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Magic: the GAFering |OT2|

R

red13th

Member
Yeah it's too good probably maybe make him cost 1RR, 3 starting Loyalty and the Stone Rain cost -3, kinda like a Fulminator Mage that can kill critters too!
 
B

bigkrev

Member
I always wonder why I'm not a better player, and then I read stuff like this and I understand I still have so much to learn

I loved this tournament because I felt I was]very well prepared for its structure and various formats. I actually hadn't cast a Born of the Gods spell until round two, because I just got mana-screwed/flooded round 1 and I did zero practice drafts as well as no Standard prep. I realize I may not be setting a great example here, explaining how I did no practice for the format and won the event, but this was a calculated decision.

I knew I was going to play Mono-Black control, a deck I have a ton of experience with. I messaged some friends and asked how they would build the deck and what they thought about Born of the Gods Standard. Ultimately, they had a similar opinion to my own going in, which was that the format wasn't going to change, and one of the decks that gained the most was Mono-Black itself via Bile Blight.

I know from experience that whenever a new set comes into Standard everyone feels the need to reinvent the wheel and try every old strategy again with the new cards, but I wanted to stick to a strong, proactive, consistent game plan that I knew could never be a terrible choice. Thoughtseize into Pack Rat is and always was the best thing to do in Standard, and I wasn't going to let a new set of cards scare me off.

Additionally, I felt that Born of the Gods on the whole was a weak set, its best cards have a low power level and there isn't anything particularly interesting. This played a large role in my choice to do no drafts. First of all, it would have been difficult for me to find boosters and 7 real, living players to get together to help me do a draft, and second, one or two drafts on the whole would do little to help my overall EV in the event, and lastly I already had a great strategy for drafting Theros and felt I was proficient at it. I was just going to lean on my existing knowledge of Magic, try to be conservative, and try my best not to do anything too crazy and survive until the Theros packs where I would go back to what I know. This seemed to work out pretty well.
Click to expand...

From http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/owens-a-win-super-sunday/
 
F

f0rk

Member
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Spike Jester
4 Spiteful Returned
4 Mogis's Marauder
4 Herald of Torment
2 Mogis, God of Slaughter
4 Thoughtseize
4 Lightning Strike
2 Dreadbore
4 Blood Crypt
4 Temple of Malice
10 Swamp
5 Mountain

1 spot left, I'm thinking Hero's Downfall but perhaps it should be another Swamp (using this article).
Sideboard some combo of Erebos, Mortars, Gift of Orzhova, Duress, Doom Blade, Dark Betrayal, Whip.

Anybody got any ideas?
 
S

suffah

Does maths and stuff
ultron87 said:
Yeah, it would've just been a warning, not a game loss, since the error was technically not putting enough back instead of drawing extra cards. I guess that could make it more reasonable to attempt it intentionally (unlike various other on camera cheats of the past) since getting caught wouldn't be a big deal.

That said, unless the player has a history I usually assume it is a mistake for this stuff when it is on camera.
Click to expand...

I remember seeing something on the stream during this match (not sure if this was the same play or not).

Ironically, his opponent during this round also did some shenanigans on Delver trigger (drew two by accident, put them in his HAND, and tried to play one of the cards). Judge only re-wound back to the draw step.

At an event like the GP...doesn't drawing extra cards mean auto-game loss?

Edit: I mean his opponent drawing extra cards. Javier's misplay does look like a violation, not drawing extra cards.
 
Y

y2dvd

Member
Get rid of some Thoughtseize or move it to the sb. You are aggro, not control. Cut down the spiteful guy or Tormented Hero for Rakdos-Freak Return. He has haste and adds an extra devotion. I think Dreadbore is fine tho I forget if its instant. If its sorcery, it may go to the sb.

I have two guys at my lgs that runs B/R. If you're going more the control route, put in 4 Dreadbores and add Stormbreath Dragons.
 
