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[BruceLeeRoy]

Whats the deal with some dead people showing up on the Island then that aren't controlled by smokey?
Are they in purgatory sidewaysflash somehow? Why are they able to be on the island?

 

[Catalix]

Whats the deal with some dead people showing up on the Island then that aren't controlled by smokey?
Are they in purgatory sidewaysflash somehow? Why are they able to be on the island?

No one quite knows for sure what the deal is with the non-sideways ghosts. Charlie, Eko, Ana Lucia, Libby, Michael, Isabella, and possibly Christian all showed up and were well-aware of their past lives. It is perplexing.

Maybe uncorking the light is what finally allowed the on-island ghosts to "move on" to the sideways world. It broke the shackles, if you will. I dunno.

 

[Blader]

No one quite knows for sure what the deal is with the non-sideways ghosts. Charlie, Eko, Ana Lucia, Libby, Michael, Isabella, and possibly Christian all showed up and were well-aware of their past lives. It is perplexing.

Maybe uncorking the light is what finally allowed the on-island ghosts to "move on" to the sideways world. It broke the shackles, if you will. I dunno.

I like to think that when a character hasn't awoken in the sideways yet, their memories manifest on the island as a ghost.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I think this dude on the Bill Simmons podcast describes the two possible reactions to the lost finale perfectly:
You loved it! : If your main motivation in the show was the characters and the relationships established.
Your disappointed : You wanted answers. You needed everything wrapped up perfectly and for everything to matter.

I am somewhere in the middle I really loved the characters so as a overall show I loved Lost but I am bummed it feels like so much was empty filler.

 

[Ereedmas]

I'm amazed this thread is still going strong. Not that I'm surprised, the Lost finale was amazing and deserves plenty of discussion.

 

[dave is ok]

This thread really needs to die. It's been two weeks almost.

Let go.

 

[Catalix]

I like to think that when a character hasn't awoken in the sideways yet, their memories manifest on the island as a ghost.

Kinda like their memories walking around in human form, waiting to fuse with their sideways selves? Heh, that's pretty neat.

Spoiler

and totally Kingdom Hearts

:lol

 

[Crisco]

This thread really needs to die. It's been two weeks almost.

Let go.

It's already dead, but everyone who's ever posted in it needs to reconnect before we can move on to the next thread.

 

[gdt]

I think this dude on the Bill Simmons podcast describes the two possible reactions to the lost finale perfectly:
You loved it! : If your main motivation in the show was the characters and the relationships established.
Your disappointed : You wanted answers. You needed everything wrapped up perfectly and for everything to matter.

I am somewhere in the middle I really loved the characters so as a overall show I loved Lost but I am bummed it feels like so much was empty filler.

Nothing whatsoever related to the characters feels like filler at all, nothing that ever happened in any of the seasons.

Now, there are some plotholes and dropped storylines (Walt) that stand out, but nothing stands out as filler to me.

(I'm talking in broad strokes, not specific episodes)

 

[Drealmcc0y]

Empty filler?

The fuck is wrong with you

 

[dave is ok]

He's right. The seasons worth of X universe plotlines just weren't very important - no matter what you believe they represented. That was filler

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I guess empty filler isn't really the right word more that there were storylines established that I was really into that never went anywhere or actually mattered. I loved watching them at the time but it was somewhat disappointing that they didn't all culminate to mean something. The sideways storylines just were all pointless and did nothing to better the series imo.

Does that make sense?

 

[Blader]

He's right. The seasons worth of X universe plotlines just weren't very important - no matter what you believe they represented. That was filler

No. The sideways stories weren't, by any stretch, unimportant at all.

 

[Drealmcc0y]

He's right. The seasons worth of X universe plotlines just weren't very important - no matter what you believe they represented. That was filler

The twins in breaking bad were filler.

This has about as much logic as your post

 

[neoism]

http://www.slashfilm.com/2010/06/02...jack-bender-developing-feature-for-bad-robot/



Bender going Big Screen?

good

 

[Catalix]

The twins in breaking bad were filler.

