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Max Payne 3 |OT| Funny as hell, we couldn't decide on a sub-title

JB1981

Member
Didn't mind the cutscenes at all during first playthrough but they really do become a chore on replays. You really can't skip them. Like at all. So if you want to replay the game on a harder difficulty you WILL be sitting through the cutscenes again.

I was very impressed with the level design in this game. Everything seemed to flow organically from the story. And the levels always had a very logical progression from one set piece to the next.
 

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
So a buddy of mine fired off some rather negative impressions on the game last night. I can see where he's coming from, but man, this is pretty scathing.

Bottom line. Cinematic Presentation of most boring yet overwrought story ever watches as Gameplay approaches the car, then locks the doors then pops the trunk.


I don't care about these stupid cutscenes. Any of them. Not the half hours ones between levels, not the thirty second breaks between every two minutes of gameplay. The story is stupid. The presentation is grating...
GRATING
Why would I ever WATCH Max Payne shoot guys? I'm supposed to BE Max Payne. Let me shoot them.

Rail shooter sections in most games can fuck right off, but in Max Payne... Goddamn this is bad. The best shit - The Best Shit - is when I'm fighting to drag my crosshair over a guy to click\shoot while it tries to recenter itself on a propane tank because THATS WHAT I AM SUPPOSED TO SHOOT IN THIS SHOOTER GAME RIGHT NOW AW FUCKIN CAPS

So many instances when the game plays with my mouse speed. Obviously bullet time. and every rail section so far. A guy gets close to me while I'm on the ground and I drag my Zowie EC1 all the way across my 17" wide Puretrak Talent like I'm turning around an oil tanker.

You can tell any time a shit ass fuck cutscene is coming up because Max will switch his topped off AK47 over to his off hand and whip out that cunty revolver that you ran out of ammo for, right before barging through a door.

Hilarious. Watching Max vault over a desk and slo-mo fire his Glock 18 in mid-air at the first wave of an army all the while holding an assault rifle by the barrel with his left hand.

Hilarious. Standing too close to a box or chainlink fence and pulling the trigger on some guys and seeing max whip his pistol all the way from the ground straight up into the air and fire into the sky because I'm too close to aim but not too close to shoot.

There is a really cool shooter here. But the story can't stop putting its dick in your face and breaks up the flow of gameplay at every turn. In fact, there IS no flow of gameplay.
instead there's brief moments of excellence that you are allowed to enjoy while you wait for the next mind-blowing-out-your-own-ass cutscene to spool up.

Unless you try playing WASD, in which case those moments get fucked up too, as often as not.
 

Derrick01

Banned
What the fuck is up with the
last boss
that is the biggest, cheapest fucking joke I've ever seen. Seriously, fuck this games single-player from here to the end of the world. Cheapest shit game I've played in years.

Fix the damn mouse acceleration so I can start some multiplayer.

Yeah that part was some hardcore bullshit. It was a typical modern shooter design flaw, a cheap way of making something challenging because they can't design something fair but tough.
 

Sethos

Banned
Meh, he's right. Story, pacing, setpieces, amount of cutscenes and the hardness created through cheap, shitty events rather than an actual challenge. Everything is a disaster - This game has the worst SP of the year for me.

Thankfully the gameplay has redeemed it and there's MP / Arcade mode / upcoming Co-op DLC.


Yeah that part was some hardcore bullshit. It was a typical modern shooter design flaw, a cheap way of making something challenging because they can't design something fair but tough.

Exactly man. Just the shit where
you'd shootdodge, kill some guys, he'd fire off some grenades and you landed on the ground with no more slowmotion and died. Boom. When you got shot and get the last stand thing, when you shot the guy who 'killed you' Becker had already fired off some grenades and when the last stand ended - Dead. Happened constantly
 

Derrick01

Banned
So a buddy of mine fired off some rather negative impressions on the game last night. I can see where he's coming from, but man, this is pretty scathing.

All the anger and curse words aside he's pretty correct in almost everything he said. I can't argue or disagree with any of it.
 