A

afternoon delight

Member
As you've all heard a bajillion times, used to play and am jumping back in. Stopped after the Urza Trilogy and am looking forward to new and wonderful heights.*

* I play with people who seem to have no rules and are totally okay with having non-restricted play, so I'm pretty sure I'll just be scamming builds from Fifth Edition on.

The Heroes stuff is interesting.
 
G

"God's Beard!"

Member
So our LGS is having weekly pauper events, and next week is colorless, non-mythic Standard artifacts.

Here's the deck I'm gonna run:

4x Codex Shredder
4x Elixir of Immortality
2x Pithing Needle

2x Siren Song Lyre
3x Ratchet Bomb

4x Dimir Keyrune
4x Guardians of Meletis
4x Opaline Unicorn

3x Trading Post
3x Akroan Horse

3x Colossus of Akros

10 Swamp
10 Islands
4 Unknown Shores

Codex Shredder mills myself for card selection, Elixir draws out the game while replenishing my library. Dimir Keyrune and Colossus of Akros are my win conditions. Ratchet Bomb, Siren Song and Pithing Needle are my removal. Opaline, Guardians and Trading Post get me the turns I need.
 
F

f0rk

Member
Firemind said:
Madcap Skills and get rid of the Dreadbores.
Click to expand...

y2dvd said:
Get rid of some Thoughtseize or move it to the sb. You are aggro, not control. Cut down the spiteful guy or Tormented Hero for Rakdos-Freak Return. He has haste and adds an extra devotion. I think Dreadbore is fine tho I forget if its instant. If its sorcery, it may go to the sb.

I have two guys at my lgs that runs B/R. If you're going more the control route, put in 4 Dreadbores and add Stormbreath Dragons.
Click to expand...

I've thought about all these as it is basically playing the same list as before (that won the GP). It's quick and punishes slower midrange decks that fuck about with too many tap lands but I don't know if it's the most consistent. From playing it I definitely think Shred-Freak was the worst card in the deck; I don't find the devotion advantage relevant as I'm not expecting to turn on Mogis in a close game. Spiteful Returned gets some damage in past blockers and is still useful should I stall and flood out. Similar with Herald, he's a bit slower but more evasive and better if I stall with just a random Cackler or something to get in the last bit of damage. Bestow is basically haste.
Because I'm slowing down a bit I have the time to Thoughtseize which lets me play around their hand - when you are trying to count to 20 like this I think it's very useful.

All theory now anyway, there's a win a box on Saturday that I'll have a go at and see where it is for Game Day. May well end up going back to Madcap Skills.
 
U

ultron87

Member
suffah said:
I remember seeing something on the stream during this match (not sure if this was the same play or not).

Ironically, his opponent during this round also did some shenanigans on Delver trigger (drew two by accident, put them in his HAND, and tried to play one of the cards). Judge only re-wound back to the draw step.

At an event like the GP...doesn't drawing extra cards mean auto-game loss?

Edit: I mean his opponent drawing extra cards. Javier's misplay does look like a violation, not drawing extra cards.
Click to expand...

My guess on that one is his opponent skated by because he had no cards when he drew the two cards. So there wasn't a "hand" for it to go to. So they just left it as "Looking at Extra Cards", which is a warning. It becomes a game loss for "Drawing Extra Cards" if the extra draw actually touches your other cards or you do some other game action because at that point you can't guarantee which card is the improperly drawn card to remedy it. Admittedly it was incredibly close to that since he was in the motion of casting the Tarmogoyf when he noted the extra card.

Edit: Nevermind. He attacked with the Delver after having them in his hand. So hell if I know. I'm still guessing the main justification was that they could easily tell the two cards in question.

The above is me knowing waaaay too much about the IPG despite not being a judge yet.
 
A

An-Det

Member
R

rCIZZLE

Member
Played some type 2 tonight for the first time in a few weeks and now I can't see myself playing again before the new set except for gameday. The turnout kind of showed that a lot of the other regulars feel the same. I will give props to a couple people there who normally play established decks but went with brews just to shake things up a bit.
 
K

Kacar

Member
I decided to go with burn for my next standard deck.

