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[Ovid]

But it does pose the question, if it did land, then why has no one attempted to use their phones? Which is one of the reasons why I'm certain it crashed into the sea.

Possible.

The other theory is that plane reached an altitude where hypoxia set in for the passengers, rendering them unconscious. That's the whole 45,000 feet theory.

 

[Oersted]

This has so far the ingredients to be one of the most confusing crimes in human history.

 

[Ovid]

You know it's a video game forum when everyone stops to note how impressive the guy's flight sim setup is.

Damn right.

 

[HoosTrax]

You know it's a video game forum when everyone stops to note how impressive the guy's flight sim setup is.

Psh! Too many dang monitors. I wonder if he's heard of Oculus Rift. Also, his cable management skills are lacking.

 

[Stitch]

 

[SmokeMaxX]

Didn't we literally have this entire discussion a few pages back?

How does the FAA use the Mode S code over the course of a typical flight? Is it simply used to differentiate planes that are flying closely together? Do they run the code against some database to verify a plane's identity? Is it not used at all?

Yeah I copied and pasted my old post because someone was confused about a similar point.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

hahahaha

 

[EatChildren]

Two transponders. One on the flight deck and the other one down below.

Cheers. Do we know when each was turned off? Or was it around the same time?

So if these has been the confirmed facts, how is it that we haven't heard from any families of those who were on board that flight and if they tried to make contact with their families? Idk about you guys, but if I was on a hijacked plane I'd be frantically calling family to speak to someone, anyone about what's going on and give up my cell phone signal to track me.

What you're suggesting requires information we don't have, as Linkhero1 suggested. We don't know how reliable network communications were at that location and at those altitudes. We do not know the status of the passengers. We don't know, in the case of a hijacking, any instructions enforced by the pilots and/or hijackers. We just don't know. You're asking valid questions that nobody has answers to, much in the same way nobody can answer "why were the transponders turned off?".

You need to remember this is still a missing aircraft that officially dropped off the grid and lost all communications after it left Malaysian airspace.

 

[Oersted]

You know it's a video game forum when everyone stops to note how impressive the guy's flight sim setup is.

Tomorrow on Fox News...

 

[DoktorEvil]

There are two(three) things you have to take into consideration.

1) At the altitude they're flying it's more than likely that none of the phone's have a signal.
2) If they did land somewhere and did not crash, it's more than likely that none of the phone's have a signal.
3) Other crazy scenarios where the plane flew at an altitude much higher than 35000 ft knocking out all passengers for the hijackers to take all mobile devices on the passengers.

I wrote off the conspiracies, mainly because for those situations to work, almost every human involved would have had to plan out and consider the errors and fuckups humans really are. It's too clean for those conspiracies to work.

But nothing has been said if the plane had any air Marshalls or someone on the flight manifest that was a high priority target or person of interest.

 

[teruterubozu]

Cheers. Do we know when each was turned off? Or was it around the same time?

Apparently slightly staggered but around the same time. They were shut off just between the Malaysia and Vietnam comm towers in what a pilot called "no man's land" - indicating that the person(s) knew exactly what they were doing.

 

[Anion]

The ironic thing is that the red line actually leads to Ukraine, probably utter coincidence.

Ukraine is just past the Caspian Sea besides Kazakhstan.

 

[railGUN]

Highly, highly speculative on my part, but nothing seems too crazy for this story at this point. I'm wondering if the erratic flight path was intentional. All of this deliberate, to throw investigators off. Or, is it possible to hack or otherwise tamper with the instruments after they've been disabled to send false data?

 

[LQX]

Has this been posted yet?

One of the pilots home sim.

And they say all that COD training is for nothing.

 

[Ovid]

Cheers. Do we know when each was turned off? Or was it around the same time?



What you're suggesting requires information we don't have, as Linkhero1 suggested. We don't know how reliable network communications were at that location and at those altitudes. We do not know the status of the passengers. We don't know, in the case of a hijacking, any instructions enforced by the pilots and/or hijackers. We just don't know. You're asking valid questions that nobody has answers to, much in the same way nobody can answer "why were the transponders turned off?".

