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[THE:MILKMAN]

One query I have is whether they know if the plane has crashed or not.

Like the pings they received from Inmarsat, is it the same for the signals from the black boxes and life rafts? Or do they have to get very close to where the plane went down to detect them?

 

[Ether_Snake]

The ironic thing is that the red line actually leads to Ukraine, probably utter coincidence.

Ukraine is just past the Caspian Sea besides Kazakhstan.

The original claims of stolen passports said the two guys were Ukrainians, for whatever reason. Turned out to be Iranians.

Highly, highly speculative on my part, but nothing seems too crazy for this story at this point. I'm wondering if the erratic flight path was intentional. All of this deliberate, to throw investigators off. Or, is it possible to hack or otherwise tamper with the instruments after they've been disabled to send false data?

I think it could be people fighting the pilot, then not knowing where they are or where to go.

Thanks. That's that. If the plane was diverted elsewhere then it's more than likely it's been done in order to obtain the plane.

No, it could have been to aim at a specific target but failed to get there.

 

[Ace Harding]

You can't, simply can't fly through Asia and not be picked up by somebody's radar.
India has very capable air radar. Add to the fact there are some really high mountain ranges and it is very difficult to fly below radar range.

Maybe they were picked up on primary radar but nobody in that area was paying attention. It is not uncommon for large commercial airliners to be flying at cruising altitude along established routes, and that radar cannot I necessarily identify an aircraft.

They flew through very dense parts of Southeast Asia and escaped detection. Why not remote parts of Myanmar, Bhutan, Nepal, India, China, Kazakhstan, wherever they went?

 

[Van Owen]

There's too much info regarding the plane not crash for this to not have been some kind of hijacking.

Pilot suicide also doesn't really fit since the plane flew for hours and no other passengers or flight staff did anything to contact anyone. They must have been under some control, had cell phones taken, etc.

 

[DoktorEvil]

One query I have is whether they know if the plane has crashed or not.

Like the pings they received from Inmarsat, is it the same for the signals from the black boxes and life rafts? Or do they have to get very close to where the plane went down to detect them?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-26544554

The mystery offlight MH370 may only ever be solved when the aircraft's "black box" flight recorders are recovered.

However, recovering them from the sea is not easy. In the case of Air France flight 447, it took nearly two years.

If under water, the boxes emit ultrasonic signals - but these signals have a limited range, and search crews may not detect them unless close to the crash site.

"Black boxes" may be the only way of establishing what went wrong.
Black boxes - described by aviation reporter Stephen Trimble in The Guardian as "one of the most galling anachronisms of modern aviation technology" - are not currently equipped with any form of GPS location transmitter.

2 years might be the shortest timeframe we have to recover the black box.

 

[DECK'ARD]

So the pilots' homes have been raided by police?

Such a strange situation, what exactly has happened. Must be agonising for the families of everyone on it.

 

[Twilight Gap]

Somehow I keep thinking about that in the last couple of days

So I'm not the only one?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-26544554



2 years might be the shortest timeframe we have to recover the black box.

Thanks. So that seems to be a no then.

 

[Amarnath]

Maybe they were picked up on primary radar but nobody in that area was paying attention. It is not uncommon for large commercial airliners to be flying at cruising altitude along established routes, and that radar cannot I necessarily identify an aircraft.

They flew through very dense parts of Southeast Asia and escaped detection. Why not remote parts of Myanmar, Bhutan, Nepal, India, China, Kazakhstan, wherever they went?

Andaman and Nicobar Islands hosts the Tri Services command (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andaman_and_Nicobar_Command). It would be heavily monitored and any unknown intruder should have been challenged. Either we lacked the radar coverage (highly unlikely) or the Jet was nowhere near the islands.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

Could the plane have more fuel than required for its journey? I mean could it have been refilled with enough fuel to fly significant farther than its destination?

yes. don't forget that the 777 200 ER (extended range) disappeared 40 minutes after takeoff...

