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[mrkgoo]

Yeah I'll definitely take it somewhere, but it's not often ha I am in he vacancy of an Apple Sore.

Fuck i, I give up trying o yep he key. If I ry o pry i off myself, is here a worry of me damaging anything? hank goodness for mostly Auocorrec.

The scissor mechanism underneath can be popped off in a bad way that breaks some tabs on the key cap itself or the scissor mechanism, but by and large they are reasonably robust.

I'd hazard a guess that the key not working may require a top case replacement unless the key it self physically different such as scrunchy (crumb underneath) or squishy or physically blocked from depressing. If it physically feels normally then it may not be the key cap that needs fixing (like the silicon dome that contacts the board, which I think is a topcase replacement).

 

[The Real Abed]

The scissor mechanism underneath can be popped off in a bad way that breaks some tabs on the key cap itself or the scissor mechanism, but by and large they are reasonably robust.

I'd hazard a guess that the key not working may require a top case replacement unless the key it self physically different such as scrunchy (crumb underneath) or squishy or physically blocked from depressing. If it physically feels normally then it may not be the key cap that needs fixing (like the silicon dome that contacts the board, which I think is a topcase replacement).

It doesn't feel any different from the other keys which is what worries me. If I could feel something I'd be relieved.

I don't suppose it could possibly be a software issue.

I can't afford a big service fee dammit. Fuck I am so mad I missed my AppleCare deadline AGAIN.

 

[mrkgoo]

It doesn't feel any different from the other keys which is what worries me. If I could feel something I'd be relieved.

I don't suppose it could possibly be a software issue.

I can't afford a big service fee dammit. Fuck I am so mad I missed my AppleCare deadline AGAIN.

How far are you out of warranty? In our country we have consumer law which dictates that a product should be free of manufacturers defects for a "reasonable amount of time", and a computer that doesn't function, say, after 2 years wouldn't be "reasonable".

Apple can be forgiving though. Best to get it checked out properly and see what the Apple Store says, the. At least you have a diagnosis. If it's not just a key cap and If you're not far out of warranty give apple a call and have a (polite) complaint.

 

[The Real Abed]

How far are you out of warranty? In our country we have consumer law which dictates that a product should be free of manufacturers defects for a "reasonable amount of time", and a computer that doesn't function, say, after 2 years wouldn't be "reasonable".

Apple can be forgiving though. Best to get it checked out properly and see what the Apple Store says, the. At least you have a diagnosis. If it's not just a key cap and If you're not far out of warranty give apple a call and have a (polite) complaint.

Well, I just passed the 2 year in November. And didn't get AppleCare because I missed my "one month left" warning email for the second fucking time.

Also, I just pried the key off and cleaned out some shit inside. But it didnt help. It doesn't seem that theres anything in the way at all. I can press the rubber button fine with its off and it gives me a T every time, but obviously I have to press really hard and directly in the center. No dirt is under the butterfly levers at all. And any that was is cleaned out to no avail. And its the ONLY key like this. And you wouldn't believe how often you need to use the T key. Why couldn't it be the `/~ key instead? It needs to be fully pressed to the circuit board which means it rarely ever does.

I hate calling customer service. It gives me anxiety and I never do it.

Fuck.

I'll keep playing around. Maybe I'll take it to a store when I can.

 

[Deku Tree]

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1180545&page=1

I guess it was a good year for me to buy my 4.0ghz skylake iMac, at least in terms of processors.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

You know what's concerning? Apple hasn't released a security update for the AirPort Extremes since 2014.

 

[Deku Tree]

You know what's concerning? Apple hasn't released a security update for the AirPort Extremes since 2014.

Do they need it?

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

Do they need it?

I can't imagine any piece of networking equipment is secure enough to not need periodic updates.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

I can't imagine any piece of networking equipment is secure enough to not need periodic updates.

Vulnerabilities are patched as they're disclosed. Companies like Apple/Google/MS that don't fix security issues disclosed to them in a timely fashion tend to be called out on it.

 

[Kilrogg]

Just as a follow-up, my boss's Mac runs like crap now. She keeps complaining about it. In fact, I'm almost expecting her to start blaming me if this goes on for too long.