This has about as much logic as your post

The Fly must've been filler too.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I don't mean to take anything away from the respect the show deserves. It is one of the tops of all time and not having it anymore is really going to bum me out. I just thought some of the storylines they developed didn't end up meaning as much as I hoped in the grand scope of the show.

 

[gdt]

I don't mean to take anything away from the respect the show deserves. It is one of the tops of all time and not having it anymore is really going to bum me out. I just thought some of the storylines they developed didn't end up meaning as much as I hoped in the grand scope of the show.

Can you give a specific example?

(Besides the token Walt)

 

[DMeisterJ]

I think this dude on the Bill Simmons podcast describes the two possible reactions to the lost finale perfectly:
You loved it! : If your main motivation in the show was the characters and the relationships established.
Your disappointed : You wanted answers. You needed everything wrapped up perfectly and for everything to matter.

I am somewhere in the middle I really loved the characters so as a overall show I loved Lost but I am bummed it feels like so much was empty filler.

My sentiments exactly. I'm a new Lost-ie, but I really grew to enjoy almost all the characters (Barring Kate and Michael), so I was happy about the end, but I also felt some stuff wasn't answered, or vaguely answered, or unnecessary. I wish I could recall when I felt like that, but watching 119 episodes over 3 weeks means I forgot much of the stuff I felt was useless anyway.

 

[Mike M]

Can you give a specific example?

(Besides the token Walt)

Ben going on to Locke about a box that contained whatever you wanted, and when they opened it this time, Locke's father was in it, who later claimed to have died in a car wreck or something.

None of that was ever explained or brought up again, which I found to be especially infuriating, because it was pretty dead on for what my pet theory was at the time.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Can you give a specific example?

(Besides the token Walt)

You actually might be able to explain this in a way my mashed potatoes brains can understand it but Season 4 seems like it establishes storylines and mythology that don't ever really go anywhere. I still don't really understand what Charles Whitmore was doing and even the point of him being on the Island. it seemed like everything that happened in that season was ultimately undone.

Ben going on to Locke about a box that contained whatever you wanted, and when they opened it this time, Locke's father was in it, who later claimed to have died in a car wreck or something.

None of that was ever explained or brought up again, which I found to be especially infuriating, because it was pretty dead on for what my pet theory was at the time.

Oh yeah I forgot about that.

 

[cyclonekruse]

Your disappointed : You wanted answers. You needed everything wrapped up perfectly and for everything to matter.

Everything did matter, though. Like I said, the on-Island stuff mattered because without it, the afterlife ceases to be. The flash-sideways stuff mattered because that's how they end up reconnecting. All the crossover in their lives serves to demonstrate that they are all important to each other. It also gave them a chance to play out their lives a little differently and in some cases find redemption (Ben with helping Alex instead of serving himself) or to realize that which they thought they wanted wasn't so important after all (Desmond with his desire for Widmore's approval).

The flash-sideways showed us that the characters finally "found" the importance of life (instead of it being "LOST"). That importance? "Finding" others to care about and to share your life with. "Nobody does it alone."

Now, there are some things that truly didn't get answered (Walt, Aaron, outrigger, pallet drop, etc.). I can understand some frustration over all of that (to be honest I would like to know some of those answers myself). But you can think of it as a little sideways way of the writers getting a message across to the audience. Maybe the questions that you want answered aren't that important. Maybe the question you should concern yourself with is "With whom do I want to spend this life that I have?" Focus less on the plot of your life and more on the characters in it.

Whether or not the writers intended for that message to come across in that way is easily debatable, but that message can still be taken from the show.

 

[Drealmcc0y]

You actually might be able to explain this in a way my mashed potatoes brains can understand it but Season 4 seems like it establishes storylines and mythology that don't ever really go anywhere. I still don't really understand what Charles Whitmore was doing and even the point of him being on the Island. it seemed like everything that happened in that season was ultimately undone.

Charles Widmore wasnt on the island in season 4. He sent a freighter to the island though in season 4.