JB1981

Member
Meh, he's right. Story, pacing, setpieces, amount of cutscenes and the hardness created through cheap, shitty events rather than an actual challenge. Everything is a disaster - This game has the worst SP of the year for me.

Thankfully the gameplay has redeemed it and there's MP / Arcade mode / upcoming Co-op DLC.




Exactly man. Just the shit where
you'd shootdodge, kill some guys, he'd fire off some grenades and you landed on the ground with no more slowmotion and died. Boom. When you got shot and get the last stand thing, when you shot the guy who 'killed you' Becker had already fired off some grenades and when the last stand ended - Dead. Happened constantly

Probably died over 20 times at the end
 

Derrick01

Banned
Exactly man. Just the shit where
you'd shootdodge, kill some guys, he'd fire off some grenades and you landed on the ground with no more slowmotion and died. Boom. When you got shot and get the last stand thing, when you shot the guy who 'killed you' Becker had already fired off some grenades and when the last stand ended - Dead. Happened constantly

Yeah the biggest flaw of that part was when you get knocked down
from his grenades
it takes like 10 seconds to get back up. I think that's a Euphoria design flaw though because it was in GTA 4 and RDR too. During my recent RDR playthrough I kept falling down and was mashing the controller and yelling at the fucker to get up too.
 

Sethos

Banned
Yeah the biggest flaw of that part was when you get knocked down
from his grenades
it takes like 10 seconds to get back up. I think that's a Euphoria design flaw though because it was in GTA 4 and RDR too. During my recent RDR playthrough I kept falling down and was mashing the controller and yelling at the fucker to get up too.

Yeah, that too. Like first the physics need to settle you back into a normal prone, THEN you need an extra few seconds to see the animation of getting up. That was a one way ticket to another retry.

On a different but similar note, the fact that mouse movement was slowed down 1800% when lying down didn't help the frustration either throughout the game. I can see what their intent was but this is crossing the line tine times over.
 

zkylon

zkylewd
iCoQdIZtOjysQ.PNG


Damn Max looks amazing in MP3...

Ok, been having internet problems these weekend, so I couldn't post more impressions but it's given me time to beat it again on hard. I'm very pleased with Steam's offline mode, I was expecting nothing would work but I could run this and Hard Reset no problems, so kudos to Valve.

So. Impressions. My overall rating of the game as a whole is unfortunately a "disliked" or at best a "meh".

Max Payne was always about plot and character and Max Payne 3 fails at both. Whatever character study Dan Houser had in his head, he must've written it in a different notebook. More frustrating than that, the plot is predictable and underwhelming, and the script itself is weak and soul-less. Max's poetic and witty sardonic nature seems to be cut off along with his hair. After Red Dead (and to some degree, GTA IV), I was expecting something more or less compelling, and I kept saying to myself "there's gonna be some twist, some smart hook or commentary down the line", but all the interesting topics -and there were plenty to choose from: alcoholism, paramilitaries brutally raiding the favelas, the contrast between the poor and the rich in Sao Paulo, the lost foreigner in a strange land, american invasionism on Latin America- are all casually hinted on, but never explored in any sort of meaningful way. Instead of copying the plot of Man on Fire and using all those elements as backdrops to the plot, Rockstar could've put any of that as forefront of the story and he might've been going somewhere.

It's not a mess at all, the plot is, after all, enjoyable to watch, in the same way a Die Hard movie is enjoyable to watch, but it's also devoid of all the ambition and the charm of the previous games, and that's criminal with such a lovable series as Max Payne.

The good is pretty obvious: the game never ceases to amaze visually, the soundtrack and sound design is excellent (I can't seem to get tired of listening to that 'Tears' theme) and the actually shooting and jumping around is a lot of fun, if you ignore the shooting galleries and turret sections. You'd think someone in Rockstar would've figured out that a game in which you can dodge bullets isn't so interesting after you block the player's movement, but, really, without the mild platforming and nightmare chapters from the previous titles, something had to break the pace, even if it's just more shooting in a different manner. I felt the checkpoints were fine, the last stand mechanic wasn't all that bad, really, and I can kinda tolerate cutscenes doing what they want with my "inventory". Having recently done a bit of catch-up in MP1 and MP2, though, I simply can't say this was my favorite Max Payne to play, so sadly I can't even give MP3 that.