IIRC (don't use Apple's calendar app), you can choose what calendars to display, check the prefs.

First, thanks for the help.
Her calendar mysteriously started to work properly this morning, thankfully.

No, 10.11 has much better memory management. However, a couple of thoughts: sometimes the upgrade doesn't catch everything that's incompatible— had a VMWare Fusion driver kick around too long that was causing huge Spinning Beachball of Death problems and UI freezes— and sometimes some old preferences get carried forward that shouldn't.

Troubleshooting is a matter of squinting at the Console log just after it's been slow and then googling the likely-incomprehensible robot barf.

I suspected that was the reason. Honestly, it's either that or her hard drive that's failing, but since it was working just fine prior to the update and the disk check utility didn't detect any problems, it's got to be some old piece of software or driver.

The thing is:
1) I'm not sure I would be able to read the console log, which you so adeptly described as "robot barf"
2) Her computer is generally slow, so it's not like I can pinpoint a specific time or event that would help me identify the issue(s). For instance, her mail takes a second to be displayed: first the header, then the message. And from what she told me, it took the computer a good 25 minutes this morning to fully boot (i.e. getting to the desktop and having everything work normally)

Also worth spending time in a new account on it to see if it's magically better, which points to problems in her hidden library folder ( ~/Library/ )

All of that is stored in /Users/[her_account]/ and is easily backed up (if its not already!) and restored.

I'll have a look if I can.

Do you think she could just take her Mac to an Apple Store and have it fixed? She doesn't know anyone who's really good with Macs. In fact, I'm probably the most Mac-savvy person she knows, which is sad: I've never had or worked on a Mac.

 

[Skel1ingt0n]

I know it comes up every few weeks, but I seriously can't stop thinking about where Apple is going to take the 15" rMBP.

It's so clear that they just hate dedicated GPUs. First it got taken out of the 13" completely. The 17" doesn't even exist. And the iMacs use AMD cards when Nvidia is arguably the better pick (I know, I know... only for games).

You have to really pay to play to get dedicated graphics on the 15". I bought the late 2013 15" with 2GB 750M when it first got announced, and it's been a fantastic laptop ever since. But it's finally - just now - starting to feel a little dated.

I will absolutely upgrade to the new rMBP 15" - but it must have a decent dedicated GPU. A 2GB 950M is what I think we'll get and what I expect; but there's no reason they shouldn't be able to match the 4GB 960M in the XPS 15.

But there's this piece of me that really fears we're gonna get no GPU at all, or they're going to throw some crap AMD card in the unit.

I really think if they don't do a dGPU, I'll get a Skylake 12" MB, and then a seperate gaming laptop that will be leaps and bounds better at games, anyway.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

The thing is:
1) I'm not sure I would be able to read the console log, which you so adeptly described as "robot barf"

Each line is an entry. Copy-paste into a text document then remove the time stamp and other specific info and then Google it. "Oh, I guess that's normal" will be a thing you say a lot.

2) Her computer is generally slow, so it's not like I can pinpoint a specific time or event that would help me identify the issue(s). For instance, her mail takes a second to be displayed: first the header, then the message. And from what she told me, it took the computer a good 25 minutes this morning to fully boot (i.e. getting to the desktop and having everything work normally)

Holy shit. Not normal at all. Would absolutely poke through Console for that period. And do try the new user thing.


Oh, one other things that will make you scratch your head as a non-Apple person (or Apple-person, frankly): the super thin ribbon cable that provides the SATA connection to/from the disk can break in Macs that use 2.5" disks, which causes all manner of performance problems. Has happened to a few of us on Mac-GAF. I'm really grateful it happened to someone here prior to it happening to my SIL's MBP.

Do you think she could just take her Mac to an Apple Store and have it fixed? She doesn't know anyone who's really good with Macs. In fact, I'm probably the most Mac-savvy person she knows, which is sad: I've never had or worked on a Mac.

Absolutely worth a shot. No experience with that.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

I know it comes up every few weeks, but I seriously can't stop thinking about where Apple is going to take the 15" rMBP.