He was trying to reign king of the island though, which was his ultimate goal

 

[gdt]

Ben going on to Locke about a box that contained whatever you wanted, and when they opened it this time, Locke's father was in it, who later claimed to have died in a car wreck or something.

None of that was ever explained or brought up again, which I found to be especially infuriating, because it was pretty dead on for what my pet theory was at the time.

Um....

Ben specifically called out the magic box as a metaphor in the S4 finale. And Cooper explained, very specifically, what happened to him.

So no, the magic box was not just brushed under the rug, but it played the line between metaphor and actual thing when it was first introduced, then confirmed as metaphor later.

Edit: It seems like you're angry it wasn't real.

 

[Drealmcc0y]

Ben going on to Locke about a box that contained whatever you wanted, and when they opened it this time, Locke's father was in it, who later claimed to have died in a car wreck or something.

None of that was ever explained or brought up again, which I found to be especially infuriating, because it was pretty dead on for what my pet theory was at the time.

dude... it was explained like 5 episodes later

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Charles Widmore wasnt on the island in season 4. He sent a freighter to the island though in season 4.

He was trying to reign king of the island though, which was his ultimate goal

I meant just his general involvement. Was he trying to become the next Jacob of the Island or just trying to get revenge on Ben? Either way it seems like as important a storyline he was in 4 in 6 he felt kind of shoe-horned in.

 

[Drealmcc0y]

Um....

Ben specifically called out the magic box as a metaphor in the S4 finale. And Cooper explained, very specifically, what happened to him.

So no, the magic box was not just brushed under the rug, but it played the line between metaphor and actual thing when it was first introduced, then confirmed as metaphor later.

Edit: It seems like you're angry it wasn't real.

actually ben said it was a metaphor in "the brig".

Locke however asks Ben in the S4 finale "Is this the magic box"

which he replys "no john its not"

 

[Drealmcc0y]

I meant just his general involvement. Was he trying to become the next Jacob of the Island or just trying to get revenge on Ben? Either way it seems like as important a storyline he was in 4 in 6 he felt kind of shoe-horned in.

He wanted to be leader and kill Ben yeah

edit: Also I'll add he didnt really want to kill Ben, he just wanted him removed off the island

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

He wanted to be leader and kill Ben yeah

I guess Season 4 really is necessary to establish who Ben is as a character. Both his good and ultimately bad sides.

 

[HowardRoark]

I wish you had believed me.

Well done.

 

[cyclonekruse]

You actually might be able to explain this in a way my mashed potatoes brains can understand it but Season 4 seems like it establishes storylines and mythology that don't ever really go anywhere. I still don't really understand what Charles Whitmore was doing and even the point of him being on the Island. it seemed like everything that happened in that season was ultimately undone.

I don't have a stellar explanation for Charles' storyline, but Season 4 was important. Without the Losties leaving the island and Locke feeling he needs to move the island (because he was manipulated by MiB), Ben would never have turned the donkey wheel. Without that, the Losties (that were still on Island) would never have jumped through time. Which wouldn't have led to Locke turning the donkey wheel in Season 5. Which wouldn't have led to the other Losties coming back to the island, some of whom went back to the 70's. Without that, they would never have stopped the Incident from being worse than it was by detonating the bomb.

As Locke said early on about Boone's death, that one occurrence set off a chain of events that led them to "this place." When he said it, he was referring to the Hatch. But for the story as a whole, "this place" is the church where they move on. Everything happened for a reason. Everything happened so they could protect the island, so they could meet in the afterlife, so they could remember, and let go. And ultimately so they could move on.

 

[gdt]

I meant just his general involvement. Was he trying to become the next Jacob of the Island or just trying to get revenge on Ben? Either way it seems like as important a storyline he was in 4 in 6 he felt kind of shoe-horned in.

I thought he always, clearly, wanted to regain leadership of The Others. Then, Jacob came to see him and convinced him to help take down MIB.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I don't have a stellar explanation for Charles' storyline, but Season 4 was important. Without the Losties leaving the island and Locke feeling he needs to move the island (because he was manipulated by MiB), Ben would never have turned the donkey wheel. Without that, the Losties (that were still on Island) would never have jumped through time. Which wouldn't have led to Locke turning the donkey wheel in Season 5. Which wouldn't have led to the other Losties coming back to the island, some of whom went back to the 70's. Without that, they would never have stopped the Incident from being worse than it was by detonating the bomb.

