SmackDaddy
Member
Yay, Peggy's in love!
What a good ending. I'm sorry to see Mad Men go, but it was time.
What a good ending. I'm sorry to see Mad Men go, but it was time.
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Mad Men - Season 7, Part 2 - The End of an Era - AMC Sundays
- Thread starter Cornballer
- Start date
Apologies if this has been posted https://twitter.com/McCann_WW
- Real-life McCann Erickson confirmed Don made the ad
- Jon Hamm confirmed it too
I think that's what threw people off. Like me, they expected an ambiguous ending but MW gave us a curveball by doing the complete opposite. A definitive ending. I think after the smoke settles, people are going to like the ending more.
- Real-life McCann Erickson confirmed Don made the ad
- Jon Hamm confirmed it too
I think that's what threw people off. Like me, they expected an ambiguous ending but MW gave us a curveball by doing the complete opposite. A definitive ending. I think after the smoke settles, people are going to like the ending more.
I've made peace with the fact that Don sucks a long time ago. I wanted him to pay in some way. But he'll just repeat the same cycle over and over, coming up with great ads while lacking self-awareness (to be clear, he knows his life sucks - he just doesn't know WHY. He is unable to admit his mistakes)
I like this. Don became at peace with who he was, an ad man and that's great. Having all of the characters have some sort of closure was a great way to end the show.
I agree entirely. It really bothered me that these two didn't go into business together. It would have been perfect for them.
I always felt she was destined to be great in advertising, not the Roger to Joan's Bert in a new company.
Yeah, she wants to be a new Don. And she wants to succeed in a company that didn't really want her.
Loved the finale, I was worried something massively dramatic and therefore completely out of character was going to happen but it was perfectly true to the show and at the same time had some great pay offs.
Peggys side of the I love you conversation was just plain hilarious, such a great ending for her.
I definitely thought the Coke ad was Dons work, to me it said what Mad Men has been saying all along, as much as the world around is changing, people never do.
Peggys side of the I love you conversation was just plain hilarious, such a great ending for her.
I definitely thought the Coke ad was Dons work, to me it said what Mad Men has been saying all along, as much as the world around is changing, people never do.
The ending also worked well as a commentary on US society.
In 1967, there was a 'Death of Hippie' march mourning the commercialization of the counterculture. The Coke ad might be seen as the epitome of that process.
EDIT: And, of course, this makes Don's coming up with the ad at a hippie camp even more cynical.
In 1967, there was a 'Death of Hippie' march mourning the commercialization of the counterculture. The Coke ad might be seen as the epitome of that process.
EDIT: And, of course, this makes Don's coming up with the ad at a hippie camp even more cynical.
I'm not sure I get people who are saying the ending isn't ambiguous. It's ambiguous. There's more than one way that it can be taken despite what those involved may believe or say, we're not really shown anything clearly definitive. It may not be on the same level of ambiguity as say, The Sopranos or The Prisoner, but still, there's a degree where what we're shown is left up to interpretation.
Red Liquorice
Member
She was just the vessel that brought him to the commune, her character's not worth spending any thought on imo.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Yeah, especially after I read Seitz. I personally don't think it's ambiguous as to whether or not Don made the ad, but it IS ambiguous as to whether or not it was a deeply cynical act.
I agree with Seitz all the way. If you look at Don's work, how focused on the individual it was, men walking into the ocean, suitcases towering over their rivals, etc, this ad is a true sea change.
Taking the wholly cynical approach implies that like David Foster Wallace never grew as a person because he kept being a writer. Or that every other person ever never grew because they kept the same career.
I've said this a few times here but the Ad Game wasn't killing Don, it was his constant terror at being "found out", whatever that meant to him on any particular day. Now he's at peace with that.
People are just trying their best.
God I've watched that Leonard scene ten times already. Did the same thing Jesse's scene in Problem Dog. Just such an incredible scene. Gah.
Whether the coke ad was cynical or not depends on your viewpoint on Ad Men. The ending was brilliant because it provided closure while being true to the character. Don may think he found enlightenment but really all that happened was him coming to terms with being an Ad Man (Don Draper). Don much like Roger did not "change", not for lack of trying.