It's so clear that they just hate dedicated GPUs. First it got taken out of the 13" completely. The 17" doesn't even exist. And the iMacs use AMD cards when Nvidia is arguably the better pick (I know, I know... only for games).

You have to really pay to play to get dedicated graphics on the 15". I bought the late 2013 15" with 2GB 750M when it first got announced, and it's been a fantastic laptop ever since. But it's finally - just now - starting to feel a little dated.

I will absolutely upgrade to the new rMBP 15" - but it must have a decent dedicated GPU. A 2GB 950M is what I think we'll get and what I expect; but there's no reason they shouldn't be able to match the 4GB 960M in the XPS 15.

But there's this piece of me that really fears we're gonna get no GPU at all, or they're going to throw some crap AMD card in the unit.

I really think if they don't do a dGPU, I'll get a Skylake 12" MB, and then a seperate gaming laptop that will be leaps and bounds better at games, anyway.

I could see them removing the dedicated GPU with the Skylake refresh to get a thinner design out now, and then it won't be a big deal, even for pros on the go by the time Kaby Lake's new GPU architecture hits.

 

[The Real Abed]

I've been having a problem for a while that I don't know how to troubleshoot myself either where my computer refuses to shut down. Whether it's for an update or manual shutdown it hangs at the point where the power should be cutting itself. If it's an update it'll hang at the "Rebooting" part of the process after the files have been copied just before it reboots. And if it's a manual shutdown it'll hang when all apps have closed and all that's left is the desktop picture with half black fading over it.

Fortunately it doesn't break anything as I can force it to turn off with the power button and it'll boot up fine with that error message asking if I want to reopen everything. But it's annoying.

Problem is I don't know if it's hardware or software and where id even start looking. I don't know if it does it if I force a shutdown with the terminal sudo shutdown -r now.

Strangely enough it seems to reboot fine if my computer happens to update itself over night which happens occasionally.

Maybe I'll ask a genius when I take it in for my T key.

 

[Kilrogg]

Each line is an entry. Copy-paste into a text document then remove the time stamp and other specific info and then Google it. "Oh, I guess that's normal" will be a thing you say a lot.



Holy shit. Not normal at all. Would absolutely poke through Console for that period. And do try the new user thing.


Oh, one other things that will make you scratch your head as a non-Apple person (or Apple-person, frankly): the super thin ribbon cable that provides the SATA connection to/from the disk can break in Macs that use 2.5" disks, which causes all manner of performance problems. Has happened to a few of us on Mac-GAF. I'm really grateful it happened to someone here prior to it happening to my SIL's MBP.



Absolutely worth a shot. No experience with that.

Thanks again for the advice. And yeah, suffice it to say she is not a computer person at all. I mean, for the longest time - a good 2 years I'd say - I've watched her "Adore Reader update" icon jump up and down in the dock, and she's never once thought that maybe she could click it and, you know, update Reader.

And when our PowerPoint presentations don't look exactly the same on her Mac and on our PCs, she gets annoyed and basically assumes we should conform to her (i.e. get Helvetica). Everything on her computer is old. Old versions of everything everywhere, and tons of e-mail accounts and calendars and shit. Icons all over the desktop, and I still can't get her to use tabs inside her browser, so she's got tons of windows open. It's complete chaos on that thing.

If I had my way she would leave the thing to me for a whole day (maybe 2) and give me carte blanche to do whatever I wanted short of deleting her data. It's a 2012 Macbook Pro, for God's sake! Now it runs worse than my €400 netbook from 2011. It's insane, and it drives me insane.

Trouble is she needs her computer all day everyday, as the owner of a 3-person business (including me), so I can't really take possession of the thing for more than a half-hour, and with the goddamn mess that it's become, I didn't even dare create a new user account (as you suggested) today for fear that she might come back and be annoyed because the computer is stuck or something. Sorry to vent like this, but ugh.

 

[mmazurkiewicz]

I know it comes up every few weeks, but I seriously can't stop thinking about where Apple is going to take the 15" rMBP.

It's so clear that they just hate dedicated GPUs. First it got taken out of the 13" completely. The 17" doesn't even exist. And the iMacs use AMD cards when Nvidia is arguably the better pick (I know, I know... only for games).

