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MechWarrior Online - News and Information Thread

Discobird

Member

Interesting, that's more than I would've expected (the official MWO forums only have about 500k members). For reference World of Tanks recently hit the 60 million registered users mark.

Do boats hit 120% often? This looks like an edge case for me personally.

It mostly affects 4+ PPC boats. Pretty hard to hit 120% on other mechs unless you are really desperate or bad at heat management.

It's a good change but not enough to balance PPC boating all by itself.
 

dionysus

Yaldog
Is it really that bad, I was thinking of giving it a try since I love turn-based tactics

Heh, I haven't played it because it is only open to Founders (I think) and Llyranor said it was a turd and to stay away. Whether it is bad or not the conspiracy theory that does have quite a bit of evidence behind it is that a whole bunch of the original MWO founder money went to Tactics and not MWO.
 

Woorloog

Banned
No SRM buff? BOO!
Movement stuff is good... if PGI didn't fuck up the classification. Stalker and Quickdraw are seriously in wrong categories... of course their sizes are fucked up anyway.
 

Lime

Member
Whether it is bad or not the conspiracy theory that does have quite a bit of evidence behind it is that a whole bunch of the original MWO founder money went to Tactics and not MWO.

Seriously? Wow, that makes me so incredibly sad that the money is wasted on such a shitty F2P game with shitty mech designs.
 

Llyranor

Member
I would have been fine if they had lesser damage starting at 100-120% heat too.

Apparently MW:T is 'better' now, but I haven't gone back to it since I have higher-priority TB games to play. The biggest glaring flaw that MWT had was the lack of a proper energy system. I only got in because they were giving away keys on various sites

So what's the 'evidence' behind that conspiracy theory, anyway?
 
Doubt there is any true evidence. Same company, same money. The money they make doesn't get marked and allocated to certain games, it's all under the same company pool of funds. Any money made my MWO is going to go into countless non related things besides the game itself.
 

Discobird

Member
My biggest worry is that the climbing changes will just funnel people into fewer areas of the map and make it even harder to close the gap against snipers

Guess I'll find out tonight
 

Llyranor

Member
The Dragon Slayer doesn't seem that good. We've encountered a bunch, and they seem to die pretty fast. Still looking forward to the Victor, though.

Y08PZFb.jpg
 
So I finally got around to installing the video card I had ordered before MWO launched (my second child was born around this time, so that obviously did not help). At any rate, I have no idea what I'm doing, but I've played all the previous Mechwarrior games, so I understand the basics.

Welp, so the great MWO experiment has failed. My new video card is crapping out on me (oddly enough, not while playing games, but rather while watching TV/videos). Had a video card crap out on me about 8 years ago as well. That's when I last swore off PC gaming. Guess I'll be doing that again. Ugh.
 

teepo

Member
Welp, so the great MWO experiment has failed. My new video card is crapping out on me (oddly enough, not while playing games, but rather while watching TV/videos). Had a video card crap out on me about 8 years ago as well. That's when I last swore off PC gaming. Guess I'll be doing that again. Ugh.

sounds like you have an issue with your power supply.
 
sounds like you have an issue with your power supply.

Shouldn't be. I put in a new one to support the video card. Antec 650 Watt, and the card only called for a 500 Watt power supply. Put in my old video card with the Antec power supply, and I'm not having any problems.

I'm gonna try to RMA the video card, but may run into troubles there, since I got it from a Kickstarter backer reward for backing Defense Grid 2, so they may not accept my "invoice."
 

dionysus

Yaldog
So what's the 'evidence' behind that conspiracy theory, anyway?

I am going off memory, I think this discussion has been scrubbed from the forums.

After Founders packs were released, it was noticed that several open positions at PG were taken down. Upon forum request it was discovered they were not filled, just that PG was no longer hiring for those positions.