Really? You don't think her being the last link to Dick Whitmen had any significance? Don tells her to "forget her past, that it will get easier" but then is called out for it. It's not true. Running away doesn't make dealing with pain easier.
My take: she left suddenly because she realized she needed to be with her daughter. the therapy and Don's poor advice just pushed her to that conclusion
And continuing with the theme of being completely stripped away. When she leaves him, he feels that she was basically the last link he had left. It's at that point when the transformation to the "new you" begins...which is him finally coming to grips with who he's always been.
I didn't have many preconceptions about the finale before it aired. I was happy with the two previous episodes and could have cut the cord with Peggy walking into McCann or Don on the bench. Those were satisfying conclusions, everyone had an ending or at least were put on a good path.
This episode felt like a "And then what happened?" too far. And actually killed everything we came to love about the characters. Starting with Don. We loved him because he was a troubled creative genius, his demons mad him an interesting character. The drinking, the adultery, his inner battles were what we were tuning in for every week. Weiner straight up murdered that character. Don is now happy and content... and he now a McCann suit. He is back in the room with the same guys from the Miller Beer pitch, turning his research document in time. When it comes to the Coca Cola meeting he is right there ready to exploit the way he found peace and harmony. He is more cynical and clinical than ever. He becomes what everyone hates in advertising and marketing. I wouldn't watcha show starring that Don Draper.
Peggy is next for the chop. Always striving to do better, show more ambition and take the lead. She tells Don that she wants her name on the door but when Joan offers her just that she refuses. Instead she stops looking forward. She never thought of Stan like before because she always looked beyond what was right in front of her. Now she is content to be at McCann, content with Stan Rizzo. It is an ending but it makes her incredibly dull.
Pete I suppose was never interesting on his own but always as part of a conflict. He is resolved by getting everything he ever wanted. Although he pretty much had that at McCann.
Roger is retired or as near as it makes no difference. Writing his will, marrying Marie. It is all very last act for him too. I suppose like Pete it was ending that way regardless of the finale.
They even straight up ruined Ken. Ken struggles to find a writer. Isn't that your passion Ken? Maybe he thinks he is too high brow for the folks at Dow but he excised himself from SCDP to be a cog in a bigger company.
Joan is the only person who got an exciting ending with steps into the unknown and trying to better herself. They even white knighted her further by having Roger ensure Kevin was financially secure so we didn't think she was being reckless setting up her own production company.
The Sally scenes were the most heartfelt and the best parts of the finale. However I wish they hadn't bothered with the episode. They had set it up so that the characters had found themselves in interesting situations where they could do anything and resolved it in the last episode by the characters all doing the most boring, least ambitious thing possible. (Except Joan, because reasons)
This episode felt like a "And then what happened?" too far. And actually killed everything we came to love about the characters. Starting with Don. We loved him because he was a troubled creative genius, his demons mad him an interesting character. The drinking, the adultery, his inner battles were what we were tuning in for every week. Weiner straight up murdered that character. Don is now happy and content... and he now a McCann suit. He is back in the room with the same guys from the Miller Beer pitch, turning his research document in time. When it comes to the Coca Cola meeting he is right there ready to exploit the way he found peace and harmony. He is more cynical and clinical than ever. He becomes what everyone hates in advertising and marketing. I wouldn't watcha show starring that Don Draper.
Peggy is next for the chop. Always striving to do better, show more ambition and take the lead. She tells Don that she wants her name on the door but when Joan offers her just that she refuses. Instead she stops looking forward. She never thought of Stan like before because she always looked beyond what was right in front of her. Now she is content to be at McCann, content with Stan Rizzo. It is an ending but it makes her incredibly dull.
Pete I suppose was never interesting on his own but always as part of a conflict. He is resolved by getting everything he ever wanted. Although he pretty much had that at McCann.
Roger is retired or as near as it makes no difference. Writing his will, marrying Marie. It is all very last act for him too. I suppose like Pete it was ending that way regardless of the finale.
They even straight up ruined Ken. Ken struggles to find a writer. Isn't that your passion Ken? Maybe he thinks he is too high brow for the folks at Dow but he excised himself from SCDP to be a cog in a bigger company.