You need to remember this is still a missing aircraft that officially dropped off the grid and lost all communications after it left Malaysian airspace.

Apparently slightly staggered but around the same time. They were shut off just between the Malaysia and Vietnam comm towers in what a pilot called "no man's land" - indicating that the person(s) knew exactly what they were doing.

Correct.

Malaysian investigators now believe that the Boeing-777 airliner, bound for Beijing with 227 passengers, deliberately cut a series of communications systems as it headed toward the boundary of Malaysian airspace. U.S. officials and aviation experts say the plane could have been hijacked by somebody with aviation knowledge or sabotaged by a crew member.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...7397d6-abff-11e3-af5f-4c56b834c4bf_story.html

 

[aeroslash]

Do they give pilots psychological evaluations every year? Not saying they were responsible but it got me thinking how so many lives can be on the hands of 2 people. Even crazier is the idea that they can't find it. Yeah earth is huge and all but with all the radar and the plane being huge...

Yes, one extensive one the first time you pass the medical examination, and a simple one every year after that. Nothing too serious, you've just answer some questions.

 

[Linkhero1]

I wrote off the conspiracies, mainly because for those situations to work, almost every human involved would have had to plan out and consider the errors and fuckups humans really are. It's too clean for those conspiracies to work.

But nothing has been said if the plane had any air Marshalls or someone on the flight manifest that was a high priority target or person of interest.

I don't think they've really talked too much about the passengers, but if there was a high priority target or poi, I doubt they would mention it at this point in time. I don't think any hijacker would go through the trouble of hijacking a plane for a single person. What's more than likely is for that target to be some sort of valuable. But then again, I don't think anything too valuable would be on a regular flight. At this point it's up in the air until we get more concrete details.

I don't know how the air marshal on a plane thing works, but from what I do know, not all flights actually have an air marshal.

 

[teruterubozu]

I don't think they've really talked too much about the passengers, but if there was a high priority target or poi, I doubt they would mention it at this point in time. I don't think any hijacker would go through the trouble of hijacking a plane for a single person. What's more than likely is for that target to be some sort of valuable. But then again, I don't think anything too valuable would be on a regular flight. At this point it's up in the air until we get more concrete details.

I don't know how the air marshal on a plane thing works, but from what I do know, not all flights actually have an air marshal.

Yeah if there are any signs of terrorism/hijacking, you can bet we won't get the whole story because of the highly sensitive nature of the information.

 

[Ovid]

I don't think they've really talked too much about the passengers, but if there was a high priority target or poi, I doubt they would mention it at this point in time. I don't think any hijacker would go through the trouble of hijacking a plane for a single person. What's more than likely is for that target to be some sort of valuable. But then again, I don't think anything too valuable would be on a regular flight. At this point it's up in the air until we get more concrete details.

I don't know how the air marshal on a plane thing works, but from what I do know, not all flights actually have an air marshal.

There wasn't any high value cargo on the plane. Let me find the article for you.


EDIT: found it

Malaysia Airlines confirmed Saturday that Flight 370 wasn't carrying any valuable cargo.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles...TTopStories&fpid=2,7,121,122,201,401,641,1009

I can't find a direct quote so it could literally mean cargo as in cargo hold and not passengers.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Interesting article from Air Traffic Controllers in India:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...airspace-Kolkata-ATC/articleshow/32091364.cms

The last 2 paragraphs are interesting if you believe the possibility the pilots could be behind it.

The controllers also pointed out that flying without informing the ATC would be extremely risky at night when there is no visibility and traffic is high. It is akin to several cars speeding on a highway at night with no headlights.

"To attempt something like that would require meticulous planning by someone who knows flight paths thoroughly to fly at an altitude where he does not anticipate another aircraft. The person then also had an intended destination where a plane as large as a B 777 can land. It is all still a big mystery to us," said Mondal.]

 

[Linkhero1]

There wasn't any high value target on the plane. Let me find the article for you.


EDIT: found it


http://online.wsj.com/news/articles...TTopStories&fpid=2,7,121,122,201,401,641,1009

Thanks. That's that. If the plane was diverted elsewhere then it's more than likely it's been done in order to obtain the plane.