You have to really pay to play to get dedicated graphics on the 15". I bought the late 2013 15" with 2GB 750M when it first got announced, and it's been a fantastic laptop ever since. But it's finally - just now - starting to feel a little dated.

I will absolutely upgrade to the new rMBP 15" - but it must have a decent dedicated GPU. A 2GB 950M is what I think we'll get and what I expect; but there's no reason they shouldn't be able to match the 4GB 960M in the XPS 15.

But there's this piece of me that really fears we're gonna get no GPU at all, or they're going to throw some crap AMD card in the unit.

I really think if they don't do a dGPU, I'll get a Skylake 12" MB, and then a seperate gaming laptop that will be leaps and bounds better at games, anyway.

I have the late 2013 as well with the dedicated GPU, but don't know why you feel it feels dated.

i too sort of wanted to upgrade but after rethinking things, theres nothing this computer can't do in terms of speed. if anything, i'd like USBC, higher res, better battery, and lighter body, but those things are sort of expected and not exactly needs of mine.

i guess i'll wait to see whats released.
how much do you think this computer can be sold for now?
last I looked it seems like $1200 is the best I can get on eBay which would be 50% of my purchase price after just two years.
not exactly the best resale value.

 

[Skel1ingt0n]

I have the late 2013 as well with the dedicated GPU, but don't know why you feel it feels dated.

i too sort of wanted to upgrade but after rethinking things, theres nothing this computer can't do in terms of speed. if anything, i'd like USBC, higher res, better battery, and lighter body, but those things are sort of expected and not exactly needs of mine.

i guess i'll wait to see whats released.
how much do you think this computer can be sold for now?
last I looked it seems like $1200 is the best I can get on eBay which would be 50% of my purchase price after just two years.
not exactly the best resale value.

Eh, there's a few things making it feel dated.

The 750M was a low-end gaming card to begin with; but it's practically worthless nowadays for anything outside of Source titles and low-res indies, and PC games from 2003 and earlier.

The PCI-E SSD felt *lightning fast* when I first got it - insane, even. But after using NVME tech in other laptops and desktops, you can definitely notice the reduced speed.

The weight doesn't necessarily bother me - but it does considering the specs. The XPS 15, for example, is pretty much the exact same weight but packs a better GPU. Ignoring the fact that Apple almost always comes in lighter and thinner than the competition.

I'd like an option for 32GB of RAM (even though I don't really need it).

I'll probably upgrade to 1TB (my storage needs have gone up drastically recently with my renewed interest in photography).

I'd really like to also see a true 4K display and reduced bezel - who knows if we'll get it, but that would be fantastic.

And finally, almost every redesign comes with improved battery life, and so that will be nice. I can get about 6-7 hours at 50% brightness and light/med use - but I expect the refresh will see that number go up by at least a couple hours.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

I've been having a problem for a while that I don't know how to troubleshoot myself either where my computer refuses to shut down. Whether it's for an update or manual shutdown it hangs at the point where the power should be cutting itself. If it's an update it'll hang at the "Rebooting" part of the process after the files have been copied just before it reboots. And if it's a manual shutdown it'll hang when all apps have closed and all that's left is the desktop picture with half black fading over it.

Fortunately it doesn't break anything as I can force it to turn off with the power button and it'll boot up fine with that error message asking if I want to reopen everything. But it's annoying.

Try an SMC reset? It is supposed to be for power issues.

Thanks again for the advice. And yeah, suffice it to say she is not a computer person at all. I mean, for the longest time - a good 2 years I'd say - I've watched her "Adore Reader update" icon jump up and down in the dock, and she's never once thought that maybe she could click it and, you know, update Reader.

FWIW, I've been quitting the Acrobat Pro updater on my Mac Pro for over a year, I think. I only need it once a year to do one small change to a client's PDF or I would uninstall it entirely in favour of the built-in Preview which is what I use the rest of the year because it's better.

I didn't even dare create a new user account (as you suggested) today for fear that she might come back and be annoyed because the computer is stuck or something.

New user won't break it more. Really.

Anyway, something has to give... can you ask for time in-lieu to work on it in the evening?

