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Mass Effect 3 Spoiler Thread |OT2| Taste the Rainbow

Replicant

Member
Huh. I know the datapad was created by separate company but most of the convo are related to the events in the game. That's why I find Ashley/Kaidan's last convo via the pad to be interesting. I was wondering if there's a scene cut if you chose the Destroy ending:

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mail_(Mass_Effect:_Datapad)

Kaidan

* Heard you came by while I was out. Thanks, Commander. I'm up, most of time, at least.
* I got my things and set up on the starboard observation deck. Come by whenever you like, okay? Door's open.
* I'll try to do humanity proud as a Spectre. Know I've got a lot to live up to.
* Thanks again for the chat. Sometimes you gotta talk through things to figure them out, you know?
* Glad you stopped by, Commander. Maybe next time we can deal you in, give Vega someone else to take money from.
Note: Received after hearing the asides from Vega and Kaidan in the lounge.
* I can't believe what I just saw--what Cerberus did. After everything we did trying to help those people on Horizon.
Note: Received if Kaidan is taken on the mission Priority: Horizon.
* Thanks for listening. Only place I'd rather be right now is Earth and if I can't be there, I'm glad I'm here.
* Hey, I'm so happy. That's all. How can the future be so unsure and so bright at the same time. Yours, Kaidan.
* Hey, Commander. Thought I might come down to see you today--if they let me. Here's hoping.


Ashley

* Heard you came by while I was out. Appreciate it. I'm awake. Lots of drugs, though.
* Looks like I'm getting out of the hospital. About time.
* I'll try to do humanity proud as a Spectre. I've got a lot to live up to.
* Heard Garrus is back on board. That is good news.
Note: This message is received directly after Garrus is recruited aboard the Normandy.
* Thanks again for coming to the memorial. That means a lot.
* Ready for action, Commander. Also, never drinking with Vega again.
* After our talk all I'm thinking of is my Dad's cooking. Normandy chow just isn't cutting it.
* Doubt any of us will be getting much sleep anytime soon. But I believe in you.
* Hey, Skipper. They might actually let me see you today. Hang in there.

I know the one convo prior to the bolded one got sent if you hook up with Kaidan. So in that sense, the last message doesn't make sense at all if it happens while he was still on the Normandy. Ash's 2nd to last convo also suggest it's something she might have said before the last mission, which again makes her last datapad convo a bit puzzling.

My guess is there was an additional scene of Shepard in the hospital recovering and the message was meant to reflect that?
 

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
I think that was discussed in the last thread. It could have been when he or she was in the hospital, so it could have been mixed up. At this point who knows if it means anything or if it will be mentioned in the EC. Maybe destroy shows Shep in a hospital by that time, though I doubt it.
 

Replicant

Member
I think that was discussed in the last thread. It could have been when he or she was in the hospital, so it could have been mixed up. At this point who knows if it means anything or if it will be mentioned in the EC. Maybe destroy shows Shep in a hospital by that time, though I doubt it.

The "Hang in there" line doesn't make sense though if it's Kaidan or Ash is the one who's in the hospital. It implies that Shepard was in some kind of sickness or something.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
This bothered me too. Also, why do they have visual computer interfaces? That makes absolutely no sense.

You are thinking about it more than Bioware did. Its the same reason all the aliens are bipedal, why a smile means the same things to everyone and why there is magical universal translation.
 

Lime

Member
The ending of AC:Revelations shit all over ME3's ending. It's thematically consistent with Ezio's character in the entire game, while also finishing Altair's story arc. And this particular AC game is even the worst entry in the series.
 

- J - D -

Member
You are thinking about it more than Bioware did. Its the same reason all the aliens are bipedal, why a smile means the same things to everyone and why there is magical universal translation.

I'm gonna give them some credit, they probably did put a lot of thought into most of the above. Some concessions must be made for the sake of accessibility and convenience.

Either way, they've got themselves covered with the following reasonings: A) Protheans. B) Reapers.
 
why a smile means the same things to everyone

I facepalmed when Shep first meeks Javik and tries to shake his hand. I wanted Javik to react with offended horror, as if she'd just propositioned him for sex or something.
 

- J - D -

Member
I facepalmed when Shep first meeks Javik and tries to shake his hand. I wanted Javik to react with offended horror, as if she'd just propositioned him for sex or something.

