Getting pretty quickly to Masterpiece repeats is something that they'd be fine with I'd think. Different fancy versions of a highly played card should still fetch a high price even if there's already a masterpiece version of it out there.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Magic: the Gathering |OT10| Aether Revolt - That shit that make your Soul Burn slow
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
- Start date
- Status
Getting pretty quickly to Masterpiece repeats is something that they'd be fine with I'd think. Different fancy versions of a highly played card should still fetch a high price even if there's already a masterpiece version of it out there.
well the only treasure card ive gotten is a black vise, which is admittedly kind of a cool card and i do like it. but i feel like anything i happen to unpack will make me feel good regardless of the relative strength of sorceries
what would my favorite sorcery be to have a masterpiece of? i guess wrath of god or armageddon are classics and work well with the theme, even if thats kinda boring
i dunno, mind twist? that would be cool to have
what would my favorite sorcery be to have a masterpiece of? i guess wrath of god or armageddon are classics and work well with the theme, even if thats kinda boring
i dunno, mind twist? that would be cool to have
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Kirblar and charlequin have touched on this a bit; if they do these sets thematically rather than mechanically they can practically do them forever.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Across formats you're still going to do fine, just reprinting all the cantrips is going to be a decent number, lava spike, discard spells, board wipes,...
45 would be on the edge of unplayable but we kinda got there already with commander only cards and artifacts.
Yeah, we went through the sorceries masterpiece idea a while back and I think Grimace is right here. Although invocation definitely sounds more thought out and deliberate- which I associate with sorceries- than cantrip-y.
Embalm is kind of scary- Fumigate and control are already kind of laughable. If they have a decent number of playable embalm cards, how is control ever supposed to do anything?
Kind of wish I hadn't bought my Ancestral Visions now. Will have to swap them out for the inevitable invocation version >>
Embalm is kind of scary- Fumigate and control are already kind of laughable. If they have a decent number of playable embalm cards, how is control ever supposed to do anything?
Kind of wish I hadn't bought my Ancestral Visions now. Will have to swap them out for the inevitable invocation version >>
divisionbyzorro
Member
Fucking Cruel Ultimatum
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
We tried this. There aren't 45 period with stretching into obvious bullshit. You have to do both. Sorceries alone is just too narrow unless they really want to print Duress or something that would piss people off.
charlequin
Banned
Yeah, I feel as if my case was partially proven by how many people are like "I was one of the disapprovers because I wanted them to do it more/better," heh.
There's no reason to ever make a hard cut between sorceries and instants on this kind of thing.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
They should cut down that number anyways.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Instant and Sorcery is the same thing with a timing restriction.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
You could say the same about Artefacts and Enchantments but with colour or sometimes requiring tapping.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Let's put it this way, if its just sorceries the list looks like
Damnation
Wrath of God
Thoughtseize
Demonic Tutor
Infernal Tutor
Imperial Seal
Armageddon
Mind's Desire
Tendrils of Agony
Anger of the Gods
Collective Brutality (there's no way they knew this was Modern playable by the time this set was finalized anyways)
Lingering Souls
Ancient Stirrings
Serum Visions (this is still Mirrodin specific even with the new printing in MMA)
Show and Tell
Through the Breach
Terminus
Bonfire of the Damned
Entreat the Angels (totally makes sense on Amonkhet. Totally.)
Ponder
Cabal Therapy (note: the Cabal doesn't exist on Amonkhet without serious hijinks)
Diabolic Edit
Chain Lightning
Faithless Looting
Half of those are already questionable as hell.
I don't agree with that assertion at all. The only functional difference between Sorcery and Instant is timing. Artifacts and Enchantments have lots of things that distinguish them in practice and in theory. Enchantments aren't really a big enough theme to do a whole series of, either. Creatures are problematic as well because of the fact that so many of them are plane-specific.
Damnation
Wrath of God
Thoughtseize
Demonic Tutor
Infernal Tutor
Imperial Seal
Armageddon
Mind's Desire
Tendrils of Agony
Anger of the Gods
Collective Brutality (there's no way they knew this was Modern playable by the time this set was finalized anyways)
Lingering Souls
Ancient Stirrings
Serum Visions (this is still Mirrodin specific even with the new printing in MMA)
Show and Tell
Through the Breach
Terminus
Bonfire of the Damned
Entreat the Angels (totally makes sense on Amonkhet. Totally.)
Ponder
Cabal Therapy (note: the Cabal doesn't exist on Amonkhet without serious hijinks)
Diabolic Edit
Chain Lightning
Faithless Looting
Half of those are already questionable as hell.