Overall, it's a weak title that's not entirely disappointing, since I never expected Rockstar to understand the sensibilities of the Max Payne series, and not terrible at all, but it's the worst Max Payne to date. If multiplayer doesn't kick me out 99% of the times I try to log-in to a match, I'll probably play some of that, since the little I tried seemed fun enough, and I still have a few golden guns and clues to pick up, so I might try to beat the game one more time. Unskippable cutscenes (specially the intro scene) really kill replayability, so I hope that gets patched or something.
 
Meh. I never found the game cheap at all. Completed it on Hard and Hardcore in Free Aim. Did the last fight with ease on Hardcore. Am currently doing Old School, eight chapters in.

Utterly love it. Fantastic gunplay, I love that everything had weight and that it takes Max some time to get up. Makes you think when and where to use shootdodge. The game would be way too easy if you could dive all over the place like a spastic salmon.

Max is great as well and the music is incredible. Fantastic game.
 

Spat_triate

Member
Eh the last boss didn't give me any trouble (medium diff). I just took cover, scored some headshots and used the bullet time to shoot the grenades. I learned early on that shoot-dodge is extremely ineffective in this game and so after the 3rd chapter I didn't bother doing it at all.

For me the worst parts were when the cutscenes had Max alert 50 guards only for the game to just dump me in the thick of it with no options.
 

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
but it's the worst Max Payne to date.
Having replayed the first two games recently, I just can't agree.

Max Payne 1 has its charms, but the gameplay is a mess by 2012 standards. It's a one trick pony in the worst way.

Max Payne 2 is certainly a big improvement over the original in that bullet time is a much more interesting gameplay mechanic but the game is definitely showing its age. It definitely holds up reasonably well, though, compared to the first game which does not.
 

Sethos

Banned
I learned early on that shoot-dodge is extremely ineffective in this game and so after the 3rd chapter I didn't bother doing it at all.

The How-to-Play-the-Game-Suggestion-Club will come hunt you down for that. But yeah, probably what I should have done instead of bouncing around. And yes, another +1 to the games cheap nature was the constant habit of plonking you down in those shitty situations after cutscene number 853.
 

Tokubetsu

Member
Meh. I never found the game cheap at all. Completed it on Hard and Hardcore in Free Aim. Did the last fight with ease on Hardcore. Am currently doing Old School, eight chapters in.

Utterly love it. Fantastic gunplay, I love that everything had weight and that it takes Max some time to get up. Makes you think when and where to use shootdodge. The game would be way too easy if you could dive all over the place like a spastic salmon.

Max is great as well and the music is incredible. Fantastic game.

Yeah, if I ever had a problem it was squarely my fault (dodging into the ocean haha).
 
Well, well, well problems are starting on my end it seems. I played 5 hours ago and the game ran flawlessly. Just started the game now and I'm getting like 10 fps in the menus/in game.

:(

EDIT: Fuck even by lowering the resolution changing the direct X version (from 11 to 9) the game is still slooooooooooow... And here I was about to praise Rockstar for the amazing port. :/

For the last time........IT'S. NOT. A. F'N. PORT!!

Also, might actually wanna test speeds on other games, if they are running slow as well you might have a hardware problem.
 

jet1911

Member
Am I crazy or is the aspect ratio a bit weird?

maxpayne32012-06-0409hwkd5.png


For the last time........IT'S. NOT. A. F'N. PORT!!

Also, might actually wanna test speeds on other games, if they are running slow as well you might have a hardware problem.