Why? On Eden Prime, when Shep grabbed Javik to stop him from escaping, both absorbed info from each other. Shep got some Prothy memories, while Javik absorbed enough to understand English and human physiology. It's not a reach to assume that he learned of their mannerisms as well.
 

Rufus

Member
Why? On Eden Prime, when Shep grabbed Javik to stop him from escaping, both absorbed info from each other. Shep got some Prothy memories, while Javik absorbed enough to understand English and human physiology. It's not a reach to assume that he learned of their mannerisms as well.
Yeah, if you swallow his touch magic you have to swallow that, too. I've said it once before, but Javik is proof that homoeopathy was right all along, at least in the ME universe. Molecules DO remember stuff. Ah... Javik's a good character though, so that stuff is forgiveable...
 
Kind of off topic, but this is probably this best place to put it.

I replayed and finished ME1 again last night... Even though I think ME2 and ME2 are better games (I.E, better cover mechanics, better shooting, etc.) , I still think ME1 is the better experience. Amazing fucking game. dat soundtrack, dat story.

Going to replay ME2 - on Insanity. Anything anyone recommends in regards to making it easier?

infiltrator,widow sniper rifle,that pyro power forgot it's name- helps during low ammo and burns thru health,Armour,shields .
Get kasumi early on,her cloak n hit power helps during fire fights.

also for all Geth missions keep ur hacking skills and reassigns those points to other skills during non Geth missions.
 
Why? On Eden Prime, when Shep grabbed Javik to stop him from escaping, both absorbed info from each other. Shep got some Prothy memories, while Javik absorbed enough to understand English and human physiology. It's not a reach to assume that he learned of their mannerisms as well.

Ah true. It was a shame Javik acted so human and relatable, though, considering he wasn't even from this cycle.
 

Massa

Member
That's not a fair assessment; it doesn't work within the structure of the games. They wrapped up Altar's story beautifully and
if you watched Embers, they did the same for Ezio.
If AC3 truly does wrap up the story of Desmond (I'm not completely convinced) we can then judge the overall quality of the narrative.

AssCred main story might be a wee bit on the looney side
(it doesn't help that Minerva looks like a crazy cat lady)
, but the individual story of Ezio and Altair were well-told and ended nicely. Also, the looney main story has not ended yet and so far it seems consistent so as long as they can end it nicely, it wouldn't be a big problem.

The ending of AC:Revelations shit all over ME3's ending. It's thematically consistent with Ezio's character in the entire game, while also finishing Altair's story arc. And this particular AC game is even the worst entry in the series.

Yep, Revelations was the first game in the series to actually finish an arc and it did so well with Altair and Ezio. I thought that part of the ending was actually pretty fantastic.

The main plot of the series is as bad as ever though imo. I hope the Mass Effect 3 debacle will teach other companies to pay more attention to their stories and their endings.
 

Kinyou

Member
It's time for crazy!

There is an expanded soundtrack of the game floating around. It does not look "official", but, from the track list, the titles of the tracks in the expanded soundtrack match those of the limited tracks.

So, what's crazy? Well, in the track list, the first track that corresponds to a music post-beam is called... 'Indoctrination'.

I am assuming whoever ripped those songs named the track himself
116 Normandy Music Player 1
117 Normandy Music Player 2
118 Normandy Music Player 3
119 Normandy Music Player 4
120 Normandy Music Player 5
121 Normandy Music Player 6
122 Normandy Music Player 7
The track just before is actually called marauder shields, lol
I guess it would be illegal do download those? Because I really miss that one Music player track on my soundtrack

(and when it's not illegal, I could really use a download link)
 
I guess it would be illegal do download those? Because I really miss that one Music player track on my soundtrack

(and when it's not illegal, I could really use a download link)

If you own a copy of the game, you already own a copy of those files, just in slightly different form. If you have the PC version then the tools are out there to rip the tracks yourself. Should also be possible on the 360 if you install the game to a USB drive.

(No idea what GAF policy on this is though)
 

Ambitious

Member
You are thinking about it more than Bioware did. Its the same reason all the aliens are bipedal, why a smile means the same things to everyone and why there is magical universal translation.

If I recall correctly, in the first book Anderson is thinking about this, assuming that bipedals just have some evolutionary advantage. But you forgot the Elcor and the Hanar.

As for the translation, there's a codex entry about that, stating that there are translating devices within clothes or dermally implanted. Still a bit magical though.
 
Its the same reason all the aliens are bipedal, why a smile means the same things to everyone and why there is magical universal translation.

