right above, how he came out in hip hop culture) or how we see pro LGBT groups sprouting up within major corporations (including one were starting in my own company).

A lot of this it's okay to say fuck ____ people is coming from tumblr which is about what I expected from tumblr culture. A friend of mine who is very active on tumblr once described it as a pathological hatred towards a cheap understanding of privilege. She is a rape survivor and the moment she would add some nuance to discussion, Tumblr's faux outrage culture would hurl insults like accusing her of being an abuser (not unlike some of the instant outrage we've seen in this thread...really, accusing your fellow brethren as being enablers?) I get it though, it's easy to be mad.

Edit: And sorry if I've offended anyone but I'm just tired of it...

 

[Mostmanlyman]

Good post jeels

 

[Ambitious]

"We'll talk to the guy who fixed your boiler", they said, "and then we're gonna call you back".

They didn't.

Just went to their office. They told me that the boiler was ancient, so they're gonna talk to my landlady and suggest replacing it. They're gonna call me later today. Oh, I'm sure they'll call.
I wonder how many weeks I'll have to wait this time.

They didn't call. Of course not. Assholes.
Anyway, for some reason the boiler and the pipes have to be checked by a chimney sweep before they're allowed to replace it. But the earliest possible date is next Tuesday, which means another weekend without warm water for me. And then I'll have to wait for the new boiler to arrive at the plumber's office, and then I'll have to wait until their next free date, and then I'll have to watch them mess up my kitchen for a few hours again. What a great summer this has been.

You know, something's different this time. Previously, after turning it on the boiler would work for about 40 seconds. Then the water would get colder and colder, and the boiler wouldn't work anymore for the next ~30 minutes. So every morning, I'd wet my hair with cold water at the sink, put shampoo on my head and some shower gel on my body, turned the shower on and try to wash myself within those 40 seconds. Sounds like fun, doesn't it?

Well, this time, since yesterday evening the boiler doesn't heat at all. There's only cold water. And have I mentioned just how cold it is? It's so cold, it actually burns on the skin. Simply washing my hands hurts like hell, and washing my face at the sink is a nightmare. And today in the morning, for the first time I actually had to shower with water that cold. Jesus Christ, dear Letters-GAF. Jesus fucking Christ.
Not only did I wear a sweater over my shirt, I actually put on a warm jacket over it. When I arrived at the office, I was still freezing.

 

[Pamplemousse]

You know, something's different this time. Previously, after turning it on the boiler would work for about 40 seconds. Then the water would get colder and colder, and the boiler wouldn't work anymore for the next ~30 minutes. So every morning, I'd wet my hair with cold water at the sink, put shampoo on my head and some shower gel on my body, turned the shower on and try to wash myself within those 40 seconds. Sounds like fun, doesn't it?

Sounds hot.

 

[Crayons]

i like it when my latin lover calls me senorito

 

[Cosmic Bus]

Ambitious, do you own that house or rent it? And I'm guessing you're in the UK?

 

[Ambitious]

Sounds hot.

why don't you invite me to your place so I

Spoiler

we

could have a hot shower

 

[Tuck]

Someone on tinder messaged me. He's cute. But trying to have a conversation with him is maddening. I keep asking questions, he keeps giving brief replies. Interesting avenues of conversation end up going no where because his replies are so brief, and he doesn't ask me anything in return. Doesn't seem to be putting in any effort to keep a conversation going. Argh.

This keeps happening. What exactly about instant messaging makes people forget basic social skills? I don't get it.

I'm hoping he'll open up more as we talk, like the last guy did. But right now its more like I'm interviewing him.

How does everyone here feel about that Daily Beast article regarding athletes in Rio and on Grindr? Apparently caused a shit storm

Its gross. I don't even get what the point of it is. Gay people have sex with each other, WHO KNEW?!

 

[Kater]

Its gross. I don't even get what the point of it is. Gay people have sex with each other, WHO KNEW?!

Clickbait, nothing more. And since this endangers people potentially I'd say that writer values clicks over the lives of (queer) people.

 

[Aeriscloud]

Absolutely done with everything.

 

[Pamplemousse]

Absolutely done with everything.

What's wrong, Aeri?

 

[Blood Diamonds]

No Man's Sky complete 180 on gaming side, Suicide Squad and the DCCU in general making OT have a meltdown, and people in this thread writing essays about how you should ignore the bad things that happen to queer people and "focus on positive change".... I love neogaf dot com

 

[Pamplemousse]

I hope Mr. Cop doesn't manscape too much. The prepubescent look does nothing for me.