Calm down a bit :eek:

I rebooted my PC and everything is fine now.
 

mephixto

Banned
Finished the game last night, gameplay is amazing but the story feel disconnect with previous games, few references didn't work at least for me. Graphics are great too. Way too much cutscenes but I think it's to cover the loading times. And the most annoying thing in the game: Low health, someone shoot you and enter in bullet time to kill the bastard, but no a fcking wall, desk or something is in the way and you can't kill him, bullet time runs out and you die.
 

Stitch

Gold Member
God the last bit of chapter
12
is such a huge POS.

- hidden time limit
- no painkillers
- shaky screen/crosshair
- not much ammo
- a fucking helmet guy with a big machinegun at the end
 

Stitch

Gold Member
well the other guys are not the problem. the problem is the guy at the end and the hidden time limit...

but hey I actually found some painkillers. should be doable now.
 

Zeliard

Member
It's mystifying what people think the previous games did from a story standpoint that was so remarkable it renders this one some staggering disappointment in that department. Max Payne in the previous games was practically a parody of Hard-Boiled Noir Guy. He was goofy fun in that very limited scope but what exactly was so fascinating there? The actual plot in all three games is nothing to write home about, but Max is much more interesting - and unique as a video game character - this time around.

You get a physically and mentally decaying, self-destructive, self-loathing, remorseful guy who basically puts himself through the ringer because he feels that's all he deserves, and all he's good for. And he's right.

It's almost unheard of to see that sort of character in a game, particularly the protagonist (and particularly in shooters), as games are usually all about player empowerment and often put you in the shoes of some superhuman, wisecracking cunt who never shows any remorse for his actions or conveys any introspection to speak of. Snore.

Of course, when you had the countless people crying about Max Payne's unkempt appearance and baldness pre-release, that's when I knew how little I truly had in common with typical modern "hardcore" gamer sensibilities. Oh no, the main character is a decrepit older guy, how can I vicariously live through him and feel like a stud?
 

Sethos

Banned
Yeah, story and character complaints for this game are nuts. Rock bottom Max is best Max.

Who says the complaints are compared to previous games. What if the story is just bad coupled with the pacing and has nothing to do with his looks, his decay or his problems.

The game also has an actual story outside of Max's problem, weirdly enough.
 

Solo

Member
Who says the complaints are compared to previous games. What if the story is just bad coupled with the pacing and has nothing to do with his looks, his decay or his problems.

I never expect much from game "stories". Having said that, this one's trumps the first two easily and the characterization is the best and deepest its been.
 

MMaRsu

Member
Meh, he's right. Story, pacing, setpieces, amount of cutscenes and the hardness created through cheap, shitty events rather than an actual challenge. Everything is a disaster - This game has the worst SP of the year for me.

Thankfully the gameplay has redeemed it and there's MP / Arcade mode / upcoming Co-op DLC.

Stitch there are 2 painkillers right after u kill the guys on the stairs.


Exactly man. Just the shit where
you'd shootdodge, kill some guys, he'd fire off some grenades and you landed on the ground with no more slowmotion and died. Boom. When you got shot and get the last stand thing, when you shot the guy who 'killed you' Becker had already fired off some grenades and when the last stand ended - Dead. Happened constantly

Lol i did that part in two times on HARD last night..come on son.
 

Stitch

Gold Member
woohoo I did it :p :D


nooo it crashed during the cutscene because I've alt-tabed and the last save is that shitty part...
 

MMaRsu

Member
Yeah.




Yeah because this game is about skills or ability and not random luck, lol.

C'mon son.

Ehh yea it is? Shoot the grenades he shoots out. I had a hard time with it on medium on my first try and then i did it in two times on hard..popping headshots left and right and dhootdodge a metric shitton.
 

Sethos

Banned
Well then what's the big deal? All I'm looking for is fun in shooting shit. Anything else in a game like this is icing if it's done half competently.

Edited my post.

And I'm also looking at shooting dudes and having fun but how can I do that when the story is shoved down my fucking throat every third minute in the BILLIONS of cutscenes the game has? Please, do share.
 