 

[apana]

My two joke predictions were Himalayas or Antarctica. Both are starting to look more realistic.

 

[Mikey Jr.]

So there is a chance that it did land somewhere, correct? Or has that possibility been ruled out completely?

Lets say that it did land somewhere, what would be the motive behind it? To use it as a bomb?

Also, why the hell are the transponders able to be turned off? What is the use in having that ability?

 

[Jenov]

Even if they did land, the logistics involved in feeding and caring for almost 200+ people without being noticed would be difficult. Sadly, it's looking more and more like all of the passengers were either killed in a crash, or are currently in very poor/dire conditions if they did land elsewhere...

 

[Mikey Jr.]

Even if they did land, the logistics involved in feeding and caring for almost 200+ people without being noticed would be difficult. Sadly, it's looking more and more like all of the passengers were either killed in a crash, or are currently in very poor/dire conditions if they did land elsewhere...

Most likely the old, men, and children are probably dead if that is the scenario.

 

[mangochutney]

What I'm struggling to reason with, is why there should be the option to turn off the transponders.

Under what scenario would a pilot need to do this? It seems like something that should not be able to do.

 

[DoktorEvil]

There wasn't any high value cargo on the plane. Let me find the article for you.


EDIT: found it


http://online.wsj.com/news/articles...TTopStories&fpid=2,7,121,122,201,401,641,1009

I can't find a direct quote so it could literally mean cargo as in cargo hold and not passengers.

Mr. Robertsson, of Flightradar24, said a crash on land rather than into the sea was unlikely because the aircraft's emergency beacon would have automatically flashed its location via satellite or radio. The beacon's signals are less easy to find if an aircraft crashes into the sea.

I'd like to joke that this sounds like something out of Lost, but to avoid the issue of poor taste I won't.

Still, to manually turn off a transponder and remain hidden from air traffic control, it has to be the work of the crew/pilots.

Terrorists would have to plan everything perfect to do this so brazenly and still not take blame.

 

[Cse]

What I'm struggling to reason with, is why there should be the option to turn off the transponders.

Under what scenario would a pilot need to do this? It seems like something that should not be able to do.

The transponders are turned off every time a plane lands. The plane doesn't exactly need to be tracked while it taxis at an airport.

I feel that such systems need to be automated and inaccessible to anyone on board. A series of transponders needs to be present on each aircraft, and they should be programmed to be turned off when the plane is on the ground. If one fails, there should be another which automatically kicks on.

 

[crozier]

What I'm struggling to reason with, is why there should be the option to turn off the transponders.

Under what scenario would a pilot need to do this? It seems like something that should not be able to do.

Q. Why would you turn off a transponder during a normal flight?

There could be several reasons. One reason could be when airplanes get close to each other (perhaps they are approaching an airport). Air traffic controllers may then request pilots to turn the transponders off or to standby. Also, if the transponder is sending faulty information, the pilot might want to turn it off. Planes are still visible on primary radar until they get below the radar's coverage ability.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/12/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-transponder-explainer/

 

[toxicgonzo]

So why are people dismissing the possibility it flew south into the Indian Ocean?
Other than lacking a good motive besides suicide without the possibility of remains being found, it still is a valid explanation considering the difficulties with a northwesterly path.

You can't, simply can't fly through Asia and not be picked up by somebody's radar.
India has very capable air radar. Add to the fact there are some really high mountain ranges and it is very difficult to fly below radar range.

 

[Linkhero1]

What I'm struggling to reason with, is why there should be the option to turn off the transponders.

Under what scenario would a pilot need to do this? It seems like something that should not be able to do.

If transponders glitch or interfere with any other devices due to it malfunctioning you would need the ability to turn it off. Anything that consumes power should have an off switch.

Edit: I thought it goes into standby mode when it lands?

 

[Megasoum]

What I'm struggling to reason with, is why there should be the option to turn off the transponders.

Under what scenario would a pilot need to do this? It seems like something that should not be able to do.

If said transponder is on fire, you want to be able to shut the power going to it.

 

[aaaaa0]

What I'm struggling to reason with, is why there should be the option to turn off the transponders.