Joan is the only person who got an exciting ending with steps into the unknown and trying to better herself. They even white knighted her further by having Roger ensure Kevin was financially secure so we didn't think she was being reckless setting up her own production company.
The Sally scenes were the most heartfelt and the best parts of the finale. However I wish they hadn't bothered with the episode. They had set it up so that the characters had found themselves in interesting situations where they could do anything and resolved it in the last episode by the characters all doing the most boring, least ambitious thing possible. (Except Joan, because reasons)
I disagree with most of this, but I think your interpretation of Petes ending is probably the farthest from the truth. Pete's character arch was discovering the need for a family life. That a career life was not fulfilling enough. He realized that in his search for always looking for "the next best thing", he'd lost the best thing and most meaningful thing in his life. He was able to "start over" much like most of the characters in the finale. They all are celebrating new beginnings. I'd detail each one out to you, but I don't want to insult your intelligence.
MikeHaggar
Member
or maybe he came to terms with being himself. which is enlightenment. my take on it is that he made that ad (that much is obvious), but he also found some peace and wisdom. and once he felt content he went back to doing what he does best.
there may be some cynicism intended, but i think if anything it's directed more at the advertising industry as a whole and not don as a person. his smile at the end is genuine and i absolutely think it represents a sense of enlightment versus "i've got a great idea for an ad."
don learned something and grew. he'll make more mistakes--we all do. but he didn't go right back to being who he was before.
Well... some might argue that that's the purpose of ending a show--because the characters have completed their changes from the conflicted people in turbulent times that they were during the story into more resolved people that no longer need a show. For every person that complains about "too much closure" there'd be 100 with torches if their characters didn't get endings.
Moff
Member
fantastic ending for a fantastic show
many probably thought he would go back to being dick at the end, leave all that advertisement behind him, or even kill himself because he wasted himself. but that final shot was pure gold, embracing don draper, and then the coke ad. incredibly well done. and I was really glad to see all the small happy ends.
many probably thought he would go back to being dick at the end, leave all that advertisement behind him, or even kill himself because he wasted himself. but that final shot was pure gold, embracing don draper, and then the coke ad. incredibly well done. and I was really glad to see all the small happy ends.
youbastards
Member
From S01E08 "The Hobo Code"
"Life is like a horseshoe, fat in the middle, open on both ends, and hard all the way through."
another 'horseshoe' in S07E14 "Person to Person":
"Life is like a horseshoe, fat in the middle, open on both ends, and hard all the way through."
another 'horseshoe' in S07E14 "Person to Person":
AlphaSnake
...and that, kids, was the first time I sucked a dick for crack
That's not a horseshoe ^^^
Also, after all of this...does anyone else get the sense that Don's struggle towards the end became a struggle of fear and successfully working on the biggest account the world could've possibly given him?
Was he just scared of failure at work this whole time?
Also, after all of this...does anyone else get the sense that Don's struggle towards the end became a struggle of fear and successfully working on the biggest account the world could've possibly given him?
Was he just scared of failure at work this whole time?
World SkiFree
Member
I agree and loved it being present in the show. I thought it just ate up way too much runtime.
She did take care of his request to translate the speech into Pig Latin. Yes, never a wasted moment from Roger.
I liked the ending but I am taking the totally cynical view. Don has another existential crisis within a year. Don's kids still don't have a father. Pete gets bored with his life and has a girlfriend in every city. Joan is still not taken serious and has to fight harassment at every turn. Peggy and Stan don't last as lovers, so she continues to fight toward the top without friends, family, or companions.
Roger and Marie do last though.
Roger and Marie do last though.
LQX
Member
Good ending. Don found himself through hippyism. And if it was not obvious to you that it was Don that came up with that Pepsi ad then you have been watching the wrong show all these seasons.
Also, while I was watching I looked over at the clock and I was thinking that is not nearly enough time for them to tie things up but I'm glad that somethings had a nice resolution while others were left for interpretation. I did need to see Betty on her last breath in a hospital bed.
