Well, it's basically what any mac user (or ad, lol) would say about it. I think that what you really pay for is the sleek design (subjective of course, and this is not the status symbol thing many people always go mumbling about, same as you don't really have to be showing off when you wear something you like), made with quality materials not easily found on other companies' laptops or all-in-one computers, designed around an OS that works wonderfully in its ecosystem (will get even better with Continuity). The hasslefree-ness is another major selling point for most people. If we're talking MBP, also the Retina display and the quality trackpad add to the value.
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Mac vs PC - 2014
- Thread starter BumRush
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Well, it's basically what any mac user (or ad, lol) would say about it. I think that what you really pay for is the sleek design (subjective of course, and this is not the status symbol thing many people always go mumbling about, same as you don't really have to be showing off when you wear something you like), made with quality materials not easily found on other companies' laptops or all-in-one computers, designed around an OS that works wonderfully in its ecosystem (will get even better with Continuity). The hasslefree-ness is another major selling point for most people. If we're talking MBP, also the Retina display and the quality trackpad add to the value.
kurisu_1974
Member
One thing PC users can do, that Mac users can't:
j/k carry on.
shut up about it
j/k carry on.
NekoFever
Member
kurisu_1974
Member
(sorry accidental post)
Vigilant Walrus
Member
OPs focus is only light gaming but if anyone is looking for a laptop for PC similar to Macbook Pro, then the Razer Blade 14 is a no brainer. It's gotten stellar reviews in all categories, except for the battery life. If you can live with 3-4-ish hours and want gaming on PC, it's simply a marvel.
The biggest problem is that Razer can't meet demand on that thing.
The Zenbook's and certain Samsung Ativ 9 Plus are also amazingly well build laptops. They are up there in build quality, battery life, mobility, ergonomics, quality of inputs (sound design, trackpad, keyboard, screen), but milage differs when it comes to performance.
The biggest problem is that Razer can't meet demand on that thing.
The Zenbook's and certain Samsung Ativ 9 Plus are also amazingly well build laptops. They are up there in build quality, battery life, mobility, ergonomics, quality of inputs (sound design, trackpad, keyboard, screen), but milage differs when it comes to performance.
I watched yesterday...very cool!
Coreda
Member
I agree, and always recommended such practices, but it takes forever for average people to 'get' it, and also see the value in such software.
I've recommended Macs to a few friends and relatives for safety and ease of use and received numerous thanks over the years (still running like the day they bought them). Regardless of what some people think OSX is a brilliant OS, and the hardware is solid, too.
For geeks though a PC is the better bang for your buck.
Oppo
Member
what's so confusing? one computer does two jobs. your solution is to buy another computer and use 2 to do 2 jobs. that's confusing to me.
I just went on HP's site to BTO a Z820 and at worst it's roughly $200-300 cheaper to make a configuration like the Mac Pro (speccing the HP with firePros equivalent to the custom ones in the Pro.)
For that money you get faster storage a much smaller form factor and an incredibly quiet cool and power-efficient workstation.
People need to realize that unless you're building your own rig Macs are actually not any more or much more expensive than comparable PCs. What you are losing out on with a Mac is some flexibility--hence if you want more options, yeah, get a PC.
CrudeDiatribe
Member
It doesn't work as well. I, a Mac user of 20+ years, am less productive using Windows if I try to use it like a Mac than if I use it in the way it seems to be designed.
I don't want to see everything at once, though. If I were more regimented in making new virtual desktops based on task this would be less of a problem.
"This piece of shit is just as brown as that slice of chocolate cake and costs far less, you should buy it if you know your way around a fork."
at least it wasn't a car analogy
So I figured for some actual numbers:
BTO a Mac Pro off Apple's site, a 6-core 3.5GHz Xeon with 32GB of RAM, dual D500 GPUs, a 512GB PCIe SSD and AppleCare (to match HP's built in 3 year warranty) comes to $4948.