 

[The Real Abed]

By the time I'll need to replace my 2013 15" rMBP (With dGPU) I will definitely have a dedicated gaming PC so I won't really care about having the top of the line MacBook anymore but I still think I'll get a 15" anyway because I'm so used to being able to run it at 1920x1200 HiDPI. I don't think I can go lower even if it is just 1680x1050 on a 13". Though I might just to have a lighter machine.

Narrower bezels would be nice but I'm happy with how thin they are now.

Since I'll have a gaming PC I won't need a dGPU anymore so I'll be able to go lower spec.

I don't even use the 500GB I have now, but could probably make use of 1TB though 2+TB would be a dream. Who knows how long it'll be before that is standard and cheap enough. Until then I can make do with my 500GB.

16GB RAM is plenty enough for me but I won't cry if 32GB was an option. But it'd probably cost a pretty penny.

I think the current Retina resolution is fine as it is now. We don't need true 4K and can put our efforts into making sure we have a GPU that can render a 4K picture instead since thats what I do now. My dGPU does it fine. And even when I use the Iris Pro card it still seems capable enough.

Try an SMC reset? It is supposed to be for power issues.

Let me give that a try.

 

[Skel1ingt0n]

I have a very capable gaming PC - a 4.5Ghz 3820 and an original Titan all under a custom water loop. I'll probably upgrade that when Pascal releases.

My thing is, I travel a lot - and so being able to play games on the road is a big deal to me. Nothing crazy. I don't need max settings. But I'd like to at least play games I'm playing at home - R6 Siege is a perfect example; it runs like dog shit on my 750M; but even the 960M in the 15" XPS is a massive improvement, making the game playable.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Skyake will come with 32GB RAM options, there's no doubt about that. NVMe will obviously come to the updates, and since the 15" has been on Haswell it'll see the biggest perf jump for any of Apple's notebooks in a while when it gets updated.

As for dGPUs, I imagine they'll stick around a bit longer, if only because for the people that want them, that's a big push to increasing the ASP of a Mac notebook higher. Sticking with AMD right now probably makes a lot of sense for Apple because AMD's compute is still much stronger than Nvidia, and they're likely getting a sweet deal for the chips. The downside is Nvidia has been much better recently at performance per watt. I'm hopeful that AMD closes up the gap with the new lineup, but that remains to be seen.

In terms of notebook upgrades, the wife is due for one. She's been trucking with the one-off 2008 unibody Macbook since it came out. The video cabling appears to be on its way out, as the screen has visual artifacts at most angles you can tilt the screen (but not all), the hinge has become obscenely loose, the screen has been cracked for the better part of four or five years since an encounter with rough baggage handlers, and the original battery is unsurprisingly not good for much more than an hour of life at this point. Hoping we get the Skylake refresh for the 13" line before this summer. Also hoping that she'll take better care of this one, but one must accept what comes...

 

[thescience]

Whenever I hear my time machine external drive start up I get the pinwheel/ internet freezes/ computer becomes unresponsive. I've ran diagnostics on the drive and it says it's OK. Anyone else have this issue? This is a month old 5k retina with 24gb of ram.

 

[japtor]

It's so clear that they just hate dedicated GPUs. First it got taken out of the 13" completely.

Technically it never really had a dedicated GPU. The Nvidia 9400M and 320M were considered IGPs as well, as part of their system chipset. It stopped being an option with the Core i series cause Intel didn't give NV a chipset license.

But there's this piece of me that really fears we're gonna get no GPU at all, or they're going to throw some crap AMD card in the unit.

The last rumors said mid year, so it could be Polaris at least, which might not be crap!

Oh, one other things that will make you scratch your head as a non-Apple person (or Apple-person, frankly): the super thin ribbon cable that provides the SATA connection to/from the disk can break in Macs that use 2.5" disks, which causes all manner of performance problems. Has happened to a few of us on Mac-GAF. I'm really grateful it happened to someone here prior to it happening to my SIL's MBP.

Yeah it's been mentioned on other forums too, kind of a mystery problem for lots of folks until someone figured out it was the cable in theirs. Word got around and a lot of people found it was the issue for them as well. If the drive itself isn't dying* (or it's happening with a new drive) but the system still seems to be exhibiting dying drive like behavior (and this one seems like it is), there's a decent chance it's the cable.