There was some forum threads complaining that the pace of updates was slow, PG was not meeting the schedules they had laid out for mechs and other updates (remember 2 mechs a month?) and they weren't hiring even though they had just concluded a very successful founders program. A high level PG employee made a post in that thread that there relationship with IGP was complicated. It might have been Paul but I don't remember.

In an interview with IGP spokesman, it was confirmed that not all of the founders money staid with PG.

I think it is very reasonable for IGP to keep some of the founders money, so that in and of itself is not troubling to me. What troubled the forums was that there didn't seem to be any investment back into MWO after what everyone acknowledged was a wildly successful founders program. But we don't know what the money was used for, it costs a lot of money to keep a dev team going for years. Maybe IGP simply was slowly giving out the money for salaries instead of blowing it all at once on rapidly expanding the team, or maybe they had racked up a lot of debt investing in MWO. Like I said, conspiracy theory but with some smoke backing it up.
 

Lime

Member
Nevertheless, it's a shame that money has been wasted on a potential resurrection of Mech Commander for a game that ends up looking like it was made by Fisher Price.

I have no idea how the art director and producer of Tactics was thinking. It's like they never even bothered to look at what direction Mechwarrior: Online was going in, in order to streamline and congregate the style of the two games.
 

Nickiepoo

Member
I'm not sure if a publisher investing money made from one game into another can really be called a conspiracy rather than just 'completely bloody normal and expected'.

MWO isn't developing as fast as the fans would like, but MWT actually needs the help, and honestly, throwing too many devs at a project that's still in its teething phase (eg sorting out essentials like the netcode) doesn't necessarily help.

Not being an apologist, just saying that that people shouting conspiracy have a one-way ticket on the crazy-train all the way to barmy-ville.
 

Llyranor

Member
I don't remember where I read this, but wasn't PGI hiring to effectively double its devteam? Iirc, it was at the ?convention where ppl started qq'ing about potentially required premium accounts to participate in CW - so it wasn't that long ago. Can't search right now
 
MWO isn't developing as fast as the fans would like, but MWT actually needs the help, and honestly, throwing too many devs at a project that's still in its teething phase (eg sorting out essentials like the netcode) doesn't necessarily help.

The latter half of this is so incredibly true. People need to understand this from a project management standpoint that just adding bodies is not necessarily cost effective or even useful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mythical_Man-Month

This is required reading if project management interests anyone here.
 
Of course. I don't mean to say that you can't have a team grow as a project increases in scope, scale, and hopefully profitability, but the solution is rarely as black and white as dropping butts in chairs and saying 'ok, it's go time'.

It's just a more organic process than that.

I agree, if anything, I'd also like to see an increase in artists/designers as well.
 

dionysus

Yaldog
I'm not sure if a publisher investing money made from one game into another can really be called a conspiracy rather than just 'completely bloody normal and expected'.

MWO isn't developing as fast as the fans would like, but MWT actually needs the help, and honestly, throwing too many devs at a project that's still in its teething phase (eg sorting out essentials like the netcode) doesn't necessarily help.

Not being an apologist, just saying that that people shouting conspiracy have a one-way ticket on the crazy-train all the way to barmy-ville.

I am pretty sure that the Founder's program was sold as a way for enthusiasts to support MWO as well as receive stuff for cheap. They delivered what they promised, but they may not have held up the other end of the bargain. What you say is fine except for the statements that the money would be invested in MWO.
 

dionysus

Yaldog
Just started out, any tips for starter Mechs? good weapons etc....

So far i've been getting destroyed but still enjoy it.

Starter loadouts almost universally suck. Your most important upgrade is Dual Heat Sinks. It should be your first upgrade.

Lots of weapons are viable. In general, it is a good idea to specialize at something. Having a balance of short, medium, and long ranges just means you are the worst mech at any range. (Player skill can make up for this of course, but it is true as a general rule.) Right now you can't go wrong specializing in long range pinpoint damage weapons, guass rifles, ppcs.... But if you want to do something else like using brawling weapons (medium lasers, srms), committ to it in your build.