BTO a 620 on HP's site, and doing the same specs with a pair of W7000s takes you to $6609. Sadly HP doesn't offer the precise equivalent to Apple's cards, but finelet's just knock it down to a pair of FirePro V3900s1GB each compared to the 3GB D500s. You're still paying $5019.
(I tried configuring a Dell Precision but they don't have the same 6-core E5 Xeon I used in the comparison above. Using a 2.6 6C and a 3.5 8C I got between $4200 and $5300 using dual W5000s, which are still worse than the D500s.)
So there's lots of rebuttals to thisyou have more than (currently) three graphics cards options on the PC, you have more slots for more RAM down the line, as well as more HDDs. And all of those are a valid, and I can see use cases where that sort of internal expansion is essential. On the other hand you're getting faster storage, quieter, more power-efficient and space-saving design with a Mac that will hold its resale value tremendously (I recently sold my 2008 Mac Pro for $1000, and my 2008 Macbook Pro for $500, complete with a nonfunctioning optical drive.) But to argue that Macs aren't competitively priced, especially from a workstation standpoint, is deeply misinformed.
BTO a Mac Pro off Apple's site, a 6-core 3.5GHz Xeon with 32GB of RAM, dual D500 GPUs, a 512GB PCIe SSD and AppleCare (to match HP's built in 3 year warranty) comes to $4948.
BTO a 620 on HP's site, and doing the same specs with a pair of W7000s takes you to $6609. Sadly HP doesn't offer the precise equivalent to Apple's cards, but finelet's just knock it down to a pair of FirePro V3900s1GB each compared to the 3GB D500s. You're still paying $5019.
(I tried configuring a Dell Precision but they don't have the same 6-core E5 Xeon I used in the comparison above. Using a 2.6 6C and a 3.5 8C I got between $4200 and $5300 using dual W5000s, which are still worse than the D500s.)
So there's lots of rebuttals to thisyou have more than (currently) three graphics cards options on the PC, you have more slots for more RAM down the line, as well as more HDDs. And all of those are a valid, and I can see use cases where that sort of internal expansion is essential. On the other hand you're getting faster storage, quieter, more power-efficient and space-saving design with a Mac that will hold its resale value tremendously (I recently sold my 2008 Mac Pro for $1000, and my 2008 Macbook Pro for $500, complete with a nonfunctioning optical drive.) But to argue that Macs aren't competitively priced, especially from a workstation standpoint, is deeply misinformed.
n64coder
Member
Can someone comment on what makes the Apple trackpad so good?
I'm thinking of replacing my laptop in the next year with a different one because of my frustrations with the trackpad. The track pad works fine for the most part except when I'm typing. I keep getting errant mouse moves/insertions/deletions because the trackpad (Sony Vaio S, 15.5") is centered on the laptop but not centered with respect to the home row position (due to the number pad). So my right hand gets a lot of palm presses unless I arch my hand up. Very annoying.
I'm thinking of replacing my laptop in the next year with a different one because of my frustrations with the trackpad. The track pad works fine for the most part except when I'm typing. I keep getting errant mouse moves/insertions/deletions because the trackpad (Sony Vaio S, 15.5") is centered on the laptop but not centered with respect to the home row position (due to the number pad). So my right hand gets a lot of palm presses unless I arch my hand up. Very annoying.
Sapiens
Member
It's the only laptop trackpad I've ever used that actually feels truly integrated into the way the OS works. It also actually feels nice to the touch; not rough as your finger glides across it.
Personally, the trackpad is the main selling point for me when it comes to laptops.
http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#iMac
http://www.macrumors.com/2014/06/11/updated-imacs-faster-processors-next-week/
Re your update in the OP. The iMac could possibly be updated next week with faster processors.
Auto-Reply
Member
Mac, solely based on that one premise!
Deku, knowing there are rumors about a new iMac being announced at their yearly event, would you hold off?
Coreda
Member
iunderstoodthatreference.overusedgif
I prefer Ctrl (as CapsLock) + Command + S for Spotlight, since I use the other hotkey for global play/pause. It becomes a satisfying finger position.