As Locke said early on about Boone's death, that one occurrence set off a chain of events that led them to "this place." When he said it, he was referring to the Hatch. But for the story as a whole, "this place" is the church where they move on. Everything happened for a reason. Everything happened so they could protect the island, so they could meet in the afterlife, so they could remember, and let go. And ultimately so they could move on.

So are all the scenes of purgatory through Jacks perspective? Like is all of Lost with Jack waking up on the island and then dying on the island just mainly about him?

 

[Solo]

What the fuck are you guys still doing in here? Move on, motherfuckas

 

[Catalix]

Ben going on to Locke about a box that contained whatever you wanted, and when they opened it this time, Locke's father was in it, who later claimed to have died in a car wreck or something.

None of that was ever explained or brought up again, which I found to be especially infuriating, because it was pretty dead on for what my pet theory was at the time.

I'm sure these are the types of "questions" a lot of the average viewers are getting hung up on. Stuff that was clearly addressed within the context of the show.

I guess people just tend to forget that they were in fact answered, or they didn't quite piece things together yet themselves.

 

[gdt]

So are all the scenes of purgatory through Jacks perspective? Like is all of Lost with Jack waking up on the island and then dying on the island just mainly about him?

I would say the show starts and ends with Jack, but I don't know if the whole show is about him.

And no, I don't think purgatory was from Jack's perspective.

 

[Catalix]

What the fuck are you guys still doing in here? Move on, motherfuckas

DON'T TELL US WHAT WE CAN'T DO

 

[Drealmcc0y]

So are all the scenes of purgatory through Jacks perspective? Like is all of Lost with Jack waking up on the island and then dying on the island just mainly about him?

How could you possibly think it was all about Jack.

 

[Archaix]

What the fuck are you guys still doing in here? Move on, motherfuckas

:lol

As long as people come in here thinking everybody was dead, and then others ask about questions that were answered years ago, there's reason for this thread to go on.

And since that still seems to be happening once every 36 hours or so, I think there's legs left on Lost-GAF.

 

[Blader]

Ben going on to Locke about a box that contained whatever you wanted, and when they opened it this time, Locke's father was in it, who later claimed to have died in a car wreck or something.

None of that was ever explained or brought up again, which I found to be especially infuriating, because it was pretty dead on for what my pet theory was at the time.

Seriously? The Others hit him in a car crash, drugged him, and brought him to the island. That's it.

I meant just his general involvement. Was he trying to become the next Jacob of the Island or just trying to get revenge on Ben? Either way it seems like as important a storyline he was in 4 in 6 he felt kind of shoe-horned in.

Revenge. He wanted to take the island back from Ben because, as we saw in S5, Ben took the island from him.

 

[Iceman]

So are all the scenes of purgatory through Jacks perspective? Like is all of Lost with Jack waking up on the island and then dying on the island just mainly about him?

I like to think that the church scene was told through Jack's perspective, but the rest of the purgatory storyline.. there were several episodes within which Jack was completely absent.. same goes for almost a third (my guess) of the other episodes throughout the series.

 

[gdt]

I like to think that the church scene was told through Jack's perspective, but the rest of the purgatory storyline.. there were several episodes within which Jack was completely absent.. same goes for almost a third (my guess) of the other episodes throughout the series.

Jack was in 113 episodes.