XL engines aren't a straight upgrade. In fact I have stripped a bunch of XL engines out of my mechs because I was getting side torsoed way to often. Certain mechs are particularly bad for XL engines, while others are great. It depends on the hitboxes and hit angles of the torsos.
 
Beaten by seconds.

Curious if they can keep up a steady stream of content until then. 12 v 12 sounds like it's imminent and the next 'feature' to look forward, now that we've gotten movement changes out of the way and an attempt at a fix for alpha strike spam.
 
That being said, they could use more devs working on new mechs/maps

For all we know they got mechs and maps already done. It's in there best interest to trickle out the content and make it last rather than splurge. Doubt they will add maps forever either, eventually they would have tons of them and that creates a lot of other issues with having to constantly keep each map in check with the game meta. Heck they are releasing four more mechs in one go soon when they are going to be releasing them slowly for general populace.

One semi big update each month is pretty decent pace for a MMO like game, lot of games don't even reach that.
 

Discobird

Member
So yesterday's patch had an undocumented JJ change--they removed the cockpit shake while jump jetting (reticule shake and random offset still apply). I'm happy about that in my Jenner, haven't tried my Cataphract 3D yet to see how it's affected.

Also I would totally pay good money to have Riot's balancing team sit down with this game for a while.
 

Nickiepoo

Member
That being said, they could use more devs working on new mechs/maps

More artists can clog up the pipeline just as much as more developers since you need the infrastructure, supervisors, producers, coordinators and testers to actually support them, even assuming that you WANT to release art assets faster to a game that's still struggling to meet its 'core' features while also trying to turn an active profit.
 

El'Kharn

Member
The Dragon Slayer doesn't seem that good. We've encountered a bunch, and they seem to die pretty fast. Still looking forward to the Victor, though.
I saw the heat it produced and didnt bother to change or even really look at the loadout i just went straight in....and died the first time i got shot to an ammo explosion lol.
Its ok i guess with a standard engine but real bad with an xl
Am running a gauss,ppc,streaks and 2 ml (i'm trying hard not to jam moar ppcs onto it, hate the ppc meta atm)
 

Discobird

Member
Just started out, any tips for starter Mechs? good weapons etc....

So far i've been getting destroyed but still enjoy it.

Weapons
This is my opinion on weapons, in no particular order within each tier:

Good weapons
* PPC (best weapon in the game right now, but PPC boating will surely get nerfed somehow)
* ERPPC
* Gauss
* Large laser
* Medium laser
* AC/20
* SSRM2 (right now they always target CT, but they are going to get nerfed to have an equal chance of targeting side torsos)
* LRMs (if you have teammates spotting and your team brings a bunch of them)

OK weapons
* ER large laser
* Small laser
* Small pulse laser
* UAC/5 if you can bring at least three of them
* AC/10
* LRMs (if you have teammates spotting but your team cannot mass a bunch of them)
* Machine guns (only if you can boat at least 4)

Bad weapons
* SRMs (not enough damage, but PGI's acknowledged they're a high priority for balance tweaks)
* Large pulse laser (poor range, poor heat efficiency, not enough beam duration reduction, weighs too much)
* Medium pulse laser (same)
* Machine gun (if you have < 4)
* Flamer (suicidal and low payoff)
* LRMs (if you have no one spotting for you)
* AC/2 (requires you to stare at your target for too long to deal damage and doesn't have the DPS payoff of UAC/5s)
* AC/5 (same)
* LBX-10 (low damage)

Light and medium mechs:
Here are some strong builds for all skill levels:

Jenner F with 5x ML. My favorite mech and the best light for killing heavier mechs. Can go toe to toe with assaults in the hands of a good pilot. This particular build is very heat efficient--the more common 6x ML build sacrifices a lot of heat efficiency for a bigger alpha (but lower sustained DPS). Very fun in both a hit-and-run and circle strafing capacity. Not the greatest against other lights because of its reliance on lasers.