*Disk Utility isn't the best way to determine that, the file system could be in tact and the drive could be dying, but if the SMART status checks out it'll show as OK. SMART isn't terribly useful as a black and white good/bad thing, but some of the details (viewable in other apps) could show signs of trouble.

Whenever I hear my time machine external drive start up I get the pinwheel/ internet freezes/ computer becomes unresponsive. I've ran diagnostics on the drive and it says it's OK. Anyone else have this issue? This is a month old 5k retina with 24gb of ram.

OS X blows with waiting for drives to wake like that, it's been like that as long as I can remember. If you don't mind it spinning all the time there's a keepalive app or something that taps the drive periodically to prevent it from spinning down. Otherwise there is (was?) a sleep drive option in System Prefs I think, but I'm not sure that ever applied to external drives.

 

[Kilrogg]

Anyway, something has to give... can you ask for time in-lieu to work on it in the evening?

Hardly seems possible, but I agree with you. I think I'm gonna push the Apple Store route even harder than I already did. Btw she complained again this morning lol.

 

[thescience]

OS X blows with waiting for drives to wake like that, it's been like that as long as I can remember. If you don't mind it spinning all the time there's a keepalive app or something that taps the drive periodically to prevent it from spinning down. Otherwise there is (was?) a sleep drive option in System Prefs I think, but I'm not sure that ever applied to external drives.

This is terrible news. Should I just turn off time machine and back it up once a week instead? This annoys me to no end. I will also look for that keep alive app and see if that works.

 

[Swag]

Is it possible to create different Spaces in OSX with their own set of desktop icons, or is it always shared?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Is it possible to create different Spaces in OSX with their own set of desktop icons, or is it always shared?

The icons (the contents of the ~/Desktop folder) are shared.

 

[Deku Tree]

Vulnerabilities are patched as they're disclosed. Companies like Apple/Google/MS that don't fix security issues disclosed to them in a timely fashion tend to be called out on it.

Like this: http://www.macrumors.com/2016/02/09/sparkle-hijacking-vulnerability/

 

[Uno Venova]

I understand why the developer wants to charge for BetterTouchTool going forward, but it's such a dick move to make all existing versions unusable because now he wants money from everyone who's already downloaded his product.

 

[The Real Abed]

I understand why the developer wants to charge for BetterTouchTool going forward, but it's such a dick move to make all existing versions unusable because now he wants money from everyone who's already downloaded his product.

It's cheap. And if you own the iOS remote app you get it free. And if you really can't squeeze $5, just whine about it via email and he'll give you a damn license to keep you from pirating it. It's not a big deal. And he gave people plenty of time to prepare. $5 is nothing.

I didn't complain when Carbon Copy Cloner did the same thing even though I used to praise that app all the time here. I still do because it's the best there is. But it costs far more than BTT does.

 

[Swag]

The icons (the contents of the ~/Desktop folder) are shared.

Quite inconvenient to have the desktop icons always be shared, makes it harder to have spaces dedicated to different purposes.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Quite inconvenient to have the desktop icons always be shared, makes it harder to have spaces dedicated to different purposes.

Depends on what you use the desktop for— if you use it as super accessible temporary storage to bounce files off to share them between applications and those applications are on different spaces then they do need to be shared.

 

[Swag]

Depends on what you use the desktop for— if you use it as super accessible temporary storage to bounce files off to share them between applications and those applications are on different spaces then they do need to be shared.

I can understand it a bit better when you describe it in this way, I'll just re-arrange the way that I structure my folders in documents, thanks.

 

[The Lucky Moose]

Not sure where else to ask: my 2011 iMac gets really hot when playing videos games (and pretty hot when watching Netflix). It never crashed or turned itself off but it feels really disconcertingly hot to me. The fans work I think (I can feel some air coming out, but I don't really hear anything). I brought it in last year for that same reason and they replaced a sensor, but that did not change much as far as I can tell. Should I be worried? Or is there nothing to worry about?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Use smcFanControl to up the minimum fan speed. Crank it all the way up and you should hear the fan(s) and feel air moving. Can get a Mac Mini to play a harmonica with its max airflow.