Also they must contain enough fuel to get to an alternative destination big enough to land it in case of issues along the way/at desination etc.

confirmed news sez

However, the investigation was able to determine that the last communication was in one of two corridors: "the northern corridor stretching approximately from the border of Kazakhstan and Turkmenistan to northern Thailand or the southern corridor stretching approximately from Indonesia to Southern Indian Ocean."

using said info, I took a crack at making a shitty picture.

I'm going to go ahead and take a stab at the northern corridor being more likely.

 

[jufonuk]

Two transponders. One on the flight deck and the other one down below.

wait what?

yeah that definitely wasn't a random occurrence.
I know it's a strange question, did they go off at the same time or one after the other?

 

[DoktorEvil]

yes. don't forget that the 777 200 ER (extended range) disappeared 40 minutes after takeoff...

Also they must contain enough fuel to get to an alternative destination big enough to land it in case of issues along the way/at desination etc.

confirmed news sez



using said info, I took a crack at making a shitty picture.

I'm going to go ahead and take a stab at the northern corridor being more likely.

What was that small strip of land between Malaysia and India? The land right near the andaman sea?

 

[ChainedMaster]

wait what?

yeah that definitely wasn't a random occurrence.
I know it's a strange question, did they go off at the same time or one after the other?

12 minutes apart. Which is why they're saying it was intentional

 

[Ovid]

wait what?

yeah that definitely wasn't a random occurrence.
I know it's a strange question, did they go off at the same time or one after the other?

Yeah, two.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=104486724&postcount=4163

 

[Sectorseven]

If someone has the knowledge to disable the ACARS system would they likely also have the ability to remove and destroy the black box (perhaps even mid flight)?

 

[oxidax]

This whole thing makes plane tracking, satelites, communications and all that technology look outdated imo.

I mean, you can't figure out where the plane is If somebody shuts down communications? Why does a pilot have the ability to make a plane go rogue and why would they need this? is there an specific reason why a pilot can turn off tracking and comms?

Why can't planes have some kind of "lo jack" that can't be turned off unless it crashes? I agree with a previous post from this thread. Isn't flying supposed to be a lot more safe post 9/11? You would think that they got their shit together after that..

I think it got hijacked probably because I don't want to think they died. I really hope they're alive somewhere. It might be a stupid thought but that's what I want to believe right now. I know if they are alive they're probably under very very critical conditions, but at least they're not dead.

 

[toxicgonzo]

Missing Malaysian flight did not pass over Indian airspace: Kolkata ATC

"If an aircraft wants to avoid being seen, they can easily become invisible to a civilian radar by switching off the transponder that relays information about the plane. But it cannot avoid defence systems. The Indian Air Force has radars in multiple installations across the country and it is inconceivable that none of them spotted the odd blip with no flight clearance," he said.

There are nine Air Defence Identification zones in the country that are manned 24x7 to prevent an enemy aircraft from violating Indian airspace.

Guild member Sushil Mondal concurred, explaining that all hell would break loose if Air Force detected an aircraft that did not have air defence clearance

http://m.timesofindia.com/india/Missing-Malaysian-flight-did-not-pass-over-Indian-airspace-Kolkata-ATC/articleshow/32091364.cms

 

[Ovid]

If someone has the knowledge to disable the ACARS system would they likely also have the ability to remove and destroy the black box (perhaps even mid flight)?

Black boxes are in the rear of the plane. I believe it's in the tail section.

 

[DoktorEvil]

This whole thing makes plane tracking, satelites, communications and all that technology look outdated imo.

I mean, you can't figure out where the plane is If somebody shuts down communications? Why does a pilot have the ability to make a plane go rogue and why would they need this? is there an specific reason why a pilot can turn off tracking and comms?

Why can't planes have some kind of "lo jack" that can't be turned off unless it crashes? I agree with a previous post from this thread. Isn't aviation supposed to be a lot more secure post 9/11? You would think that they got their shit together after that..

I think it got hijacked probably because I don't want to think they died. I really hope they're alive somewhere. It might be a stupid thought but that's what I want to believe right now. I know if they are alive they're probably under very very critical conditions, but at least they're not dead.