Enco

Member
Nearly done with the game (chapter 12).

My updated opinions:

- Jaw dropping graphics
- Amazing physics
- Badass action
- Awesome soundtrack
- Really detailed multiplayer
- (MP1, MP2 and LA Noire as pre order bonuses)
- Brutal multiplayer feuds
- An interesting story (so far)
- Great variety and awesome level design
- Fun multiplayer modes
- This is the only game where shooting people over and over is fun. Probably some psychological thing involved but the slow motion shooting is awesome

I wasn't a big fan of the NY parts. Found them really boring compared to all the other locations. The Jersey shore guys were hilarious though.

14 hours logged so far and wont be stopping any time soon.
 

Varna

Member
Yeah, story and character complaints for this game are nuts. Rock bottom Max is best Max.

They didn't need to barrage you with cutscenes to get this point across. In MP1/2 the story scenes were something to look forward to because they would come after huge stretches of gameplay.

They even have that "clue" system that gave you bigger insight into the story and it's characters... That should have been more relevant instead of just spood feeding you that information.
 

Sethos

Banned
Hyperbole, thy name is Sethos

Sorry I didn't join the Max Payne 3 circle jerk club and remain critical towards some aspect of it.


Ehh yea it is? Shoot the grenades he shoots out. I had a hard time with it on medium on my first try and then i did it in two times on hard..popping headshots left and right and dhootdodge a metric shitton.

So you had already played it and learned the scripted, cheap event? Monkey see, monkey do - That is skills right there bro, high five.
 

MMaRsu

Member
well the other guys are not the problem. the problem is the guy at the end and the hidden time limit...

but hey I actually found some painkillers. should be doable now.

Also helpfull i know u finished it but one of the guys drops a bull pistol..just a few shots in a back wards shootdodge and hes dead.
 
Man, the soundtrack in multiplayer is really, really badass. THE GIRL playing throughout a Gang Wars match on the docks is the best one so far. When it starts raining on that map and that song is playing amongst the carnage, it's like shootout nirvana.
 
Just finished it on PS3. loved it. GOTY for me.

I had the same issues with it just like all of you guys; door = cutscene, the game drops you right into the middle of a firefight right after a cutscene with no cover, the pistol thing was really annoying and it crashed on me once (I also clipped through the wall at one stage and ran underground for a while and fell into a big white area.. then died. :|)

But I can overlook ALL of these things cos the games shooting machanics and cover system with the 'slow-mo head shot popin goodness' easily makes up for it. I really got to hand it to Rockstar, they are killing it this gen. They made a better Max Payne 3 than Remedy would have.

The writing was so good.. just loved some of the lines. "It was at the worst, when I was at my best" and
"Max, you know I will walk"
"Yeah, you'll walk.. with a limb!" [Kicks him]

Also the Music. When THIS kicked in towards the end. I turned it up. So good.

And finally, Best Max Payne? I think so.
 

cackhyena

Member
Edited my post.

And I'm also looking at shooting dudes and having fun but how can I do that when the story is shoved down my fucking throat every third minute in the BILLIONS of cutscenes the game has? Please, do share.

Hyperbole aside, I get your point. I'm not a fan of unskippable scenes in any game.
 

Sethos

Banned
Hyperbole aside, I get your point. I'm not a fan of unskippable scenes in any game.

Would have been nice if they removed them completely from Arcade mode at least.

By the way, anyone knows the details on grenade throwing in MP? Last time I played, I was looking through a window and pressed the middle mouse. Guy does an underhand throw into the wall beneath and I need to dodgy out of the way.

Is the over / underhand thing dynamic or the way you press the button?
 

MMaRsu

Member
Man, the soundtrack in multiplayer is really, really badass. THE GIRL playing throughout a Gang Wars match on the docks is the best one so far. When it starts raining on that map and that song is playing amongst the carnage, it's like shootout nirvana.

Yup good track, reminds me of RDR though..

anybody on Ps3 wanna hop in a party?
 

zkylon

zkylewd
Having replayed the first two games recently, I just can't agree.