There's a bit of suspension of disbelief needed, but the series does do a better job of justifying much of this than most.

The game/codex/universe makes it clear that most aliens aren't speaking in english, that the process isn't perfect, and when a new species is encountered that linguists have to spend much time and effort decoding the new language before it can be translated.

Hell, I think you could even handwave apparent lipsync and not hearing untranslated language behind the translated stuff by stating that it's an optical / auditory illusion generated by expectations and the brain adapting. Bit of a stretch, but it does have some basis in reality.

As for certain gestures having the same meaning in different species, I can think of two possibilities:

1) It's done for the audience's benefit by translating an alien gesture into something that can be understood, in a similar way as language is. And/or it saves a huge amount on having to create unique animation that's very hard for players to appreciate.
2) Other races understand the meaning due to an understanding of human body language. LotSB shows Tali downloading a manual on human body language for instance.
2.5) The game also shows that gestures, metaphors and so on do not automatically come across to other species and that these can and do lead to confusion.

I suppose we could always go with SPACE MAGIC
 
You are thinking about it more than Bioware did. Its the same reason all the aliens are bipedal, why a smile means the same things to everyone and why there is magical universal translation.

I'm kind of beaten to this, but:

Elcor, Hanar, edit: and the Rachni aren't bipedal. Neither are the Keepers, though they sorta "don't count."

Universal translation is machine assisted. This is a sci fi trope going back to the 60s (with star trek, Dr. Who, more i forget) so calling bioware out on it is kind of unfair.

And if you read the file on the Elcor, they specifically note that the elcor's physical social cues are far too subtle for other races to pick up on- they don't "smile" or "frown" for instance, so they need to verbally describe emotional tone before beginning a sentence when talking to other races. comes off kind of hokey unless you read the file, then it makes sense.
 

firehawk12

Subete no aware
I'm kind of beaten to this, but:

Elcor, Hanar, edit: and the Rachni aren't bipedal. Neither are the Keepers, though they sorta "don't count."

Universal translation is machine assisted. This is a sci fi trope going back to the 60s (with star trek, Dr. Who, more i forget) so calling bioware out on it is kind of unfair.

And if you read the file on the Elcor, they specifically note that the elcor's physical social cues are far too subtle for other races to pick up on- they don't "smile" or "frown" for instance, so they need to verbally describe emotional tone before beginning a sentence when talking to other races. comes off kind of hokey unless you read the file, then it makes sense.
The Elcor are probably the one unique race that they designed, but they exist mostly as a gimmick since you never actually need to see them do anything. How do they actually... say, use computers, for instance?
 
And if you read the file on the Elcor, they specifically note that the elcor's physical social cues are far too subtle for other races to pick up on- they don't "smile" or "frown" for instance, so they need to verbally describe emotional tone before beginning a sentence when talking to other races. comes off kind of hokey unless you read the file, then it makes sense.

Badassfully: Damn you Blasto, I was 2 days from retirement.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
Ah true. It was a shame Javik acted so human and relatable, though, considering he wasn't even from this cycle.

? All aliens in ME act human. Why would being from a different cycle be any less different than being from a different world with a different environment?
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
I'm kind of beaten to this, but:

Elcor, Hanar, edit: and the Rachni aren't bipedal. Neither are the Keepers, though they sorta "don't count."

Universal translation is machine assisted. This is a sci fi trope going back to the 60s (with star trek, Dr. Who, more i forget) so calling bioware out on it is kind of unfair.

And if you read the file on the Elcor, they specifically note that the elcor's physical social cues are far too subtle for other races to pick up on- they don't "smile" or "frown" for instance, so they need to verbally describe emotional tone before beginning a sentence when talking to other races. comes off kind of hokey unless you read the file, then it makes sense.

The Elcor's social cues are far to subtle so they didnt have to animate a mouth. Elcor originally had traditional mouths.

Also note all the non bipedal council aliens do the least, never move, we never see how they interact with things.

Also you assume I'm holding this against them.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
Yeah, if you swallow his touch magic you have to swallow that, too. I've said it once before, but Javik is proof that homoeopathy was right all along, at least in the ME universe. Molecules DO remember stuff. Ah... Javik's a good character though, so that stuff is forgiveable...

It was done so that Shepard and Javik could interact immediately. Bioware is really, really bad with pseudobiology.
 

Z_Y

Member
How excited I was when I got that quest about rescuing some Elcor from their homeworld. But, alas..