4 shock
4 magma jet
4 lightning strike
4 searing blood
4 boros charm
3 skullcrack
3 warleader's helix
3 young Pyromancer
4 satyr firedancer
4 chandra's phoenix

4 temple of triumph
3 plains
16 mountain

Sideboard
2 burning earth
1 skullcrack
3 toil/trouble
3 chained to the rocks
4 firedrinker satyr
2 ???

Its basically Brad Nelson's deck. I'm struggling on the last 2 spots for the sideboard. I have guttersnipes would those be worth siding in for any particular matchup? And for what matchups is fierdrinker satyr for? Also I thought act of treason might be good for matchups against desecration demon. Thoughts?
 
Y

y2dvd

Member
I like Act of Treason, though if you steal their demon, they can just sac one of their creatures and make it bigger for the next turn. Boros Reckoner for midrange and Stormbreath Dragon for late. Chandra PW to play your burn spells for free or ping creatures with 1 toughness. I'd go with the PW.
 
T

ThLunarian

Member
Play testing with my own version of Modern 5 color gifts has been promising so far. The main deck could use a little work, but the most exciting thing is that the mana seems to be rock solid, so the deck is infinitely tunable.

In a limited testing session, I crushed a Merfolk deck, struggled against a pure burn deck, and always seemed on the back foot against Faeries. We didn't have any straight aggro builds on hand to test against.

Here's the list I'm working with:

4 Sylvan Caryatid
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Gifts Ungiven
4 Path to Exile
3 Supreme Verdict
2 Lingering Souls
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Kiora the Crashing Wave (likely to change, I just don't know to what yet)
1 Sun Titan
1 Elesh Norn
1 Iona
1 Unburial Rites
1 Eternal Witness
1 Ajani Vengeant
1 Jace AoT
1 Elspeth Sun's Champion (also may change)
1 Gideon Jura

4 Tendo Ice Bridge
3 Vivid Meadow
3 Vivid Marsh
4 Reflecting Pool
4 Marsh Flats
1 Godless Shrine
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Temple Garden
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Twilight More
1 Fetid Heath
1 Wooded Bastion
1 Plains

My favorite Gifts-for-value package (when a reanimated fatty won't be enough) is Sun Titan, Eternal Witness, Unburial Rites, and Liliana. Your opponent has no good choices.

This deck is really fun. I'm open to ideas for what the under-performers could be replaced with.
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
This is a Gifts deck, so you shouldn't be running three Supreme Verdict. You should have Supreme Verdict, Day of Judgment, and Wrath of God.

I would also figure out a way to put Timely Reinforcements in your list. At the very least it should be in the sideboard.
 
F

f0rk

Member
I think Grave Titan is better than Sun.
You are missing the Life to the Loam package.
Vivid Lands are eh.
I would want 4 Lingering Souls, especially with all those Planeswalkers.
 
T

ThLunarian

Member
I feel like the uncounterability of Verdict is important in a world with Faeries and Merfolk decks, but I see your point. I will wait to see what the metagame looks like before I change it though.

I never would've thought to put in Timely Reinforcements, but I definitely see it helping some matchups.

Jace AoT is there to pull double duty as an answer to Bitterblossom and as card draw. So far in testing, I either already have a Liliana in the grave by the time I draw the Titan, or I'm Gifts-ing for both of those cards, so baby Jace probably isn't needed.

Vivid lands are great. I haven't yet been unhappy to see them (except when getting flooded). With only 6 always-CIPT lands, the mana base hasn't failed me yet. I'd be willing to consider 4 Lingering Souls; they'd help against Faeries for sure.

I am mildly concerned that I may have too many mana sources in the deck. 26 land plus 4 caryatid seems like a lot, even if some of them can block.

Considering all this, I think I'll take out a Kiora and a Marsh Flats, replacing them with a Lingering Souls and a Timely Reinforcements to see if things improve.

I haven't thought a lot about my sideboard, but my first pass at it looks like this.