The tracking of planes is still done by radar and not necessarily by GPS. Kinda makes piss poor sense considering incidents like this would destroy the credibility of an airline and the credibility of the air traffic authority. Also, when manufacturers build airliners, they prioritize features friendly to pilots or to consumers, not necessarily friendly to safety. A bold statement without proven facts, yes, but is it so bold considering companies like Boeing brag about the speed, size, and velocity of a plane without stating if it is doubly safe?

 

[Ace Harding]

Missing Malaysian flight did not pass over Indian airspace: Kolkata ATC


http://m.timesofindia.com/india/Missing-Malaysian-flight-did-not-pass-over-Indian-airspace-Kolkata-ATC/articleshow/32091364.cms

Yeah, so they didn't fly over India. Would have been stupid to do so. Clearly this person/group of people knew a lot about aviation. I'm sure he/they would have plotted a route with these kinds of considerations in mind.

My money is still on a flight off the Myanmar coast and over the Himalayas. From there, who knows.

 

[ChainedMaster]

This whole thing makes plane tracking, satelites, communications and all that technology look outdated imo.

I mean, you can't figure out where the plane is If somebody shuts down communications? Why does a pilot have the ability to make a plane go rogue and why would they need this? is there an specific reason why a pilot can turn off tracking and comms?

Why can't planes have some kind of "lo jack" that can't be turned off unless it crashes? I agree with a previous post from this thread. Isn't aviation supposed to be a lot more secure post 9/11? You would think that they got their shit together after that..

I think it got hijacked probably because I don't want to think they died. I really hope they're alive somewhere. It might be a stupid thought but that's what I want to believe right now. I know if they are alive they're probably under very very critical conditions, but at least they're not dead.

It's not so much that they can be "turned off" but are connected to fuses, as everything electrical in the plane is. All you have to know is which fuse powers the transponders. Fuses are meant to protect electrical systems but I agree, transponders should at least have a backup battery. You'd think that at the very least this shouldn't be able to die out during a flight.

 

[Cat Party]

The tracking of planes is still done by radar and not necessarily by GPS. Kinda makes piss poor sense considering incidents like this would destroy the credibility of an airline and the credibility of the air traffic authority. Also, when manufacturers build airliners, they prioritize features friendly to pilots or to consumers, not necessarily friendly to safety. A bold statement without proven facts, yes, but is it so bold considering companies like Boeing brag about the speed, size, and velocity of a plane without stating if it is doubly safe?

You don't know what you're talking about. Planes are designed with the utmost concern for safety.

 

[Megasoum]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

 

[KHarvey16]

The tracking of planes is still done by radar and not necessarily by GPS. Kinda makes piss poor sense considering incidents like this would destroy the credibility of an airline and the credibility of the air traffic authority. Also, when manufacturers build airliners, they prioritize features friendly to pilots or to consumers, not necessarily friendly to safety. A bold statement without proven facts, yes, but is it so bold considering companies like Boeing brag about the speed, size, and velocity of a plane without stating if it is doubly safe?

That's absolutely ridiculous. The safety of the 777 has been mentioned by every single pilot that's flown one and spoken about it on TV this past week and I can guarantee you it's a point of pride for the manufacturer. Everything regarding the development of aviation equipment is centered around safety.

GPS is a one way system. Airplanes and phones and navigation systems in your car have receivers only, so they know where they are but GPS satellites have no idea. There are multiple systems on aircraft that relay this GPS data to the ground but in this case they were disabled.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

So wait it may not have crashed? This story is getting crazier.

 

[DoktorEvil]

You don't know what you're talking about. Planes are designed with the utmost concern for safety.

I know jack shit about the engineering of planes so I knew it was a stretch to say that.

http://www.live5news.com/story/24966419/boeing-official-answers-safety-concerns-over-missing-jet

 

[Ace Harding]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

Jeez. Just looking at maps days ago I thought about this possibility. That's an extremely remote area. Every new piece of news starts to point in this direction. If this thing landed and is intact, and if people are still alive... Crazy.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

On land as in crashed, or landed?

 

[ChainedMaster]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

Who is this man?

 

[Ovid]

Missing Malaysian flight did not pass over Indian airspace: Kolkata ATC


http://m.timesofindia.com/india/Missing-Malaysian-flight-did-not-pass-over-Indian-airspace-Kolkata-ATC/articleshow/32091364.cms

I'm not saying this is true or disinformation but what country wants to readily admit that their airspace can be easily penetrated?