I was so excited when I got that quest too. I was envisioning going to battle fighting alongside a bunch of bad-ass Elcor with missiles strapped to their backs. I had just spent an hour and half traveling from star system to star system randomly scanning areas and jumping in and out of solar systems playing tag with Reapers. I was anxiously looking forward to some combat.

I bolted out of the Citadel and into the Normandy. After googling to find out which system to even go to...I hopped on a Mass Relay and away we went. Get to the Elcor homeworld and I can't do shit. Can't land...can't scan. WTF? Back to Google I go. Ooooh.....I already scanned here and got whatever I needed. Back to the Citadel i go to talk to the Elcor again to complete the quest. What a mood killer that was.
 

flyover

Member
How excited I was when I got that quest about rescuing some Elcor from their homeworld. But, alas..

Aw, why'd you have to bring that up? I was so happy when I originally received that quest. I actually waited to do it until I knew for sure I'd have a few uninterrupted hours, so I could explore every nook of whatever area they'd designed.

And then it was wham, bam, probe planet, thank you ma'am.

I should've known better. In retrospect, there was nothing to hint it would be any more than what it was, but I was sure it would be.
 

nel e nel

Member
Its the same reason all the aliens are bipedal,

blasto_the_hanar_spectre_by_silverwillow-d3g7cxf.jpg


This one takes offense at your unjust generalizations.
 
But seriously, is there some reason the Asari look exactly like human women (like the same bone structure and everything), except for tentacles instead of hair, and a slight scaliness and strong blueness to the skin? Was that ever explained?

Not that it really matters. I can accept things like that.

Still, Turians are pretty damn different (despite being bipedal), Krogans are way different, Hanar/Elcor/etc.
 

zkylon

zkylewd
But seriously, is there some reason the Asari look exactly like human women (like the same bone structure and everything), except for tentacles instead of hair, and a slight scaliness and strong blueness to the skin? Was that ever explained?

Not that it really matters. I can accept things like that.

Still, Turians are pretty damn different (despite being bipedal), Krogans are way different, Hanar/Elcor/etc.
Supposedly Asaris look different for everyone that looks at them, although always attractive (by that race's standards) and always blue. So to humans, they look like sexy blue chicks, but to Krogan, they look like Eve, etc.

This is all based on some random conversation a Turian, a Salarian and a human have in a bar in Illium in ME2. What's dumb about this, is that even if you create a female straight Shepard, Bioware still made them to look like blue chicks.
 
But seriously, is there some reason the Asari look exactly like human women (like the same bone structure and everything), except for tentacles instead of hair, and a slight scaliness and strong blueness to the skin? Was that ever explained?

Wasn't it done as a throwback to the 'green-skinned space babe' from earlier science fiction?

Supposedly Asaris look different for everyone that looks at them, although always attractive (by that race's standards) and always blue. So to humans, they look like sexy blue chicks, but to Krogan, they look like Eve, etc.

This is all based on some random conversation a Turian, a Salarian and a human have in a bar in Illium in ME2. What's dumb about this, is that even if you create a female straight Shepard, Bioware still made them to look like blue chicks.

The game actually implies more than anything else that each species focuses on the similarities between them and asari. So, shape for humans, 'head tentacles' for turians, and skin colour for salarians.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
Wasn't it done as a throwback to the 'green-skinned space babe' from earlier science fiction?



The game actually implies more than anything else that each species focuses on the similarities between them and asari. So, shape for humans, 'head tentacles' for turians, and skin colour for salarians.

Yes to both.
 
Wasn't it done as a throwback to the 'green-skinned space babe' from earlier science fiction?



The game actually implies more than anything else that each species focuses on the similarities between them and asari. So, shape for humans, 'head tentacles' for turians, and skin colour for salarians.

Well, at least they addressed it to some extent. It doesn't exactly make sense, but they made an effort. I remember that now.
 

zkylon

zkylewd
The game actually implies more than anything else that each species focuses on the similarities between them and asari. So, shape for humans, 'head tentacles' for turians, and skin colour for salarians.
Wait so there's no mind control thing? Where's that said or implied? The way that conversation's written's definitively sways you in the mind control direction.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
Wait so there's no mind control thing? Where's that said or implied? The way that conversation's written's definitively sways you in the mind control direction.