 

[Zantetsuken88]

Like I hate napping for many reasons - I only ever fall asleep in the middle of the day accidentally...

But one of the most major gripes? When you're waking up in a pair of jeans: that 'morning

Spoiler

boner

' fucking hurts.

 

[Kater]

No Man's Sky complete 180 on gaming side, Suicide Squad and the DCCU in general making OT have a meltdown, and people in this thread writing essays about how you should ignore the bad things that happen to queer people and "focus on positive change".... I love neogaf dot com

lmao all I hear about Suicide Squad was all I expected tbh

People got their hopes up for that film too after the other disappointment of a film...

 

[Pamplemousse]

Like I hate napping for many reasons - I only ever fall asleep in the middle of the day accidentally...

But one of the most major gripes? When you're waking up in a pair of jeans: that 'morning

Spoiler

boner

' fucking hurts.

Tease.

 

[Sweeney Tom]

lmao all I hear about Suicide Squad was all I expected tbh

People got their hopes up for that film too after the other disappointment of a film...

You know they're gonna do it for Wonder Woman too

I'm just going to laugh when people get their hopes up for Justice League, bc lets be honest at this point they deserve to be disappointed by Snyder again

 

[Buzzman]

Hey everyone sorry for butting in, a friend of mine (MtF) has been having issues, And I don't really know what to do.
She's severely depressed. After surgery and years of hormone treatments she's of course still struggling with her own body. Her family and random strangers are still being assholes and sometimes "forgetting" her name or misgendering her.

I guess I'm just so fucking oblivious because I think she looks great and had no idea she even was trans. I just don't know what to reply when she says she hates her own body. I can't imagine how difficult it must be, but I'm afraid I'll just make her feel even worse by saying stuff like that. And of course I don't want to minimize in any way what she's suffering and say stupid stuff like, "it could've been worse! durr"

 

[RatskyWatsky]

Hey everyone sorry for butting in, a friend of mine (MtF) has been having issues, And I don't really know what to do.
She's severely depressed. After surgery and years of hormone treatments she's of course still struggling with her own body. Her family and random strangers are still being assholes and sometimes "forgetting" her name or misgendering her.

I guess I'm just so fucking oblivious because I think she looks great and had no idea she even was trans. I just don't know what to reply when she says she hates her own body. I can't imagine how difficult it must be, but I'm afraid I'll just make her feel even worse by saying stuff like that. And of course I don't want to minimize in any way what she's suffering and say stupid stuff like, "it could've been worse! durr"

You're more than welcome to post in here, but you might also check out the trans thread, which has a lot of users who don't post in here.

 

[Sibylus]

Hey everyone sorry for butting in, a friend of mine (MtF) has been having issues, And I don't really know what to do.
She's severely depressed. After surgery and years of hormone treatments she's of course still struggling with her own body. Her family and random strangers are still being assholes and sometimes "forgetting" her name or misgendering her.

I guess I'm just so fucking oblivious because I think she looks great and had no idea she even was trans. I just don't know what to reply when she says she hates her own body. I can't imagine how difficult it must be, but I'm afraid I'll just make her feel even worse by saying stuff like that. And of course I don't want to minimize in any way what she's suffering and say stupid stuff like, "it could've been worse! durr"

It sounds like she's not getting the support she needs from family or from the wider community. My suggestions would be:

a) For her to see a therapist who can help give her the mental health support she needs as she continues transition and living around these folks.
b) For her to spend time away from fam/strangers who are unsupportive. You can help and invite her to meets or coffee, maybe introduce her to friends who are great on these matters too.
c) Listen, even if you don't have the words or the solutions.
d) Compliment her on how she looks today. Be specific and thoughtful.
e) Celebrate how far she's come and the adversity she's overcome.
f) Be present.

 

[Buzzman]

Thanks for the advice

I didn't know there was a Trans-specific thread aswell. Gonna check it out.

 

[Aeriscloud]

What's wrong, Aeri?

Bleh, just having a super shitty day.

 

[B-Dex]

This is a hot mess.

 

[EulaCapra]

It deserves its own thread, but here's Colton Haynes representing Team USA:

 

[Alrus]

This is a hot mess.

I swear Latrice has the most contagious laugh.

 

[Crayons]

I just had my first threesome

 

[Kater]