 

[Arcteryx]

Black boxes are in the rear of the plane. I believe it's in the tail section.

Yes, FDR/CVR are located in the aft section.

See, http://imgur.com/a/GCCAg for location, as well as, how to gain access to E/E compartment via floor panel.

 

[DoktorEvil]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

"believe"

So it's not confirmed?

 

[Megasoum]

Who is this man?

Jonah Fisher: BBC Myanmar/Burma correspondent. Previously in Thailand, Nigeria, South Africa, Sudan, Eritrea... and a few other places along the way. jonah.fisher@bbc.co.uk

 

[Ether_Snake]

Why do people even assume the plane would follow ANY corridor?

 

[chaosblade]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

It just seems crazy to me that they could have avoided detection by both India and China getting up there. But this whole story is crazy.

On land as in crashed, or landed?

If it actually did get there, I would assume it had somewhere to land. Seems like it would have to be an intentional destination.

 

[apana]

Wouldn't the Chinese have detected the plane? They are hyper vigilant regarding their borders.

 

[jufonuk]

so either the overtaking of the plane went ahead successfully and the location of the passengers and the plane is yet to be known

or it was in progress and it went wrong resulting in a crash.

that's what I am thinking anyway

 

[MThanded]

When was the last time any one had voice contact with the pilots on that plane?

 

[sangreal]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

That is an old tweet, by this guy: https://twitter.com/jonahfisher

and he doesn't seem very sure of it -- posted several clarifications afterwards

 

[CHEEZMO™]

So uh.. what the hell is going on?

 

[MThanded]

https://twitter.com/FlightDKM/status/444897441599717376

That tweet is 9 hours old. Just for clarity.

 

[scsa]

It is creepy that something as big as a jet can just disappear.

To the ocean, it is smaller than a fly.
I think we might get a crash confirmation after two to three years from somewhere in the southern Indian ocean.

It seems a repeat of the air France crash. But this time for some other reason than the opposite joystick pulling.

 

[Pandaman]

Wouldn't the Chinese have detected the plane? They are hyper vigilant regarding their borders.

maybe thats why it was thought flying towards the andaman's initially, passing over the indian ocean would keep distance from china until they got behind the Himalayas.

 

[Oersted]

Wouldn't the Chinese have detected the plane? They are hyper vigilant regarding their borders.

It seems like they flew along a commercial route. You don't ask a commercial plane so often why it is there.

So uh.. what the hell is going on?

It seems like someone purposefully turned the communication-systems off and changed the route.

 

[.GqueB.]

To the ocean, it is smaller than a fly.

Yup.

I think this is making people realize just how large this planet actually is.

 

[Ovid]

When was the last time any one had voice contact with the pilots on that plane?

This was from a few days ago.

The last communication received from a Malaysia Airlines plane suggests everything was normal on board minutes before it went missing over the South China Sea, Malaysian authorities say.

Flight MH370 replied "All right, roger that" to a radio message from Malaysian air control, authorities said.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-26541057

 

[raindoc]

Wouldn't the Chinese have detected the plane? They are hyper vigilant regarding their borders.

I'd be surprised if MH370 didn't show up on any other radar than the malaysians', but judging from their hesitation to come forward with that data, I assume that the public will never hear any official statement from other nations, regarding that matter.

Also regarding Eat Children's summary: It was Vietnamese airspace MH370 was about to enter, not chinese. They were supposed to contact Ho Chi Minh City air control when the flight "disappeared".
It also has been confirmed that the transponders were disabled manually at 1:07 & 1:21.

It seems like they flew along a commercial route. You don't ask a commercial plane so often why it is there.

How would you know it's a commercial flight, if the transponder's turned off?

 

[Sectorseven]

So if this went to central Asia, aren't there a lot of abandoned soviet airports in that region?

 

[teruterubozu]

Yup.

I think this is making people realize just how large this planet actually is.

It made me realize how vast the Indian Ocean is, that's for sure.

 

[apana]

CNN is saying the incident started before the final message.