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Magic: the Gathering - Oath o/t Gatewatch |OT| Look again, the mana is now diamonds!

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ElyrionX

Member
[QUOTE="God's Beard!";193236362]Modern UWR Flash is the saddest of all tournament-winning control decks. It was the first real Modern deck I wanted to try, and all I could think of even back then was how garbage all the cards are.[/QUOTE]

This. Lol this was precisely how I felt before and after I played the deck.
 
So tonight my modern G/W deck beat Infect, Living End, and Gifts Reanimator. Got crushed by Tron and B/W Eldrazi. What are good sideboard cards against those decks?

Against Eldrazi Leyline of Sanctity should help, stops their hand disruption, Oblivion Sower and Liliana of The Veil

Ghost Quarter Stony Silence of course against Tron. Pithing Needle and Aven Mindcensor/Leonin Arbiter (?), Gaddock Teeg would stop Ugin and Karn from being played.
 
They should bring back Extended. It was the best format.
Which version of Extended do you bring back, though

There are some other quirks to the reserved list. They can never print a 1WW 2/2 Flying, First Strike creature (something that sounds like a perfectly fine limited card), because Thunder Spirit is on the list, and the list prevents them from making functionally identical cards. They can never do a 4UU 3/4 Flying, Shroud because Zephid is on the list (OK, with the existance of Hexproof this woulnd't happen anyway, but lets think in 2011 terms here).

I don't think they can even print a Hexproof version because there's some kind of unwritten provision that prevents them from printing functionally similar/superior versions of reserved cards. See also why they can't just print Snow Duals
 

WanderingWind

Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Against Eldrazi Leyline of Sanctity should help, stops their hand disruption, Oblivion Sower and Liliana of The Veil

Ghost Quarter Stony Silence of course against Tron. Pithing Needle and Aven Mindcensor/Leonin Arbiter (?), Gaddock Teeg would stop Ugin and Karn from being played.

To add to this, against Eldrazi the gameplan is very simple. Kill their Eye of Ugin, kill their Temple. If your meta is heavy with Eldrazi, Ghost Quarter is secret tech. Also, manlands. The deck is light on instant removal. GW doesn't have an answer for All is Dust that I can think of though, unlike any blue deck you can't just clog the board with small guys and get in beats.
 
I don't think they can even print a Hexproof version because there's some kind of unwritten provision that prevents them from printing functionally similar/superior versions of reserved cards. See also why they can't just print Snow Duals

They've clarified that another 1WW 2/2 Flying First Strike is prohibited by the letter of the law while Snow Duals would only violate "the spirit." (I say violate the fuck out of the "spirit" of a list whose spirit was "fuck you," but to each their own.)
 
To add to this, against Eldrazi the gameplan is very simple. Kill their Eye of Ugin, kill their Temple. If your meta is heavy with Eldrazi, Ghost Quarter is secret tech. Also, manlands. The deck is light on instant removal. GW doesn't have an answer for All is Dust that I can think of though, unlike any blue deck you can't just clog the board with small guys and get in beats.

Judge's Familiar?
 

Xis

Member
They've clarified that another 1WW 2/2 Flying First Strike is prohibited by the letter of the law while Snow Duals would only violate "the spirit." (I say violate the fuck out of the "spirit" of a list whose spirit was "fuck you," but to each their own.)

I think the problem is that breaking the letter of the law will definitely get them in trouble, but breaking the spirit of the law might get them in trouble
 

Haines

Banned
Do they do any special promos or anything for the magic online prerelease or is it just business as usual with more stuff to buy
 
I guess I'll add in ghost quarters as a shared hate card against Tron and Eldrazi. Those plus infect were the most common decks last night.
 

ultron87

Member
Thinking on random Tron hate. Wonder if they could do something like:

"Mana Constriction 1W
Enchantment

Whenever a land is tapped for mana and it would produce more than one mana, it produces one mana of a type that land could produce instead."

But I'd want it to have wording where it works against both Tron lands (which this wording does) and stuff like Heartbeat of Spring and Fertile Ground which is tough because with those enchantments the land itself isn't producing the mana, it's a triggered mana ability. Hmm.