 

[The Lucky Moose]

That can't be the solution right? If the fans work they should manage to cool the thing down without me having to tinker with them

 

[Vashetti]

Not sure where else to ask: my 2011 iMac gets really hot when playing videos games (and pretty hot when watching Netflix). It never crashed or turned itself off but it feels really disconcertingly hot to me. The fans work I think (I can feel some air coming out, but I don't really hear anything). I brought it in last year for that same reason and they replaced a sensor, but that did not change much as far as I can tell. Should I be worried? Or is there nothing to worry about?

Are you watching Netflix in Safari?

Because if not, Apple has boasted of Safari being specially optimised for Netflix on OS X. I never hear my fans whilst browsing or using Netflix whilst in Safari.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

That can't be the solution right? If the fans work they should manage to cool the thing down without me having to tinker with them

Sorry, my first reply had said that Apple favours quietness over coolness; not sure why I deleted that when making my reply. SmcFanControl exists because owners of Macs sometimes have different priorities or concerns.

Ramp it up and blow the dust out and be satisfied it can cool itself down if it reallllly wants to. And then you can decide if you would prefer a higher minimum fan speed than Apple picked. Note: you cannot set a lower minimum, so hard to shoot yourself in the foot.

 

[The Lucky Moose]

Oh okay, thanks. One more question: does this whole "it turns itself off before damage is done" thing also work for the GPU?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Yes, in that the GPU will shut off and the screen will go dark, but the Mac will otherwise appear to be on.

E.g. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qXso8KFG78M

 

[Deku Tree]

Yes, in that the GPU will shut off and the screen will go dark, but the Mac will otherwise appear to be on.

E.g. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qXso8KFG78M

My new iMac has had a problem where while I was shutting it off instead the screen would go blank and the computer would appear on otherwise and it required a restart to start working again. Has only happene twice since I've had the machine.

 

[The Lucky Moose]

Yes, in that the GPU will shut off and the screen will go dark, but the Mac will otherwise appear to be on.

E.g. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qXso8KFG78M

Can the GPU break is basically what I want to know, or will it do that before it breaks?

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Can the GPU break is basically what I want to know, or will it do that before it breaks?

I think the thermal shutdown will save it; you may want to search for "[your mac model] gpu failure" and see what you find. There were defective GPUs in some MacBook Pros that failed quite spectacularly and permanently due to heat— there was an extended repair programme for them. I do not recall reading about any such thing for iMacs.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Generally a black screen isn't how you'll know about a GPU failure, though—you'll get distortions or inconsistent performance before it goes.

 

[The Lucky Moose]

Thanks for all the help. So really I should not be worried about the heat if the iMac has never shut itself down or went black? It's all in my head?

 

[Fuchsdh]

Thanks for all the help. So really I should not be worried about the heat if the iMac has never shut itself down or went black? It's all in my head?

Hey definitely get hot, but the jury is out on whether or not it'll have an appreciable difference on the life of the machine. Worst-case scenario it does, and a few years down the line Apple offers a replacement program that might address the issue.

On a quasi-related note, I found Barefeats latest series of tests, "What's the Best Gaming Mac in January 2016?" pretty interesting. The iMacs perform quite well against the Mac Pros and quite well in general, as long as the game in question is leaning on the CPU more than the GPU.

It does make me think that for my needs, my next Mac purchase (which I'm trying to put off until 2018 or so) is going to be an agonizing one. I don't want a giant iMac, but they're far and away the best bang for your buck; you spend a little less and get a lot less with the 21" iMac and Mac mini, and you spend a lot more and get a little more with the Mac Pro. Maybe Adobe will finally get its act together and make a high-core Mac Pro much more useful, but I'm not sure if it would ever be $1000–2000 more useful.

Also makes me think about those hardcore old Mac Pro guys desperately hanging on and upgrading with m2 PCIe flash and big new graphics cards. You're still sinking more money into these old towers (or even a new tube) for less than you'd get for the price of a mid-to-top tier iMac, and you don't get a good 5K screen in the process.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

Also makes me think about those hardcore old Mac Pro guys desperately hanging on and upgrading with m2 PCIe flash and big new graphics cards. You're still sinking more money into these old towers (or even a new tube) for less than you'd get for the price of a mid-to-top tier iMac, and you don't get a good 5K screen in the process.