Under what scenario would a pilot need to do this? It seems like something that should not be able to do.

Didn't they say that to disable one of the transponders they'd have to go into the guts of the plane and starting pulling circuit breakers?

I think that would take planning and detailed knowledge of how the systems on the plane worked.

 

[DoktorEvil]

Didn't they say that to disable one of the transponders they'd have to go into the guts of the plane and starting pulling circuit breakers?

I think that would take planning and detailed knowledge of how the systems on the plane worked.

Unless it was something clearly visible that could be disable via explosive or by shooting at it?

 

[Ultra Magnus]

Can't believe I missed that.

That's interesting, maybe because they want to exhaust every possible lead before concluding it could be a hijacking or terrorism attack? It's something they should answer.

But is using Interpol going to lead to that assumption I figured at this point the more eyes that are looking the better

 

[Cse]

Also, is this merely a coincidence?

Malaysian Airlines Flight 370 gone missing on 3.7.2014...

 

[Wind's Howling]

You can't, simply can't fly through Asia and not be picked up by somebody's radar.
India has very capable air radar. Add to the fact there are some really high mountain ranges and it is very difficult to fly below radar range.

Why not? What if China tried to contact the unknown plane via radio and the pilot knew the procedures so he could keep on flying? Everything is possible at this point.

 

[DoktorEvil]

Also, is this merely a coincidence?

Malaysian Airlines Flight 370 gone missing on 3.7.2014...

 

[CadetMahoney]

so ppl are doing joke posts and image macros now?

 

[Pandaman]

Also, is this merely a coincidence?

Malaysian Airlines Flight 370 gone missing on 3.7.2014...

almost certainly.

why bother with the theatre?

 

[chaosblade]

Why not? What if China tried to contact the unknown plane via radio and the pilot knew the procedures so he could keep on flying? Everything is possible at this point.

Because this absolutely would have been reported at this point unless China had something to hide.

 

[Deleted member 1235]

Just woke up and so much information. I don't know what's confirmed and what's not confirmed. Where's Falk when you need him
.

all of this is confirmed information, no rumours, no conjecture only established facts.

latest info always gets highlighted yellow

http://avherald.com/h?article=4710c69b&opt=0

On Mar 15th 2014 Malaysia's Prime Minister stated in a press conference: "based on new satellite communication we can say with a high degree of certainty that the Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System (ACARS) was disabled just before the aircraft reached the east coast of peninsular Malaysia. Shortly afterwards, near the border between Malaysian and Vietnamese air traffic control, the aircraft’s transponder was switched off." Movements of the aircraft until the aircraft left Malaysia's primary radar coverage were consistent with deliberate action by someone on the aircraft. The primary radar target, so far believed but not confirmed to be MH-370, could today be identified as MH-370 with the help of new data received from the satellite data provider. The aircraft could have flown on for 7 hours, the last trace of the aircraft was identified at 08:11L (00:11Z Mar 8th). "Due to the type of satellite data we are unable to confirm the precise location of the plane when it last made contact with the satellite." However, the investigation was able to determine that the last communication was in one of two corridors: "the northern corridor stretching approximately from the border of Kazakhstan and Turkmenistan to northern Thailand or the southern corridor stretching approximately from Indonesia to Southern Indian Ocean." The investigation team is working to further refine the information. The search in the South China Sea and Gulf of Thailand has been ended. "In view of this latest development the Malaysian Authorities have refocussed their investigation into the crew and passengers on board. Despite media reports, that the plane was hijacked, I wish to be very clear we are still investigating all possibilities as to what caused MH-370 to deviate from its original flight path."

On Mar 15th 2014, following the speach by Malaysia's Prime Minister, Malaysia Airlines released a statement stating amongst others: "This is truly an unprecedented situation, for Malaysia Airlines and for the entire aviation industry. There has never been a case in which information gleaned from satellite signals alone could potentially be used to identify the location of a missing commercial airliner. Given the nature of the situation and its extreme sensitivity, it was critical that the raw satellite signals were verified and analysed by the relevant authorities so that their significance could be properly understood. This naturally took some time, during which we were unable to publicly confirm their existence.