(This is obviously absurdly narrow.)
 

OnPoint

Member
Thinking on random Tron hate. Wonder if they could do something like:

"Mana Constriction 1W
Enchantment

Whenever a land is tapped for mana and it would produce more than one mana, it produces one mana of a type that land could produce instead."

But I'd want it to have wording where it works against both Tron lands (which this wording does) and stuff like Heartbeat of Spring and Fertile Ground which is tough because with those enchantments the land itself isn't producing the mana, it's a triggered mana ability. Hmm.

(This is obviously absurdly narrow.)

So you want a less restrictive Blood Moon? At least that's how I'd do it, so it's less narrow.

Tectonic Shift 2W
Enchantment

Non-basic lands lose all abilities and gain "Tap: Add one mana of any type to your mana pool that lands you control can produce."​

This way the lands aren't useless, but they don't do their special shit.
 
So you want a less restrictive Blood Moon? At least that's how I'd do it, so it's less narrow.

Tectonic Shift 2W
Enchantment

Non-basic lands lose all abilities and gain "Tap: Add one mana of any type to your mana pool that lands you control can produce."​

This way the lands aren't useless, but they don't do their special shit.
I don't think this actually works rules wise the way you want.

I've always been a fan of land "destruction" ie

Destroy target non-basic land. Its controller puts a land token into play named Wastes with "T: Add C to your mana pool."
 

OnPoint

Member
I don't think this actually works rules wise the way you want.

I've always been a fan of land "destruction" ie

Destroy target non-basic land. Its controller puts a land token into play named Wastes with "T: Add C to your mana pool."

I don't 100% understand the templating rules I guess? But what I want the card to do is obvious, no? Basically "Blood Moon" except non-basic lands become Reflecting Pool, not Mountain.
 
I don't 100% understand the templating rules I guess? But what I want the card to do is obvious, no? Basically "Blood Moon" except non-basic lands become Reflecting Pool, not Mountain.
I understand your intent, but the point behind this thought experiment is to come up with hate that's both functional, clean, and effective, no? In your example the lands lose all abilities so they have no possible mana they could produce.
 

ultron87

Member
That's a little different than what I was thinking.

Basically I was brainstorming for wording that would:

1) Have Tron lands only produce 1 colorless mana.
2) Have Tolarian Academy and Gaea's Cradle produce, at most, 1 blue or green mana respectively.
3) Make Mana Flare, Fertile Ground, Heartbeat of Spring and other "double your mana" effects not work.
 

OnPoint

Member
I understand your intent, but the point behind this thought experiment is to come up with hate that's both functional, clean, and effective, no? In your example the lands lose all abilities so they have no possible mana they could produce.

I don't see how it isn't functional, clean and effective.

They'd require a basic of some sort to function, yes. That's how Reflecting Pool works. It's hate that would require decks like Eldrazi to play basics, whether they are Swamps or Wastes.

Did you mean to imply that the hate should be functional, clean, effective and fair? Then that's a different story.

I would say something like this:

Tectonic Drain 2W
Enchantment

Non-basic lands lose all other abilities and gain "Tap: Add <> to your mana pool".​

I guess this would be the "fair" version. It's at least cleaner and more functional. It's too bad Wastes isn't a sub-type. That would be even cleaner.
 
That's a little different than what I was thinking.

Basically I was brainstorming for wording that would:

1) Have Tron lands only produce 1 colorless mana.
2) Have Tolarian Academy and Gaea's Cradle produce, at most, 1 blue or green mana respectively.
3) Make Mana Flare, Fertile Ground, Heartbeat of Spring and other "double your mana" effects not work.

"Whenever a player would add more than one mana from any one source to his or her manapool that player instead adds 1 mana of any type the source would have added.

Enchantments can't add mana to players manapools"

I see no other way to stop land enchantments
 
I don't see how it isn't functional, clean and effective.

They'd require a basic of some sort to function, yes. That's how Reflecting Pool works. It's hate that would require decks like Eldrazi to play basics, whether they are Swamps or Wastes.