4 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Volcanic Fallout
3 Timely Reinforcements
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Ray of Revelation
4 Castigate

Castigate seems like an acceptable way to get some defense against combo decks, especially graveyard based ones. It's also much better than Thoughtseize against burn.

Thanks for the input, guys.
 
Y

y2dvd

Member
Went 2-1 in draft tonight, losing really to Perplexing Chimera. I think I was too scared and didn't know how to play against that card, so I passed several turns not playing anything. Looking back, that was a mistake as I was in the lead. My opponent eventually built his board state and took over. Next time, I'm just going to play spells and offer a trade if I can deal with it afterwards.
 
G

GamerKingFaiz

Member
Hey what are the rules for being able to destroy a Mutavault? I was trying to ask somebody if Ultimate Price can target a Mutavault but they said they couldn't answer me in the way I was asking them.

What about Doom Blade, minus counters (Bile Blight), board wipes? Anything else I'm missing? What works and what doesn't?
 
K

kirblar

Member
GamerKingFaiz said:
Hey what are the rules for being able to destroy a Mutavault? I was trying to ask somebody if Ultimate Price can target a Mutavault but they said they couldn't answer me in the way I was asking them.

What about Doom Blade, minus counters (Bile Blight), board wipes? Anything else I'm missing? What works and what doesn't?
Click to expand...
Ultimate price can't hit it. Mutavault is no-colored.
 
L

lawlohwhat

Banned
GamerKingFaiz said:
Hey what are the rules for being able to destroy a Mutavault? I was trying to ask somebody if Ultimate Price can target a Mutavault but they said they couldn't answer me in the way I was asking them.

What about Doom Blade, minus counters (Bile Blight), board wipes? Anything else I'm missing? What works and what doesn't?
Click to expand...

ultimate price won't work since mutavault is colorless. doom blade will since it's a nonblack creature. hero's downfall can of course. devour flesh can kill it, though indirectly. supreme verdict and other wipes like drown in sorrow will kill it while it's active since it has a toughness rating while it's up. eye gouge will kill it too since it becomes a cyclops.
 
S

Silexx

Member
Hey guys, need help with a ruling involving Gods.

So during this match, Player A has Nylea, God of the Hunt out on the field and meets the devotion requirement to make it a creature. Player B then uses Ashnod's Transmogrant on Nylea to make it an artifact creature. Player B follows this up by playing Master Thief to gain control of Nylea. Here's the question: Given that Player B is playing a blue deck and thus is not able to meet the devotion to green requirement, does Nylea remain a creature (that can be used to attack and block, naturally) because of the Transmogrant's ability?

For reference, here is the full text:
Tap, Sacrifice Ashnod's Transmogrant: Put a +1/+1 counter on target nonartifact creature. That creature becomes an artifact in addition to its other types.
Click to expand...

I'll admit this, part of the confusion comes from the reading of the original text:

Tap, Sacrifice Ashnod's Transmogrant: Put a +1/+1 counter on target nonartifact creature. That creature becomes an artifact creature permanently.
Click to expand...
 
A

An-Det

Member
B will gain control of Nylea with a +1/+1 counter on it (since Nylea is now an artifact), then checks will happen and it'll lose Devotion and stop being a creature and remain under B's control. The Transmogrant does not make it a creature, it only adds a counter and makes it an artifact.
 
K

Keru_Shiri

Member
Silexx said:
Hey guys, need help with a ruling involving Gods.

So during this match, Player A has Nylea, God of the Hunt out on the field and meets the devotion requirement to make it a creature. Player B then uses Ashnod's Transmogrant on Nylea to make it an artifact creature. Player B follows this up by playing Master Thief to gain control of Nylea. Here's the question: Given that Player B is playing a blue deck and thus is not able to meet the devotion to green requirement, does Nylea remain a creature (that can be used to attack and block, naturally) because of the Transmogrant's ability?

For reference, here is the full text:


I'll admit this, part of the confusion comes from the reading of the original text:
Click to expand...