Personally, if the iMac gets updated next week I would buy it right away. If it doesn't get updated next week, I would wait until the fall update whatever it may be. But that's just me. Apple is always going to be coming out with the next update around the corner. And rumors don't always come to fruition.
tell that to the pc gamer patrol...
Thank you! I'd rather get something newer sooner than fall given the fact that I'm currently using a 4 year old computer at home.
victreeb3l
Member
Buy a 15" Retina Macbook Pro. Best laptop in the world.
Yeah, sounds like you're looking for a Mac. As with many things in life, you get what you pay for. Macs are a little pricier but you get value for that. Better build, longevity, customer service. Less time spent troubleshooting and maintaining.
I prefer Mac to Windows for just about everything outside of gaming and MS-exclusive development like .Net. And even gaming is a lot brighter on Mac these days than it used to be. Bioshock Infinite, CoD, etc, are on it. You can't guarantee all the AAA major releases, but you get a good chunk more than you used to.
Yeah, PC laptops for me usually don't make it too far passed the 3-4 year mark, but in my experience Macs go twice that at least. And even when I've upgraded Macs, it's because I want to get into the newer features I've been missing out on, rather than because it simply died. My wife still uses her 2007 white macbook and it runs like it did when she first got it.
I prefer Mac to Windows for just about everything outside of gaming and MS-exclusive development like .Net. And even gaming is a lot brighter on Mac these days than it used to be. Bioshock Infinite, CoD, etc, are on it. You can't guarantee all the AAA major releases, but you get a good chunk more than you used to.
Yeah, PC laptops for me usually don't make it too far passed the 3-4 year mark, but in my experience Macs go twice that at least. And even when I've upgraded Macs, it's because I want to get into the newer features I've been missing out on, rather than because it simply died. My wife still uses her 2007 white macbook and it runs like it did when she first got it.
I'm leaning towards a desktop right now since I have a work laptop and an ipad that I pretty much bring everywhere.
Wiktor
Member
You get what you pay for. If you buy cheap PC laptop then yea, it will last 3-4 yaears. Buy premium Thinkpad and it can last forever. I still got functional T42 that works like charm and that's like 11 years old piece of hardware. But then, those do cost a lot more than typical laptops, same as Macbooks.
Chance Hale
Member
Of course building your own rig is where you save the money, companies like Alienware are just as bad. The difference with pcs as compared to macs is you don't have to go through them.
Most people are talking about the Macbook Pro/imac don't think there was much discussion about the Pro. Although its still overpriced
Of course building your own rig is where you save the money, companies like Alienware are just as bad. The difference with pcs as compared to macs is you don't have to go through them.
Most people are talking about the Macbook Pro/imac don't think there was much discussion about the Pro. Although its still overpriced
See my post above. You're just wrong.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Buying every part on its own and putting it together yourself is cheaper than buying it pre-assembled by the premium computer maker? I've learned a lot today.
Chance Hale
Member
20 minutes of work and saving hundreds if not over a thousand dollars is usually worth it. About as complicated as Legos.
Buying the individual parts is still much cheaper according to the andtech review but people usually have contracts that require them to deal with either Dell, HP, or Apple no? But yes, the Mac Pro seems to be comparatively priced compared to other pre-built workstations, and honestly the form factor is pretty neat with no real comparison on that front. Most of the conversation in the thread was about the macbook pro/imac though.
Pre-built anything is terribly overpriced, it's just with apple that's your only option.
It's your only officially supported option. Myself and several others have posted in this thread about building your own Mac.
Chance Hale
Member
Older Mac Pros right whereas the new one no longer has that option? One imagines they will continue along that line.
I built my desktop so I'm curious how you selected the best compatible parts for the price and then assembled the whole thing in 20 minute.
Both took quite a bit longer for me.
My 3 year old Macbook Air runs both of them fine on OSX with medium settings. Anything newer should do an even better job.