Jack's total episode count is 113 (as of the series finale, "The End").
Jack only appeared in archive footage in "Across the Sea" - in a scene from "House of the Rising Sun".
Jack is one of the six characters to have their first flashback in the episode they first appeared in. The other five are Juliet, Charlotte, Lapidus, Miles and Jacob.
Jack was the first character to ever have a flashback and a flash-forward.
However, he was only the third character to have a traditional centric episode after Kate and Locke.
The first episodes of seasons 1, 2, and 3 featured Jack's flashbacks.
He was also the first character to have a flash-forward centered around him, in "Through the Looking Glass", and later had several more in season 4. He later had a centric episode in Season 5 ("316"), and had seven episodes that were partially Jack Centric in Season 6 ("LA X, Part 1") ("LA X, Part 2"), ("Lighthouse"), ("The Last Recruit"), ("The Candidate"), ("What They Died For"), and ("The End"), giving him a total of 22 centric episodes.
Both Nikki, and Paulo, even taken together, appeared in fewer episodes than Jack has centric.
As of "So It Begins", Jack's mobisode count is 5, which makes him one of the two most appearing mobisode characters, along with Michael with also 5 appearances.
Jack generally has the most appearances or ties for the most appearances in a season. The only exception is season 3, where he was second to Kate.
Jack was the nineteenth main character to die, and the last main character to die on screen.
Jack and Kate are the only characters to appear in every season premiere of the series.
More main characters have died in Jack-centric episodes than any other: Boone ("Do No Harm"), Charlie ("Through the Looking Glass, Part 2"), Michael ("There's No Place Like Home, Part 3"), Juliet ("LA X, Part 1"), Sayid, Jin, and Sun have all died in episodes that were at least partially Jack centric. ("The Candidate") Both The Man in Black and Jack have died in an episode that is partially Jack centric as well. ("The End")

 

[cyclonekruse]

So are all the scenes of purgatory through Jacks perspective? Like is all of Lost with Jack waking up on the island and then dying on the island just mainly about him?

No, I think the afterlife scenes were through each characters' own perspective. The scenes showed how all these characters arrived at the same point (the church) through different routes. He needed to be awoken for them all to move on. "You needed all of them. And they needed you," Christian says. And Jack being the stubborn person he is was always going to be the last person to reach enlightenment. So, in that sense the final moments of the show revolved around him.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

How could you possibly think it was all about Jack.

Just as far as leading him to his eventual heaven.

No, I think the afterlife scenes were through each characters' own perspective. The scenes showed how all these characters arrived at the same point (the church) through different routes. He needed to be awoken for them all to move on. "You needed all of them. And they needed you," Christian says. And Jack being the stubborn person he is was always going to be the last person to reach enlightenment. So, in that sense the final moments of the show revolved around him.

Ah gotcha that makes sense. Thanks for the answers man.

 

[Kurtofan]

What the fuck are you guys still doing in here? Move on, motherfuckas

We'll stay here for a while.

 

[Solo]

More main characters have died in Jack-centric episodes than any other: Boone ("Do No Harm"), Charlie ("Through the Looking Glass, Part 2"), Michael ("There's No Place Like Home, Part 3"), Juliet ("LA X, Part 1"), Sayid, Jin, and Sun have all died in episodes that were at least partially Jack centric. ("The Candidate") Both The Man in Black and Jack have died in an episode that is partially Jack centric as well. ("The End")

:lol

Bolded are not Jack-centric episodes.

TNPLH is O6
LA X is everyone
Candidate is Jack AND Locke
The End is everyone

 

[Catalix]

:lol

As long as people come in here thinking everybody was dead, and then others ask about questions that were answered years ago, there's reason for this thread to go on.

And since that still seems to be happening once every 36 hours or so, I think there's legs left on Lost-GAF.

Thank god that's the case. I'm not ready to let go just yet, and honestly I don't have to. LOST was designed for evergreen discussion.

 

[Solo]

Evergreen discussion of the same shit we've disussed 100 times, you mean :lol Thats why I havent posted in here pretty much all week, and pretty soon wont ever again. We've charted the ends of the earth now. All thats left to do is retread ground.

 

[Lion Heart]

So why did Locke kill Naomi in cold blood? Didn't fit his character imo and it never really explained it, or I'm not remembering :/

 

[Drealmcc0y]

So why did Locke kill Naomi in cold blood? Didn't fit his character imo and it never really explained it, or I'm not remembering :/

Because he was "supposed" to