The mind control thing is just speculation. Otherwise how would it work if you took a photo of them and look at it when no asari were around?
 

zkylon

zkylewd
The mind control thing is just speculation. Otherwise how would it work if you took a photo of them and look at it when no asari were around?
I dunno, ask Bioware's shitty writers :p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLSjR_-hgD8

The dialogue implies (and otherwise flat out says) that they're using mind control. It's a funny side-sequence that shouldn't be taken at face value, I know, but it wouldn't be the first time there's been fucked up things in the ME universe.
 

DTKT

Member
If there is one thing that this ending has brought us, it's quality posts.

The decision in Legion’s loyalty mission is nothing like the ending of ME3 except in the most superficial sense that both involve some sort of choice. The context of the situations, the nature of the revelation involved, the significance of the “choice” are all completely different.

At the time we met Legion, we had just spent a game and a half fighting the Geth, who were actively waging a war against the Citadel races in conjunction with the Reapers. There was no question that at some level they were a destructive and dangerous enemy. Then we learned that this was only part of the story. This information challenged our assumption that the Geth were a homogeneous society, but it didn’t contradict the clearly-established lessons of the story that preceded it. It expanded our knowledge of the situation without asking us to ignore the significance of what we had witnessed previously.

ME3’s ending, in contrast, demands that we disregard everything the last three games have taught us about synthetic life. It’s not a good thing when the primary motivation of your antagonist is revealed to be completely incongruous with the story you just told. The games go to great lengths to establish that synthetics are alive and capable of growth and selflessness and individuality and love just in time for Shepard to exterminate them all. It’s like ending Pinocchio with Geppetto stuffing him into a wood chipper.

We’re also implicitly asked to forget that this was never even the central conflict of the game. The Reapers—and the heretic Geth, for that matter--were not our enemy because they were synthetic. That they were synthetic was incidental; it would have been the same had they been oozing, fleshy space-shoggoths. No, they were our enemy because they were trying to destroy and/or subjugate us. The battle of ideas at the core of the ME series was never organic vs. synthetic life, but rather indoctrination and subjugation vs. freedom and self-determination. Appropriately, this theme was even paralleled in the gameplay itself through its unprecedented emphasis on meaningful player interactivity vs. being forced down a predetermined path. Then they reached the end and inexplicably threw it all out the window.

It’s just as faulty to compare the choices in Legion’s loyalty mission to the red and blue endings. Shepard never sought to control the heretic Geth. You can indeed argue the ethics of rewriting them, but you cannot claim it is the same as Shepard attempting to control the reapers after spending literally the previous scene (and ME2, if you were a Paragon) explicitly explaining to TIM why controlling the Reapers was insane and doomed to failure. Based on everything the game has told us, there is no reason to think attempting to control the Reapers will even work. Really, the best comparison for the control ending is not rewriting the Geth but rather Morinth convincing Shepard that he’s so awesome and special that he can survive mind-melding with her. How did that turn out?

Likewise, destroying the heretic Geth was a serious and debatable decision, but killing a hostile enemy in wartime is a far cry from deliberately massacring your own allies to the last man after gaining their trust. A general might send his men into a dangerous and deadly situation to fight; that’s a realistic ethical dilemma. No general of any conscience, however, would simply butcher his own men himself in exchange for an objective. Some prices are simply too high to pay, and he would attempt to find another way even if it meant losing. Without question Paragon Shepard would reject that sort of diabolical calculus. Even Renegade Shepard, who is no less committed to self-determination, would balk at being shoehorned into the Catalyst’s phony and obviously flawed paradigm.

This decision is not even a sacrifice in any meaningful sense of the word. People wrongly use that euphemism to describe Shepard’s arbitrary killing of the Geth, probably because it sounds nobler than alternatives like “mass murder,” but it is nothing of the sort. The Geth are not giving their lives. Shepard is taking them without their consent. As for Shepard himself, he is condemned the moment he enters the Citadel. It’s never a question of whether; it’s just a matter of how. There is no feeling of choosing to give up your life in exchange for a greater good (as, for example, there could be at the end of Dragon Age: Origins) because your life is automatically forfeit, and it’s never clear that any of your choices even result in good, regardless. That’s not a sacrifice: it’s a gratuitous death sentence.
 

HK-47

Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
If there is one thing that this ending has brought us, it's quality posts.

Yes, well most games are power fantasies. The dark energy ending also has this problem. You can sacrifice humanity by making a human reaper to save the galaxy. But who the fuck are you to speak for more than 11 billion people? Fuck you, ya power tripping cunt.

Choice is nice but I actually hate big choices like this cause they are so artificial and selfish.
 
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