Chance Hale
Member
Obviously I took longer than 20 minutes to research parts, but the actual act of building a computer really doesn't take that long. I didn't time it but I was definitely up and running in less than an hour. Would take less time for those who are using an old hard drive and already have an OS installed. Now for the people who care about cable management I'm sure tucking cables behind your motherboard takes longer but I don't really care.
And at this point I just slot new parts in as I upgrade which takes 5 minutes or less.
Airflow and easier maintenance got me to work on cable management. I'm all for building a PC but I've had disaster in the past where I sold someone on how easy it was to do. He ended up driving 2 hours to my town so we could fix all the issues he encountered.
Driver issues, getting the hard disc to boot, graphics cards that don't fit, all kind of things can happen. It's fun to work though those but its not exactly a cakewalk. My favorite error when building a machine was "Keyboard not found, press F2 to continue."
Chance Hale
Member
I've never had issues but I've always made sure to get the right motherboard so things like incompatible graphics cards aren't an issue
Have never bought a dead drive either, but such things are luck of the draw. Then again my dad helped me build my first PC when I was 8 so I had someone who knew what they were doing to get the basics down. People without experience would need to read more before doing so. Just don't think it's very complicated.In any case, didn't originally mean to start such a big PC vs Mac debate but it was my fault for doing as such. Hope the OP enjoys his imac!
Definitely agree about 1. But do those last two really count as 'common sense' for your average casual user?
God no, don't be cheap when buying a computer. That is some of the worst advice in a while.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
I laughed when I read those, like a kid sister just knows as soon as she's old enough to go to school.
I don't even know what "use sandboxie on executable files" is, but I can guess by the words in it. I can't imagine the horror of trying to explain NoScript whitelisting to my parents.
Druz
Member
Macs are getting the same kind of malware that PCs are nowadays, just not as much but that's quickly changing.
But if cost isn't an issue, then you want to buy the platform with better build quality. Which at least in the laptop world, is a Mac. Just don't think you're going to be upgrading after the fact.
You're essentially asking, which is the better built shell.
I'd never buy a desktop mac though, fuck that!
But if cost isn't an issue, then you want to buy the platform with better build quality. Which at least in the laptop world, is a Mac. Just don't think you're going to be upgrading after the fact.
You're essentially asking, which is the better built shell.
I'd never buy a desktop mac though, fuck that!
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
[citation needed]
Um. No. They aren't. OS X prevents installation of apps that are not directly from the Mac App Store or from identified developers by default. That makes it pretty tough to infect a Mac with malware.
I've never had any malware issues on PCs.
Been using multiple PCs daily for over 20 years.
I don't do anything all that special either.
1) Don't use IE
2) Don't surf piracy sites, keep to big named porn sites, don't do any pirating of any kind either..
3) Never click on pop-ups
I generally don't even have anti-virus software enabled either. I just do regular scans.. never had anything but ad cookies removed other than the occasional false positive on something like an ISO loader.
I know it's party luck that I haven't had an issue.. but really it's also just intuition. My ex-wife really wanted to watch True Blood once.. and I told her not to google around for it, and ordered it the Blu-Ray instead... she's then complaining of malware on our laptop.. checked her internet history, and she'd gone to one of those ghetto TV streaming sites. Such an "I told you so" moment.
Been using multiple PCs daily for over 20 years.
I don't do anything all that special either.
1) Don't use IE
2) Don't surf piracy sites, keep to big named porn sites, don't do any pirating of any kind either..
3) Never click on pop-ups
I generally don't even have anti-virus software enabled either. I just do regular scans.. never had anything but ad cookies removed other than the occasional false positive on something like an ISO loader.
I know it's party luck that I haven't had an issue.. but really it's also just intuition. My ex-wife really wanted to watch True Blood once.. and I told her not to google around for it, and ordered it the Blu-Ray instead... she's then complaining of malware on our laptop.. checked her internet history, and she'd gone to one of those ghetto TV streaming sites. Such an "I told you so" moment.
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