I don't agree with that assertion at all. The only functional difference between Sorcery and Instant is timing. Artifacts and Enchantments have lots of things that distinguish them in practice and in theory. Enchantments aren't really a big enough theme to do a whole series of, either. Creatures are problematic as well because of the fact that so many of them are plane-specific.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
There are literally enchantment artifacts. Flavour wise you could make sorceries and instants distinct but magic is 25 years old and flavour has been all over the place throughout.
A spell that takes setup, as in an invocation, is a sorcery while a spell conjured on the spot is an instant, mechanically there should be a difference in strength. In magic spells often actually do not have much flavour at all since they tend to just depict something happening instead of doing something.
Look at fling just reprinted, there's a creature throwing another creature, you're not actually using a spell to throw the creature.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
There are 5 of them. Artifacts also appear as creatures in every single set (there is one block of Enchantment Creatures)
Generally speaking they are not the same thing in the way Instants and Sorceries are even though there's room in their design aesthetic to allow them to operate identically. From both a gameplay and a thematic standpoint I don't think that argument works beyond as a point of contention.
Simply Sarah
Member
To make it worse, Diabolic Edict wouldn't even be an option because it's an instant.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I mean there are literal copies too.
From a gameplay perspective you'll find many permanents with a static ability in either category.
It's only when you delve deeper than that, you will find complete distinctions. Which in the case of enchantments and artifacts mostly includes tapping the latter.
There could be a difference between sorceries and instants thematically too but wizards isn't good at showing it and specifically in the past gave no fucks.
If we're doing that, an invocation would be calling on (ie invoking) some other power for aid. So if they're sticking to that word specifically, it probably wouldn't be things the individual mage is doing, but more of your Wrath of God type grand effects.
Simply Sarah
Member
I also want to point out that "invocation" is vague enough that, if limited to a card type, it could probably apply to sorceries, instants, enchantments, or creatures. It could also easily be all sorts of related cards of various types (divine related, for example).
theres also color distinction afaik, like instants and sorceries dont generally seem to be used as more than a gameplay balancer or flavor lender, whereas enchantments and the destruction thereof are strongly identified with certain colors, much like the destruction (and occasionally usage as seen in esper) of artifacts
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
True which would be quite difficult to tie in just to amonkhet.
coloured artifacts have been in Alara, New Phyrexia, Theros and Kaladesh.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
That list looks a hell of a lot better if you turn it into:
Force of Will
Lightning Bolt
Path to Exile
Swords to Plowshares
Thoughtseize
Damnation
Wrath of God
Armageddon
Show and Tell
Mind's Desire
Abrupt Decay
Cryptic Command
Lightning Helix
Brainstorm
Flusterstorm
Counterspell
Mana Drain (lol)
Dark Ritual
Tendrils of Agony
Cataclysm
Collected Company
Lingering Souls
Demonic Tutor
Infernal Tutor
Vampiric Tutor
Natural Order
I agree Invocation is a vague term that could apply to practically any non-creature magical effect, including Enchantment effects like Necropotence or Blood Moon that would make sense in the Amonkhet theme.
ya im just trying to think of unbalanced sets, i would imagine phyrexia and theros and kaladesh are all relatively color balanced w/r/t artifacts
i didnt play for alara so maybe there was more than just esper
The idea that they'd split instants and soeceries is crazy town. They have a lot more to lose if they dilute the Masterpiece line by including underpowered/undesirable cards than they do if they start reprinting cards in themed sets once they've exhausted the major card types in the next year or so.
The moment someone pulls a Read the Bones masterpiece, the whole line will lose its lustre.
The moment someone pulls a Read the Bones masterpiece, the whole line will lose its lustre.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Proposed card:
More Human Than Human
W
Sorcery
Target creature card in your graveyard gains Embalm until end of term. The embalm cost is equal to its casting cost.
=V
More Human Than Human
W
Sorcery
Target creature card in your graveyard gains Embalm until end of term. The embalm cost is equal to its casting cost.
=V
I agree that 45 a set is a bit much, and they're likely including instants in there as well, but it's pretty easy to hit 45 sorceries if you start including some older iconic cards:
Balance
Maelstrom Pulse
Vindicate
Channel
Natural Order
Wheel of Fortune
Council's Judgment
Time Stretch
Glimpse the Unthinkable
Glimpse of Nature
Bribery
Tinker
Grim Tutor
Genesis Wave
Living Wish
Glittering Wish
Tooth and Nail
Sylvan Tutor
Personal Tutor
Cruel Bargain
Ravages of War
Pox
Decree of Pain
Traumatize
Scapeshift
Enter the Infinite
Time Warp
Cruel Ultimatum
There's probably an in-set cycle taking up space in there, too. (And then you can never do sorcery Masterpieces again.)