Did you mean to imply that the hate should be functional, clean, effective and fair? Then that's a different story.

I would say something like this:

Tectonic Drain 2W
Enchantment

Non-basic lands lose all other abilities and gain "Tap: Add <> to your mana pool".​

I guess this would be the "fair" version. It's at least cleaner and more functional. It's too bad Wastes isn't a sub-type. That would be even cleaner.
Oh actually i did misread what you originally posted. But i like your revised version more anyways
 

ultron87

Member
"Whenever a player would add more than one mana from any one source to his or her manapool that player instead adds 1 mana of any type the source would have added.

Enchantments can't add mana to players manapools"

I see no other way to stop land enchantments

Ooh, I like using "source" since that makes it not the narrowest card ever. Could play against an artifact mana deck. Or like Rofellos and Rituals.

Yeah, to stop the enchantments it'd have to say something like "and triggered mana abilities cannot produce mana." And they'd never put that on a Magic card.
 

G.ZZZ

Member
Just print a Root Maze that work only on non-basics so you hose fetchlands and non-basics all at once.

Vine Maze G
Enchantment
Non-basic land and artifacts ETB tapped.
Nature sometimes take back

Ez game.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Rally has access to Ayli as a sac outlet now, not nearly as good but she suffices and Reflector Mage also helps making the coast clear for the conventional way. Rally vs Rally with Hallowed moonlight was interesting to watch.

Ayli isn't free, which is a huge difference, particularly with Flaying Tendrils around.
 

Fou-Lu

Member
I am trying to decide what to play in Standard. Might just give Elves a shot, I like the odd way the current Elves play together. Closer to Aristocrats than anything.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Generic can be paid by colorless though. Generic can be W/U/B/R/G/C, I'm saying something that can only be paid with W/U/B/R/G.

It adds such a tiny amount of design space it isn't worth it.

Hybrid Mana already exists for a similar concept that's less limiting.
 
Generic can be paid by colorless though. Generic can be W/U/B/R/G/C, I'm saying something that can only be paid with W/U/B/R/G.

The difference in difficulty of paying generic mana versus mana that can only be paid in color is so small that the value is pretty much the same.

With the "pay 1 of 2 colors" costs the difficulty is different enough to actually be treated different in value.
 

alternade

Member
I am trying to decide what to play in Standard. Might just give Elves a shot, I like the odd way the current Elves play together. Closer to Aristocrats than anything.

I'm settling on Mono-C Eldrazi or G/R Eldrazi Ramp.

The mono-c eldrazi deck is kinda of bonkers when it goes off
 

red13th

Member
Maro recently said they wouldn't do hybrid with more than two colours because it starts getting too close to generic, I really doubt they would make generic minus colourless. It's something they COULD do, like bringing back banding, but I doubt they would.
 

bigkrev

Member
After reading Efro's article on Zoo in modern,(and I think Zoo is a good deck again). i'm kind of liking Worship as a SB card. It has printings in Urza's Saga, and 7th, 8th, and 9th edition. Are there enough copies out their to keep it reasonably priced? I did notice that Channelfireball was sold out of all copies of the card.
 
Can't stop buying singles on EBay. At least it's a lot less financially foolish than cracking packs.

I'm going to open about 20 packages over the weekend. It's going to be like Christmas all over again!
 
I liked it when they did hybrid plus a 3rd colour in the cost in Alara reborn. I hope that when we go back to Alara one day we'll get hybrid A/B C/2 costs. C being the center colour.

That seems pretty unlikely, given Blogatog responses like this. They tended to confuse people, more so in terms of determining whether the card fits into your Limited deck then on a case-by-case basis I presume. Plus, to be honest, most of those cards were pretty bad, especially in terms of justifying the colors used. I can't imagine they'd combine it with 2/M costs.

MaRo doesn't have any problems with 2/M costs on their own, by the way.
 

Hero

Member
Anyone have experienced with All-Star Games on Amazon? The World Breakers I pre-ordered still haven't been delivered.
 
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