Jenner D with 4x ML, 2x SSRM2, BAP. The best anti-light light in the game. Shoot your Streaks to cool off when your heat is high. Excellent for capping on Conquest because of how well it duels other lights.

Raven 3L with 3x ML, 2x SSRM2, ECM. A pretty good anti-light mech, and it carries ECM which is very useful for protecting your team and covering a flanking action against uncoordinated pubbies. Does not have JJ and the legs are easy to destroy so it is not as strong in combat as the Jenners.

Blackjack 1x with 8x ML. Big damage in a small package, but poor heat efficiency. It'll teach you heat management for sure. Pretty fast too, faster than the Hunchback 4P. I prefer standard engines in these because Blackjacks with XLs are very fragile.

Centurion AL with 3x LL. EXTREMELY durable due to the Centurion's fantastic hitboxes (more durable than everything short of a Stalker if played right. Yes, they can survive longer than Atlases.). 3X LL gives you a decent short and midrange punch. This mech will teach you how to torso twist to spread damage over your body. Use your left arm as a shield to absorb fire and protect your right arm with the two lasers. The other Centurions are underwhelming right now because SRMs are weak but they should be strong again when SRMs come back.

Hunchback 4P with 9x ML (I think this is still available as a trial mech). Similar to the Blackjack 1X with better heat efficiency and a bigger alpha at the expense of 16 kph speed. Six of your lasers are in your hunch and everyone will try to target it so try to protect it by keeping your left side toward your enemy while you're cooling down.

Avoid Spiders if you're a beginner since they have a high skill cap and pretty low reward. Avoid Commandos entirely since they don't do anything better than the other lights. I don't know anything about Cicadas and Trebs so maybe someone can share a build with you for those mechs.

For heavy and assault mechs please see this post.

General tips on mech building
Frankenmechs (mechs with lots of different weapon systems and ranges) are typically bad. Pick a range and dominate it.

Avoid putting ammo in your torso sections if you can. I find CASE unnecessary most of the time but it might be a good idea if you have a lot of ammo in a torso section.

DHS should be placed in sections with lots of weapons to absorb critical hits and make your weapons less likely to be destroyed. Only use the engine DHS slots if you have no space.

Always use BAP with Streaks if you can, otherwise you will be unable to fire them at ECM mechs unless someone else is cancelling out the enemy ECM.

When stripping armor to save weight, go in this order: arms without weapons, head, legs (if not a light). Never strip armor from CT. Never strip armor from legs on a light, your legs are your life and you cannot protect them by torso twisting.

Categorically avoid XL engines in the following mechs: Hunchback, Centurion, Stalker, Atlas. These mechs see a huge survivability increase by taking standard engines due to their hitboxes (small CTs and everyone targets your hunch in a Hunchback). XLs are fair game in everything else.

Always bring ECM and JJs if your mech can equip them. 1 JJ is enough unless you plan to poptart snipe.

As far as modules go, the advanced seismic sensor is incredibly overpowered and is a must-have on every mech right now. The difference between seismic and no seismic is night and day. PGI has said they're going to nerf it, but with no details and no timeline it is still totally worth getting because you are at such a huge disadvantage without it. Coolant flush (unless your mech never overheats), target information gathering, target decay (for LRM and SSRM users) and sensor range (for snipers) are also good though not as powerful as seismic. Avoid the zoom module, all it does is give you a small grainy zoomed in picture-in-picture in the middle of your HUD.
 