Oi!

Used Mac Pros plus upgrades are a lot cheaper than an iMac 5K especially if you have a screen you like— my 27" isn't retina, but it's still nice and has years of life left.

Additionally, for me to upgrade from my old Mac Pro to an iMac means I have to get a NAS or DAS box for the TBs of storage I have in my Mac Pro. Easily adds 20% or more to the cost of an iMac to achieve the disk speed and capacity I have now even if I keep all of my existing disks.

2008 Mac Pro with oodles of RAM, PC video cards and SSDs on PCI-E cards is plenty fast for what I need and I have two more Mac Pro tower revs to pick from if I want a CPU boost while keeping my other bits.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Oi!

Used Mac Pros plus upgrades are a lot cheaper than an iMac 5K especially if you have a screen you like— my 27" isn't retina, but it's still nice and has years of life left.

Additionally, for me to upgrade from my old Mac Pro to an iMac means I have to get a NAS or DAS box for the TBs of storage I have in my Mac Pro. Easily adds 20% or more to the cost of an iMac to achieve the disk speed and capacity I have now even if I keep all of my existing disks.

2008 Mac Pro with oodles of RAM, PC video cards and SSDs on PCI-E cards is plenty fast for what I need and I have two more Mac Pro tower revs to pick from if I want a CPU boost while keeping my other bits.

And if you're doing fine with a 2008 Mac Pro, then it's not an issue. But if you're doing most pro work you're going to want more horsepower, and when it comes to keeping a 5,1 or older Mac and upgrading it, you're going to be paying a premium for performance and displays over an iMac, and you're going to have to kludge a lot more. USB3 still gives me issues, Thunderbolt is non-existent, BT4 can cause issues with USB3 cards, mSATA flash storage can be finicky if you want to boot from it, and you've only got four slots to fit all this stuff in.

I got a 3,1 Mac Pro because I was waiting on Apple to come out with new ones, and I wanted a desktop after college. I ended up migrating to a 5,1 and upgrading the processor, and since I could swap in my hard drives and graphics card it was a cheap upgrade. But a Xeon from 2011 is easily outclassed in most metrics by far cheaper i7s, and it seems like it's throwing bad money after good at this point to throw hundreds or thousands to refit an old Pro. Sadly Apple chose to go with the more specialized tube model so it's not a real option to transfer kit the same way you or I have, but at this point it's unlikely to change so there's no point dwelling on it.

 

[CrudeDiatribe]

mSATA flash storage can be finicky if you want to boot from it, and you've only got four slots to fit all this stuff in.

FWIW I'm using Apricon cards with 2.5" SSDs and they boot just fine, so there are SATA PCI-E chipsets that are Mac compatible.

it seems like it's throwing bad money after good at this point to throw hundreds or thousands to refit an old Pro.

I certainly wouldn't buy this set up from scratch again— it's the culmination of a dozen years of upgrades since I bought a Power Mac G5 DP1.8 at the beginning of 2004 (after university).

I don't know where this tower path ends, and I'm not looking forward to it— I'm less irritated by it than Apple getting rid of Aperture. I can solve this by throwing money at it, but eventually I have to find photography workflow software I don't hate and things are not looking good.

 

[Fuchsdh]

FWIW I'm using Apricon cards with 2.5" SSDs and they boot just fine, so there are SATA PCI-E chipsets that are Mac compatible.



I certainly wouldn't buy this set up from scratch again— it's the culmination of a dozen years of upgrades since I bought a Power Mac G5 DP1.8 at the beginning of 2004 (after university).

I don't know where this tower path ends, and I'm not looking forward to it— I'm less irritated by it than Apple getting rid of Aperture. I can solve this by throwing money at it, but eventually I have to find photography workflow software I don't hate and things are not looking good.

Seems like your options are Lightroom, Photoshop, or hoping that Photo extensions take off.

(I have seen some really good pro-level extensions out there, and I'm actually doing design work for some of them right now. But I dunno if there are other issues aside from editing controls that pros need.)