The "permanently" portion is better read as "indefinitely" as opposed to "until end of turn." Since most effects lasted until end of turn, a lot of older cards would specify when an effect didn't end at end of turn. Usually, it's best to hop on Gatherer and check out the most up-to-date Oracle if you come across a confusing, older card.
 
D

divisionbyzorro

Member
I just first-picked a Chromanticore in a BTT draft!

I abandoned it about six picks later when green was clearly being cut (since base-green is the only shot you have of making that card work) and ended up playing a mediocre UW heroic deck. I think the 2-1 I got with that deck was way better than what was going to happen if I insisted on making the Chromanticore work. But man, I really, really wanted to make that happen.
 
T

ThLunarian

Member
What's the most fun to play standard deck that's at least tier 2?

My definition of 'fun' is 'does cool and interesting things that also help you win', and not 'Win at all costs because that's fun enough'. For example: to me, in general, Gifts Ungiven decks are fun. Monored burn decks are not fun. I guess basically I'm looking for something that's not straightforward and you have to tailor your game plan to each specific game.

I'm interested in getting back into constructed after many years away.
 
F

f0rk

Member
ThLunarian said:
What's the most fun to play standard deck that's at least tier 2?

My definition of 'fun' is 'does cool and interesting things that also help you win', and not 'Win at all costs because that's fun enough'. For example: to me, in general, Gifts Ungiven decks are fun. Monored burn decks are not fun. I guess basically I'm looking for something that's not straightforward and you have to tailor your game plan to each specific game.

I'm interested in getting back into constructed after many years away.
Click to expand...

Standard is boring right now because there aren't any good 'cool and interesting things' going on unless that's how you feel about playing cards with lots of mana symbols for devotion. Everything feels very linear.
Maze's End maybe but playing lots of copies of Fog isn't fun to me.
 
O

OnPoint

Member
The Jund Chromanticore deck we built the other day was fun. I don't know about "Tier 2 status", but we won a fair share of games in the practice room. It was a ton of fun to pilot. I'll see if I can get you a decklist later.
 
T

ThLunarian

Member
I don't know a whole lot about Standard, but I do recall hearing that black devotion, blue devotion, and UW control are the top dogs, so Maze's End and Chromanticore both sound interesting. What is it about Chromanticore (the card) that's making it viable in Standard? On its face it doesn't seem that good, being a 5 drop that dies to everything.
 
O

OnPoint

Member
I don't know that it's good, per se, it's just fun. The Jund shell allows you to play a controlling game, then you Ideally you cast it for bestow on another threat. You haven't lived until you bestow a Chromanticore on a Chromanticore.
 
J-Roderton

J-Roderton

Member
What does the +1/+1 or +3/+3 mean on cards? I know it's the attack/defense, but how do I apply that?

Example

uV3eO04.jpg


Sorry. Just started. Only played a couple few times now.
 
L

Leunam

Member
You've got a Dragon that's a 4/4. With that enchantment, it becomes a 7/7. If the enchantment is destroyed, your Dragon would go back to 4/4. If you had two copies of that enchantment on the battlefield, the effects would stack and you would have a 10/10 Dragon.
 
J-Roderton

J-Roderton

Member
Okay. I'm really making it more complicated than it is. I'm starting out on the Xbox Arcade game. It's much better playing with a real deck, yeah?
 
K

kirblar

Member
Jroderton said:
Okay. I'm really making it more complicated than it is. I'm starting out on the Xbox Arcade game. It's much better playing with a real deck, yeah?
Click to expand...
DOTP is a good intro way to learn the basics. Once you're bored with that, search out a local shop. Sealed Deck is the easiest way to start off in tournament play, or you can just play casuals.
 
K

Kacar

Member
Looking at the modern banned list.

Why are cards like golgari grave troll, Glimpse of nature, and green suns zenith banned?
 
K

kirblar

Member
Kacar said:
Looking at the modern banned list.

Why are cards like golgari grave troll, Glimpse of nature, and green suns zenith banned?
Click to expand...
Dredge, Elves, and Dryad Arbor, respectively.

There are not many cards on the list that could potentially come off. Troll is probably one of them though.
 
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