Llyranor

Member
Heh, nice session, disco. But yeah, seems like LRMs are back. I've fitted it on my assaults and slow heavies. 1.5ton (or the critical space) is hard to find sometimes :(
 

Mupod

Member
Weapons
This is my opinion on weapons, in no particular order within each tier:

Good weapons
* PPC (best weapon in the game right now, but PPC boating will surely get nerfed somehow)
* ERPPC
* Gauss
* Large laser
* Medium laser
* AC/20
* SSRM2 (right now they always target CT, but they are going to get nerfed to have an equal chance of targeting side torsos)
* LRMs (if you have teammates spotting and your team brings a bunch of them)

This is interesting from the standpoint of someone who hasn't played since last year. PPCs used to be pretty godawful compared to gauss but I used them a lot anyways, did they get buffed or did the metagame simply gravitate naturally towards MW4 poptarting/camping? Since that's where they excel. Although I always found it a waste of time, we rarely encountered tryhards so it was basically just casual stomping with brawler atlases, hunchbacks and my turbo-Awesome.

I'll catch up on patch notes when I get bored, although if SRMs really are that bad then I don't even really want to play again. They were always my favorite weapon even through the nerfs and shit netcode, although they got a bit better with artemis at the cost of ammo/tonnage. Although if it weren't for the free ammo workarounds then I wouldn't have bothered at all.
 

Discobird

Member
This is interesting from the standpoint of someone who hasn't played since last year. PPCs used to be pretty godawful compared to gauss but I used them a lot anyways, did they get buffed or did the metagame simply gravitate naturally towards MW4 poptarting/camping? Since that's where they excel.

They got buffed, big heat decreases and projectile speed increases (they are the fastest projectile by a good margin).

I'll catch up on patch notes when I get bored, although if SRMs really are that bad then I don't even really want to play again.

If you like SRMs I'd wait and see what PGI does with them in the coming weeks since they're high on PGI's balance priority list.
 

Grief.exe

Member
Just picked this up thanks to discobird

Played a couple matches. Awesome.

I wish I knew how to set my sensitivity, usually I measure it to 3.5 inches per 360 degrees. Tough to measure that out in a game like this.

In the BJ1X trail vehicle with 4xML and 4x Flamer. The flamer is only useful in very specific situations and doesn't seem tailored to this playstyle.
 

Discobird

Member
Glad you like it so far :) There's not much point in using a high sensitivity in this game because it's more about precise aiming than quick aiming, plus every mech has a limited torso twisting speed based on the mech and engine rating (bigger engine and smaller mech -> faster twist speed).

Looking over the current trial mech rotation... uhh none of them are all that good unfortunately. I guess the Atlas is the best of the crop. The game really opens up once you buy your own mech and customize it how you want.

BTW, you earn bonus C-bills for your first 25 matches. You should have enough C-bills by then to afford and fully kit a light or medium of your choice (maybe a heavy depending on how well you do, I forget exactly how much you'll end up with).
 

Mupod

Member
They got buffed, big heat decreases and projectile speed increases (they are the fastest projectile by a good margin).

Dang. I used to strap PPCs to my founder cat and use it as a surprisingly deadly farm machine. Their projectile speed (a problem exacerbated by the horrid netcode) and heat were still a real bummer. I mean, if I'M having trouble with lag, then they must have been unusable for other people. I average a 15 ping because their servers are next door to me, or something.

If you like SRMs I'd wait and see what PGI does with them in the coming weeks since they're high on PGI's balance priority list.

I was THE SRM guy. I loved how they felt in beta, like a huge shotgun blast of rockets. I suppose the sheer amount of murdering I did in an 81kph, quad SRM6 Awesome helped usher them along to nerfsville though. Even artemis didn't bring them back to their old level, but I still made good use of them especially on a hunchback 4SP I used during the Great Streakcat Gathering (since picking a hunchie often gave the other team a useless yen-lo-wang or trial cicada instead of something dangerous). So if they get tweaked I'll definitely give them a try.

Since grief.exe will soon be in the market for a starter mech - are hunchbacks still pretty good? I used to love them and I recommended them to all new players, since you could get up and running with a 4P for a minimum of c-bills. Just slap a billion small lasers in there, buy a larger standard engine, and go to town. From there you could upgrade it accordingly and get even more deadly without having to worry about expensive repairs.