We were well aware of the ongoing media speculation during this period, and its effect on the families of those on board. Their anguish and distress increases with each passing day, with each fresh rumour, and with each false or misleading media report. Our absolute priority at all times has been to support the authorities leading the multinational search for MH370, so that we can finally provide the answers which the families and the wider community are waiting for."

 

[killer rin]

So there is a chance that it did land somewhere, correct? Or has that possibility been ruled out completely?

Lets say that it did land somewhere, what would be the motive behind it? To use it as a bomb?

Also, why the hell are the transponders able to be turned off? What is the use in having that ability?

Thats what I'm thinking, You'd think that they would put one of them somewhere where nobody can get to it (like in a blocked compartment under the plane) thats only job is to get GPS data and transmit its position. Something that can't be turned off under any circumstances other than mechanical. Something that isn't connected into the main systems and is or isn't powered independently.

It would offer alot more information than what we're given because in this case, we would be able to determine weather something destructive happened to the plane mid-air, or if the plane was hijacked.

 

[Slayven]

It is creepy that something as big as a jet can just disappear.

 

[crozier]

I don't buy the suicide theory. Why switch off communications and tracking, and why intentionally avoid radar? We're talking meticulous planning here--hours and hours of additional flying, and hundreds of miles off course--all to crash the plane into a different ocean? It doesn't add up.

 

[Cromat]

Could the plane have more fuel than required for its journey? I mean could it have been refilled with enough fuel to fly significant farther than its destination?

Also, about how the plane wasnt spotted by military radio, I think we need to remember that in the end of the day, there's some guy whose job is to watch the radar. In countries that are relatively calm in the military sense it's very easy for something strange to be dismissed as nothing and ignored.

 

[LanceVance]

Also, is this merely a coincidence?

Malaysian Airlines Flight 370 gone missing on 3.7.2014...

Maybe you should type it out in wingdings and see what it says

 

[Ovid]

Here's more info on the MH 370's transponders.

The first loss of the jet's transponder, which communicates the jet's position, speed and call sign to air traffic control radar, would require disabling a circuit breaker above and behind an overhead panel. Pilots rarely, if ever, need to access the circuit breakers, which are reserved for maintenance personnel.

Pulling one specific circuit breaker, which is labeled, would render inoperative both of the 777's transponders, according to documents reviewed by The Wall Street Journal and bolstered by comments from aviation industry officials and those who have worked with the 777.

Becoming familiar with the 777's systems requires extensive training for pilots and aircraft mechanics alike, experts said. However, considerable technical data on the airplane is also available online in discussion groups or other websites.

After vanishing, the jet's satellite communications system continued to ping orbiting satellites for at least five hours. The pings ceased at a point over the Indian Ocean, while the aircraft was at a normal cruise altitude, say two people familiar with the jet's last known position. Investigators are trying to understand that loss, and whether or not "something catastrophic happened or someone switched off" the satellite communication system, says one of the people.

A physical disconnection of the satellite communications system would require extremely detailed knowledge of the aircraft, its internal structure and its systems. The satellite data system is spread across the aircraft and disabling it would require physical access to key components. Disconnecting the satellite data system from the jet's central computer, known as AIMS, would disable its transmission. The central computer can be reached from inside the jet while it is flying, but its whereabouts would have to be known by someone deeply familiar with the 777.

Getting into the area housing the 777's computers would "not take a lot" of knowledge, said an aviation professional who has worked with the 777. However, this person added, "to know what to do there to disable" systems would require considerable understanding of the jet's inner workings. Some airlines outfit the access hatch to the area below the floor with a special screw to prevent unauthorized intrusion, the person added.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304914904579439653701712312

 

[DoktorEvil]

It is creepy that something as big as a jet can just disappear.

What's more unsettling is that no one knows why a jet just disappeared. To have all of these systems in place to control air traffic and still have a rogue plane just brings up everything TSA and the NSA are supposed to prevent in a post 9/11 world. I would have thought other countries would have been as secure, if not more than the US became post 9/11.

 

[Despera]

Holy shit this case aint solved yet? It's been over a week now.