Max Payne 1 has its charms, but the gameplay is a mess by 2012 standards. It's a one trick pony in the worst way.

Max Payne 2 is certainly a big improvement over the original in that bullet time is a much more interesting gameplay mechanic but the game is definitely showing its age. It definitely holds up reasonably well, though, compared to the first game which does not.
Gameplay is just one aspect and no, I don't think it was improved enough to:
a) overcome its problems: weird mouse aim, uninteresting weapon selection (as opposed to the dozen guns you got in MP1&2, which all felt different and were more or less fun to use), turret sections, lack of gameplay variety, the last stand mechanic can be very hit or miss, cutscenes interrumpting gameplay every 5 minutes, even for stuff like showing Max run across a hallway or open a door.
b) add anything new: sure, the animation system is pretty and there's a certain elegance to the weapon limit, but what else is there? Cover? Pfffft.

It's the same as the others, with an extra generation, for all that's good and bad about that.

It's mystifying what people think the previous games did from a story standpoint that was so remarkable it renders this one some staggering disappointment in that department. Max Payne in the previous games was practically a parody of Hard-Boiled Noir Guy. He was goofy fun in that very limited scope but what exactly was so fascinating there? The actual plot in all three games is nothing to write home about, but Max is much more interesting - and unique as a video game character - this time around.

You get a physically and mentally decaying, self-destructive, self-loathing, remorseful guy who basically puts himself through the ringer because he feels that's all he deserves, and all he's good for. And he's right.

It's almost unheard of to see that sort of character in a game, particularly the protagonist (and particularly in shooters), as games are usually all about player empowerment and often put you in the shoes of some superhuman, wisecracking cunt who never shows any remorse for his actions or conveys any introspection to speak of. Snore.

Of course, when you had the countless people crying about Max Payne's unkempt appearance and baldness pre-release, that's when I knew how little I truly had in common with typical modern "hardcore" gamer sensibilities. Oh no, the main character is a decrepit older guy, how can I vicariously live through him and feel like a stud?
Like Sethos said, I don't have a problem with Max's personal story (aside from that Rockstar
casually ignores that Max in the end of MP2 actually moves on from the death of his family
), it's in fact the best thing about the game's story, but it's criminally underdeveloped and everything else is just predictable and unnecessarily convoluted.

And most of all, it lacks charm of any kind. One of the more obvious ways of seeing this is comparing Baseball Bat Boy in MP1 and MP3. In MP1 it acts as a black, ironic campy contrast to Max's being tied up in a chair, getting tortured by some thug. In MP3, well, I don't know what the hell they were trying to do but they sure as hell spent a lot more money on it. There's a lack of self-awareness and literariness and it shows. The other Max Payne games weren't Dostoyevsky, but at least they weren't Michael Mann movies, or were trying to be, which IMHO, it's aiming rather low.

They didn't need to barrage you with cutscenes to get this point across. In MP1/2 the story scenes were something to look forward to because they would come after huge stretches of gameplay.

They even have that "clue" system that gave you bigger insight into the story and it's characters... That should have been more relevant instead of just spood feeding you that information.
Yes, exactly. Story in MP1&2 was complimentary to gameplay, in MP3 it's interrupting. You can't push a button, open a door, talk to someone, without the control being taken away from you for whatever reason. I wouldn't mind so much if you could skip the cutscenes, but, well...

I would've preferred if the game had loadings than this dumb mix of pre-rendered cutscenes (which are fine, specially compared to games that completely botched their pre-rendered cutscenes, like DX: HR, but are still noticeably worse) and unskippable cutscenes.

edit: I'm not saying this game is vomit-inducing and that I regret my purchase. In fact, I had a lot of fun with it. I just don't see Max Payne 3's contribution to videogames to be anything more than a summer blockbuster with pretensions of grandeur. The effect Max Payne 1 had on shooters can be still felt today and it's a timeless classic. I don't think many people will remember MP3 ten years from now.
 
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