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Kaladesh Inventions already included cards that see next to no play at all to only play in Commander. Can't tell me you can't fill a sorcery list with commander staples and commonly played cards in modern w/o stooping to read the bones levels.
And it was awesome.
Simply Sarah
Member
.
Meld was sweet, but it suffered from being practically nonexistent at lower rarities. I never melded anything across ~a dozen limited events.
When I opened my first pack of EMN and saw a flip card, I was super disappointed to find it didn't have meld. No idea why they were so conservative with the mechanic.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
I'd kill for masterpiece cultivate.
Masterpiece Preordain for my pauper decks, please.
I never know the rhyme and reason of the reserved list because Wheel of Fortune is on the list but that got a judge promo.Err...yes? So is Time Spiral. Time Walk is also on the reserve list.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
reserve list used to not apply to foils but then they doubled down on it IIRC, shortly after mox diamond.
Pre revision they could put out reserved list cards in foil versions. They used to do them in limited print shit like Judge Foils and FtV, but then printed PHYREXIAN NEGATOR (a shit card) in a Duel Deck and hell broke loose.
charlequin
Banned
Yeah, the issue is gonna be much more proximity that repetition in general. I mean we just got a brand-new pimp option for Force of Will with EMA last year and that's not gonna stop people from getting psyched for a Masterpiece version now.
Enchantments would be easy without the Reserved List. With that in place, the only Enchantment that sells for over $25 is Doubling Season; there's only five over $20 and thirteen over $15. Obviously some of these cards and even lower ones would do gangbusters in special fancy editions (pretty sure people would pay deece money for really nice Leylines of the Void, say) but it's not enough for a whole theme, yeah.
Yeah, unfortunately none of the legends people would care about for this purpose are Dominarian and a Time-Spiral-esque set is a pretty unlikely thing to see again even for the 25th Anniversary, so there go its two best shots. In the future though I would expect to see a lot of popular legends get masterpiece versions in return blocks though.
I don't understand.
charlequin
Banned
BTW, if there's any question about the effect of WotC's reprinting efforts over the last few years -- this will surely increase once the bloom is off the MM 2017 rose, but at the moment there's just 22 non-reserved cards with a price above $50.
Yeah but the list of stuff that no one's enthused about would basically be, like... the lamer Swords, Static Orb, Black Vise, Meekstone, and the Gearhulks. The vast majority of the cards are actively used in enough places to drive demand.
Cosigned.
Nobody knows exactly who got mad about them backdoor-eliminating the Reserved List, but someone did and as a result they closed the loophole completely, thereby blocking even the mostly harmless uses they'd made of it previously.
Yeah but the list of stuff that no one's enthused about would basically be, like... the lamer Swords, Static Orb, Black Vise, Meekstone, and the Gearhulks. The vast majority of the cards are actively used in enough places to drive demand.
Cosigned.
Nobody knows exactly who got mad about them backdoor-eliminating the Reserved List, but someone did and as a result they closed the loophole completely, thereby blocking even the mostly harmless uses they'd made of it previously.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
lightning greaves, chromatic lantern, champion's helm, cloudstone curio, gauntlet of power, hangarback walker, mind's eye, rings of brighthearth, scroll rack, solemn simulacrum, duplicant, staff of domination, extraplanar lense,...
the list of inventions that have an almost exclusive commander (cube) appeal among the inventions is quite extensive.
There's many, many sorceries fitting that category.
So fucking awesome
Melding the rats in limited felt amazing, especially when your cards were foils!
Anyway, my LGS is doing a weird event on Wednesday and not sure if I wanna go. It's 15€ entry per player. Three rounds, and for each win you get one random Shockland. So the feel bads aren't huge if you win at least once, but 15€ ain't cheap.
EDIT: Forgot to add that it's Modern.
Anyway, my LGS is doing a weird event on Wednesday and not sure if I wanna go. It's 15€ entry per player. Three rounds, and for each win you get one random Shockland. So the feel bads aren't huge if you win at least once, but 15€ ain't cheap.
EDIT: Forgot to add that it's Modern.
What format?
You could probably just buy two Shocks that you need for that money instead. Unless they're both Gatecrash ones.
- Status