I used to put a large pulse laser in the arm opposite the hunch in addition to the small lasers. That way if I lost the hunch I still had half my firepower, which could be aimed very accurately.

Bah I'm getting the itch to play again even though I'll probably just get mad at PGI as soon as I do. I'll hold off for a while though, I have other games right now.
 

Discobird

Member
I was THE SRM guy. I loved how they felt in beta, like a huge shotgun blast of rockets. I suppose the sheer amount of murdering I did in an 81kph, quad SRM6 Awesome helped usher them along to nerfsville though. Even artemis didn't bring them back to their old level, but I still made good use of them especially on a hunchback 4SP I used during the Great Streakcat Gathering (since picking a hunchie often gave the other team a useless yen-lo-wang or trial cicada instead of something dangerous). So if they get tweaked I'll definitely give them a try.

The story I heard is that SRMs became bugged to do up to 12x their damage in some circumstances, then PGI fixed the bug but also cut their damage in half for good measure. So they basically got a 96% nerf in one patch. They've been slowly bringing them back up ever since. A lot of people attribute the current PPC dominance to the fact that SRMs are pretty weak so brawlers have fewer options when they manage to close the gap vs PPC users.

Since grief.exe will soon be in the market for a starter mech - are hunchbacks still pretty good? I used to love them and I recommended them to all new players, since you could get up and running with a 4P for a minimum of c-bills.

The 4P is still a top tier medium mech. I know that the #2 medium pilot in the recent Heavy vs the World tournament used a 4P and I wouldn't be surprised if half of the rest of the top 10 used one as well. The other Hunchback variants are pretty hard to use right now and not really newbie friendly.

The 4P has some competition in the new Blackjack 1X which can carry 8 lasers and run up to 116 kph vs the 4P's 93 (but the BJ is 5 tons lighter and generally packs fewer heatsinks).
 

Nickiepoo

Member
Like you say though, Mediums are hard on new players right now, so it's tempting to recommend you go Heavy or Assault, particularly as the difference in cost isn't even that great.

But then, this is from someone in a relatively high ELO, it's hard to say what they're like in the starter bracket.
 
Thanks for the advice guys.

This is going to sound really nooby, can you increase the armour on your back or does that count when you increase it on the overall torso? just want to make sure i'm not missing anything.

I think i have built a mech that is a mixture of both ranges may explain a lot.

It's the Hunchback with the AC20, i upgarded the heat sinks and put in an extra medium laser so i have three and the whole lot can be fired at once without using much heat.

But it's not very quick for a medium mech and i'm getting caught out trying to get too close, to larger mechs.
 

Nickiepoo

Member
Front and back armour share their 'limits' for each part of your torso. So it'll be (say) a max 100 points on your CT which you can split front and back any way you want. Same for the side torsos, but with a lower limit.

How much back armour you actually need depends on the mech in question, and keep in mind that hits to your side will count as front armour entirely.

As for your mech, AC20/3MLs is fine but any decent player will blow off your hunch as soon as look at you so you've got to be the second into the fight behind the assaults and ideally pick at your enemies sides without being any sort of target. Hard in sniper/LRM focused metagame since you need for other people to be in a brawl before you can be really useful and that doesn't always even happen.
 

Llyranor

Member
Front and back armor have a shared max.

For my ac20 hunch, i run it with a 250engine (81kph + speedtweak). Anything less, and heavies can catch up to it. Requires a big investment, though. Double heat sinks (11), endosteel AND ferrofibrous. I only kept 2 medlasers though (head and L arm). 3 would be too heat-intensive with my loadout, and this also allows me to strip off a bit of armor off the weaponless R arm. The ac20 (4ton ammo) is the main weapon, lasers just a backup; so don't go laser-happy and overheat - make sure you maintain cool enough to fire that AC regularly.
 
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