Also, while I was watching I looked over at the clock and I was thinking that is not nearly enough time for them to tie things up but I'm glad that somethings had a nice resolution while others were left for interpretation. I did need to see Betty on her last breath in a hospital bed.
lybertyboy
Thinks the Evil Empire is just misunderstood.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
So Don got saved by Supergirl.
I thought they had done the groundwork for ending the show with the closure and dismantling of the SC&P office. With Pete, Joan, effectively Roger and presumably Don (as he sat at the bus stop) no longer working in advertising that was enough reason for the show to be over.
It was a very TV finale with every character getting a spot and a bit more tacked on even if it wasn't needed. Pete and Trudy stepping onto a jet added nothing. In fact I could have done without everything apart from the Don, Peggy and Sally scenes.
This was an episode no one needed.
chris121580
Member
She'll always be Billie Jean to me
LQX
Member
Pepsi? Speaking of watching the wrong show...
Ha, same thing.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
That's how I felt. I thought it would fade to black at the meditation and I thought hmmm that's ok I guess. But the coke commercial and everything it implies and whatnot took it to a whole other level.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Likewise.
Being a kid when that aired all the time, I recognized it immediately.
I didn't get that he wrote it at first.
Is there any good post-mortem videos or podcasts I can listen.
I don't want this to be over just yet
I started re-watching the series on Netflix
I started re-watching the series on Netflix
My partner saw The Suitcase last night. And called me afterwards to talk about the show.
Ugh, EMOTIONS
ZackieChan
Member
Huh. Really surprised at all the praise. As a casual viewer of Mad Men over all 7 seasons, I thought that was a pretty awful finale. Maybe I need to watch again or something. Did absolutely nothing for me.
Don's story and Peggy/Stan were particularly terrible.
Don's story and Peggy/Stan were particularly terrible.
Huh. Really surprised at all the praise. As a casual viewer of Mad Men over all 7 seasons, I thought that was a pretty awful finale. Maybe I need to watch again or something. Did absolutely nothing for me.
Don's story and Peggy/Stan were particularly terrible.
define "casual viewer" and back up your claims a bit please
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
So much in Mad Men is implied are alluded to in subtle ways that I don't think it suits casual viewing.
Moff
Member
I think don will follow stan's words now. he will just do what he likes doing. ads. life is more than just work. he gives up on calling the shots. I think that mindset would be important for him to even return to McCann.
To allow McCann to pitch it, they have to fire every creep that messed with Joan.
I can't even imagine how anyone could walk into their old job after taking off like that. Balls of steel.
Well, McCann kind of tipped his hand in that regard, since he admitted he basically did everything and anything to get Don Draper from the beginning.
ZackieChan
Member
Back up my claim that I thought it was awful? I basically didn't like anything that I was seeing. The only interesting part dealt with Joan - her story over the last season was my favorite, all told. The Coke commercial doesn't make up for an entire episode of nonsense with Don. Previous episode was great, btw.
I'm not saying how others should feel or making an argument, really - so there's no "claim" to "back up."
I'm a casual viewer because I watch the show, but don't really get into any of the deeper meaning that you guys seem to discuss, nor do I really care to. Maybe I'm missing a lot of depth, but I'm definitely not the guy who watched Season 1 of Lost and came back for the finale, declaring it trash.
World SkiFree
Member
Cornballer
Member
A couple new articles from Grantland:
- Chuck Klosterman: Human Resources: Work Friendship and the Hidden Legacy of Mad Men
- Andy Greenwald: The Real Thing: The Ending and Lasting Artistic Impact of Mad Men
- Chuck Klosterman: Human Resources: Work Friendship and the Hidden Legacy of Mad Men
- Andy Greenwald: The Real Thing: The Ending and Lasting Artistic Impact of Mad Men
World SkiFree
Member
I still adhere to the cynical angle. I don't think Don/Dick is ever really happy. He just survives and thrives as an ad man. Him commercializing his hippy dippy, communal experience is masterful. Turning an extremely anti-corporate experiene into a profitable ad. A great way to close. The Don cycle continues but what a high note to end on! Just my take, of course ...
That would have been a neat take on the scene. Definitely would have fueled the speculative flames!